Just a struggling newbie...unsure of problem.

Nugnewbie said:

Well, I usually managed to combine an excess of alcohol consumption along with my weed intake. My personality would change as my drinking increased, not that I knew or seemed to care to recognize that, and messed up many times in many ways. But, I'm alive and reasonably happy, and didn't kill anyone along the way. But my memory has always been a bit shaky, and short term memory lately has almost been...., frustrating sometimes. Like when I forget walking from one room to another, why I was going to that room, or forgetting wtf I wanted to search on the internet before I get to type it out, heh.

Click to expand...

My long term memory kicks ass. It's my short term memory that sucks,

PadawanWarrior said:

You had to say how organic weed tastes and smells better. Oh no. Here they come,

Click to expand...

Yes, the thought had crossed my mind I might be opening a hornets nest hehe, but sometimes you have to live on the wild side

Nugnewbie said:

Yes, the thought had crossed my mind I might be opening a hornets nest hehe, but sometimes you have to live on the wild side

Click to expand...

Kinda off topic, but we had a nest in our spa's equipment pack housing when I was a kid. It was all nice and painted like our house. I told my dad I would take care of it. Built a little explosive device and attached it to the inside using a long pole. Blew the side of the housing out. My dad wasn't very happy, but all the bees were gone,

PadawanWarrior said:

My long term memory kicks ass. It's my short term memory that sucks,

Click to expand...

Well, that is what I seem to remember reading years ago, that weed does in fact adversely affect short term memory. It always made sense to me, but never scared me from smoking it.

PadawanWarrior said:

Kinda off topic, but we had a nest in our spa's equipment pack housing when I was a kid. It was all nice and painted like our house. I told my dad I would take care of it. Built a little explosive device and attached it to the inside using a long pole. Blew the side of the housing out. My dad wasn't very happy, but all the bees were gone,

Click to expand...

Guess he didn't recognize genius in action eh?

Put the neoseiulus cucumeris mites (not Amblyseius cucumeris)on the plants, hopefully not too thick. Didn't use any of the soluble seaweed extract, just sprayed leaves with a bit of RO water so the bran would stick to the leaves. Adding straight de-chlorinated to the reservoir. Leaves seem to be looking a bit better.

PadawanWarrior said:

I've got a math degree, lol. But this sounds like a question for @kratos015 .

Click to expand...

I just use 1/2 of what the bottle tells me to use; if the bottle recommends 1tsp per gallon, I try 1/2tsp per gallon and see how the plants react. 0-0-17 might sound high, but I use Langbeinite constantly (0-0-22) and have noticed zero negative results. I went through some of your photos, your plants do look good for the most part, but you've definitely got a K deficiency starting to form. Use your 0-0-17 stuff at 1/4-1/2 the recommended dose on the bottle, or get yourself some Langbeinite and top dress with that.

Doesn't look like lockout to me, looks like a genuine deficiency. You have anything like Big 6 or TM-7 for your micro nutrients?

K+Mg deficiencies can be common with quality LED lights, I've heard. Plenty of experienced growers have found this out the hard way when they transitioned to new LED lights, so you're not the only one friend.

I know that some of the strains I grow under my DE HPS show K+Mg deficiencies pretty quick as well. K and Mg are directly responsible for photosynthesis and chlorophyll production, and K specifically plays a role in fruits "setting", so you'll notice K deficiencies often manifest around weeks 2-3 of flower when the budlets are forming.

People overemphasize P with plants, fact is that K is just as important as P. I recently started growing vegetables ~18 months ago, fruits would form, but then fall off shortly. That is how I learned that K deficiencies result in blooms falling off. Once I added Langbeinite (0-0-22) into the mix, fruits stopped falling off and grew as they were supposed to.


tl;dr: Use your 0-0-17 seaweed extract at 1/4-1/2 the recommended dose on the bottle, and look into TM-7 for micro nutes.

All the best, and happy growing.

kratos015 said:

I just use 1/2 of what the bottle tells me to use; if the bottle recommends 1tsp per gallon, I try 1/2tsp per gallon and see how the plants react. 0-0-17 might sound high, but I use Langbeinite constantly (0-0-22) and have noticed zero negative results. I went through some of your photos, your plants do look good for the most part, but you've definitely got a K deficiency starting to form. Use your 0-0-17 stuff at 1/4-1/2 the recommended dose on the bottle, or get yourself some Langbeinite and top dress with that.

Doesn't look like lockout to me, looks like a genuine deficiency. You have anything like Big 6 or TM-7 for your micro nutrients?

K+Mg deficiencies can be common with quality LED lights, I've heard. Plenty of experienced growers have found this out the hard way when they transitioned to new LED lights, so you're not the only one friend.

I know that some of the strains I grow under my DE HPS show K+Mg deficiencies pretty quick as well. K and Mg are directly responsible for photosynthesis and chlorophyll production, and K specifically plays a role in fruits "setting", so you'll notice K deficiencies often manifest around weeks 2-3 of flower when the budlets are forming.

People overemphasize P with plants, fact is that K is just as important as P. I recently started growing vegetables ~18 months ago, fruits would form, but then fall off shortly. That is how I learned that K deficiencies result in blooms falling off. Once I added Langbeinite (0-0-22) into the mix, fruits stopped falling off and grew as they were supposed to.


tl;dr: Use your 0-0-17 seaweed extract at 1/4-1/2 the recommended dose on the bottle, and look into TM-7 for micro nutes.

All the best, and happy growing.

Click to expand...

Thanks Kratos. Always enjoy reading your posts.

kratos015 said:

I just use 1/2 of what the bottle tells me to use; if the bottle recommends 1tsp per gallon, I try 1/2tsp per gallon and see how the plants react. 0-0-17 might sound high, but I use Langbeinite constantly (0-0-22) and have noticed zero negative results. I went through some of your photos, your plants do look good for the most part, but you've definitely got a K deficiency starting to form. Use your 0-0-17 stuff at 1/4-1/2 the recommended dose on the bottle, or get yourself some Langbeinite and top dress with that.

Doesn't look like lockout to me, looks like a genuine deficiency. You have anything like Big 6 or TM-7 for your micro nutrients?

K+Mg deficiencies can be common with quality LED lights, I've heard. Plenty of experienced growers have found this out the hard way when they transitioned to new LED lights, so you're not the only one friend.

I know that some of the strains I grow under my DE HPS show K+Mg deficiencies pretty quick as well. K and Mg are directly responsible for photosynthesis and chlorophyll production, and K specifically plays a role in fruits "setting", so you'll notice K deficiencies often manifest around weeks 2-3 of flower when the budlets are forming.

People overemphasize P with plants, fact is that K is just as important as P. I recently started growing vegetables ~18 months ago, fruits would form, but then fall off shortly. That is how I learned that K deficiencies result in blooms falling off. Once I added Langbeinite (0-0-22) into the mix, fruits stopped falling off and grew as they were supposed to.


tl;dr: Use your 0-0-17 seaweed extract at 1/4-1/2 the recommended dose on the bottle, and look into TM-7 for micro nutes.

All the best, and happy growing.

Click to expand...

I ended up applying some mites and the bran is still on the leaves. So, yeah, the bran on the leaves, not sure how long I should just leave that on the leaves, so would complicate a foliar spray i would guess. Any advice on that? I bought them, then watched a youtube vid on how to spray a bit of water and then shake some on the leaves, but don't remember if the video said how long it should stay there. So, unless I try to remove the bran from the leaves, I can't really do a foliar right now? Its soluble so supposed to be mixed with water in any application, whether directly in the soil or in a foliar.

I am north of the 49th, langbeinite doesn't seem that abundant up here. Places I've ordered coots mix ingredients don't seem to carry it. Amazon sources are all from the USA, so expensive to get here.

I have some TM-7. Can't remember why I ordered it, haven't used any yet.
I'll have to read up on how to apply it. As soon as I find it.

So, I am going to assume you would advise me much like Padawan to wait to begin flowering until the plants look healthier? I suppose best to get any deficiencies under control ahead of then.
Thank you for taking the time Kratos, much appreciated.

Edit: Found the TM-7. Label says: Container Plants: 0.75-1.25 g per 3.78 L of irrigation solution. Hydroponic: 0.5-0.75g per 3.78L of nutrient solution used in reservoir (use with every change. Top-offs can be chared with 1/4-1/2 normal rate). Foliar Rates: 0.75g per 3.78L every 7-10 days

So, how is this best applied? I'm in a SIP. Doubt I would add to reservoir. Probably top water it in? Or foliar best?

Nugnewbie said:

I ended up applying some mites and the bran is still on the leaves. So, yeah, the bran on the leaves, not sure how long I should just leave that on the leaves, so would complicate a foliar spray i would guess. Any advice on that? I bought them, then watched a youtube vid on how to spray a bit of water and then shake some on the leaves, but don't remember if the video said how long it should stay there. So, unless I try to remove the bran from the leaves, I can't really do a foliar right now? Its soluble so supposed to be mixed with water in any application, whether directly in the soil or in a foliar.

I am north of the 49th, langbeinite doesn't seem that abundant up here. Places I've ordered coots mix ingredients don't seem to carry it. Amazon sources are all from the USA, so expensive to get here.

I have some TM-7. Can't remember why I ordered it, haven't used any yet.
I'll have to read up on how to apply it. As soon as I find it.

So, I am going to assume you would advise me much like Padawan to wait to begin flowering until the plants look healthier? I suppose best to get any deficiencies under control ahead of then.
Thank you for taking the time Kratos, much appreciated.

Edit: Found the TM-7. Label says: Container Plants: 0.75-1.25 g per 3.78 L of irrigation solution. Hydroponic: 0.5-0.75g per 3.78L of nutrient solution used in reservoir (use with every change. Top-offs can be chared with 1/4-1/2 normal rate). Foliar Rates: 0.75g per 3.78L every 7-10 days

So, how is this best applied? I'm in a SIP. Doubt I would add to reservoir. Probably top water it in? Or foliar best?

Click to expand...

I mix mine into my water when I use it. So I use it as a drench. But I only have the 6 so far. Gonna order the TM-7 soon.

PadawanWarrior said:

I mix mine into my water when I use it. So I use it as a drench. But I only have the 6 so far. Gonna order the TM-7 soon.

Click to expand...

I forget whether you said you grow in a SIP or not. I can still do some top water in a SIP, so I will do it that way, on top of the nematodes I put in the other day. Been keeping them moist. I'll go with 1 g /L of the TM-7, midrange. I still haven't had anyone give me a solution to my neoseiulus cucumeris mites in bran still on my leaves, and the recommended foliar of my soluble seaweed extract. I am guessing I will just have to wait a few days and the mites should all have left the bran for my plant and any thrips that might still be lurking. (Doubt it but who knows)

Nugnewbie said:

I forget whether you said you grow in a SIP or not. I can still do some top water in a SIP, so I will do it that way, on top of the nematodes I put in the other day. Been keeping them moist. I'll go with 1 g /L of the TM-7, midrange. I still haven't had anyone give me a solution to my neoseiulus cucumeris mites in bran still on my leaves, and the recommended foliar of my soluble seaweed extract. I am guessing I will just have to wait a few days and the mites should all have left the bran for my plant and any thrips that might still be lurking. (Doubt it but who knows)

Click to expand...

I'm in pots. But I've used cucumeris. I know you're supposed to put them on the plant, but if plants are budding I just put it close to the stalk. That's probably not ideal, but I didn't want that stuff all over my buds. During veg I might get some on the plants though. I've never moistened the leaves first though.

I'm not the best one to ask about the bran and stuff on the leaves.

PadawanWarrior said:

I'm in pots. But I've used cucumeris. I know you're supposed to put them on the plant, but if plants are budding I just put it close to the stalk. That's probably not ideal, but I didn't want that stuff all over my buds. During veg I might get some on the plants though. I've never moistened the leaves first though.

I'm not the best one to ask about the bran and stuff on the leaves.

Click to expand...

I'm going to search my history for the YouTube video I watched that recommended spritzing the leaves a bit so they'd adhere better. Maybe they mention length of time to be left on leaves. Kind of messy anyway. Looking forward to clearing the leaves of this. Just don't want to remove the mites.

Nugnewbie said:

I ended up applying some mites and the bran is still on the leaves. So, yeah, the bran on the leaves, not sure how long I should just leave that on the leaves, so would complicate a foliar spray i would guess. Any advice on that? I bought them, then watched a youtube vid on how to spray a bit of water and then shake some on the leaves, but don't remember if the video said how long it should stay there. So, unless I try to remove the bran from the leaves, I can't really do a foliar right now? Its soluble so supposed to be mixed with water in any application, whether directly in the soil or in a foliar.

I am north of the 49th, langbeinite doesn't seem that abundant up here. Places I've ordered coots mix ingredients don't seem to carry it. Amazon sources are all from the USA, so expensive to get here.

I have some TM-7. Can't remember why I ordered it, haven't used any yet.
I'll have to read up on how to apply it. As soon as I find it.

So, I am going to assume you would advise me much like Padawan to wait to begin flowering until the plants look healthier? I suppose best to get any deficiencies under control ahead of then.
Thank you for taking the time Kratos, much appreciated.

Edit: Found the TM-7. Label says: Container Plants: 0.75-1.25 g per 3.78 L of irrigation solution. Hydroponic: 0.5-0.75g per 3.78L of nutrient solution used in reservoir (use with every change. Top-offs can be chared with 1/4-1/2 normal rate). Foliar Rates: 0.75g per 3.78L every 7-10 days

So, how is this best applied? I'm in a SIP. Doubt I would add to reservoir. Probably top water it in? Or foliar best?

Click to expand...

I've been ordering Langbeinite on eBay in 5lb packages, not sure if you've checked, but you may be able to find it there also. Hopefully someone more local to you is supplying it, but definitely no point shipping anything half way across the planet.

Let the bugs settle for a day or two, then go ahead and foliar. The foliar will still help, despite not covering 100% of the leaves, it will still be helpful.

What you could also do is a soil watering of it, even in a SIP. If I had to guess, that 0-0-17 bottle recommends 1/2-1tsp per gallon of water? For sake of example, lets say it does. Typically, when applying nutrient water of any sort, we're not watering to runoff, let alone anywhere near runoff. You can still "top water" certain things into SIPs. You just have to be extremely mindful to avoid having runoff go into the SIPs.

Nice thing about SIPs though, its pretty simple to avoid runoff with applying nutrients via top watering. The entire substrate is perfectly moist from the SIPs, so you can just "top water" 1/2-1cup of whatever and not have it runoff into your SIPs and "infect" them. You're definitely spot on about not wanting to get anything but pure water in the SIPs. Pain in the ass to redo those things if you didn't install a drain valve like I did the first time, lol.

TM-7 can be watered in, but it is definitely best used/absorbed in a foliar application. No harm watering it in though if you're concerned about messing with your bugs.


I absolutely recommend wait to flower. To you, and anyone else that may happen to read this. Absolutely hold off on triggering 12/12 until your plants look "textbook". I've learned that the hard way, and wouldn't with the results on anyone else. I'm always thrilled when someone can solve issues in veg before triggering 12/12.

Personally when I'm growing indoors, I wait until I consistently see new growth every day before I trigger 12/12. Ensures I'm flowering only healthy and thriving plants.



tl;dr: You can water in TM7 and likely even your 0-0-17 Seaweed stuff, just follow the bottle's instructions at 1/4 to 1/2 strength. From what I'm seeing, I feel that those things would show positive results for you within a week.

All the best.

kratos015 said:

I've been ordering Langbeinite on eBay in 5lb packages, not sure if you've checked, but you may be able to find it there also. Hopefully someone more local to you is supplying it, but definitely no point shipping anything half way across the planet.

Let the bugs settle for a day or two, then go ahead and foliar. The foliar will still help, despite not covering 100% of the leaves, it will still be helpful.

What you could also do is a soil watering of it, even in a SIP. If I had to guess, that 0-0-17 bottle recommends 1/2-1tsp per gallon of water? For sake of example, lets say it does. Typically, when applying nutrient water of any sort, we're not watering to runoff, let alone anywhere near runoff. You can still "top water" certain things into SIPs. You just have to be extremely mindful to avoid having runoff go into the SIPs.

Nice thing about SIPs though, its pretty simple to avoid runoff with applying nutrients via top watering. The entire substrate is perfectly moist from the SIPs, so you can just "top water" 1/2-1cup of whatever and not have it runoff into your SIPs and "infect" them. You're definitely spot on about not wanting to get anything but pure water in the SIPs. Pain in the ass to redo those things if you didn't install a drain valve like I did the first time, lol.

TM-7 can be watered in, but it is definitely best used/absorbed in a foliar application. No harm watering it in though if you're concerned about messing with your bugs.


I absolutely recommend wait to flower. To you, and anyone else that may happen to read this. Absolutely hold off on triggering 12/12 until your plants look "textbook". I've learned that the hard way, and wouldn't with the results on anyone else. I'm always thrilled when someone can solve issues in veg before triggering 12/12.

Personally when I'm growing indoors, I wait until I consistently see new growth every day before I trigger 12/12. Ensures I'm flowering only healthy and thriving plants.



tl;dr: You can water in TM7 and likely even your 0-0-17 Seaweed stuff, just follow the bottle's instructions at 1/4 to 1/2 strength. From what I'm seeing, I feel that those things would show positive results for you within a week.

All the best.

Click to expand...

How much Langbeinite do you use? I always add a little to topdressings, but I once used a magnetic stirrer for a couple days and it seemed to be a little rough for them.

kratos015 said:

I've been ordering Langbeinite on eBay in 5lb packages, not sure if you've checked, but you may be able to find it there also. Hopefully someone more local to you is supplying it, but definitely no point shipping anything half way across the planet.

Let the bugs settle for a day or two, then go ahead and foliar. The foliar will still help, despite not covering 100% of the leaves, it will still be helpful.

What you could also do is a soil watering of it, even in a SIP. If I had to guess, that 0-0-17 bottle recommends 1/2-1tsp per gallon of water? For sake of example, lets say it does. Typically, when applying nutrient water of any sort, we're not watering to runoff, let alone anywhere near runoff. You can still "top water" certain things into SIPs. You just have to be extremely mindful to avoid having runoff go into the SIPs.

Nice thing about SIPs though, its pretty simple to avoid runoff with applying nutrients via top watering. The entire substrate is perfectly moist from the SIPs, so you can just "top water" 1/2-1cup of whatever and not have it runoff into your SIPs and "infect" them. You're definitely spot on about not wanting to get anything but pure water in the SIPs. Pain in the ass to redo those things if you didn't install a drain valve like I did the first time, lol.

TM-7 can be watered in, but it is definitely best used/absorbed in a foliar application. No harm watering it in though if you're concerned about messing with your bugs.


I absolutely recommend wait to flower. To you, and anyone else that may happen to read this. Absolutely hold off on triggering 12/12 until your plants look "textbook". I've learned that the hard way, and wouldn't with the results on anyone else. I'm always thrilled when someone can solve issues in veg before triggering 12/12.

Personally when I'm growing indoors, I wait until I consistently see new growth every day before I trigger 12/12. Ensures I'm flowering only healthy and thriving plants.



tl;dr: You can water in TM7 and likely even your 0-0-17 Seaweed stuff, just follow the bottle's instructions at 1/4 to 1/2 strength. From what I'm seeing, I feel that those things would show positive results for you within a week.

All the best.

Click to expand...

I think I'm going to try to leave the leaves alone, and give the mites a chance to explore. I'll water the soluble seaweed extract 0-0-17 and TM-7 into the soil. I had/have a thrips infestation. So, I thought I read that they lay their eggs in the leaves, so makes more sense to me to allow the mites on the leaves bite the heads of those little buggers as they emerge. If there are any left after the measures I've already taken. I haven't seen any more leaf damage, but can't see leaves very well at the moment.

I was adding activated EM to my reservoir, but believe that could have knocked my soil pH out of whack as I think I was using too much. But, other than that, pure water in the reservoirs.

I'll keep looking for a source of Langbeinite. It seems it could be quite beneficial in creating nice flowers. Wish I had some now. Also wish I could set lights to 12/12, but what's another week really. Hopefully summer isn't a scorcher this year like last. Get this crop to harvest and will shut down until fall, once temperatures outside cool off.

Thank you again Kratos. I can see why Padawan enjoys your posts. Good information.

To update. The two Hulkberry in the one SIP to me look fine now. No sign of thrips anymore and growth looks good to my untrained eye. May top dress soon as haven't since March 28th. Have some medium (coots mix)I can add to the container instead of just adding 4-4-4. Would that be better?

However, the Tropicana Banana clone isn't looking great yet. Lower leaves look nice and green. Top growth is yellowing and most of the upper growth is cupping like there is light or heat stress. I don't know why it is doing this when the other cultivar isn't. Does the cupping actually have more to do with deficiency? If this plant were healthier, would the leaves still cup like this? This past Tuesday I did a soil drench with the soluble seaweed extract (0-0-17), and TM-7. Being that I had applied predatory mites onto the leaves, I didn't want to do a foliar feeding quite yet. Alot of the bran with the mites in it has fallen off the leaves. I am not sure I should foliar feed even yet, but TB still looks deficient, so need to do something. I don't want to flower an already deficient plant but my tent is starting to get crowded, and not sure I will not have a height problem with the stretch.