mixing cal/mag products into coco right from the transplant?

4

40sdroppinhot

Well-Known Member
Hey guys I have been doing a couple plants as an experiment with osmocote+ (dont judge lol) and it has actually been going exceptionally at least through veg.
Really the only issue has been the increased cal/mag into from them being in coco. I am trying to have the best of both worlds, the osmocote to save time mixing nutes up, and the hydro-esque growth characteristics of coco.

I was curious if anybody has tried mixing there calmag supplements into their media at the beginning?
I know people in soil use dolomite lime for this, but I also know it raises PH in the media. Which I assume would cause an issue in coco??

Anybody have any thought or ideas?
I was contemplating like a mix of peat/coco/dolomite to balance the ph out with the OC+ mixed in?
 
xtsho

xtsho

Well-Known Member
spek9 said:
@xtsho grows exclusively in coco and might be able to provide some insight as far as his strategy goes.
Click to expand...
My thoughts are to treat coco like hydro and feed every watering. I think if you want to mix everything in then just mix your own soil. There are people doing good using coco and adding amendments but most end up having issues down the road. That's not to say that coco can't be used instead of peat in a soil mix. But just coco, timed released fertilizer, and lime isn't something I would do but the OP is doing an experiment so I say give it a try. I'd like to see how it turns out. But they should do a side by side. One coco treated like hydro and fed every watering and one done with the blend the OP mentioned. That way you could see the difference between the two methods.

Also, although I grow mostly in coco I've been playing around with soil I mix myself. So far the results have been good. I've grown in soil before but I find it economically unacceptable to pay what they charge for bagged soil on an ongoing basis. I make my own compost, am setting up a worm farm, and already purchased 40 - 50 lb bags of many amendments, like kelp, alfalfa, shellfish meal, etc... My goal is to move from blumats and coco to blumats and living soil. As much as I like growing in coco I only really use it for cannabis but I grow a very wide variety of other plants in soil. I want to just mix up batches of soil and use it for everything. Flowers, houseplants, and of course cannabis. I want to simplify things as much as I can. Instead of rehydrating coco and mixing nutes, adjusting pH, I just want to fill a pot with soil and grow.
 
4

40sdroppinhot

Well-Known Member
xtsho said:
My thoughts are to treat coco like hydro and feed every watering. I think if you want to mix everything in then just mix your own soil. There are people doing good using coco and adding amendments but most end up having issues down the road. That's not to say that coco can't be used instead of peat in a soil mix. But just coco, timed released fertilizer, and lime isn't something I would do but the OP is doing an experiment so I say give it a try. I'd like to see how it turns out. But they should do a side by side. One coco treated like hydro and fed every watering and one done with the blend the OP mentioned. That way you could see the difference between the two methods.

Also, although I grow mostly in coco I've been playing around with soil I mix myself. So far the results have been good. I've grown in soil before but I find it economically unacceptable to pay what they charge for bagged soil on an ongoing basis. I make my own compost, am setting up a worm farm, and already purchased 40 - 50 lb bags of many amendments, like kelp, alfalfa, shellfish meal, etc... My goal is to move from blumats and coco to blumats and living soil. As much as I like growing in coco I only really use it for cannabis but I grow a very wide variety of other plants in soil. I want to just mix up batches of soil and use it for everything. Flowers, houseplants, and of course cannabis. I want to simplify things as much as I can. Instead of rehydrating coco and mixing nutes, adjusting pH, I just want to fill a pot with soil and grow.
Click to expand...
well so far my initial side by side, during veg, of the osmocote + vs dynagro was hands down no contest in favor of the OC (honestly was shocked).
Just trying to see if I can take this a step further. I really really think adding dolomite too the coco will give me ph issues though.

How do you like those blu mats btw? I did an experiment with one of those last year as I loved the concept, but couldnt get it to leach correctly.
 
xtsho

xtsho

Well-Known Member
40sdroppinhot said:
well so far my initial side by side, during veg, of the osmocote + vs dynagro was hands down no contest in favor of the OC (honestly was shocked).
Just trying to see if I can take this a step further. I really really think adding dolomite too the coco will give me ph issues though.

How do you like those blu mats btw? I did an experiment with one of those last year as I loved the concept, but couldnt get it to leach correctly.
Click to expand...
I don't know anything about Dyna-Gro other than I use their neem oil. Now you have me curious and I might just do my own side by side with the VitaGrow I've been using for years. I have everything on hand to mix up a coco mix. What Osmocote are you using?

Have you thought of using gypsum for the calcium? It has sulfur as well and is pH neutral.

Blumats are the best thing since sliced bread. 100% coco. No perlite. It's not needed. And just basic hydro nutrients like Jacks, VitaGrow, Masterblend, etc... All 3 of those use calcium nitrate which eliminates any calcium issues with coco. Fill up the reservoir, set the carrots, and walk away. Watering by hand sucks. Plus with blumats you can grow in coco and not have to deal with runoff.
 
xtsho

xtsho

Well-Known Member

Gypsum as a soil amendment

I plan on using gypsum as a soil amendment. I've found prilled and agricultural grade soluble gypsum. Is one better than the other? Im mainly wondering if the soluble will wash out of the soil faster making the prilled a longer lasting option. I may be overthinking it ;)
www.rollitup.org
 
4

40sdroppinhot

Well-Known Member
xtsho said:
I don't know anything about Dyna-Gro other than I use their neem oil. Now you have me curious and I might just do my own side by side with the VitaGrow I've been using for years. I have everything on hand to mix up a coco mix. What Osmocote are you using?

Have you thought of using gypsum for the calcium? It has sulfur as well and is pH neutral.

Blumats are the best thing since sliced bread. 100% coco. No perlite. It's not needed. And just basic hydro nutrients like Jacks, VitaGrow, Masterblend, etc... All 3 of those use calcium nitrate which eliminates any calcium issues with coco. Fill up the reservoir, set the carrots, and walk away. Watering by hand sucks. Plus with blumats you can grow in coco and not have to deal with runoff.
Click to expand...
I am using the osmocote+ for veg and about to switch to flower here soon with a top dress of the regular OC 14-14-14.... wattsaver has done a ton of the legwork on this issue for us already. But so far, I am honestly blown away and it has cut down a big chunk on my time.

A Real K.I.S.S. Growing Method - Soilponics

I normally wouldn’t share something like this but it really works, and I’ve been doing it for over 3yrs now. It is the simplest and easiest growing style I know of. I am not saying you will grow the biggest baldest plants with this system, but you will be able to grow well above average plants...
www.rollitup.org

he has a few other threads as well, but that was the beginner one I believe. DocBud (before he did the high brixx stuff) also did a bunch of experimentation and side by sides.

I will look into the gypsum! for some reason I had it stuck in my head that it adjusted ph up like dolomite did.....
Now I just have to find an amendment source of magnesium and I will be fully good to go!
I have been beyond busy lately.... but if your interested I will try to shoot you a pm with how things go into flower and what solutions I found.

As far as the blumats that is what i was initially looking at but I was just so nervous of one of them failing or something. I ended up just building a drip system. Like you said though, I have some strains drinking faster then others and have to deal with the runoff on some of them.
My bold move is going to be setting them on flood tables and still watering dtw, hoping that the strains drinking more will suck up the water from the ones drinking less, and if I keep that runoff to a minimal hopefully avoid the rot! Fingers crossed. (long term plans are to only run a hybrid, a sativa, and an indica, but im am still in the process of finding my indica and hybrid keepers.)
 
Cinco

Cinco

Well-Known Member
This is my first grow in coco, and first grow where I’ve had the time and equipment to do most things right, and I’ve had some good success. 7 weeks from seed in this photo. I fertigate 2x daily at around 1.5 EC nutes, and supplement 0.3 EC CALiMAGic in there once a week.

I also have a whole boatload of other plants (herbs, peppers) in coco. I have hydrated and used 15kg of coco brick this season so far. I love it, but it took a little adjustment to the way I was used to growing in soil.

I am running 80/20 coco coir and hydroton, I don’t like perlite. I have some other plants in pure coco and they are fine as well. I am mixed in whether coco needs aeration yet. The longer coarser fibres are better for this.

My best success has been following guidelines of hydrating and then rinsing the coco until runoff EC is within range of tap, and then buffering x2 for at least 6 hours each in a 5.8-6.0 pH heavy calmag solution. Drain in between, and then rinse after. Ready to plant.

In every instance where I did not do this, I had calcium lockout issues within a few weeks and the medium needed to be flushed. Have not had any issues since.

So, I don’t see why it wouldn’t work the same with Osmocote, once the coco is buffered it’s mostly neutral as I understand and experience.
 

Attachments

Last edited:
4

40sdroppinhot

Well-Known Member
Cinco said:
This is my first grow in coco, and first grow where I’ve had the time and equipment to do most things right, and I’ve had some good success. 7 weeks from seed in this photo. I fertigate 2x daily at around 1.5 EC nutes, and supplement 0.3 EC CALiMAGic in there once a week.

I also have a whole boatload of other plants (herbs, peppers) in coco. I have hydrated and used 15kg of coco brick this season so far. I love it, but it took a little adjustment to the way I was used to growing in soil.

I am running 80/20 coco coir and hydroton, I don’t like perlite. I have some other plants in pure coco and they are fine as well. I am mixed in whether coco needs aeration yet. The longer coarser fibres are better for this.

My best success has been following guidelines of hydrating and then rinsing the coco until runoff EC is within range of tap, and then buffering x2 for at least 6 hours each in a 5.8-6.0 pH heavy calmag solution. Drain in between, and then rinse after. Ready to plant.

In every instance where I did not do this, I had calcium lockout issues within a few weeks and the medium needed to be flushed. Have not had any issues since.

So, I don’t see why it wouldn’t work the same with Osmocote, once the coco is buffered it’s mostly neutral as I understand and experience.
Click to expand...
I WANT to say the coco pearl I use is pre buffered, but maybe not because I do run into calmag issues even with 120 ppm (x700 scale) tap water.
That said, I do a long two month veg and dont generally run into issues until week 5-6.

What ppm (and scale) has your buffering water been? or what calmag dose I should say
 
Cinco

Cinco

Well-Known Member
40sdroppinhot said:
I WANT to say the coco pearl I use is pre buffered, but maybe not because I do run into calmag issues even with 120 ppm (x700 scale) tap water.
That said, I do a long two month veg and dont generally run into issues until week 5-6.

What ppm (and scale) has your buffering water been? or what calmag dose I should say
Click to expand...
Yeah, the coco I use is supposed to be washed and buffered too, be wary because I had one brick that was fine (well, 0.8 EC or [email protected]) and the others wee all through the roof, 3.2 EC on some ([email protected]). I had crinkled new growth and obvious calcium deficiency (never saw any mag deficiency signs) even with adding Calmag at every feed. Then I tested PPM of the runoff and it was way too high. Did a slurry test with my prepared coco, and it was super salty.

So now I just wash it well anyway, even though I hate doing it. I use a big (114l? I think) plastic tote and drilled a ton of 6mm holes in the bottom, and then use the garden hose to let it flush for 30-45 minutes until the runoff is same as my water.

Then I let that drain and place that tub inside another non-drilled one so it holds water, and then fill it all with CaliMagic @ 7.5ml per 4l of tap water pH’d to 6.0 (anywhere within coco PH range is fine, 5.5-6.5).

I let it go 6-8 hours, then lift the inner tub and drain and dump the calmag solution. Then I buffer it again with another solution of the same, for the same time.

This is 1.5x the dose indicated on the bottle, with the idea that it will buffer and exchange for sodium at all the cation exchange sites within the coco coir.

I can’t remember what ppm that comes out to, but I can sure check for you tomorrow if you need. I want to say it’s around 1.0EC, [email protected].
 
Last edited:
4

40sdroppinhot

Well-Known Member
Cinco said:
Yeah, the coco I use is supposed to be washed and buffered too, be wary because I had one brick that was fine (well, 0.8 EC or [email protected]) and the others wee all through the roof, 3.2 EC on some ([email protected]). I had crinkled new growth and obvious calcium deficiency (never saw any mag deficiency signs) even with adding Calmag at every feed. Then I tested PPM of the runoff and it was way too high. Did a slurry test with my prepared coco, and it was super salty.

So now I just wash it well anyway, even though I hate doing it. I use a big (114l? I think) plastic tote and drilled a ton of 6mm holes in the bottom, and then use the garden hose to let it flush for 30-45 minutes until the runoff is same as my water.

Then I let that drain and place that tub inside another non-drilled one so it holds water, and then fill it all with CaliMagic @ 7.5ml per 4l of tap water pH’d to 6.0 (anywhere within coco PH range is fine, 5.5-6.5).

I let it go 6-8 hours, then lift the inner tub and drain and dump the calmag solution. Then I buffer it again with another solution of the same, for the same time.

This is 1.5x the dose indicated on the bottle, with the idea that it will buffer and exchange for sodium at all the cation exchange sites within the coco coir.

I can’t remember what ppm that comes out to, but I can sure check for you tomorrow if you need. I want to say it’s around 1.0EC, [email protected].
Click to expand...

hey thank you mate I really appreciate that! I have never buffered before, i always just did the first water after transplant with a decent calmag dose and called it good lol. Wonder if that was my issue all along :/

the amount of coco I need.... my god I hope thats not the issue because it doesn't really seem feasible lol
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top