HID's are dead. Long live LED's

HighFlow

Active Member
So I ponied up the cash and started using LED's this year. So far I've had a couple of successful cycles but I decided to start documenting it from now... so, this journal will be back to font as were starting from flower here and when I clone for the next one I'll show that process as I go.

What to say before I begin? LED's are the future. Anyone who was against them to begin with, with the way the tech has progressed the last few years, no longer has an argument. They are an expensive outlay initially, granted, but they more than repay themselves with longevity and power consumption. That is the only one point of contention I can entertain as any claims about inferior bud density, resin production and yield are quite honestly, ridiculous. Pictures as evidence.

So what am I using here?

Light: Flower room - I have just over 1000w of LED's across a 3m x 1m footprint. Samsung diodes and Meanwell drivers. 95% are full spectrum Samsung LM301H diodes and the remainder are made up of far red and UV
Mothers, clones and veg are all done exclusively under T5 florescents. Did I mention that HID's are dead? flouros are just great for young plants as they're gentle and the internode spacing is just great. Putting HID's on young plants and having to keep them at a distance so as not to burn them, with light intensity working on the inverse square law, doesn't make much sense to me. You can use far less light and keep it far closer to get better results.

System: 200l reservoir servicing a 12pot IWS flood and drain system. Helea chiller for temp, circulation and aeration. Upgraded feed pump to 1200l/ph to get a quick fill time. Feed for 10 mins every 2 hours. I clone in an aero cloner, not much to say about that, if you make a lot of clones and you don't have one.. you need to get one. Mothers all use DWC. I'll generally use them for one maybe two cycles and then replace them.

Nutrients + additives: Less is more, but more is also more. This means I don't mess around with all the shit they try to sell you in the hydro store because I've found invariably, it's all shit. At the same time, more is more, so I like to run my PPM's till I can just see burn on the tips. :cool:
I use Lucas formula and rarely mess with it. I occasionally add a little Mg mono during the initial flowering stage but nothing else. I don't use RO anymore. My tap water is about 100ppm.
The only other stuff I put in is a batch of Great White when I first fill the res, and Hygrozyme at 1/2 strength. I've always run sterile grows before this year but H202 every other day is just a pain, and as I don't need it for the 02 with the system i'm using, I now opt for a non-sterile system. to be honest, the results are in favour of a non-sterile, though only marginal. It comes down to personal preference I think. I wont knock anyone opting to run a peroxide only grow, I did it for years and never had problems. For anyone that doesn't use a chiller, and has a system like an R-DWC, or NFT, anything where the nutrient is flowing through pipes, under lights, essentially if you have warm water, you have to opt for enzymes rather than peroxide as to keep pythium at bay you'll end up using damaging amounts of peroxide.

Any comments or questions welcomed.
 

Attachments

Last edited:

HighFlow

Active Member
Eagle eyed viewers might have spotted my guardian says im running at 17'c. Well yes, were getting into the final couple of weeks of flower now so I've dropped the rootzone to 17'c and the humidity is down to about 35-40. Both these things serve to tell the plant summer is over and it's time to finish up and leads to a final spurt as the plant tries it's very best to find a mate... sorry girls.. maybe next time.. With genetically pre-disposed plants this dropping of rootzone temps will bring out the blue's and purples we all love.
 

HighFlow

Active Member
A note on pruning and training. I top all my clones once they're rooted and veg for about 2 weeks before they go to flower. 2 weeks into flower I will remove every single fan leaf on the plant, along with any bud leaves that are either shading other bud sites, or are growing inwards towards another bud. I've recently learned this process is called Schwazzing.. I didn't know this, but apparently yes, it has a name. 2 weeks before the end of flowering I will do another heavy defolation. The process serves multiple purposes and is in no way harmful to the plants, quite the reverse. For anyone wanting further info. I'm sure there are plenty of how-to guides out there. The simplified version is this: Fan leaves shade bud sites. Heavy foliation blocks airflow and leads to mould. Plants grown indoors and fed everything they could possibly want, every 2 hours, don't need extensive batteries of reserve nutrients (lower fan leaves) Buds photosynthesise. The end.
 

Romeo7701

Well-Known Member
I agree with you whole heartedly Highflow here is the readings on one of mine I gave less then $80 bucks for it the reading is at canopy level... Tell me what you think please!!!73E6FA88-48FE-4AA9-B6AB-5788D0FF28D5.png
 
Last edited:

HighFlow

Active Member
I've not measured the output with a lightmeter so I don't actually have a baseline with which to compare yours. What I will say, is that lux isn't everything. You could have a super bright LED in the completely wrong wavelength and you're not going to get anything out of it. This is the problem with some cheap lights. Mine are non brand, cheap DIY units, but the drivers and diodes themselves are legit.
 

Trickyticky

Well-Known Member
So I ponied up the cash and started using LED's this year. So far I've had a couple of successful cycles but I decided to start documenting it from now... so, this journal will be back to font as were starting from flower here and when I clone for the next one I'll show that process as I go.

What to say before I begin? LED's are the future. Anyone who was against them to begin with, with the way the tech has progressed the last few years, no longer has an argument. They are an expensive outlay initially, granted, but they more than repay themselves with longevity and power consumption. That is the only one point of contention I can entertain as any claims about inferior bud density, resin production and yield are quite honestly, ridiculous. Pictures as evidence.

So what am I using here?

Light: Flower room - I have just over 1000w of LED's across a 3m x 1m footprint. Samsung diodes and Meanwell drivers. 95% are full spectrum Samsung LM301H diodes and the remainder are made up of far red and UV
Mothers, clones and veg are all done exclusively under T5 florescents. Did I mention that HID's are dead? flouros are just great for young plants as they're gentle and the internode spacing is just great. Putting HID's on young plants and having to keep them at a distance so as not to burn them, with light intensity working on the inverse square law, doesn't make much sense to me. You can use far less light and keep it far closer to get better results.

System: 200l reservoir servicing a 12pot IWS flood and drain system. Helea chiller for temp, circulation and aeration. Upgraded feed pump to 1200l/ph to get a quick fill time. Feed for 10 mins every 2 hours. I clone in an aero cloner, not much to say about that, if you make a lot of clones and you don't have one.. you need to get one. Mothers all use DWC. I'll generally use them for one maybe two cycles and then replace them.

Nutrients + additives: Less is more, but more is also more. This means I don't mess around with all the shit they try to sell you in the hydro store because I've found invariably, it's all shit. At the same time, more is more, so I like to run my PPM's till I can just see burn on the tips. :cool:
I use Lucas formula and rarely mess with it. I occasionally add a little Mg mono during the initial flowering stage but nothing else. I don't use RO anymore. My tap water is about 100ppm.
The only other stuff I put in is a batch of Great White when I first fill the res, and Hygrozyme at 1/2 strength. I've always run sterile grows before this year but H202 every other day is just a pain, and as I don't need it for the 02 with the system i'm using, I now opt for a non-sterile system. to be honest, the results are in favour of a non-sterile, though only marginal. It comes down to personal preference I think. I wont knock anyone opting to run a peroxide only grow, I did it for years and never had problems. For anyone that doesn't use a chiller, and has a system like an R-DWC, or NFT, anything where the nutrient is flowing through pipes, under lights, essentially if you have warm water, you have to opt for enzymes rather than peroxide as to keep pythium at bay you'll end up using damaging amounts of peroxide.

Any comments or questions welcomed.
Investment after xmas
 

Trickyticky

Well-Known Member
Lovely ladies but as far hid being dead not to sure about that but I'm loving what you are doing as always thank you for your time and the best wishes to you and your
They are the way forward though , save money , they do there part in saving environment , less noise as intake and exhaust can be reduced ,
But hid are good as tried and tested
 

FADING-SILHOUETTE

Well-Known Member
I started with CFLs, then went on to 2x 90w UFOs 'blurples.....yuck ..then went 400w CMH, 'which was so great '...then a 600w HPS Son T...great results !!!.....and now I run Cobs .....infact i swear by them.....

The 600HPS did have huge dense results...but my last grow which ran just shy of 700w all including 4x54w cobs 1x Phantom xl 6 secret jardin strip lights a 660 and 600nm lamps, erm ...a 400nm and 430nm UV ....and some incandescent 1800k led lamps ....absolutely destroyed the 600 hps.....the 600hid gave me 13.5oz for a huge scrogged 6 month vegged single plant....the mear extra 100w of led which i could shrug off to thhe low wat incandescents.....

The Cob grow in a smaller tent also a 6 month vegged scrogged single plant produced a whopping 17.5 oZ dry weight !!!!and had 2 extra bags of popcorn buds i didnt even include...Its LED COBS for me ...heat is easier and quieter to dispurse..no giant inline fan just a 4 inch inline...with silencer...

BUT HID does have a certain radiation or something that leds lack.....aside from that and the results I ve had... You are indeed right !! LEDs 'ARE' THE FUTURE !!! - STELTHY :leaf:
 

Romeo7701

Well-Known Member
I've not measured the output with a lightmeter so I don't actually have a baseline with which to compare yours. What I will say, is that lux isn't everything. You could have a super bright LED in the completely wrong wavelength and you're not going to get anything out of it. This is the problem with some cheap lights. Mine are non brand, cheap DIY units, but the drivers and diodes themselves are legit.
This is the manufacturers chart I don't have the equipment to check it against what they say...7329B1BB-FB5F-4B82-A259-E94CEF3EB344.jpeg
 
Last edited:

Star Dog

Well-Known Member
I'm not into paying good money for lighting then paying to run a heater as well, if your in a cooler climate you'll be happy with the heat from hid, atm I'm toiling to maintain 25c above the canopy and 20c below it where the inlets are.

Fluorescent light are OK for seedlings or rooting clones when there's no rush, they're so slooowww lol give me a mh any time.

I think my led will be good for vegging where constant air exchange isn't so vital, it's low operating temperature isn't always welcome, horses for courses.
 

Trickyticky

Well-Known Member
I started with CFLs, then went on to 2x 90w UFOs 'blurples.....yuck ..then went 400w CMH, 'which was so great '...then a 600w HPS Son T...great results !!!.....and now I run Cobs .....infact i swear by them.....

The 600HPS did have huge dense results...but my last grow which ran just shy of 700w all including 4x54w cobs 1x Phantom xl 6 secret jardin strip lights a 660 and 600nm lamps, erm ...a 400nm and 430nm UV ....and some incandescent 1800k led lamps ....absolutely destroyed the 600 hps.....the 600hid gave me 13.5oz for a huge scrogged 6 month vegged single plant....the mear extra 100w of led which i could shrug off to thhe low wat incandescents.....

The Cob grow in a smaller tent also a 6 month vegged scrogged single plant produced a whopping 17.5 oZ dry weight !!!!and had 2 extra bags of popcorn buds i didnt even include...Its LED COBS for me ...heat is easier and quieter to dispurse..no giant inline fan just a 4 inch inline...with silencer...

BUT HID does have a certain radiation or something that leds lack.....aside from that and the results I ve had... You are indeed right !! LEDs 'ARE' THE FUTURE !!! - STELTHY :leaf:
Long veg time that
 

Trickyticky

Well-Known Member
I'm not into paying good money for lighting then paying to run a heater as well, if your in a cooler climate you'll be happy with the heat from hid, atm I'm toiling to maintain 25c above the canopy and 20c below it where the inlets are.

Fluorescent light are OK for seedlings or rooting clones when there's no rush, they're so slooowww lol give me a mh any time.

I think my led will be good for vegging where constant air exchange isn't so vital, it's low operating temperature isn't always welcome, horses for courses.
Horses for courses
 

Romeo7701

Well-Known Member
I'm not into paying good money for lighting then paying to run a heater as well, if your in a cooler climate you'll be happy with the heat from hid, atm I'm toiling to maintain 25c above the canopy and 20c below it where the inlets are.

Fluorescent light are OK for seedlings or rooting clones when there's no rush, they're so slooowww lol give me a mh any time.

I think my led will be good for vegging where constant air exchange isn't so vital, it's low operating temperature isn't always welcome, horses for courses.
I'm lucky my temp never gets above 24C or below 20C fans and discharge fans in flower room and veg room...
 
Top