No flush - white ash.

Yeah, I thought about that after I posted. Those guys were just selling books, but kushman I think knows his stuff. Though I could be mistaken in regards to kushman suggesting a flush. It very well could have been Ask Jorges section of hightimes.

Though myself personally with the general hydroponic line, I do have to cut the micro for two weeks before chop or I do taste the micro in the smoke and I do not like it. The ideal "flush" for myself is just cutting out micro for last two weeks and cutting all nutes last 3-5 days. It also helps to clean the system by removing salts in the tubes and roots(DIY aero w/ ez clone sprayers) and I have found it to be more flavorful. But this could be psychosomatic, the old placebo effect?

Here's to a fat bowlful of your own smoke, how ever you like it.

blacksun said:

#1: Flushing to fix root zone issues:

#2: "Flushing" (quotes for a reason) for the last two weeks "to make ash burn white and get rid of nute tastes!!!!11":

Click to expand...

#2 is a "pre-harvest flush", and to be fair isn't always two weeks, some 'believe' one, others 'believe' just days.

You can all have the same silly endless discussion about something as basic as giving nutes or giving water. E.g.:

- Should I water my plants?
- Should I give nutes to my plants?
- Should I do a flush?
- Should I do a pre-harvest flush?

The answer in all cases is: "it depends on..." and not a simple yes or no like you are all trying to make it on both sides of the argument.

Somehow the question/argument always gets an implied "always"

- Should I always water my plants?
- Should I always give nutes to my plants?
- Should I always do a flush?
- Should I always do a pre-harvest flush?

In which case the answer is 'always' hell no.

EVERY grow guide in the world tells to flush, even good ol george why is this if its wrong?????
i have chopped bud early without running a cleaning solution through it or plain water and it did taste chemy,

i know in my set up (dwc) this flush phenomenon DOES work.

it really pisses me off that even with all this medical community care giver crap we still don't have basic answers to basic questions.

I grow indoors and out with soiless coir and chemical ferts inside and organic outside, in both cases flushing doesn't seem to affect the burn of the final product for me. I've stopped with the long flushing, usually I stop feeding the soiless during the final week and for the organic you cant really flush it if you're using a compost/soil mix so it's pointless. Even with wines I don't think growers flush their grapes and those guys are true connoisseurs with super refined palets compared to stoners.

Lemon king said:

it really pisses me off that even with all this medical community care giver crap we still don't have basic answers to basic questions.

Click to expand...

That's the prob right there, the question and answer isn't as simple as ya'll trying to make it. Can't strip it from its context and at the same time want it to be a simple yes/no answer.

racerboy71 said:

Do you smoke your .medium ??? I personally do not, so I'll never understand why people think dumping water through a medium is going to do thing one for the taste of the buds..
Do any other farmers flush their crops ?? I grow a veggy garden every year and use chems on them.. I've never had a tomato taste like chemicals, that's for damn sure.. what makes marijuana so unique that it's gotta be flushed..??

And everyone knows that hydro grown will ever taste better than soil grown organic or Chen.. anyone who thinks is differently is simply lying to themselves..

Click to expand...

Son...Did you actually read what you wrote? You completely contradicted yourself in the same post, at least these other guys(and I use the term loosely) take a few posts to do that! So tell me then smart guy how does hydro taste different than dirt if flushing has nothing to do with it? The medium MAKES the plant uptake the heavy metals? You guys will argue abut anything, you want proof, facts and are not willing to the research or spend a couple of bucks and prove to yourself that one way or another. C'mon man with all those posts you should have a better knowledge base, or your just a cheap fucker that won't put out the $40 bucks for the test and actually learn something. sad that a member of your status is still making rookie mistakes and believing guys like UB on here and are always putting their feet in their mouths.

racerboy71 said:

And everyone knows that hydro grown will ever taste better than soil grown organic or Chen.. anyone who thinks is differently is simply lying to themselves..

Click to expand...

I'm guessing he meant 'never'... And I disagree. Anyone who thinks 'better taste' is a valid reason to grown organic instead of hydro is lying to themselves.

racerboy71 said:

And if flushing really did what you claim it does, everyone would flush.. simple as that bcuz who wants to smoke buds that taste all nasty and chemically and taste like poo??
Umm... no one.. right.. so if flushing made any difference everyone would simply flush because unflushed bud would taste like ass and nasty chemicals and no one in their right kind would buy it or smoke it.. but that's simply not true..

Click to expand...

Not everyone 'needs' to flush to get a quality tasting bud. The fact that many don't do it doesn't automatically mean it makes no difference in reality, it just means it's not "always"/standard/by default necessary. Your logic is flawed. The whole reason this topic keeps popping up is because it is NOT as simple as you amongst others want to make it.

The flush simulates the November rains.... After summer as plants near harvest the rains come in most parts of the world. Flushing is part of farming, growing and health in general. Dr's prescribe water for all manour of ailments, body builders flush out their steroids, drinking plenty of water positively effects the skin......... This process is carried out for plants outdoors by the Nov rains....... This concept is noted by meteorologists, farmers, fishermen and is prevalent in "popular media"........- Sung about by several rock and country musicians..... The "rains" come to wash away the toxins/sins of the summer........ I can think of at least 3 songs that make mention...... Fuck me!!.... there are even wall carvings that depict the Nov rains.......... Don't come and try to mislead new growers and deride time honoured methods.

George Cervantes and Kyle Kushman are not wrong. Nor are the generations of growers who have implemented this time honoured technique wrong. It is part of simulating, indoors, what the plants would experience in an outdoor season. We have a new generation of faux prophets whose weed you'll never smoke. They have found their home on the internet where they can gain popularity by suggesting you miss steps i.e decide how much veg and bloom nutes plants will have by premixing the soil once before even seeing the goddam plant.......... or by not flushing because you mixed the perfect amount of rotting veg and animal matter before you even see the size and potential of your plant. This is all just hooey being pushed around the time the "growing population" begins to, ever increasingly, resemble the general public....! Lazy growing tips for lazy growers. Putting big plants in all-in-one grow mixes, in large pots, under a 1000w light is the caveman approach to gardening.

Don't you think Advanced, Canna, Bio Bizz and GH would gladly print on their feed schedules to feed for 1 or even 2 extra weeks? It would, certainly, be in their FINANCIAL INTEREST!

Now, the No Flush might work for a limited number of highly capable organic growers, particularly outdoors. They might know their mix and plant phenotype and feed schedule inside out and be able to read exactly the levels of nutes the plant has and wants....... If you are not one of those growers you risk leaving unwanted impurities in your buds and medium. I can't see what is stupid or faddish about that??

Galvatron said:

those guys are true connoisseurs with super refined palets compared to stoners.

Click to expand...

You must think lowly of stoners then. I consider my palate for weed as quite refined. Just me personally, I can tell the difference in the buds I smoke.

This really is not that hard to get a definitive answer. Somebody just make a video and have people blindfolded and have them smell and take one or two tokes of both flushed vs. non-flushed and organic vs. hydro(you have to survey a lot of people for a more non-bias result). Tally up the result
Do it like the corporations. Why do you think pepsi had to do the taste challenge. Because taste is subjective, so majority rules in the eye of the public.

jumpy0ne said:

Don't you think Advanced, Canna, Bio Bizz and GH would gladly print on their feed schedules to feed for 1 or even 2 extra weeks? It would, certainly, be in their FINANCIAL INTEREST!

Click to expand...

This is a very good point and soooo true, I have brought this up before and it gets overlooked by the numbnuts that just want to fight and call names. If UB was here he would call them snake oil salesman with morals.

and yet dyna-gro,(not geared especially for MJ) has simple instructions for fruits and NOWHERE says to flush

Sir.Ganga said:

Son...Did you actually read what you wrote? You completely contradicted yourself in the same post, at least these other guys(and I use the term loosely) take a few posts to do that! So tell me then smart guy how does hydro taste different than dirt if flushing has nothing to do with it? The medium MAKES the plant uptake the heavy metals? You guys will argue abut anything, you want proof, facts and are not willing to the research or spend a couple of bucks and prove to yourself that one way or another. C'mon man with all those posts you should have a better knowledge base, or your just a cheap fucker that won't put out the $40 bucks for the test and actually learn something. sad that a member of your status is still making rookie mistakes and believing guys like UB on here and are always putting their feet in their mouths.

Click to expand...

ok, then tell me smart guy, why don't my veggies that i don't flush taste like chems??

and what proof do you have that flushing does anything for the taste of the buds?? you say i don't have proof it doesn't, where's you're proof that it does??

and you're right, people like uncle ben know absolutely nothing about growing cannabis, i'd much rather listen to sir ganja..

the rookie mistake is thinking that dumping water into a medium like soil is going to do dick all for the taste of the buds.. how on earth you think that works is so beyond me it's not even funny.. tell me please how dumping water through dirt makes the buds taste better, i'd love to hear it..

try and insult me when you've got more of the same as jumpy0ne did four pages back. and if flushing made a difference, why doesn't everyone do it?? no one wants crappy, chemically tasting buds that snap crackle and pop when you smoke them right?? truth is, that my buds don't taste like dog poo, nor do they snap crackle and pop when you burn them..
nor do the vegetables that i grow in the garden for a decade plus.. surely eating a food i'd taste all those nasty chemicals you claim build up in the buds ( fruit) right??

what makes cannabis so damn special that it's the only crop in the world that people feel the need to flush??

chuck estevez said:

and yet dyna-gro,(not geared especially for MJ) has simple instructions for fruits and NOWHERE says to flush

Gardens (vegetables and fruits)

Use Liquid Grow 7-9-5 and Pro-TeKt, The Silicon Solution, throughout the season to produce an abundance of succulent fruits and vegetables. Feed 1 tsp per gallon of water with every watering.

Click to expand...

well duh chuck, that's because all of the tomatoes i grow, cucumbers, peppers, squash, zuchini, cabbage, lettuce, etc, etc, etc, etc, all taste nasty and disgusting and have a funky chemical taste to them.. duh... smh..

racerboy71 said:

well duh chuck, that's because all of the tomatoes i grow, cucumbers, peppers, squash, zuchini, cabbage, lettuce, etc, etc, etc, etc, all taste nasty and disgusting and have a funky chemical taste to them.. duh... smh..

Click to expand...

Funny, i just took a Anaheim Chile from a little plant and tried a bite. Grown with Dyna-gro. It tasted like a chile. Wonder if i flushed it with some pineapple juice I could get a tangy Chile. What'cha think?

racerboy71 said:

.........and if flushing made a difference, why doesn't everyone do it?? .......

what makes cannabis so damn special that it's the only crop in the world that people feel the need to flush??

Click to expand...

Dude you're a clown. What sort of flawed logic is that?? If everyone doesn't do it then it's bollocks...... So does this apply to eating fresh fruit and vegetables? Not everyone does so it's bullshit yeah? Not everyone exercises daily. That's bullshit too then. Hahahahaha Not everybody believes what Uncle Ben says so it must be bollocks too. You sir are a grade A fool. I guess they don't need to be that smart to delete spam and sniff UB's tighty whiteys.......

It has also been well established in this thread that Cannabis is not the only crop that gets flushed.... FAR from it. Many, many other crops indoors and out are flushed. November rains.........

You're like a broken record...... Uncle Ben says..... But Uncle Ben says. Uncle Ben should stick to selling fucking rice in this growers opinion. He claims to be a myth buster lulz

racerboy71 said:

ok, then tell me smart guy, why don't my veggies that i don't flush taste like chems??

and what proof do you have that flushing does anything for the taste of the buds?? you say i don't have proof it doesn't, where's you're proof that it does??

and you're right, people like uncle ben know absolutely nothing about growing cannabis, i'd much rather listen to sir ganja..

the rookie mistake is thinking that dumping water into a medium like soil is going to do dick all for the taste of the buds.. how on earth you think that works is so beyond me it's not even funny.. tell me please how dumping water through dirt makes the buds taste better, i'd love to hear it..

try and insult me when you've got more of the same as jumpy0ne did four pages back. and if flushing made a difference, why doesn't everyone do it?? no one wants crappy, chemically tasting buds that snap crackle and pop when you smoke them right?? truth is, that my buds don't taste like dog poo, nor do they snap crackle and pop when you burn them..
nor do the vegetables that i grow in the garden for a decade plus.. surely eating a food i'd taste all those nasty chemicals you claim build up in the buds ( fruit) right??

what makes cannabis so damn special that it's the only crop in the world that people feel the need to flush??

Click to expand...

Spend the $40 and find out for yourself...Sadly bud your veggies should be tested also. If flushing doesn't do anything, then there should not be a flavor difference from hydro to organic like you say.. My Hydro grown bud comes back clean as a whistle every time. I test 3 times a year not just for me and my piece of mind but for my patients also.

jondamon said:

I haven't flushed my chemically fed plants in nearly 2 years.

Clean white ash, no chem taste, no snap crackle and pop etc etc.


Flushing is something OLD SKOOL growers had to do because of over feeding.




J

Click to expand...

the feeding charts/schedule for most of the hydro foods i can remember would advise to feed water only for the last 2 weeks of the crop
many of these same companies sell "flush" products lol, they propagate this myth of metallic tasting weed/fruit
newbies and older growers buy into this
flushing is pretty standard advice on many if not most forums i have seen i would think it is pretty much the norm
folk such as myself who do not flush their plants are in the minority, flushing is just extra work to me

i haven't flushed hydro plants since the early 1990s
also i never replace the nutrients every 2 weeks as instructed by most of the food companies
topping up the food to maintain the desired EC works perfectly
(nutrient imbalance) is the scare tactic used to con folk into replacing food every 2 weeks , spending more money

i notice my plants do not use very much food towards the end, it is not necessary to feed them (top up) for the last 2 weeks or so as the EC does not lower itself very much at all , EC will stay at 1.5 to 2.0 until harvest

peace

I've still never subjected myself to a colonic, the people version of a flush. Cheerios shouldn't count. But anyway, isn't the idea only appropriate if you've ingested something wrong (or, e.g., undigested red meat perhaps)? Anyway, put me down as another who sees flushing plant as a last resort to fix a major salt problem.

So, should I flush or not? LOL. Sorry just making myself laugh.

I tried to find some scientific research results conclusive to this topic, but after reading a few from New Zealand's Massey University about hydroponics and flavor in relation to salt content, this was the best essay I could find. I think the research was bias on the grounds that it was performed by the state in order to convince farmer's that using hydroponics and cheap chemical multi purpose fertilizers like Peters brand fertilizers they could achieve a successful harvest comparable to soil. That is bad science in my opinion, supporting non renewable petroleum based fertilizers instead of developing a more sustainable renewable organic alternative using home brew teas and compost from organic used matter produced by farms on hand. But it's all about a lazy buck.

http://mro.massey.ac.nz/handle/10179/2816 The essay is I think the bottom folder/download PDF link. The other folder is the index.

My opinion to the side, results stated that out of ec levels of 2, 4, 6, tomatoes grown at ec 6 produced fullest flavor and healthiest fruit. I did not see anything about a water wash or for that matter a complete feeding schedule index which I was surprised that for a dissertation it did not include a comprehensive feeding schedule at all. Just mentioned at what ec they grew the tomatoes at i.e. 2, 4, 6, and it was nft vs. peat with the nft out performing the peat.

This was just one nice long study, I'll try to find more. However this will not change my feeding system, still going water wash with the general h line. Side by side my buds taste more like what I prefer that way. Others do it as you find most pleasurable for you. If anyone else has some good research relevant to the topic I'd like to check it out. As they say cooler heads prevail and knowledge is king. Cheers.

I feel it is like cooking, two people can use the same exact ingredients to cook the same dish and still arrive at different flavors. I've gave clones to buddies many times and though we all use the same nutes, the buds always taste slightly and sometimes very different. Better or worse is only relevant to the person taking the puff.

PS: to elaborate on the bias in the study. In the study they used three fertilizers, but all Peters. Which means Peters probably sponsored the study since research is expensive and someone working on their dissertation would need some financial consideration. If the study would have included three totally unrelated fertilizer companies I would not venture to assume it was bias. You know like Peter's paying handsomely for favorable results that way they could push their ferties on the new hydro farmers of New Zealand. Boy what a mouthful. Cheers.

Dude you drown the plant in water and it makes all the bad toxins go away, just like magnetic bracelets.