New newie got 1800W COB LED’s needs advice

Canadain Closet Gardener said:

You didn't do anything really wrong but trust a sales person at a retail store. Not all retail employees are like this but some can be. Especially if manufacturers give incentives to retail employees to push their products. I've been a manager at a sports retailer, Merch Manager for VS and have been a part of this . Adidas sent me to Bermuda a few times for being the top a sales person. Alot salespersons get gift cards, gifts and clothing as sales incentives. With hydro stores it's alot of they have had this product on the shelf for years.

How tall is your tent?

Cheers
CCG

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Hi, it’s 2metres tall. I emailed the dude from the shop & he has been really great, he said they have rethought that package with the size of the tent to include another panel of LEDS which he’s given to me free & he has also thrown in 2 CFLS with shades etc all delivered free of charge & he has setup & sent me pics of the entire thing with detailed instructions. I am pretty impressed with his customer service.

Oh & my seeds arrived today from Seedsman so I’m a happy girl

GBAUTO said:

Sounds like you need a bigger house...

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LOL - 1000 sq feet is plenty big enough for the two of us. What I REALLY need is a bigger yard, in a rural area, so I could do an outdoor grow..

Lucky Luke said:

Its a fairly big house... Kids have left home and the wife and I are thinking of downsizing to a smaller 2 or 3 bedroom place ( i recon two bedroom would be fine but she wants 3- fk knows what for..) Trouble is finding one with large enough shed space.

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There you go with that "shed" thing again... LOL

Neto said:

Hi, it’s 2metres tall. I emailed the dude from the shop & he has been really great, he said they have rethought that package with the size of the tent to include another panel of LEDS which he’s given to me free & he has also thrown in 2 CFLS with shades etc all delivered free of charge & he has setup & sent me pics of the entire thing with detailed instructions. I am pretty impressed with his customer service.

Oh & my seeds arrived today from Seedsman so I’m a happy girl

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Hi Neto, well far be it from me to cast aspersions on the salesman's good intentions, but have you considered that he's really just trying to keep from taking back those overpriced lights (if they're the ones on the website, they're advertising them for $675 per light, so if that's right you're already in for over $1300)? I could be wrong, but from my experience a lot of retail grow light sellers aren't much better than used car salesmen, and not really well informed as others have pointed out (ergo his having to rethink the package when imo he should have gotten it right the first time).

So if you haven't already committed entirely to the deal, I'd slow down and reconsider. If your seeds are just arriving, you aren't going to need those lights for at least 2-3 weeks so you have time to get something better. But if it's a done deal then I guess you'll just have to make the best of it and just see how your plants do using them. It seems like you're fairly new at this, or is it just the lighting? Just curious, cuz I figure if you have some xp growing mj then you'll be able to tell from the yield whether those lights are working for you, otherwise you might consider posting a grow log and let folks here help you out and give you advice as you grow.

And just remember for future reference don't hesitate to ask for advice BEFORE you buy, lol, I know cuz I've been there and done that, being the impatient type myself I've often put the horse before the cart. But sometimes making our own mistakes is the best way to learn, good luck with your grow ;?)

i have to agree. his profit margin is prob so obscene on those garbage lights that hed rather sell 3 or 4 or 5 for $1300 than give back the $1300.

and anybody who would recommend 80 lm/W CFLs in 2018 knows absolutely nothing about lighting and surely shouldnt be relied upon for advice.

not trying to poo-poo your situation just trying to be straight

Lucky Luke said:

You seem to be assuming I'm anti LED. I'm not at all.

I'm merely pointing out that the LED industry needs a standard so owners of them like the OP, and lets face it we see a thread like this every day get and understand what they are paying for.

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You seem to be assuming that the "industry" operates as a collective, and that unscrupulous companies give a crap about you, me, their customers, or other sellers. Those sellers simply lie, so there is little the good guys can do to combat that.

The tactics the bad guys use are simple: cherry pick numbers, misrepresent them in whatever fashion they think might sound good to uneducated buyers, and then don't waste time standing behind their products. That doesn't mean there aren't good sellers out there, or that you shouldn't invest a bit of time educating yourself so you can benefit from reliable and efficient technology. CobKits already said something important - that we all got burned buying crumby LEDs at first. You're on the right track though, as this forum is a great resource for figuring out what's bunk and what's worth your money.

The bad guys sell crappy lights or, at best, massively over state their specs. What they do would be like Nissan saying their Maxima sedan is a 750 horsepower car. The logic behind that would be that you could rebuild the internals and add a big honkin' turbocharger and intercooler system, new injectors, new ignition system, a new computer to control it all, and a new transaxle to transfer the power to the wheels, and get 750 HP out of it. This assumes that the engine block could handle 750 HP and ignores the fact that the engine, as sold, puts out about 300 HP at the crank, or 250+ at the wheels. By your logic, Nissan making a wildly false claim would be the car industry's fault, make GM and BMW untrustworthy (in your eyes), and might convince you to stick to a horse and buggy because you know 1 horse = 1 HP, by definition.

I don't mean to be as confrontational as I probably sound, so I apologize if you see it that way, but my point is that the good guys in the LED "industry" do promote real, quantifiable standards, and should not be held at fault for the scammers out there, as they have absolutely no way to force the shady folks to stick to truth, facts, and science. You also seem to be saying that the rapid evolution of LED grow light technology, and the advancement of emerging or future components, somehow invalidates current products, which I don't understand; yes, LEDs are changing all the time, but if particular COBs or whatever are good today, they won't be obsolete. Of course you can stick to HPS or whatever technology works for you, which is never a bad idea, but I dig efficiency and lower costs over time.

Again, please take no offense, as I'm just some idiot on the internet trying to put things in perspective, so pardon the manifesto. You do have to buy form a good source (there are lots of them), but if you do it right, LEDs can do anything HPS can do - except heat, LOL.

emepher said:

You seem to be assuming that the "industry" operates as a collective, and that unscrupulous companies give a crap about you, me, their customers, or other sellers. Those sellers simply lie, so there is little the good guys can do to combat that.

The tactics the bad guys use are simple: cherry pick numbers, misrepresent them in whatever fashion they think might sound good to uneducated buyers, and then don't waste time standing behind their products. That doesn't mean there aren't good sellers out there, or that you shouldn't invest a bit of time educating yourself so you can benefit from reliable and efficient technology. CobKits already said something important - that we all got burned buying crumby LEDs at first. You're on the right track though, as this forum is a great resource for figuring out what's bunk and what's worth your money.

The bad guys sell crappy lights or, at best, massively over state their specs. What they do would be like Nissan saying their Maxima sedan is a 750 horsepower car. The logic behind that would be that you could rebuild the internals and add a big honkin' turbocharger and intercooler system, new injectors, new ignition system, a new computer to control it all, and a new transaxle to transfer the power to the wheels, and get 750 HP out of it. This assumes that the engine block could handle 750 HP and ignores the fact that the engine, as sold, puts out about 300 HP at the crank, or 250+ at the wheels. By your logic, Nissan making a wildly false claim would be the car industry's fault, make GM and BMW untrustworthy (in your eyes), and might convince you to stick to a horse and buggy because you know 1 horse = 1 HP, by definition.

I don't mean to be as confrontational as I probably sound, so I apologize if you see it that way, but my point is that the good guys in the LED "industry" do promote real, quantifiable standards, and should not be held at fault for the scammers out there, as they have absolutely no way to force the shady folks to stick to truth, facts, and science. You also seem to be saying that the rapid evolution of LED grow light technology, and the advancement of emerging or future components, somehow invalidates current products, which I don't understand; yes, LEDs are changing all the time, but if particular COBs or whatever are good today, they won't be obsolete. Of course you can stick to HPS or whatever technology works for you, which is never a bad idea, but I dig efficiency and lower costs over time.

Again, please take no offense, as I'm just some idiot on the internet trying to put things in perspective, so pardon the manifesto. You do have to buy form a good source (there are lots of them), but if you do it right, LEDs can do anything HPS can do - except heat, LOL.

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No offence taken you can be an idiot where ever you choose to.


I just connected up 1, 25 ish watt Strip..man they are bright! Glad I didn't spend the money on Cobs or QB.

Lucky Luke said:

No offence taken you can be an idiot where ever you choose to.


I just connected up 1, 25 ish watt Strip..man they are bright! Glad I didn't spend the money on Cobs or QB.

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Just received a handful of Sammie F strips myself...

Maybe look at getting a tent then box that in with styrofoam if it gets super cold.
You will still have the issue of having to suck in cold air in constantly unless you also run CO2.

ANC said:

Maybe look at getting a tent then box that in with styrofoam if it gets super cold.
You will still have the issue of having to suck in cold air in constantly unless you also run CO2.

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no thanks ANZ. I'm all good with whats working.
Remember I'm not growing very much.

Yeah, scale makes a difference, and if it is only for yourself, it is fine if you miss out on some yield.
I'm also doing a small run at the moment luckily the temperatures and stuff were quite good the whole time so I am not doing much to control it. Ran the aircon twice for the plants when it was getting testy with the heat.

nfhiggs said:

Just received a handful of Sammie F strips myself...

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Nice!
How many W fixture are you building and why did you decide to go strips over Cobs or QB's?

ANC said:

Yeah, scale makes a difference, and if it is only for yourself, it is fine if you miss out on some yield.
I'm also doing a small run at the moment luckily the temperatures and stuff were quite good the whole time so I am not doing much to control it. Ran the aircon twice for the plants when it was getting testy with the heat.

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Yea, I'm happy just in a 4 x 4. Illegal here and don't want to go to big. From what ive picked up over my limited time on RIU you grow on a much larger scale (and get away with it!)

Lucky Luke said:

Nice!
How many W fixture are you building and why did you decide to go strips over Cobs or QB's?

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This will be a 150W fixture for my 2x3 veg cabinet. I've been a strip convert since last summer. I already have a strip fixture made from second tier Samsung Acuity strips, its running at 320W currently over a 2x4 ft space. I may order some more soon for the other side of my flower cabinet (another 2x4 ft)

nfhiggs said:

This will be a 150W fixture for my 2x3 veg cabinet. I've been a strip convert since last summer. I already have a strip fixture made from second tier Samsung Acuity strips, its running at 320W currently over a 2x4 ft space. I may order some more soon for the other side of my flower cabinet (another 2x4 ft)

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Your running a small veg and flower like me.
My veg area is 1.6 x 1.6 and my flower is a 4ft x 4ft.
I'm looking to add a separate clone area that will be fairly small, not sure on the size but one of the small cabinets that sometimes sit above a sink. I'm thinking one 25 ish W strip will suffice.

nfhiggs said:

This will be a 150W fixture for my 2x3 veg cabinet. I've been a strip convert since last summer. I already have a strip fixture made from second tier Samsung Acuity strips, its running at 320W currently over a 2x4 ft space. I may order some more soon for the other side of my flower cabinet (another 2x4 ft)

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I like your style. I just built a 10-strip light for my 2x3 scrog, using acuity strips. I still have a shot ton of strips to build with. My 5x5 tent has 2 2'x4' overhead fixtures (15 22" strips in each capable of around 360 watts per light fixture), 16 48" strips around the perimeter for side lighting, and I'm about to put horizontal lighting between the 4 plants in there. Oh, and the bidcage fixture for my solo cup grow

I loves me some led strips!

fearnoevil said:

Hi Neto, well far be it from me to cast aspersions on the salesman's good intentions, but have you considered that he's really just trying to keep from taking back those overpriced lights (if they're the ones on the website, they're advertising them for $675 per light, so if that's right you're already in for over $1300)? I could be wrong, but from my experience a lot of retail grow light sellers aren't much better than used car salesmen, and not really well informed as others have pointed out (ergo his having to rethink the package when imo he should have gotten it right the first time).

So if you haven't already committed entirely to the deal, I'd slow down and reconsider. If your seeds are just arriving, you aren't going to need those lights for at least 2-3 weeks so you have time to get something better. But if it's a done deal then I guess you'll just have to make the best of it and just see how your plants do using them. It seems like you're fairly new at this, or is it just the lighting? Just curious, cuz I figure if you have some xp growing mj then you'll be able to tell from the yield whether those lights are working for you, otherwise you might consider posting a grow log and let folks here help you out and give you advice as you grow.

And just remember for future reference don't hesitate to ask for advice BEFORE you buy, lol, I know cuz I've been there and done that, being the impatient type myself I've often put the horse before the cart. But sometimes making our own mistakes is the best way to learn, good luck with your grow ;?)

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Thanks for the reply. I am a bit deflated now & feel a bit of a dick for thinking how awesome the guy is. Oh well I have asked a few others & have mixed answers about these LEDs so I’ll give these a good go. I am not xp at all, my first time, my partner has some limited xp. I appreciate all the help & advice. Should I be adding some others?? how should I layout the lighting in 2m x 2m x2m tent?

Neto said:

Thanks for the reply. I am a bit deflated now & feel a bit of a dick for thinking how awesome the guy is. Oh well I have asked a few others & have mixed answers about these LEDs so I’ll give these a good go. I am not xp at all, my first time, my partner has some limited xp. I appreciate all the help & advice. Should I be adding some others?? how should I layout the lighting in 2m x 2m x2m tent?

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All lights grow good pot (even CFL's). So don't be to deflated.
You will find indoor growing is a bit of an addiction so what we all have is always being changed and what we did use can often be used as something else..

Neto said:

Thanks for the reply. I am a bit deflated now & feel a bit of a dick for thinking how awesome the guy is. Oh well I have asked a few others & have mixed answers about these LEDs so I’ll give these a good go. I am not xp at all, my first time, my partner has some limited xp. I appreciate all the help & advice. Should I be adding some others?? how should I layout the lighting in 2m x 2m x2m tent?

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First off Neto, how many plants are you planning on putting in the tent? I don't know how many seeds you bought, but if this is your first time, then please read a lot on how to germinate seeds, as that is where so many newbies make mistakes and just kill a bunch of expensive seeds, happens to almost everyone starting out.

That's one reason I encourage beginners to start with an inexpensive and easy strain so you won't feel too bad if you don't have success right away. Also it's a good idea to start just half your seeds, see if your technique works then either make adjustments or just repeat for success (iow, don't put all your eggs in one basket). I have a fairly foolproof method, but it's detailed so just pm me if you want and I'll shoot you a link.

Once you figure how many plants you want, or end up with (best laid plans of mice and men etc, etc ;?) you can figure out how you want to arrange the lights. As I understand it, they gave you one more of the 320W led panels and 2 CFL's (what wattage?). Also the number of plants versus the size of your tent is to some extent going to dictate how long you're going to veg your plants - for example fewer plants = more space = longer veg time, and vice versa. A lot also depends on the strain - largely indica usually means shorter and bushier, more sativa means taller, lankier and more stretch when you flip to flower.

Plus don't know what system are you going with? Straight soil, some form of hydroponics? Imo, the easiest for beginners is actually a form of hydro called Hempy Buckets - it's a DTW or Drain To Waste, which means you don't need any fancy reservoir with pumps, no chillers, no worries about keeping pH balanced in the res, and if something goes wrong in your res then all the plants can be affected even killed.

You basically start with a bucket that has a hole drilled about an inch or two from the bottom, then fill it with a medium that consists of coco coir and perlite in a 60/40 mix although that can vary 10% either way. You could add a small percent of organic soil but it's not needed and imo it's better to start simple with a well-proven method that is really hard to screw up, lol. Then you just mix up your nutes and then water your hempy buckets until about 5%-10% of the solution runs out the hole. Just have to figure out how often your particular plant/bucket needs to be watered and it's just that easy.

Straight soil is good if you know what you're doing, having some previous gardening experience helps, but if you make a mistake like feeding too high a nute concentration or too often, these conditions can be much harder to correct. There's also some other issues you can read about, but these are just suggestions in case you haven't already decided which way to go.

Btw. sorry for such a long response, bad habit, lol, but as you can see there's lots of information that's needed in order to make decisions and to give good, accurate advice. That's why, if you have the time, I encourage you to start a grow log in that section of RIU. That way you can put all this information out there and others can give you advice (some good, some bad, you'll have to figure that out on your own) and it'll help you get through the rough parts and you can also check fellow RIU'ers grow logs as well. In fact you can get a lot of ideas from reading about the experiences others are having, some you'll be able to relate too and help keep you from making the same mistakes, and also lots of good ideas you can borrow. If you haven't fallen asleep reading this, lol, good luck and good growing ;?)

Lucky Luke said:

All lights grow good pot (even CFL's). So don't be to deflated.
You will find indoor growing is a bit of an addiction so what we all have is always being changed and what we did use can often be used as something else..

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Well that's a rather broad statement and I'd have to differ in that, yes all lights will grow pot, but not all lights grow GOOD pot. Perhaps better to say that all decent grow lights have the potential to grow good pot, not to pick too fine a nit, lol.