How to setup a vertical HPS?

Tillinah

Member
Have you seen his footprint? It's 2' x 1'. If you can drop a bare bulb in-between two plants - with a floor fan in the middle - and still leave enough room to grow either side, then good luck!

Tillinah, don't let me put you off - try a vertical bulb if you wish - but you will likely find that the bulb will need to be hung high to give yourself enough room to grow, which will defeat the purpose of growing vertically. With vertical growing, you really need the bulb to be hung about two-thirds the way up the plant to take advantage of the 360-degrees of light. Hanging a bare bulb above the plant is actually less efficient than a horizontal bulb with a reflector.

Heat will also be an issue, so a horizontal cool tube reflector (you know the type - they're a cool tube with reflective material on one side) will help with heat while also giving you lots of light.

As for my yields growing with a horizontal 250, it's so long ago (15 years) that I can't recall. I usually had six small plants growing 3x2 and my yields probably would have been around five-six ounces. These days I grow with 1200w of vertical light and consistently yield 3-3.5lb. Check my signature and you'll see my set-up.
5-6oz per plant or total? I checked out your current setup pulling pounds, it's pretty awesome! Is it all for personal use? I wish I had the space where I could do that. For this grow I may end up going the horizontal route until I get a bigger spot to grow in. I'll probably go with one of the hps + cooltube kits that don't have the ballast built in so I can always swap to vertical later.
 

Prawn Connery

Well-Known Member
LOL! No, total. Anyone who can pull 30-36oz from a 250w is God!

Yes, get a remote ballast, as this will keep the heat down in the grow chamber. With a HPS ballast, you can also run a metal halide retro bulb during veg and HPS during flower. Some ballasts allow you to switch between the two (MH/HPS), so are handy.

Alternatively, see if you can get a 250w ceramic metal halide with matching HPS ballast, as this will offer the best of both worlds (good mix of red and blue spectrums for alround growing).

And do I grow for personal? Sure do. Obviously I have a bit left over - which only goes to my circle of friends - but I primarily grow for myself. That means I'm not growing for yield, but variety. If I monocropped for yield, I'd get a bit more. But usually I have four or five different strains going at any one time. I also do lots of different seed runs for clone mothers, which don't always yield well.

Once you get right into growing, you'll find variety is the spice of life! :weed:
 

Tillinah

Member
LOL! No, total. Anyone who can pull 30-36oz from a 250w is God!

Yes, get a remote ballast, as this will keep the heat down in the grow chamber. With a HPS ballast, you can also run a metal halide retro bulb during veg and HPS during flower. Some ballasts allow you to switch between the two (MH/HPS), so are handy.

Alternatively, see if you can get a 250w ceramic metal halide with matching HPS ballast, as this will offer the best of both worlds (good mix of red and blue spectrums for alround growing).

And do I grow for personal? Sure do. Obviously I have a bit left over - which only goes to my circle of friends - but I primarily grow for myself. That means I'm not growing for yield, but variety. If I monocropped for yield, I'd get a bit more. But usually I have four or five different strains going at any one time. I also do lots of different seed runs for clone mothers, which don't always yield well.

Once you get right into growing, you'll find variety is the spice of life! :weed:
Your friends must love coming to visit you haha!
I've done a little research on the CMH bulb but not enough, is it basically a mix of the red and blue spectrum so you can run it during the whole grow or is it just for flowering? Also I thought I read something that they don't work with every electronic ballast?
 

Canon

Well-Known Member
Right now it's 2ft wide, 28in high (can be 4ft if I add the second cab under it), and 1ft depth. Look in my sig thread if you want to see some pictures of it.
Quite honestly,,, you'd do better with vertical CFLs in there. Drop a 50 ish watter down the middle and surround with 4 droppers in the 25 watt range. You'll be smiling and cool!
 

Prawn Connery

Well-Known Member
HID lights are actually more efficient than CFLs. Would you believe CFLs produce more heat per watt than HPS or MH lights? It's true. The heat is spread more evenly along the CFL element than it is in a metal halide (which has a smaller element in comparison), but the total heat is more, and will actually create more heat in your grow chamber.

In addition, CFLs have built-in ballasts which also create heat - HID lights can run on external ballasts that keep some of the heat outside the chamber.

The OP's original vertical 150w HPS idea would be a better compromise than a vertical CFL, in my opinion.

Trust me, a long time ago I grew with about 200w of CFLs before switching to a 250HPS and the difference in yield was phenomenal. The difference in heat wasn't.
 

Prawn Connery

Well-Known Member
Your friends must love coming to visit you haha!
I've done a little research on the CMH bulb but not enough, is it basically a mix of the red and blue spectrum so you can run it during the whole grow or is it just for flowering? Also I thought I read something that they don't work with every electronic ballast?
Yes, everyone loves coming to my place. I make great coffee, too :blsmoke:

I don't run CMH bulbs (they don't make them bigger than 400w at the moment), so I'm not talking from experience. But from what I've researched, most will run on a HPS ballast (you will need to double check before purchasing, obviously) and can be beneficial for both vegging and flowering, as they produce a wider spectrum of PAR (photosynthetically active radiation - light is radiation) which the plant can use.

The old style of thinking was MH in veg - when the plant needs more blue/green spectrum - and HPS in flower - when it needs more red/orange. Think about nature: in late spring/summer the sun is higher and the sky is bluer. In late autumn/winter, the sun is lower and sky is redder. That's how most flowering plants have evolved.

But plants still need all the colours of the rainbow to grow efficiently - just in different ratios at different times.

And that's why growers started adding metal halide lights to their HPS grows at a usual ratio of 2HPS to 1MH to add more blue/green spectrum. Ceramic metal halide bulbs are supposedly the best of both worlds.

I say "supposedly" because I only form concrete opinions when I try something myself! So I would love to hear from those who are doing it themselves and hear their opinions. But again, from what I've read, they do seem to be more beneficial during flowering. Certainly I have not read many reports of people being disappointed with them. I would try CMH bulbs in a heartbeat if they made them in 600w.
 

Prawn Connery

Well-Known Member
For real. You make a pretty good coffee yourself.

^ DUD is the guy I was talking about earlier in this thread who grows in a small cabinet using a vertical 400w HPS.

Hope I got the dimensions of your cabinet right, mate. If there's any other advice you can offer these guys, now's ya chance! (When you have time, that is.)
 

DownUnderDoper

Well-Known Member
Yes, everyone loves coming to my place. I make great coffee, too :blsmoke:

I don't run CMH bulbs (they don't make them bigger than 400w at the moment), so I'm not talking from experience. But from what I've researched, most will run on a HPS ballast (you will need to double check before purchasing, obviously) and can be beneficial for both vegging and flowering, as they produce a wider spectrum of PAR (photosynthetically active radiation - light is radiation) which the plant can use.

The old style of thinking was MH in veg - when the plant needs more blue/green spectrum - and HPS in flower - when it needs more red/orange. Think about nature: in late spring/summer the sun is higher and the sky is bluer. In late autumn/winter, the sun is lower and sky is redder. That's how most flowering plants have evolved.

But plants still need all the colours of the rainbow to grow efficiently - just in different ratios at different times.

And that's why growers started adding metal halide lights to their HPS grows at a usual ratio of 2HPS to 1MH to add more blue/green spectrum. Ceramic metal halide bulbs are supposedly the best of both worlds.

I say "supposedly" because I only form concrete opinions when I try something myself! So I would love to hear from those who are doing it themselves and hear their opinions. But again, from what I've read, they do seem to be more beneficial during flowering. Certainly I have not read many reports of people being disappointed with them. I would try CMH bulbs in a heartbeat if they made them in 600w.
For real. You make a pretty good coffee yourself.

^ DUD is the guy I was talking about earlier in this thread who grows in a small cabinet using a vertical 400w HPS.

Hope I got the dimensions of your cabinet right, mate. If there's any other advice you can offer these guys, now's ya chance! (When you have time, that is.)
Close, 3w x 3h x 2d. The only thing I'd add is even with mass ventilation you can still only let the plants get about 6 or 8 inches from the 400w globe Or it just bleaches all fuck out of what should be your best buds.
 

Tillinah

Member
Close, 3w x 3h x 2d. The only thing I'd add is even with mass ventilation you can still only let the plants get about 6 or 8 inches from the 400w globe Or it just bleaches all fuck out of what should be your best buds.
Nice! Do you have any pictures or a thread up on your setup? You haven't considered using CMH?
 

DownUnderDoper

Well-Known Member
I must revise those measurements, my metric conversion is off a bit. Should be 4' x 4' x 2' (1.2m x 1.2m x .6m)
I can probably put up a couple of pics of the cabinet in here if you like, it's tragically empty at the moment. I'll start a grow thread once I'm up and running again.

I haven't really given much thought to CMH, I usually veg to about 40 - 50cm under flouros in a separate cabinet, fairly weak lights to induce a bit of stretch, then into the flower box. I'm not sure if I would benefit greatly from the extra light spectrum CMH gives, but I guess it couldn't hurt.
 

iFreeSki420

Well-Known Member
Where can I get a socket to screw my 1000w HPS bulbs in without getting a whole hood? Does one come with the ballast?
 

Tillinah

Member
I must revise those measurements, my metric conversion is off a bit. Should be 4' x 4' x 2' (1.2m x 1.2m x .6m)
I can probably put up a couple of pics of the cabinet in here if you like, it's tragically empty at the moment. I'll start a grow thread once I'm up and running again.

I haven't really given much thought to CMH, I usually veg to about 40 - 50cm under flouros in a separate cabinet, fairly weak lights to induce a bit of stretch, then into the flower box. I'm not sure if I would benefit greatly from the extra light spectrum CMH gives, but I guess it couldn't hurt.
Ya I'd love to see some pics.
 

Prawn Connery

Well-Known Member
Ask your local hydro shop or light store. Anywhere that sells HID lamps and ballasts should also sell separate sockets and chords that plug into the ballast.
 
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