First Time Grower, G13 Feminized

neem oil test spray seems to have gone fine. i did a 2nd test spray night. i am looking for side effects now and don't see anything obviously wrong, so i'll just wait about a half cycle and lightly spray whole plant. full cycle according to their instructions is 7 days, so let's see... friday. this coming friday i should do a full spraydown w/ neem oil.

another 40oz/370ppm watering today. should probly skip watering tomorrow, unless! ... unless things dry out too much from having a/c running a lot. tomorrow they're calling for a high of 101F & low of 76F so the a/c will be needed a lot.

veg day 56 today.

watered w/ 30oz/380ppm

max height 16"
max leafspan 28"
day 57 if i'm doin the math right
gonna go ahead & do a drought day since i've watered 3 days in a row
sucker's gonna touch the walls any minute now, which is about 32" around. judging by dr.gruber and how he said his ended up 52" tall and about the same wide, my hula room may be insufficient one day soon. that sux coz i have no plan B at the moment, ack. then again, his (p2) was already 24" tall by day 57 and mine's only 16" so maybe hula room will be nice & crowded but not overcrowded? that's the best plan A at the moment

watered w/ 30oz/410ppm. probably 30 inches wide at the widest spot, and 16-ish tall
lately i'm finding one or two small leaves w/ really thin stems drying out at the very bottom of the tree trunk where less sun action happens, and removing them from the scene. sucks, but i consider it normal.
for a week or two now or more, there's majorly asymmetric branch growth, not just from one side of the plant versus the other, but also on individual branches the smaller branches are coming out more randomly now. that's good in my book. the top end still looks pretty symmetric as you would expect.
probably at 63 days old, or up to 70, depending on things, i will switch to a 12/12 light cycle. maybe just for the hell of it i'll transition over at one hour per day, like 18/6, 17/7, 16/8, 15/9, 14/10, 13/11, then 12/12 till the end. i gotta be thorough when checking for bugs, etc. it just makes sense they'd be attracted to flowers more than to leaves, which is all i have now.

questions for anyone who wants 2 take a stab:

1 - do you have experience with molasses during flowering? like how much per 16 ounces of water, or how much per gallon, etc. what are the advantages and disadvantages? i have heard it's beneficial and makes for fatter buds.

2 - as the fan leaves form 9 leaf blades when coming out the top, i have had a few of them forming one extra blade jutting out on top of the normal 9. i first mentioned this effect on 7/2/11 on post 139 (linked). is this an early flowering response or what? is this what will happen normally throughout the plant when i induce lighting later on? i don't even consider it anything to worry about, just a weird oddity to me, since i've never grown weed before. i have some pics if necessary.

i don't know what the norm is for G13 or for any other strain for that matter, but right now over these past several days i'm getting a full ONE NODE PER DAY... not bad at all, in my book this may be more incentive to vegetate more than 63 days, closer to 70 perhaps. we'll see. the time is drawing near. we're in day 58 right now.

neem-oil spraydown earlier, around 1230pm. not 100% thorough, but got to most of the upper & lower sides of the leaves. 6 hrs later, no side effects at all. leaves lookin really stiff & upright right now. omg, i'm running out of room already! lol... side-leaves touching (or damn-near touching) the insides of the hularoom in 3 areas. keep in mind, inner diameter of room is like 34 inches. i suppose i could ditch the hularoom but then light penetration totally drops off. i'll have to let the leaves max out or whatever they're gonna do, & take it from there. some 48" hulahoops would help i guess, if there even is such a thing...

watered 40oz/400ppm @ sun-up (6:30pm est)
removed 6 or 8 tiny little leaves at the bottom which had dried out with ultra thin stems. unless i hear otherwise, i think this is normal maintenance at this point. plant is effin huge.
after neem oil, i got more stretch & less new leaf tissue. i don't know if the 2 are related or not. if anything, it allowed more sunlight to penetrate deeply. now the nodes are starting to pick up again out of the top.

supersymmetry said:

View attachment 1683581View attachment 1683582
ok some zoom shots on the needle pairs i'm talkin about. pic 1 shows 1 pair of needles. pic 2 shows 2 pair of needles.

i have had these from the start on basically every branch spot. there are no other features on the branch spots except regular ol' leaves here & there (not pictured) so, what are these needles called? are they pistils or something else?

Click to expand...

Those are fem preflowers, I think. Females preflower usually doubles, Males usually single spike. You are very bold to take on a race horse for your 1st.

hi tony, good 2 hear from ya
you're right. every day i'm like "wow, can i still keep up with this challenge?" so far it has been trouble-free, except for my occasional fumble. my main fear now is running out of room and not having a good plan B to stay stealth. the thing is enormous beyond what i expected, and i have not even started flowering yet...

i chose g13 for a few reasons
1 - i have the mentality of "if you're gonna go, go all out" i.e. don't half-ass it
2 - i don't like having to hunt down unreliable/shady dealers
3 - buying weed from a dealer is a total ripoff
4 - it is not practical to grow a new plant all the time so i like how g13 claimed to be the heaviest plant available. my plan was to do one fairly gigantic grow, and store it all in the fridge for usage over a year, or as long as it lasts.
5 - my taste standards are pretty low (beggars can't be choosers) so that wasn't really a consideration. dr.gruber (fellow g13 grower) rated it a 7 out of 10. dr.greenthumb (the seedbank) rated it a 4.5 out of 5. either one of those is fine by me. i just like some relaxation, i don't care about exotic flavors too much.
hope 2 hear more from you
6 - oh yeah forgot the most important thing: good genetics, old school genetics. i did a lot of scouring around the net to see other people's opinions before buying the seeds and they all said how it has really top-notch genetics and is easy to grow and is low-smell. they were right on all fronts, so far. the fact that it is directly based on plants from the 1970s or 1980s is a good thing in my book.

current stats: about 18 1/2" high, about 35" wide at the widest leafspans

this is a cool utube find. it's not mine, nor do i know the author, but it's one of the more informative time lapse vids for newbys like me because it's so detailed up close & personal http://youtu.be/mjRcLzEgGFs

[video=youtube;mjRcLzEgGFs]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mjRcLzEgGFs[/video]

bought 100ft of 3/4" irrigation tubing & 4 plastic connectors. plan to buy some more light-tight white fabric. plan is to build a bigger grow room about 5ft wide (current one is just under 3 ft at 34") with those materials. main advantages: bigger size & easily openable side, unline current room. ordered another carnival mirror. will use it, and the existing one, to line bigger grow room. haven't decided if i want to set up in main room like now, or adjacent smaller room. main advantages: smaller room would be easier to keep light-tight but i think it has it own little "ecosystem" of water-thirsty mini-gnats, not sure. smaller room also far more stealth than main room. i need to decide soon & get going because the plant is touching all around current grow room. even though it doesn't feel any outta-space stress yet, i wanna relieve/prevent that stress asap.

at this point i'm determined to *not* buy another UFO light. newer/better lights are out all the time in this fast-moving industry & i just don't wanna get caught up in researching the best bang-for-yer-buck deals right now. maybe i'll change my mind during flowering. if things get hot & heavy later, i can supplement with conventional lights from the hardware store or whatever. that's only if the buds tell me they need it. i'd prefer to see what the measly 90-watter can do alone, because so far it has kicked ass.

spotted one for-sure pistil earlier. watered 30oz/400ppm couple hrs ago. the internodes really vary in size. i'm getting some very tight spacing again, whereas right around the time i neem-oiled it a few days ago i got a lot more stretch.

baby's lookin quite ready to flower and i am ready too. this week or early next i should be making the final decision when to switch to 12/12, and what times of day to cycle light/darkness. i don't expect as much density as dr.gruber's, but i must say the mirrors kick ass too.

19 1/4" tall by probably 37" wide on this drought day. maxed out to about 1 1/2" on both sides of the appx 34" wide room. i hope to work on bigger room construction 2moro in preparation for flowering.

if i want to switch nutes from jacks classic 20-20-20 general purpose mix to jacks classic 10-30-20 bloom mix, can i do that right away or do i have to mix the two mixes for a while?

Super wrote:
"at this point i'm determined to *not* buy another UFO light. newer/better lights are out all the time in this fast-moving industry & i just don't wanna get caught up in researching the best bang-for-yer-buck deals right now. maybe i'll change my mind during flowering. if things get hot & heavy later, i can supplement with conventional lights from the hardware store or whatever. that's only if the buds tell me they need it. i'd prefer to see what the measly 90-watter can do alone, because so far it has kicked ass."

Hey Super, I'm a UFO user for three years although the UFO's are made by all kinds of peeps, some lousy and some work great. I am currently working on a hybrid of UFO's and the Litro Glow flourescent tubes. If you are building a new flower area then I strongly suggest looking into the possibility of a hybrid as well.

Also you mentioned Gnats. Those are a serious invader so get right to work on kicking their little butts out. I suggest internet search "root aphids" You will find a PDF "HOW TO FIGHT OFF ROOT APHIDS". The same treatment fights root aphids and fungus gnats both of which will rob you if not kicked out.
Good luck, Tony

just watered plant w/ 60oz/400ppm. usually i do 40oz every other day & get no runoff water, so i wanted to see if 60oz would run off. nope not yet...

tony what do you mean by hybrid, you mean a combination of the ufo w/ additional fluorescents? i might have to go that way during flowering. i will b flowering as soon as my new 5ft-across grow "room" is built. i am working on building it tonight.

my rooms aren't really rooms. my current room is 2 hula hoops with 4 feet of blackout fabric between em and flex mirror material lining the inside. fabric is called blackout because it blocks out all light, but its actual color is white/white or white/ivory. anywaythe new "room" will be based on same concept, but built off of 3/4" irrigation tube (from lowe's) which i have cut down to a huge hula hoop 14ft 3inches around, or 5ft diameter. this was based on how dr.gruber said that his g13 plant got to be over 4 feet wide.

the gnats are not really a problem right now. i don't see any insects at all except a while fly or a single micro/black gnat occasionally. i have tried to keep it all-natural by using neem oil extract and Mosquito Dunks. these 2 things seem to be working well. i will check into what you said, thanks

today is actually day 63 in vegetation so i should be starting to flower any minute now if i wanted to do a 63veg/63flower schedule, but i will wait until i'm satisfied w/ the bigger hula-room because the plant is pushing up against the current room in 3 or 4 areas & i need to give it more room. probably a few hours to build new room, probably a few days to make sure it's reliable. also waiting on a new 56" x 84" flex mirror from http://carnivalmirror.com which should be here tomorrow

edit. my ufo came from http://prosourceworldwide.com/Illuminator-90W-UFO-LED-Grow-Lights-p/illuminator ufo 90w.htm they had excellent reviews & it came with a 3-yr warranty. paid $250 on sale earlier this year. hard to beat for a beginner. last i checked they were $300 regular price. it says on it "5-band tri-spectrum illuminator ufo" and is rated at 90 watts, 100 watts w/ fans running. i consider it a legit product. there are cheap lookalikes but this one is high quality so far. if i ever buy more grow lights, it'll probably be the 180w or higher, or from a different supplier with those external re-focusing lenses and whatnot.

Super, Yes my 4 UFO's all are from Prosource too. I've been running them all the way start to finish with good results. One of mine is the 180 jumbo and I just got 21/2 ozs of finished product from a White Berry under it. Yes I agree good products from Prosource. My main flowering right now is twin 90's running on a light mover with the addition of the 90w "flower accellerator".

Yes by hybrid I do mean running Litro Glow tubes in conjunction with the UFO's. I expect my results to go from good to verrry good.

Suggestion about air flow.... with a super bud machine like you have really strong air circulation will help keep that bud rot away.

I understand your natural approach to gnat and whitefly control. I use Azamax as my main weapon against them as well as sticky traps. Just remember one can lay a thousand eggs so keep them at bay. Sometimes seems they are getting used to Azamax so I am also considering other products. I have had them ruin my yield in the past so I don't take them lightly.

2 pics from 8 hours ago - 1 from each side. i don't know how easy it is to see but the side leaves are touching the flex mirror

stem center is now 20 1/2" tall. the full-size fan leaves @ the top reach to exactly 21" when erect. width is maxed out in the 34" wide grow room (about to be upgraded), so the total width would be around 38" right now without constraints

tony thanks, good idea. i probably need to get a bigger fan. in the pics you can see my red 4-inch fan on the floor. that's what i have right now. got it in the bargain bin at wal-mart for $6. it has done well but it's time for a fan bigger than smurf-sized...

it's been about a month since the previous Mosquito Dunk application so i just did another one, sorta backwards style. i wanted to see if it would be water soluble so i crumbled 1/4 of one disc (based on directions) and put it in about 10oz tap water and shook it up over 15 or 20 min. hmm, well the water did turn foggy but the cork-looking chunks of the dunk kept floating. so i figured i'd go ahead & crumble a separate 1/4 disc & top-dress the soil as best as possible. plant is too dense down there so getting even distribution was hard, but i did allright. after that, i used that foggy water & added 10oz more of 420ppm nute water & watered the plant. so the grand total was: about 20oz of 210ppm water plus the dissolved stuff from 1/4 disc of Mosquito Dunks, poured over a separate 1/4 disc of Mosquito dunks spread crumbled up on the dirt.

watered 40oz/410ppm

new room 54"-around room is up! wow, so roomy compared to the 34"-around one i just took down. it's very rudimentary right now. it's just 2 sheets hanging from 2 semicircle plastic tubes, all hanging from my ceiling fan. no mirrors yet, but there will be later tonight and/or tomorrow. the 2 tubes are 7 ft 1 1/2" each, each carrying an 8 ft long sheet about 54" tall. sheet was cut longer than tube for light-proof overlapping.

need to work on cutting room-top cone-shaped sheet coz it's wide open, so i gotta have it done by sundown. sundown = 1230pm tomorrow.

disadvantages so far:
- it's almost twice as heavy as the old room so i gotta go buy at least 5 more bungee cords for a total of 10 for good weight distribution
- basically impossible to have 1 continuous mirror piece because mirror comes in 56" wide x 84" long sheet, & room innards are now 54" height x 171" around

advantages so far:
- it had been forever since i had a chance to lift grow pot to get a feel for weight. that's easy now.
-watering is effortless right now... step right in & we (i & the plant) easily fit together in there. it had been a pain in the ass to water lately as the plant quickly filled the old room.
- much easier up-close observation for pests.
- mirrors will be smaller pieces so there's almost no chance a mirror could collapse on plant. there were some close calls up till now in old room

more later, gotta go