Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
Are you a fan of imposed socialism or voluntary socialism is the question.
If your answer is imposed, how is it any different from any other kind of system that imposes a central authority?
obama kills white people
- Thread starter UncleBuck
- Start date
If your answer is imposed, how is it any different from any other kind of system that imposes a central authority?
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
So socialism with privately owned means of production?
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
Wouldn't all means of production be "privately owned" if the means of production is merely the aggregate of INDIVIDUALS labor?
In other words, don't individuals own the results of their labor ?
If they do, then can't they trade their labor for things they want?
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
Look, I know you need attention, but grown folks is talkin. I will get around to your obfuscation later. Right now I'm correcting schuylaar who is misusing words in ways differently from the way you do but I have already been through your arguments for months.
We're just going to suspend this transaction.
yes.
see nordic model.
social capitalism. or sometimes referred as social democracy.
it works well in a place where peoples are notoriously construed as 'happy' living their life to the fullest without the anxiety of a true means of production society because their government doesn't allow this.
the peoples are #1 resource; not the means of production.
specifically at enhancing individual autonomy, promoting social mobility and ensuring the universal provision of basic human rights, as well as for stabilizing the economy, alongside a commitment to free trade. The Nordic model is distinguished from other types of welfare states by its emphasis on maximizing labor force participation, promoting gender equality, egalitarian and extensive benefit levels, the large magnitude of income redistribution, and liberal use of expansionary fiscal policy.[5]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nordic_model
if means of production is greedy; they just go out of business and fade away..the people and government cannot be leveraged for bail out.
n'awwwwwwwwwww @Rob Roy
i didn't even realize you needed my attention..i'm sorry..just so busy telling the world..you know how it is
how do you define 'free trade society'?
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
Translation = Communists like A.C. believe in the "good kind" of forced relations and thinks individual rights are secondary to the herd.
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
I'm not sure of the context you intend or your definition of society.
However free trade to me, literally means unobstructed by parties external to the trade.
well AC has come from institutionalization.. the military..same as prison for the most part.
do you like free trade? yes or no?
would you vote for this idea?:
according to the us government a full-time job is that of 40 hours per week.
mcdonalds suggested employee budget includes the income from working 2 full-time jobs at 80 hours/week..that is the expectation of means of production in america 2015..that is their solution, the employee is to work 80 hours rather than means of production giving up that penny per share or god forbid no executive level bonuses
:
according to the us government a full-time job is that of 40 hours per week.
mcdonalds suggested employee budget includes the income from working 2 full-time jobs at 80 hours/week..that is the expectation of means of production in america 2015..that is their solution, the employee is to work 80 hours rather than means of production giving up that penny per share or god forbid no executive level bonuses
:
Last edited:
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
If by "free trade" you mean free market, yes.
If you mean, I'll show you mine if you show me yours, I'd have to first warn you, I'm quite hairy and very large.
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
No. It is based in force. That's what caused the problem in the first place.
It doesn't strike any root causes and shows a fundamental misunderstanding of how to solve problems.
Ending cronyism and the government protection that is provided to corporations would be a better idea.
yes and this is precisely what social capitalism is all about.
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
Wait...you are saying social capitalism is the same as a free market?
Interesting....how so?
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
That's cute and I'm not even going to get into the merits of it. I'm just going to say that it's not socialist. It's still capitalism. Privately owned means of production, by definition, is capitalism. Oh it may be an improvement over what we have but it is capitalism. I know, you were giving the short answer, a direct yes. To be fair, the Nordic model is not completely private. The important social institutions such as health care and education are not put in private hands the way they are in Merica. To explicate your arguments charitably, I can see that you're conveying your views.
However, what I said originally still stands, you were abusing the word socialism the same way its detractors do. Obama has moved away from socialism and it shows especially with ACA. They call him socialist as a criticism and you were accepting it as endearment. Nonetheless, a socialist he is not.
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
Communism means stateless and classless society. Still waiting for that to happen. Now, privatization like you masturbate to, that's the real coercion.
Individual rights. That's clearly a euphemism for the right to violate rights.
thank you for your thoughts.
i still consider this a social capitalistic hybrid would address many of our issues if implemented.
unfortunately, as much as i like it, we are a too diverse people..too many, from too many lands..it seems to work where most people are the same with trace diversity.
EDIT: people alike would be into the better good..those that are diverse have different applications for the 'better good' based upon their respective culture..not all the same and quite subjective.
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
Mao Tse Tung called and said you should take a great leap forward, right up those basement steps and get yourself a real job young man!