Heaven, Hell, and the Devil aren't real, but God is?

DancesWithWeeds said:

You would have to be more stone than flesh to not choke on that one. My experience wasn't that bad, but try explaining circumcision to a 9 yo boy's class. Time to call the preacher in.

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Oh that wasn't the only verse she had no answer to.
1 Timothy 2:12 comes to mind.

Circumcision - I couldn't talk or walk for nearly a year afterwards.

Ozumoz66 said:

Oh that wasn't the only verse she had no answer to.
1 Timothy 2:12 comes to mind.

Circumcision - I couldn't talk or walk for nearly a year afterwards.

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Actually, It wasn't hard to explain at all.

It was a very small church, 100 people at the most on Easter. There was a farm next door with a nice pound that the boys went went skinny dipping in so they knew the difference. All I had to do was tell them why.

bursto said:

Yeah,

keep em coming guys, i'll do my best to explain them, as best i can.

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Did you though? C&P doesn't count!

Ezekiel was a schizophrenic, not that there's anything wrong with that. I know two and they're beautiful people that intrigue me.

I don't belong to any book club. Reading spiderman doesn't prove they exist.

DeadHeadX said:

There are literally thousands upon thousands of translation errors in any modern Bible.

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Not true. There's a bunch, but not "thousands upon thousands".

There's something for the atheist in the last paragraph. It could be our common link on this thread.

Here's something, maybe inline or maybe off track.

Do you have idea what "cherubim" are? Once more we come to a word ending with "im". That's plural for "cherub". Just like "elohim", translated as god, is the plural of "eloh".

A lot of people think they are cute little angles. Not so. The earliest writings describe them as some sort of war machine with a flaming, rotating sword. At one time Yahweh road his cherub into battle to save David from the Philistines.

The cherub was large enough for Yahweh to sit and stand on and was weaponized.

Here's something even the atheist may like. Yahweh instructed Moses to build an alter for sacrifices at "the opening to the tent of meeting". There were very specific instructions given. It was to have certain wood, meat prepared to exact specs, and herbs. It was to be burned because...get this...it "calms him". Now assuming that he is God, the creator of all things, including pot, maybe he should be here at RIU.

DancesWithWeeds said:

Not true. There's a bunch, but not "thousands upon thousands".

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A figure I recently read actually put the number over 14000. It makes perfect sense to me. A lot of words to argue over in translation - literally 1000s of translations of eons, from ancient languages where meaning continues to be debated. It’s like the telephone game. Things change, and there are translations discussions/debates/corrections over literally every passage. And it’s a big book. The once popular King James Version is a great example. Research errors on the KJB. And others. It’s a pretty profound thing to think about, imo.

DeadHeadX said:

A figure I recently read actually put the number over 14000. It makes perfect sense to me. A lot of words to argue over in translation - literally 1000s of translations of eons, from ancient languages where meaning continues to be debated. It’s like the telephone game. Things change, and there are translations discussions/debates/corrections over literally every passage. And it’s a big book. The once popular King James Version is a great example. Research errors on the KJB. And others. It’s a pretty profound thing to think about, imo.

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That's the reason I ONLY refer to it. What I like about Biglino's book, and his translation as far as he got is he doesn't guess at the meaning of words. If you don't know the meaning use the original word. Leave the words alone.

DancesWithWeeds said:

You would have to be more stone than flesh to not choke on that one. My experience wasn't that bad, but try explaining circumcision to a 9 yo boy's class. Time to call the preacher in.

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I would like for you to explain Yahweh's fixation on the foreskin to this 63 year old boy. I still don't know what his hang up is.

Is god real? Of course. Do you think folks would give 10% of their cash if not? Was he created by man? Of course. That's what we do.

My view of the after life is that we are like refrigerators. We run as long as we can, then we stop. Sometimes you can get a compressor or whatever changed to keep it going for a few more years, but in the end, it stops working.

With that said, I was raised in a house with a ghost, so some people do make it to an afterlife. Our ghost was named Sam. Mamma's half sister, Ruby had a disagreement with Sam over how much affection is too much, and she used an ax to make her point. It took a couple three years, but he died from the wounds. Mamma and Daddy ended up buying his home place. They tore down the old house and used the lumber in our new (1960) house. Sam has been there for all of my life. We have all moved down to the other end of the road, about a mile away. But maybe Sam has moved too. Last year the wife say a man walk through my end of the house while I was out doing my nightly 3-5 miles.

Sam was never scary, but he would make noise to make you think you had company when you didn't, and you really didn't want any. Like when you were breaking up an elbow on the dining room table, he would make it sound like the front door opened.

injinji said:

I would like for you to explain Yahweh's fixation on the foreskin to this 63 year old boy. I still don't know what his hang up is.

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If you read the first five books of the bible and not use some of the ridiculous translations it's plain.

First, get the book "Gods of the Bible" and read it. That book explains some of the things that are passed over by most people. It is about a LITERAL translation of portions that relate to God, OR should we say the Elohim, witch is ALWAYS translated as God. That is a intentional mistranslation of the Bible because they didn't know what it meant. The words, el, eloh, and elohim, which is plural, are always translated as God. In early Hebrew words ending with "im" are plural.

Yahweh was one of the elohim. Yahweh instructed Moses in circumcision "so that I will know my people."

Yahweh also had someone that he was he was directly responsible to. Elyon.

Lue Elizondro said if you want to know about ET's read your Bible. I say read this book and then read your Bible.

"The Arabs get the oil and we have to cut off the end of or WHAT?"

i could make up a bunch of bullshit and explain it too. good job humans.

xbiox said:

i could make up a bunch of bullshit and explain it too. good job humans.

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I won't argue with you about it until you study the language. Find out whit it really says. The first five books are about the "Elohim" who were mistaken for gods.

injinji said:

My view of the after life is that we are like refrigerators. We run as long as we can, then we stop. Sometimes you can get a compressor or whatever changed to keep it going for a few more years, but in the end, it stops working.

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Thing is, it don't matter what we tell ourselves the story about the afterlife is, or what our upbringing taught us to believe in, be it any of the many forms of religion, which mislead people to this day.

The thing that matters is recognizing the fact that there is a creator, that he wanted us to have an eternal life/existence with him in it, and that due to the sin described in the bible caused by Adam and Eve, and the rejection of his rules, we (the descendants) all now will be judged, by the creator on what we have said and done with the life that he has given us.

Calling your self a Christian, or Roman Catholic and going to church every Sunday doesn't mean you going straight to heaven when you die, being a Buddhist and not stepping on any bugs don't help you come back as a dolphin either.

Jesus never started a church called the Christian church, that was just a name given to the followers of Christ, after the resurrection to persecute them, after alot of people started to follow his teachings, and believed in his divine nature.

The story of Jesus casting out the demons that possessed a man into to the pigs, that then ran off the cliff, is a good example of his power, the demons recognized him from a distance, and were scared of him, begging not to be cast into he abyss preferring to inhabit an unclean animal than go to the place set aside for the imprisonment of evil spirits, and even the pigs themselves preferred death than to co exist with demon possession.

Pick up a bible and try reading it, you'll be surprised how accurate it is

bursto said:

Thing is, it don't matter what we tell ourselves the story about the afterlife is, or what our upbringing taught us to believe in, be it any of the many forms of religion, which mislead people to this day.

The thing that matters is recognizing the fact that there is a creator, that he wanted us to have an eternal life/existence with him in it, and that due to the sin described in the bible caused by Adam and Eve, and the rejection of his rules, we (the descendants) all now will be judged, by the creator on what we have said and done with the life that he has given us.

Calling your self a Christian, or Roman Catholic and going to church every Sunday doesn't mean you going straight to heaven when you die, being a Buddhist and not stepping on any bugs don't help you come back as a dolphin either.

Jesus never started a church called the Christian church, that was just a name given to the followers of Christ, after the resurrection to persecute them, after alot of people started to follow his teachings, and believed in his divine nature.

The story of Jesus casting out the demons that possessed a man into to the pigs, that then ran off the cliff, is a good example of his power, the demons recognized him from a distance, and were scared of him, begging not to be cast into he abyss preferring to inhabit an unclean animal than go to the place set aside for the imprisonment of evil spirits, and even the pigs themselves preferred death than to co exist with demon possession.

Pick up a bible and try reading it, you'll be surprised how accurate it is

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Have you actually read it yourself? How do you know it's accurate? Seriously.

bursto said:

Pick up a bible and try reading it, you'll be surprised how accurate it is

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Reading it is one thing, but try comparing it to the ORIGINAL LANGUAGE. The problem is that when it was translated if they didn't know what the word was in Hebrew a meaning was assigned to the word. Nothing more than a guess at what they thought it meant. You cannot use the Bible to prove itself. It's EXACTLY like using a word to define itself.

Based on the KJV or any other popular version can you tell me what the "Glory of God" is? What is are cherub (plural)? Why couldn't Yahweh save Moses if he stood in front of the what is translated as "The Glory of God". He was told to stand off to the side because Yahweh said he, Moses, would die if he stood in front of it.

I'm not saying there isn't a God. I'm saying that the Bible has not only been mistranslated, but bastardized by religious zealots and people with agendas. If you REALLY want to know then compare the Bible to the earliest writings. They are vaguely similar but not the same.

injinji said:

With that said, I was raised in a house with a ghost, so some people do make it to an afterlife. Our ghost was named Sam. Mamma's half sister, Ruby had a disagreement with Sam over how much affection is too much, and she used an ax to make her point. It took a couple three years, but he died from the wounds. Mamma and Daddy ended up buying his home place. They tore down the old house and used the lumber in our new (1960) house. Sam has been there for all of my life. We have all moved down to the other end of the road, about a mile away. But maybe Sam has moved too. Last year the wife say a man walk through my end of the house while I was out doing my nightly 3-5 miles.

Sam was never scary, but he would make noise to make you think you had company when you didn't, and you really didn't want any. Like when you were breaking up an elbow on the dining room table, he would make it sound like the front door opened.

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I don't dought that at all. I never said or even implied that there isn't an after life. If you want to hear my story just PM me. I got a pretty good one but I really don't want to post it here.

RottyRzr said:

Have you actually read it yourself? How do you know it's accurate? Seriously.

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Back in 2017 i hurt my foot and had a major operation where my foot was going to be in an elevated position in hospital and at home for a few months, so i decided the best way to get through the time was to start from the Genesis, and read every single word in the bible, until i got to revelation.
Some of the genealogies, were a bit tough to pronounce but i stuck with it.

So what happened was, the doctors would do their daily rounds, and I'd be paying more attention to reading the chapters of the bible, than them, (it reduced my stress levels a lot as they would often propose doing extra operations i didn't really want or need i had three already) managed to get through the old testament, in that time and finished the new testament at home recovering from all the the skin graphs.

i can understand peoples point of view about its accuracy, that's why there were 12 Apostles, so you can hear what 12 different people saw.
If a group of people saw a crime go down, and the cops asked us for witness statement's, each one would give similar but slightly different statements, out of that they would be able to piece together, what really happened, same with the bible.

bursto said:

Back in 2017 i hurt my foot and had a major operation where my foot was going to be in an elevated position in hospital and at home for a few months, so i decided the best way to get through the time was to start from the Genesis, and read every single word in the bible, until i got to revelation.
Some of the genealogies, were a bit tough to pronounce but i stuck with it.

So what happened was, the doctors would do their daily rounds, and I'd be paying more attention to reading the chapters of the bible, than them, (it reduced my stress levels a lot as they would often propose doing extra operations i didn't really want or need i had three already) managed to get through the old testament, in that time and finished the new testament at home recovering from all the the skin graphs.

i can understand peoples point of view about its accuracy, that's why there were 12 Apostles, so you can hear what 12 different people saw.
If a group of people saw a crime go down, and the cops asked us for witness statement's, each one would give similar but slightly different statements, out of that they would be able to piece together, what really happened, same with the bible.

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I've never sit down and read it straight thru but have read and studied the whole thing. Some of the things never made sense to me until I started looking at the earliest Hebrew and using the original word when we don't know the exact meaning.