Plasma is the Future of growing!

plasmargon said:

It's like discovering a new hot woman. She might thrill you, but it's still alot of work to keep her and your friends will never believe you 'till you bring her around.

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Big deal so you're popping the lights cherry. For every beautiful woman you see out there, there's a guy who's sick of fu#^ing her.

thanks for the spam

Now that's a great first post with some fine content blackthumbs

I don't see plasma for bigger grows at this moment in time. You need at least a 300 watt plasma light to get some real intensity. On the other hand.. if the output goes up another 30% it will compete with MH or HPS.

The investment is high of course, just as with leds, and we need to see what yields we get (in a normal growroom situation, not a specialised micro climate) and what quality. Until then I wouldn't recommend buying it anyway, though it does wonders in veg. On one hand, T5's are much easier to distribute over a big surface, on the other hand: if you have the height...

Interesting find the last grow that the buds were about 25% "heavier" - that's 25% more dry matter and/or trichomes! Sannie expected based on the fresh weight about 70+ grams and it became 90+ in the end.

whazzup said:

Sannie expected based on the fresh weight about 70+ grams and it became 90+ in the end.

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Thanks Wazzup. Now that's the kind of posts we like to see. Solid performance!

I promised to publish some spectrum graphs for HPS and Plasma.

Well here they are. first the plasma light, then the HPS.

Now one thing you need to take into consideration when looking at these graphs (Luxim versus Philips HPS Greenpower): The SCALE is DIFFERENT! To be able to compare the quality we needed to use a much smaller scale on the plasma as it doesn't output as much light! his graphs is therefore purely for spectrum analysis purposes.

What HPS manufacturers always show is the PAR part of the output spectrum. They do not want to show the very high heat output of the light. Well we did do a spectrum including the Infra Red light.

I think the graph speaks for itself. You have no heat radiation problem with the LEP.

Btw the plasma fixture and reflector for horti use are developed by Gavita, Lumatek will brand it for the hydroponics market in their high-end line.

whazzup said:

"I think the graph speaks for itself. You have no heat radiation problem with the LEP."

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@ Whazzup; I have a huge question for you and I wonder why no one else on this thread has caught it yet... You have just proven that there is very little IR heat coming from the emitter in the LEP system (the driver puts out more heat). So why do you HAVE to pull the light so far away (50- 60cm) to keep it from stunting bud growth?

My air-cooled model can get 25 cm away without stunting bud growth. I wonder why?

(Answer; isolating the light by glass results in no loss in Relative humidity at close proximity, and less UV-B/C)

YouGrowBoy said:

Thanks Wazzup. Now that's the kind of posts we like to see. Solid performance!

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You act like you speak for the whole community when I've posted here more than you. Wanker; You probably aren't even getting ANY let alone getting sick of someone beautiful.

plasmargon said:

@ Whazzup; I have a huge question for you and I wonder why no one else on this thread has caught it yet... You have just proven that there is very little IR heat coming from the emitter in the LEP system (the driver puts out more heat). So why do you HAVE to pull the light so far away (50- 60cm) to keep it from stunting bud growth?

My air-cooled model can get 25 cm away without stunting bud growth. I wonder why?

(Answer; isolating the light by glass results in no loss in Relative humidity at close proximity, and less UV-B/C)

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A bigger font doesn't make a question more important

First of all we think the stunned bud growth is the result of not enough red spectrum in the light (too little grow light) and the UVB levels. I attribute the leaf abnormalities at short distance to the higher UVB radiation of the light. The leaf reaction to the light at close proximity is the same as how leafs react to high amounts of UVB in high areas or around the equator. So you have the following options:

- shield the light with glass
- increase background irradiation as this reduces the sensitivity to UVB
- increase the distance to the light to reduce UVB
- increase the amount of growlight relative to the UVB

We choose not to shield the light. We added a reflector, we increased the distance, we increased the amount of growlight by adding 80 watt R and FR LED to the 180 watt LEP.

There are numerous scientific publications that show high intensity UVB leads to reduced leaf size and increased dry matter. But more importantly, UV-absorbing flavonoid compound levels (and THC) increase a lot under high levels of UVB.

plasmargon said:

My air-cooled model can get 25 cm away without stunting bud growth. I wonder why?

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Now you're asking: I indeed wonder why you would want it so close because there is no way you can light more than a very small patch from that distance. Furthermore it is more difficult to get uniform lighting at short distances, though I suppose while the plants are turning an even lighting is not your concern at all, that's a given in that system (dark/light). I just wonder how you would use the same light for flowering from 25 cm height. That must be some freakin reflector if it can cover a square meter from 25 cm distance at a good uniformity. I take it you don't turn them during the complete flowering period.

So, it's not the UVC, not the UVB, not the heat and not humidity imho. Glass not only decreases UVB output but also takes away 5-8% of all light. That's ridiculous to do in our opinion if you don't have a climate problem.

plasmargon said:

You act like you speak for the whole community when I've posted here more than you. Wanker; You probably aren't even getting ANY let alone getting sick of someone beautiful.

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Damn man, your skin is too thin for internet forums and you come across like a dick pretty much everywhere you post. Not really a good impression. At this point with all the complaining, name calling, and even threats over on sannies board (opengrow), I'd fly to Europe to pick up a light before i'd buy one of yours. Ever consider that complementing wazzup on their work had NOTHING to do with you? Then call the dude names? WTF?
Just comenting on your lack of decorum in the hope that you'll come to your senses and shape up. I doubt it.

The Warlord said:

Damn man, your skin is too thin for internet forums and you come across like a dick pretty much everywhere you post. Not really a good impression. At this point with all the complaining, name calling, and even threats over on sannies board (opengrow), I'd fly to Europe to pick up a light before i'd buy one of yours. Ever consider that complementing wazzup on their work had NOTHING to do with you? Then call the dude names? WTF?
Just comenting on your lack of decorum in the hope that you'll come to your senses and shape up. I doubt it.

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Very well put. I believe the testing over in Europe will be the white papers of tomorrow.

It's not possible to have a good discussion without common data to discuss. I can only speak for what we see and learn. You make it very difficult to have a decent discussion plasmargon. You sound like "if you're not with us, you're against us". Don't underestimate the impact of what you say on a forum.

The Warlord said:

Damn man, your skin is too thin for internet forums and you come across like a dick pretty much everywhere you post. Not really a good impression. At this point with all the complaining, name calling, and even threats over on sannies board (opengrow), I'd fly to Europe to pick up a light before i'd buy one of yours. Ever consider that complementing wazzup on their work had NOTHING to do with you? Then call the dude names? WTF?
Just comenting on your lack of decorum in the hope that you'll come to your senses and shape up. I doubt it.

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I have complimented and tried to help Whazzup and Sannie on many different occasions and it only blew up in my face. I would not doubt your connected with them just like all the people they've had harass me in the past.
If you look carefully I wasn't calling Whazzup anything. I said it to yougrowboy, but you're right they're probably connected. I was talking with Doc on OpenGrow and somehow insulted Whazzup. Go figure...

So go to Europe to get your light I don't give a shit (good luck getting an adapter to use with it). I've had over 1000 requests for this light already. I have only been doing this to keep it in the blogs. Now I'm ready to launch my website.

These guys don't want help or support they just want to harass me, that's why they came to this site. You should have read the shitty responses I got from them on Opengrow (Quote;"are you trying to turn people against us? now I'll do everything in my power to turn your people on you"). So if you side with them go fuck yourself. I started this thread for a reason. Now I'm done.

Whazzup, I just met you at the Cannabis cup and you didn't even know who I was hahahaha. If you make it here for the next Grow expo I'll make SURE to make you feel welcome.

Moderator, you can close this thread.

I have been a supporter so far. but whats with all of the negativity? and where's a link to the site?

Integra21 said:

I have been a supporter so far. but whats with all of the negativity? and where's a link to the site?

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Sorry Integra,

I'm really burnt out on these guys following me to harass me. This is the third site they have enrolled in just because I was on it. (look at the record)

I do admit I came off very intense on their site (opengrow), only because I thought they knew who I was because we have mutual connections and I was trying to help them. Then I got shit on by Sannie while at the same time His partner Doc was trying to ask my boss for free product. We don't play like that.

So when I found out they don't even know who our mutuals are, I left it alone. But they kept following me to every website I was trying to get this info out to. At first I didn't mind because they have pictures and I can't post anything with my lawyer and investor breathing down my neck. But now several months later they're still trying to fuck with me.

So guess what Whazzup?... We'll see each other again soon. When you see who I am I hope you shit your pants. I know who you are now. You just had to keep pushing me.

He could be a serial killer. And he knows who you are. You don't know who he is. The drama continues.

I think that sulfur plasma is the future.

A purchase from plasmargon is not in the future.

plasmargon said:

Sorry Integra,

I'm really burnt out on these guys following me to harass me. This is the third site they have enrolled in just because I was on it. (look at the record)

I do admit I came off very intense on their site (opengrow), only because I thought they knew who I was because we have mutual connections and I was trying to help them. Then I got shit on by Sannie while at the same time His partner Doc was trying to ask my boss for free product. We don't play like that.

So when I found out they don't even know who our mutuals are, I left it alone. But they kept following me to every website I was trying to get this info out to. At first I didn't mind because they have pictures and I can't post anything with my lawyer and investor breathing down my neck. But now several months later they're still trying to fuck with me.

So guess what Whazzup?... We'll see each other again soon. When you see who I am I hope you shit your pants. I know who you are now. You just had to keep pushing me.

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I think plasma could be a great innovation and everyone should be able to learn about it. So actually I am doing your promotion work by showing how it works. We just disagree how the technology should be applied.

If I'm not mistaken you visited Opengrow and joined sannies thread first, spamming completely out of control.

We actually gave you a few ideas in that thread, showing you the levels of UVB actually can enhance the plant and the plant can have lots more of it than you initially thought.

It seems that I even demonstrated the light and the reflector to you (what did you think of it?).

Now you have had results with a 400 watt (cooled) light of more than a gram per watt per month, (if I remember well), so I suppose you expect to get even better gr/watt using these lights (otherwise why bother?). We don't get any close to those results here so you must have something unique. If that is the case, why worry? Unfortunately you don't share any data about it. If I had a light that did more than a gram per watt per month (so, 400 grams in two months from under this 180 watt light) I wouldn't worry at all. I would just sit in a corner and smile.

I am looking forward to the designs and your website and I'm sure we will find out about you and the results then.

As for my remark about posting on forums: It's really unfortunate that you say these things on a public forum and don't stick to the content. I can understand you are frustrated at this point still not being able to share your light with us yet, but you destroy your own reputation by these remarks.

There is something else that really surprises me: Gavita has the European distribution rights for the professional agri market, and does not sell to the US.

Even Chameleon already shows LEP plasma light fixtures prototypes on their site, where we don't operate on the US market so I don't see why you are so irritated as we don't even compete with your light in the US. Now that would be something... first ship the plasme unit from the US to The Netherlands, build the fixture, and then send it back

You make it into something personal that it isn't. If you would have been a brave man you would have stepped forward after my presentation to talk to me as many did. I would surely have done the same if I had been at one of your demos and I would have gladly discussed any issues and demonstrate you our light more closely.

I hear your frustration, but please channel that in a different way than threats, that's so counter-productive. Forums have a bad effect on you - don't make it into something personal, stick to the discussion. Keep it professional.

I have read most of Plasmargons posts on ALL message boards. I will give him some credit as he is smart. But that's it. I have also read all of Wazzups posts and he is smart too, but he is also respectful, modest and most of all has some evidence to back up his statements. Wazzups goal is to further the exploration and experimentation of more then just plasma. I can't say that for other people that are just looking show us how smart they are (we don't care), pretend they are the inventor of plasma technology, and the 1st to use it. We don't care about 1st, all we care about is the process and the end result. If you show us the process and the end result along with non-arrogant dialogue you will have our attention and not be flamed.

Plasmargon got me interested in plasma light but my attention has switched to Opengrow's tests because they are showing the world what plasma can and can't do.

I and the rest of us are here to see what results can be achieved by new technology and not to listen to someone spout "they have all the answers to the future of lighting and they are great because they were there 1st" BFD! Did you invent plasma light or are you riding its coat tails?

Much respect to Sannie and Wazzup for backing up the talk with some serious work.

You aren't reading the same posts I am. Whazzup is clearly needling him in a covert way.