Organic Soil, Microorganisms, and pH

jcurtis - thanks for that - really informative. I'm way too tired and stoned to respond right now but I'm sure I'll have more to say tomorrow.

+rep to you for all that stuff, solid job.

Alright finally some time to respond -

First off, you definitely know what you are talking about so don't be timid to add your 2 cents to the conversation...we are all grateful, and are by no means experts here (if we were experts I wouldn't have needed to create the thread!!!)

So basically, the conclusion we are all seeming to come to here is that pH is only significant if it is so extreme that your microbes can't survive...and even then the few surviving microbes will eventually neutralize the pH. So when we are thinking about pH we should think about the pH that the microbes enjoy, not the plants, therefore giving us a much broader range of potential application (between pH 4.5-9 roughly instead of pH 6-7 or something of that nature). I'm starting to think that my "pH problems" are actually just a massive lack of nutrients...next round I will be going with very nutrient rich soil and letting my plant decide how much it needs via exudates etc.

Thanks for contributing - you definitely helped solidify this information as truth and not just some theory

jcurtis912 said:

Dogs have been our companions since we were actually called human. Wolves and dogs split from an ancestor dire wolf. They became domesticated because they were once scavengers, and they would follow us around and eat our scraps, and get the leftovers from our kills in the wild. They have evolved alongside us, and as a result they have come to live in the same toxic chemical world that we have made for ourselves. The name for this place is called civilization. Everything is chemical based, from the food we eat, to the dashboard in your car, to the shoelaces in your chuck taylors. Dogs have developed THE EXACT SAME DISEASES as humans from Hip Dysplasia to Cancer, more than likely because they share our environment. Wolves in the wild, which are genetically similar to dogs do not have these ailments. So what does this mean? Minimize your chemical exposure. Go organic.

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100% agreed, this are the same thought processes I have all the time...

jcurtis912 said:

I NEVER PH ANYTHING. I couldnt tell you what my PH is at anytime in my grow. I dont aerate my tap water which comes straight out of my sink here in Long Beach, CA. I could go on the water dept website and get the data, however my school study showed me it really didnt matter, as long as the water isnt super contaminated.

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This is the only thing I would disagree on...I would get yourself a filter or at least aerate the water to remove chlorine (chloramine is another issue). Although it won't kill 100% of your microbial life, you will be hugely stunting your micro-community by watering with chlorine laden water. What school study are you referring to? Would love to read it...

Anyway, thanks for the info, I wouldn't consider it a hijack at all...keep posting if you got more! This is the reason I started this thread positive constructive discussion

The only Ph solutions I use is earth juice natural crystals. From what I been told you are not supposed to adjust the ph of an aact. If you are using liquid organic nutes the chelating organic acids are what make the ph dive so hard. That's what I didn't like about using them, I was using earth juice products and they would work great but the dam ph was so low. I would be using alot of ph up. So now I have switched to Down to Earth dry nutes and and pure rain water and i'm loving it.

what happened to this thread? Im currently reading Teaming with Microbes and growing some harborside clones in a modified Subcools super soil recipe. THE PLANTS LOOK AMAZING! I do PH my water to 6-6.5 though, I was thinking about dropping the PH due to the microbes excretion being acidic but after hearing whats going on here I think I can be at 5.5.-6.5 in range without having to worry about PH problems. Why? Because as previously mentioned plant root absorb nutrients in the rhizosphere.

Besides the aforementioned...genetics have a lot do deal with this - this isnt just about the the nutrients being absorbed int the rhizosphere, but the plant itself controlling this function. Good genetics, good plant function.

This is a damn good thread, I'm growing in Roots Organic soil at the moment and have been experiencing all the same problems as some of the other users.

I didn't know what "organic" meant at the time of purchasing the RO soil, I thought it was like buying an organic apple from the grocery store. After doing alot of reading, googling, and what not... I came upon this thread.

I'm using the following nutrients with my feedings:

Organic Nuterients: Aurora: Budda Grow, Budda Bloom, Trinity and a Vermi T compost Tea
Non organic nutes: Bud Candy, Gen Org CalMG


With that being said, after adding 5 ml of each into 1 gallon, my mix was at 5.0 PH and ~800-900 ppm. At this point, I didn't understand how micro organisms and all of that worked yet, and decided to use PH UP to bring the PH to 6.5. I use tap water that has been left out for a few days.

In between feedings, I water with the same tap water that has been sitting out, the problem here becomes the PH rises in tap water that has been sitting out. My tap fresh off the faucet clocks in at ~7.1-7.2 and jumps to 7.8-8 after a few days of aerating. This being my first grow, I've been PHing the water DOWN to 6.5 for my regular waterings and PHing the water UP to 6.5 for nutrient feedings. I'm betting this is the cause of my eagle claws and the lower fan leaves yellowing.

I'm at day 35 with my autoflowers, anyone know if I should just leave well enough alone and stop using PH up or down?

With my next grow, I will not using PH up or down with my roots organic soil, I will just amend it with dolomite lime and let the microbes do there thing.