LED is it worth it/

hellraizer30

Rebel From The North
well was looking into it and its pricy but has any of you got a opion on
this, low watts the right light and low heat sounds good but it seem to
good to be true.
 

Hidden Agenda

Well-Known Member
The answer is, not yet.

LED's may be the future, but HID's are still king of today, and next year at this time that answer will be the same.

Check back in 5-10 years, and maybe we'll be growing a pound every two weeks under 500 watts of light :D
 

hellraizer30

Rebel From The North
you have a good link to a shop that has these lights im a newbie and
ive seem hps and mh and led but hid havnt seen to much on that.
 

groprofosho

Well-Known Member
keep your eyes on ebay. i found pallats of LED's that have hugely increased bud production and speed. Found them for 20 bucks a pop, 500 lights each, 20 watts. They used to be old rail car signs. The gov. will have auctions once and awhile. You want to find the red ones primarily with a few blue in there as well. They are the way of the future but are best used with other traditional lighting like HPS and MH. Nasa currently uses led's to grow in space.
 

Mantis

Active Member
About waiting 5 or more years?!! Not true at all. Technology is increasing exponentially always. There could be something new released next month that revolutionizes growing altogether, there has already been new information and data from studies showing exciting findings about flowering plants.. Anyway, The technology is not new. It has been around for a very long time, but it is just now starting to become more heavily focused upon, as it is obviously a better and more efficient way to grow plants. Imagine if you could have the same intensity, or more than you do now, say using a HPS and a MH both together for vegging, with LED's and much less heat and electricity usage, well there are so many issues to be addressed as to the greatness of the new technology.

If you use LED's for vegetative, and have them set up properly, well at the moment they work great but do cost a lot. (My 12"x12" Blue 225 LED panel was $70 - good for one plant I'd say.) I can see them working really good for SCROG keeping a perfectly level canopy and adjusting it however you wish to instigate upward or outward growth.. If you keep the lights directly on the leaves, as in touching the canopy, they will just get bushier and remain happy, and lower growth will continue. If you raise the lights about an inch to 3 inches above tops, they will reach upward in a day or 2 and take over that space, making the plant taller. New growth is always extremely perfect looking, uniform, symmetrical, and lush. This is my first time using an LED panel and I decided to use it on one plant to dedicate the intensity to 1 square foot, for one plant in a 5 gallon pot.

I have LST trained the plant so far and it is at day 63 Veg now. The main top has come around the entire inside of the pot and I have run out of room. Next I'll raise the LED panel up an inch at a time until the bushy canopy reaches the lights again. When Im satisfied with the height Ill start flowering. I can easily keep it bushing out farther and farther and continue to tie down branches, but I have already gone well over my 1 square foot space.

I am also using a High Output Fluorescent with red/blue spectrum. The LED's are supposedly at this point in the technology, meant to be supplemental.. This is true if you want to greatly increase your yield. You can absoultely grow cannabis and other plants solely using LED's.

The LED panel does give the absolute most correct, pure spectrum of blue light best for vegetative growth. Using a HPS solely for vegging is wasting a lot of light, energy, money, time.. You are really heavy in the red spectrum with a HPS and deficient in blue spectrum. Sure HPS will work great and you can get awesome results using all the way through, but the fact of the matter is, you can take away about 70 percent of that light (most of the red spectrum) and then you would be using less energy, and have less heat, but still have the same amount of light output in the blue spectrum.

Nasa has been developing and contributing to the ongoing innovations in LED growing technology for growing plants in outer space. LED's also have an extremely long life so it would be an obvious choice for long space missions. Astronauts say the thing they miss most while in space is fresh salads and veggies. I bet they miss fresh GANJA TOO lol.

This is my first post here..

These are just some random thoughts from reading your posts guys and girls so let me know what you think; I would love to talk about this more!
 

Thebot

Well-Known Member
HID's describe a group of lights (high intensity discharge) . Some in this category are HPS and MH.
still he was correct in saying that HID's are the king of today regardless of mh or hps. but about LED's,5-10 years???, LED's just popped up on the growing grid maybe in the last few years and already they are being marketed. if they are marketing it then it also means that they are finding ways to make it better, and since this is a capitalist world, they are finding ways to make it cheap. You can buy a 1000 dollar HID system or a 100 dollar HID system. i say this time next year LED's not only be a whole hell of alot more practical, they will be more than half the price they are now. 2 years ago the computer im typing on now was 2 grand. now its worth about 1 grand, and thats computers with thousands of parts. a diode isnt rocket science.
 

hellraizer30

Rebel From The North
sweet im liking his led progress, still not sold on the idea seem like they grow a little slower maybe its just that there from seed, I was at the grow store today and was asking about the led and the guy behind the counter was trying to sell me on T5s a 4ft by 2ft system i think it had 8 to 10 tubes
for like $250 each setup I figured I would need 10 system for a 10x12 room
with 48 ladies in it, seems like a lot of cash whats your guys take on this?
 

Thebot

Well-Known Member
sweet im liking his led progress, still not sold on the idea seem like they grow a little slower maybe its just that there from seed, I was at the grow store today and was asking about the led and the guy behind the counter was trying to sell me on T5s a 4ft by 2ft system i think it had 8 to 10 tubes
for like $250 each setup I figured I would need 10 system for a 10x12 room
with 48 ladies in it, seems like a lot of cash whats your guys take on this?
im just making an assumption that since your looking to buy a light system that this might be your first grow, i may be wrong, but if it is i think 48 plants might be too much of an undertaking for someone who hasnt grown before. thats even too much for me to deal with. it would be better to try to set up some kind of perpetual grow so you can harvest every two weeks instead of having 48 plants to worry about every day. ive never looked much into the T5's though so im not sure on price. i hear great things, but i think youd be better off spending that 250 on an HID system instead of a couple 250$ fluoro setups
 

alexdunaba

Well-Known Member
The answer is, not yet.

LED's may be the future, but HID's are still king of today, and next year at this time that answer will be the same.

Check back in 5-10 years, and maybe we'll be growing a pound every two weeks under 500 watts of light :D
I don't mean to be rude, but dude, what's up, you gotta use my avatar? Maybe we should all use Garden Knowm's avatar if this is the norm. sheesh. LEDs work fine if you keep them about an inch above the plant. I doubt in time to come LEDs will become the norm for growing. That's like using a bug bulb to light up a 20' square area over a HID bulb (say outdoors by a shed at night). Remember, size + wattage=more luminescence.
 

FloppyForeskin

Active Member
I agree Thebot. The light emitted from leds isn't sufficient to flower plants AND the light is "straight". If you use both cfl and led, you will get a yield comparable to cfl only. If you have environmental or cost restrictions that prevent you from using HID light, use CFL. Led is more of an investment and it will only frustrate you at flowering. I've seen grow journals of everything out there (execpt that "ufo" thing, but that just sounds retarded--$600 for what?). If are concerned about the power consumption of HID, then go replace all the bulbs in your house with CFLs. That dropped my electric bill to below it's normal amount even with a 400W HID running 18/6 the whole month. And 48 kids is a big undertaking. The stench alone would be phenominal. I also advise SOG method so you can get max performance for you lighting square footage. A single 1000W digital ballast and good bulb can SOG 12 plants easily. 3 plant yields every 2 weeks if you pick a good strain. Even if you go "kola only" you can still pull about an ounce per plant and you could probably pack in more plants.

I keep preaching electronic ballasts because they are more efficient on the electric bill, they emit more light per watt, they soft start which drastically increases bulb life. Bulb life is the major reason I like electric. If you are going after 48 mediocre plants under T5 then you should reconsider. I suggest you get a 1000W lumatek, horilux eye dual arc bulb, and a light mover and run 24 plants in the same area. Light movers let you bring the bulb closer to the top of the plants and dual arc bulbs better mimic the suns' light spectrum. If all my advice is pissing in your sandbox, then ignore me. I thought I had a green thumb and the wave of the future with LED lights.....100 of hours of research later, I'm running HID. Advertisements are not the same as advice. Most of the advice found on these boards has no $$$ agenda. Keep that in mind. I would much rather listen to somebody that doesn't see me as a source of income. But anyways, good luck with your grow no matter what you decide.
 

hellraizer30

Rebel From The North
advise is great I thank all for the info as for my first grow this is my 4th time
going at it. as for it being to much work not a chance, and your right about
the t5 vs hid im going with x2 hps and x1 mh should be ok with that and il save much$ in the long run. as for the smell ive got x2 com shrubers that
do wonders. I plan on spliting the 48 system in hafe by a room devide and
doing 2 stages but both will be in flower and on the same resavoir any thoughts on that should i keep them seperateas a back up if a disastor might
happen?
 

FloppyForeskin

Active Member
I would separate so you can test your theories (or other peoples'). You're probably pretty good on nutes being the 4th time, but maybe you can experiment a little. Do you use peroxide? Carbs? Superthrive? Organic vs chemical? I like to tinker with the tiny details to see if I can learn something and maybe up my yield or potency.

2 hps and 1 mh? So you'll have mothers under mh? And then clones into the flowering rooms? You wrote "2 stages". If you separate by young/old you then you should separate the reservoirs so you can add a extra ppm and finishing stuff to the phase 2 plants. Then you would avoid doing a clean water flush (or carb loading) to the phase 1 flowerers. PH is also a factor--some people like to let it creep up a little towards the end of flower.

I think SOG would benefit you the most. Look for a thread from Al B. Fuct called "get a harvest every two weeks" or something like that. Uses a no vegging/kola only method to pack more plants under the same lights. He said he gets about an ounce per plant, 4 trays of 16 harvesting every two weeks. I'm excited for your set up, it will be a lot work, but fun. What strain(s)?
 

hellraizer30

Rebel From The North
im going to be using avanst nutrients seni pro with cal-mag/sub culture.
strain is barny farms blue cheese, clones are being done in a easy cloner
60, for veg only going 14 days to keep them short and sweet. the lights
x2 hps x1 mh will be running them all on the set up was going to seperate them but I just im going all at once, cant aford to buy another lite so im stuck with what I got, maybe next time around. rnning out of money is a bitch with my gen 2 co2 system and the 48 even flow hydro setup just got
to wait for the funds to upgrade my lights.
 

FloppyForeskin

Active Member
Jesus christ! You've got a lot of gear. But it sounds like you've got the plan beaten down too. Are you going to do a grow journal? How do you like the co2? Is it worth it?
 

hellraizer30

Rebel From The North
was thinking of it, as for the c02 its a must howerver you get it in your room
is good, I saw a huge impact at day 4 with 1500ppm some claim up to
30% more in time and weight. wish I had the lighting to ad to it, hard to see
the real deal with lacking light but having c02, also thinking of throwing up some white poly to help increade light.
 

Mantis

Active Member
exactly my friend, think about COMPUTERS.. when the first ones came out, they were entire rooms you would walk in to.. you could fit quite a few people in your computer, many more than you can fit in your car today.. and now.. we have micro mini computers.. Im not sure how fast the rate is, but the technology is doubling every so often, just like everything else, but most comparably to modern day computers as far as evolution of technology is concerned, which is a wonderful thing for us growers!

Nasa has been experimenting with grow LEDs since the 70's. LED's were actually invented in the 20's, in case anyone was curious..

They are gettting much brighter, more intense, more penetrating, and cheaper, easier to make.. I cant wait! But yeah, HID is much more powerful and cheaper at the moment.. To equal the power, you would need a lot of LEDs, which is doable, but more expensive at this time..
 

fat sam

Well-Known Member
led's are going to take over the indoor grow scene in the future a company in china just made a single led bulb that puts out 200,000 lumens and uses 200 watts, of course it is far from production but with specs like that its only a matter of time before they take over
 
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