Enjoy your jail time Holder...

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
Ah, I see you've been 'inspired' by the vanguard party. I thought more highly of you than I ought.
who praytell is the Vanguard party? i form my own opinions regardless of which side is blowing smoke up my ass, and both sides blow smoke extensively. truth be told they are not even two sides, they are pro wrestling. a show for the rubes with babyfaces and heels throwing each other about and taking "bumps" while the concessionaires and Vince Mc Mahon rake in the dough. It doesnt matter if the Undertaker defeats Mankind, or Stone Cold delivers a Stunner to The Rock, the men behind the curtains still controll the show, write the scripts and decide who wins and who loses. everything else is theater for the masses. Each party plays the role they are given and it doesnt matter if they switch now and again (remember the dems of the 60's hating negroes with such passion, and ten years later they love them?) its all a game. and not Hunter Hearst Helmsley either.

your vehement hatred of Degeneration X and love for the Mc Mahon faction and the Spirit Squad clearly puts you at odds with those who have pierced the veil and seen the truth. I still enjoy wrestling, but its not as engrosssing as it was when i was a little Hulkamaniac booing The Nature Boy Rick Flair. childhood ends, and the heroes of our youth are just men, flawed, fallible and mortal. except The Rock. Hes still awesome. I used to drink in the words of Ted Kennedy and Tom Brokaw, they were what was right and good. then i saw their lies and falsehoods as i learned how the world really works. i dont pray at the feet of rush limbaugh or glen beck either, they all kinda piss me off with their bullshit. i preferr facts truth and logic to the comfortable lies of politicians telling me what they think i want to hear.
 

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
who praytell is the Vanguard party?
When libertarian is done incorrectly, it is fascist. It came from the far right and is disguised as nonpartisan. It's strongest message is anti liberalism. It spreads only fear. It is a proletarian revolution from above only differing from classic fascism in one way, it's love of Laissez Fair capitalism. Above all, it is anti egalitarian and would leave our society highly regimented, stratified more so than ever.

Am I mistaken for taking you for a Paulbot?
 

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
When libertarian is done incorrectly, it is fascist. It came from the far right and is disguised as nonpartisan. It's strongest message is anti liberalism. It spreads only fear. It is a proletarian revolution from above only differing from classic fascism in one way, it's love of Laissez Fair capitalism. Above all, it is anti egalitarian and would leave our society highly regimented, stratified more so than ever.

Am I mistaken for taking you for a Paulbot?
i am a constitutional constructionist, a real libertarian, and a free market fan, as long as the market is regulated fairly to ensure trusts dont form and unions dont become the masters of other people's businesses. No one, natural or corporate should be allowed to "externalize" their costs on somebody else, and nobody should be forced to labour for the government for more than half the year to pay taxes on their own sweat.

my favorite presidents are Theodore Roosevelt, Thomas Jefferson and John F Kennedy in that order. does this answer your question?

Ron Paul has one thing dead right. our privatized monetary system and fiat currency issued by the banking cartel called the Federal Reserve is the root of many of our problems. it was conceived in secret, drafted by the most despicable banking and money elite imaginable, jp morgan, william randolf hearst, the rockerfellers, the carnegies and the rothschilds (rothchilds are the only jews in this list so save the accusations of antisemitism, this is history not fiction) on jekyll island, sold through lies to their dupe woodrow wilson (who regretted this action till his dying day, thank you very much) and their willing servants in congress, despite the entreaties of the founding fathers, abraham lincoln and every other american historical figure who wasnt an idiot, and the fact that the costitution gives congress the power and responsibility to coin and mint money, and does NOT give them the power to gift this authority to an unaccountable secret cabal of bankers. ever since the federal reserve act created the central bank our political system has been up for auction to the highest bidder, and since the bankers now have the power to create money from their magic hat, they always win. I dont agree with everything Ron Paul says but he is better than Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum who are currently giving each other open handed slaps to the chest while Jerry Lawler makes the Play by Play at the announce table.
 

abandonconflict

Well-Known Member
i am a constitutional constructionist, a real libertarian, and a free market fan, as long as the market is regulated fairly to ensure trusts dont form and unions dont become the masters of other people's businesses. No one, natural or corporate should be allowed to "externalize" their costs on somebody else, and nobody should be forced to labour for the government for more than half the year to pay taxes on their own sweat.

my favorite presidents are Theodore Roosevelt, Thomas Jefferson and John F Kennedy in that order. does this answer your question?

Ron Paul has one thing dead right. our privatized monetary system and fiat currency issued by the banking cartel called the Federal Reserve is the root of many of our problems. it was conceived in secret, drafted by the most despicable banking and money elite imaginable, jp morgan, william randolf hearst, the rockerfellers, the carnegies and the rothschilds (rothchilds are the only jews in this list so save the accusations of antisemitism, this is history not fiction) on jekyll island, sold through lies to their dupe woodrow wilson (who regretted this action till his dying day, thank you very much) and their willing servants in congress, despite the entreaties of the founding fathers, abraham lincoln and every other american historical figure who wasnt an idiot, and the fact that the costitution gives congress the power and responsibility to coin and mint money, and does NOT give them the power to gift this authority to an unaccountable secret cabal of bankers. ever since the federal reserve act created the central bank our political system has been up for auction to the highest bidder, and since the bankers now have the power to create money from their magic hat, they always win. I dont agree with everything Ron Paul says but he is better than Tweedle Dee and Tweedle Dum who are currently giving each other open handed slaps to the chest while Jerry Lawler makes the Play by Play at the announce table.
So you are mainly focused on the fed as the source of problems in the country. Well I can dig that, however, I think that it is something that goes deeper than the outside eye can see. I think the whole point of it is to create a way for the right wing to hit us with a hidden tax in the form of inflation to fund war. They print and invade. I think that they give the left a chance to sit in the seat to replenish the wealth at the bottom rungs of society, which can then be looted for more war when a righty takes office again. This is why the right promises lower taxes, since they plan on robbing us anyway by printing more money, then they have a lefty come and redistribute the wealth. That is my crazy hypothesis I will never prove. Anyway, just sharing my interpretation of the beast, since you shared yours. There certainly is a beast.

I think both the left and the right have opposing unsustainable economic policies, but when you alternate between the two, you create the endless growth paradigm and yield a fortune that can be looted and spent on war every few years. This in turn creates a space to continue growing as well as resources to devour.

I highlighted in bold a part of what you wrote that I don't understand, it seems to me not to make sense and you seem to write better than that so maybe you made a mistake. Actually, I think it is the main problem with Ron Paul, his economic radicalism. That and does this guy really think it is ok for sick people to die in the street and for poor people to starve? Hate welfare all you want, but as long as 5% (rough number, I don't know exact figures, but it isn't a pushy guess) of the population isn't working, that is the only way they are going to eat, I don't really agree that 5% of America should starve, I love my country, how dare anyone suggest such a thing.

Just for shits and giggles, because you seem like a smart guy, would you read this wiki? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism Just to see how much this Ron Paul revolution resembles a Leninist Vanguard Party for proletarian revolution. Differing only in that it claims to be diametrically opposed to Socialism, which is the only way it would be possible in America, since we are mostly old farts with a cold war indoctrination. Never before have I seen so many people with no political intuition blindly following the ideas of one man who wields the power to dictate ideologically over his followers.
 

canndo

Well-Known Member
"our top political priority over the next two years should be to deny president obama a second term."

top POLITICAL priority, not above economic issues winning the war in afghanistan, or preventing the spread of ebola among preschoolers in america

you have an agenda, and quick soundbites and pictures with words scribbled on them doesnt make republicans into the font of evil you desire them to be.

bot republicans and democrats have done the bullshit thats put our country on the shitheap. they shared the spoils, and the fun, now they need to share the blame. if the people of the USA stand in their left-wing VS right-wing groups and hurl insults at each other the bastards will slink off with their pockets full of our wealth and prosperity while we fight.

Nice parse - if you don't think that our current economic situation is political then you havn't been paying attention.

"AN ELECTION THAT THE REPUBLICANS NEEDED TO LOSE – GOOD LUCK OBAMA
By Dick Morris on November 6, 2008
Published on TheHill.com on October 5, 2008
If ever there was an election that was not worth winning, it was the contest of 2008. While it was hard-fought on both sides, had McCain won, it might have spelled the end of the Republican Party. As it is, the party is well-situated to come back in 2010 and in 2012, if it learns the lessons of this year.
Simply put, all hell is about to break loose in the markets and the economy. The mortgage crisis will likely be followed by defaults in credit card debt, student loans and car loans. We will probably be set for two years of zero growth, according to economists with whom I talk. And the federal efforts to protect the nation from the worst of the recession will probably lead to huge budget deficits and resulting inflation. We are in for stagflation that could last for years.

Had McCain won, he would be the latter-day Hoover, blamed for the disaster that unfolded on his watch. Now it is Obama’s problem. With the Republicans suffering a wipeout in congressional elections (although not as bad as they feared), the ball is now squarely in the Democratic court. Good luck!"


Now what does this tell us? that the right was aware of the shit storm brewing, a shit storm that they spent 8 years making (well, actually 30 but who is counting). It says that indeed, Obama is correct in blaming his predecessor, it says that they knew what was going down and wanted to leave it at the doorstep of someone in the other party. Further investigation i.e. the intense obstructionism, including voting against bills that the right previously was for, demonstrates that the right is in the process of accomplishing, through any means, that "political" priority.
 

canndo

Well-Known Member
who praytell is the Vanguard party? i form my own opinions regardless of which side is blowing smoke up my ass, and both sides blow smoke extensively. truth be told they are not even two sides, they are pro wrestling. a show for the rubes with babyfaces and heels throwing each other about and taking "bumps" while the concessionaires and Vince Mc Mahon rake in the dough. It doesnt matter if the Undertaker defeats Mankind, or Stone Cold delivers a Stunner to The Rock, the men behind the curtains still controll the show, write the scripts and decide who wins and who loses. everything else is theater for the masses. Each party plays the role they are given and it doesnt matter if they switch now and again (remember the dems of the 60's hating negroes with such passion, and ten years later they love them?) its all a game. and not Hunter Hearst Helmsley either.

your vehement hatred of Degeneration X and love for the Mc Mahon faction and the Spirit Squad clearly puts you at odds with those who have pierced the veil and seen the truth. I still enjoy wrestling, but its not as engrosssing as it was when i was a little Hulkamaniac booing The Nature Boy Rick Flair. childhood ends, and the heroes of our youth are just men, flawed, fallible and mortal. except The Rock. Hes still awesome. I used to drink in the words of Ted Kennedy and Tom Brokaw, they were what was right and good. then i saw their lies and falsehoods as i learned how the world really works. i dont pray at the feet of rush limbaugh or glen beck either, they all kinda piss me off with their bullshit. i preferr facts truth and logic to the comfortable lies of politicians telling me what they think i want to hear.

Except, those of us who have seen the truth are overwhelmed by it. I have an intense distrust for anything that might stink of conspiracy but continue to encounter something akin to it (except that in many cases that "conspiracy" is in plain sight). What part does Dominionism play in your understaning of your "truth"?
 

Dr Kynes

Well-Known Member
I highlighted in bold a part of what you wrote that I don't understand, it seems to me not to make sense and you seem to write better than that so maybe you made a mistake. Actually, I think it is the main problem with Ron Paul, his economic radicalism. That and does this guy really think it is ok for sick people to die in the street and for poor people to starve? Hate welfare all you want, but as long as 5% (rough number, I don't know exact figures, but it isn't a pushy guess) of the population isn't working, that is the only way they are going to eat, I don't really agree that 5% of America should starve, I love my country, how dare anyone suggest such a thing.

Just for shits and giggles, because you seem like a smart guy, would you read this wiki? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism Just to see how much this Ron Paul revolution resembles a Leninist Vanguard Party for proletarian revolution. Differing only in that it claims to be diametrically opposed to Socialism, which is the only way it would be possible in America, since we are mostly old farts with a cold war indoctrination. Never before have I seen so many people with no political intuition blindly following the ideas of one man who wields the power to dictate ideologically over his followers.
First off, markets, if not regulated become a free-for-all of buying and selling untill those with more at the start have evertything. this does not mean markets should be controlled, just regulated. heres a medieval example:

Jon raises sheep in the cotswald hills on land he RENTS from his fuedal overlord, but is forbidden from owning. Jon's tax is his rent. as long as his lordship receives his rent, jon could raise sheep, grow turnips, brew beer or juggle on the street corner for his living. His lordship doesnt care at all as long as the rent is paid. Jon's sheep provide milk wool and meat. he trades milk and meat with his neighbors all winter long for vegetables, cabbages and whatnot. He makes cheese with the excess milk, and sells that to the local innkeeper and his lordships castellan for his lordship's table. come the spring though, thats when jon plans to turn the profit at the wool faire. He shears his sheep, bundles the wool and loads up a waggon with his wool. To help defray the costs of the waggon rental he may share the waggon with the brewer and the baker who are also headed to the wool faire as concessionaires. Upon arriving at the wool market he heads over to the weaver's stalls to see who will pay him the most for his wool. how odd, so many people with so much unbought wool this year. he manages to reach a weaver through the throngs, and is offered 2 schillings for all ten bundles of his finest wool. this is of course unacceptable! It seems, the weavers are buying their wool from Andalusian sheep herders, and since Andalusian sheep herders wool is cheap as fuck, they dont need to pay jon and his friends for their wool at all. Apparently Andalusia is in the middle of a crisis, and the sheepherders will take a pittance for their wool rather than starve! Jon doesnt want the Andalusian sheep herders to starve, but doesnt want to starve himself either, and if he cant sell his wool for the 10 schilling minimum just to pay the rent this year he will be cast out or forced to work as a bonded servant untill he can make up the debt (and ten schillings will take a decade to pay off as a bondsman). so, jon is fucked, the andalusian sheep herders are fucked, the king doenst get his cut of the wool faire's proceeds, because most of the weaver's guild didnt even bother to show up and pay their fee to his majesty, his lordship doesnt get his rent paid and thus has to dip into his own purse to pay HIS liege lord, and in the end only the weavers are smiling, as they got the wool they need for 1/5th what they would normally pay, and cloth still will cost the same come winter. ohhhh yeah!

regulating markets is a sovereign duty, if your people produce something, then you MUST charge a duty on imports of that product, or your own people could wind up starving, or surviving on the queen's charity (which comes from the king's pocket). securing your markets, and ensuring your people will not be undercut by foreign goods is a basic necessity of any market economy. the burghers and merchants will always seek out the lowest price for goods, and charge the most they can get for the products. thats how they make their cheddar. if left to their own devices they will "Buy Low" the fuck out of foreign lands, and " Sell High" the ass of your peasants on the shit they have to have in order to live. The merchant class (the middle class) are by their nature non-productive. they consume, rather than produce. they are the middle managers who decide what a store sells based on "metrics" which are arbitrary and useless, the marketing geniuses who thought New Coke was a good idea, but still have their jobs, CEOs who run a company into the ground and then pull the cord on their platinum parachutes, and faceless mandarins who declare the European Feral Pig a protected species in contra costa county. think about that one...

well regulated markets prevent the merchant class (and their corporate creations) from purchasing their goods in foreign lands and undercutting local producers of these same goods. Japan lays heavy tarriffs on imported rice, because they see their rice farmers as worhty of protection, and it's in their national interest to insulate themselves from world rice market prices. this is a sensible step, taken by many nations to protect the producers of the products they need. The US should lay fat ass tariffs on EVERYTHING coming into this country, so that we will no longer be a "service" economy, and we can actually produce the things we need rather than importing therm because they are cheaper that way.

leftists always bitch because the 12-pack of tube socks wal-mart sells for $5 only cost them 30 cents to produce in indonesia china or vietnam. the profit motive of wal-mart and the "free trade" bullshit from both the leftists and the right wingers throughout the last 30 years has made the EXPENSIVE TRADE we now have to deal with. if we made our own fucking tube socks again they might cost $8, but that $8 would be paid to americans who would then have the money to buy said tube socks without going on the dole! if you export your money to buy goods from foreign lands you only enrich the assholes who ship those goods, and the dickheads who sell them to you. thats how the sainted "middle class" make their money. when leftists talk about the "middle class" they mean the working class, and when rightists talk about the "middle class" they mean the money trust. this is not semantics, this is marxist doctrine on both sides, seize control of the language and you control the debate. by shifting the eyes of the people with their dicks in a vice from the dudes who are actually twisting the handles (congress, government bureaucrats and the money trust that controls them both) to the false villain of the "corporations" and the "1%" the real assholes can just twist away till your cock falls off into the meat grinder.

government regulations, the money trust and the natural and understandable drive of the rich to get richer are the driving forces behind the destruction of our economy. when the money trust of bankers, the federal reserve and other "industries" who only move money about and let some of it stick to their fingers run the regulation of the markets that make them rich then those markets will only continue to make them richer. Obama sold himself as the NEW MAN who had no allegiance to the assholes who have been pulling the strings for so long. it was all marketing. his new opponent Romney is undoubtedly a servant of the money trust. this election is now just a vote to see who gets to piss on your face, the black guy or the weird mormon guy. either way we still get a face full of piss. Thats all we can expect until the markets are once again FREE at the bottom, with very little regulation for small players and well regulated at the top, to ensure the big players dont run the table.
 
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