grow more fertilizer ???

velrui said:

no one ??? wow this must be the real secret why northen cali has some nice fire ...the people i know that use this dont like to talk about when i ask them ????s these guye grew 14 foot trees using this stuff and the bud was some of the best i have ever seen...actualy people couldnt even belive it was outdoor ...

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You're talking about my customers, either direct or from the stores I distribute to. The schedule they are following can be found at Plants That Produce .com, under Guides, "Guide To Nutrients For Cannabis". Note that if you are growing outdoors with local water, the Cal-Mag additive is not needed. If you are growing indoors: the most important ingredient is water, and the next most important ingredient is lighting. If you aren't meeting the lighting requirements I describe then all bets are off for results.

Certainly you can get great results with products from other manufacturers, but you'll need an agriculturist like myself to design the proper dosages for the ingredients you have chosen.

I wanted to add more info about Grow More Sea Grow. I've been curious how much it costs to use. I recently weighed the two products (and Hawaiian Bud & Bloom). AP has 241 feedings per pound (at 1/2 tsp per feeding). F&B has 225. (HB&B is 370 feedings at 1/4 tsp.).

I bought 5lb tubs of Sea Grow (3lb jar of HB&B). That's about 2 cents per feeding. The smaller quantities come out to about 4 cents.

[1] The Sea Grow material can be a little fluffy due containing organic materials. I weighed the density (compaction) that I normally do when scooping a half tsp. I didn't pack it into the cup. Lightly tamped down. Lightly settled. The per Tbsp weight came out the same as the weight of a Tbsp scooped and leveled the way I'd do it if I were feeding a Tbsp.

Anyone use these nutes in DWC or Hempy? I wanted to try them in DWC but I use dutch master root zone and it kills bennies. Does that mean I wouldn't be able to use sea grow in my res?

velrui said:

has anyone ever used there ferts ?? if you have do u know the schedule?? my buddy is using there 20 10 20 from start to finsh ....any help or info would apprecited ,thanks

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hand full per plant every 2weeks man havent used there ferts never heard of the shit but i do use rock ferts for my outdoors so im thinking same same shit so thats what i do 1 hand full per plant around the base

Freiya said:

Anyone use these nutes in DWC or Hempy? I wanted to try them in DWC but I use dutch master root zone and it kills bennies. Does that mean I wouldn't be able to use sea grow in my res?

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Sea Grow dissolves completely in water. But, I don't know if its organic contents are too high for DWC or hempy, if it would lead to gunk buildup. @Hermitian is the person to answer this. I suppose he'll say it's not appropriate because his guide (<<link) for cannabis shows Sea Grow for biologically active medium. For inert medium like hydro he recommends different Grow More products.

I'm still liking Sea Grow. After I reduced the amount of give from 1tsp to 1/2 tsp, the soil acidification problem stopped. Plants are still getting enough food. It's cheap and we notice a distinct taste/smoothness difference compared to the GH Flora 3-part I was using.

I always wanted to try organic to see if it tasted as good as advocates claim. Wasn't looking forward to all the headaches of cooking a soil, brewing teas, etc. Sea Grow's definitely a nice "in between." Nice taste difference without the trouble of full organic.

I've been tweaking the NPK by mixing all-purpose and flower&bloom. For example, in veg I add Botanicare Calmag+ and GH ArmorSi to Sea Grow AP. This gives me higher N and K ratios in veg. In flower, I mix AP and FB to get a reasonable higher P an K. I replace Botanicare CM+ with Gen. Organics CaMg if I want to eliminate that source of N. I shoot for 1-3-2.

Things are going much better now. I'd like to try hermitian's guide for Sea Grow in soil. I worked out the NPK of the products his guide uses and it comes out relatively sane. I thought converting all the way to F&B (1-6.5-6.5) would be too high PK. But, the maxi-cal has a lot of N, bringing NPK down to 1.00-3.71-2.57 in bloom.

damn that sucks. I'd at least like to be able to use sea grow in hempy buckets. I just see myself leaving soil for hempy and rather not have all that fert go to waste lol. I guess i can always try it though.

Freiya said:

Anyone use these nutes in DWC or Hempy? I wanted to try them in DWC but I use dutch master root zone and it kills bennies. Does that mean I wouldn't be able to use sea grow in my res?

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I don't recommend SeaGrow for DWC. Please see the guide here: http://www.plantsthatproduce.com/guide-nutrients-for-cannabis.html

Hermitian said:

Grow More manufactures Humic Acid in two strengths: 12% for soil applications and 8% for true hydroponics. The latter is designed for better flow through Coir, Hydroton, NFT, and DWC in general; and to avoid possible clogging in microtubing.

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I wouldn't recommend humic acid or anything organic for hydroponics.

Hermitian said:

Certainly you can get great results with products from other manufacturers, but you'll need an agriculturist like myself to design the proper dosages for the ingredients you have chosen.

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I don't think so.

- Jiji

Freiya said:

damn that sucks. I'd at least like to be able to use sea grow in hempy buckets. I just see myself leaving soil for hempy and rather not have all that fert go to waste lol. I guess i can always try it though.

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I have about $40 of leftover GH Flora 3-part. It bothered me at first. But, after a few grows with Sea Grow at $1 per grow (per plant), it's just part of the big picture. I thought about using it to bump NPK to different ratios. But, calmag bumps N enough, ArmorSi bumps K enough. GrowMore Hawaiian or Hula bumps P (although I could probably find something more organic).

I'll probably donate the 3-part to the hydro store. I can't think of anything better to do with it.

jijiandfarmgang said:

I wouldn't recommend humic acid or anything organic for hydroponics.

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Humic acid is chemically classified as an organic compound because it is composed of complex chains of carbon molecules. However, it is not a biologically active compound. There are several manufacturers offering a heavy-weight (high density) extraction of Humic Acid, including the standard Grow More product. The 8% product I mentioned above works well as a bio-catalytic agent in DWC without clogging up irrigation, reservoirs, and troughs.However, I wouldn't recommend it to everyone. Take a look at your entire fertilization program -- it just might already contain humic acid in one of the inputs. Further, be careful of dosage. Too much available carbon can be a problem.

Why anyone would want their hydroponic system to have a slime residue build up from humic acid on everything the nutrient solution touches is beyond me.

No "fertilzation program" or humic acid here.

- Jiji

jijiandfarmgang said:

Why anyone would want their hydroponic system to have a slime residue build up from humic acid on everything the nutrient solution touches is beyond me.
- Jiji

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Production of auxins. Please don't knock the 8% 'till you've tried it. Then I'd be happy to hear about your feedback.

I haven't tried your product but have used other fertilizers in the past in hydro that have humic acids. It leaves a brown residue on everything, from ph probe to container.

You sell the stuff, you could care less what I think.

Just my humble opinion.

- Jiji

jijiandfarmgang said:

I haven't tried your product but have used other fertilizers in the past in hydro that have humic acids. It leaves a brown residue on everything, from ph probe to container.

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I agree that happens with general-purpose formulations -- especially those that are repackaged from 55-gallon drums normally sold to soil farmers. I have seen it myself.

jijiandfarmgang said:

You sell the stuff, you could care less what I think.

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That's far from true.

az2000 said:

... I recently weighed the two products (and Hawaiian Bud & Bloom). ...

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I periodically send products to an agricultural lab for testing -- to verify the contents and obtain current density information (the density can vary from year-to-year depending on what buffer is being used). I send the products to the lab in unopened manufacturer's packaging.

Here's results for some of the products discussed here.
0-37-37 ; 0.717 lbs/cup
5-11-26 Tomato ; 0.633 lbs/cup
Maxi-Cal 10% ; 0.78 lbs/cup
SeaGrow 16-16-16 ; 0.55 lbs/cup
SeaGrow 4-26-26 ; 0.62 lbs/cup
Hawaiian Bud (Tiki Face) ; 0.562

Grow More's Bio-Cozyme is rocking my proverbial socks this grow.

I've wasted 3 times as much money on an inferior enzyme product before.

That being said, it's the only Grow More I've used.

Im for sure going to try more of their stuff and see where it takes my crop in the future.

rohis said:

Grow More's Bio-Cozyme is rocking my proverbial socks this grow.

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It is certainly a good product. I think of it as their fourth generation hormone product. The fifth generation product is Grow More's reformulated "Jump Start" which in my trials was cheaper per dose and more effective. Consequently I removed BioCozyme from my inventory. I'd be interested in feedback (public or private conversation) from growers who have tried both, and also from experienced growers that would like to try a side-by-side comparison.

I would love to do a side by side with various enzymes on the market. So many people in the grow community aren't using enzymes, but that's certainly going to change over the next year or two when they see how helpful they can be.

The problem with doing enzyme side by sides is they are usually one of the most expensive 'bottled nutes' you can buy except for the grow more stuff, of course.

Hmm ... in the agricultural world, enzyme products have been available for at least half a century.

The truth about enzyme products is that their main active ingredients are not enzymes but rather plant hormones, auxins and other plant growth regulators that increase or decrease specific enzyme production in plants. In particular when you see "contains extracts of alfalfa, barley, seaweed" -- this tells you that the product contains one or more natural extractions of triacontanol, gibberellins, IAA, etc. Not only is dosage key to getting desired results, but also the product needs to have these compounds in certain ratios to each other -- or risk sending the plant mixed messages. The extraction process is not simple on an industrial basis so the price can be high and the results -- although food grade are not "pharmaceutically clean". You'll also notice on the label that the quantities or concentrations of these extracts are often not listed because fertilizing labeling laws don't require it. Rather, only substances that are considered plant nutrients (primary NPK, secondary and micro mineral nutrients) are required to be listed in the minimum amount present. So the numbers you see in "Guaranteed Analysis" represent the "nutrient" analysis of the extracts (which is not their primary function) plus any minerals the manufacturer might have fortified the product with. For example, the iron and zinc present in Grow More's Jump Start is probably there to provide vigor during the enzyme production. Further, you might find some "non-plant food ingredients" listed which are part of the extracts but might not be part of the product function. This can be either for advertising purposes or to distract would-be copycats from deducing the product contents.