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Dyna-Gro vs Advanced Nutrients Connoisseur (AK47 Grow)

Discussion in 'Grow Journals' started by homebrewer, May 5, 2011.

  1.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    This showdown is going to be in the same manner as my http://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/358562-dyna-gro-vs-general-hydroponics.html journal in that it won’t be a simultaneous grow-off, but rather a direct comparison of the base nutrient lines offered by DynaGro and Advanced Nutrients. I’ll be comparing things like pH stability, salt build up, plant performance, plant health, nutrient concentration levels, and of course final yield.

    I chose Connoisseur because it’s probably the most expensive, over-hyped base nutrient on the market and as a veteran grower, I’m in a much better position to put out the truth about the actual performance of this product than some beginner who just doesn’t know any better. After 11 years in this hobby, I’ve settled into the no-frills DynaGro brand which offers total and complete plant nutrition and isn’t purposely split up into multiple products. I’m not starting this journal because I’m unhappy with my current nutrient brand, I just want to post some honest and bullshiz free info about AN’s most ‘prestigious’ base nutrient. Welcome to the no-hype zone ;).

    The strain we’ll be working with is Serious Seeds’ AK47, a strain I’ve grown many times before and am very familiar with. Using DynaGro, my yields for the past four grows have all been between 20 and 21.3 ounces (most recent harvest numbers are not in yet) so this shall be the benchmark for AN’s Connoisseur. In regards to the final product, I’ll also be looking for differences or similarities in potency, aroma and flavor, all of which will be 'tested' for in a blind comparison.

    Now AN fanboys are probably among the most annoying members in this community and there will probably be a few following along. There will be no arguing, personal attacks, or just plain old newb-grower ignorance in this thread, just the facts as I post them throughout this comparison. Unwanted and unwarranted posts will be reported. Let the competition begin….

    My setup is a DIY Ebb & Flow system with 6 inch rockwool cubes and a 600 watt HPS hortilux. I flood two to three times per day for 15 minutes with weekly res changes and a pH in the high 5's. These plants were vegged with DynaGro Grow and were also topped.


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  2.  
    bestbuds09

    bestbuds09 Well-Known Member

    Count me in.. I'm one of those that believe AN is overrated and overpriced...... I hate going to a hydro store where I'm @, they always try to sell me that bullshit. Anyhow I'm really interested in the ak47 yiull be growing. I've been looking for some good seeds from sensi. How good is sensis AK?
     
  3.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    So this being day 1 of flowering, there isn’t much I can report on except for cost and concentration levels. If I have time, I'll get into the NPK ratios as well.

    Nutrient concentration levels: This is one thing that is often overlooked by growers when factoring in the actual cost of a fertilizer. Take DynaGro for example; at near $50 per gallon, DynaGro doesn’t appear to be one of the most economical fertilizers on the market. One thing that the bottle wont tell you is just how concentrated the nutrient solution actually is. 1ml of DynaGro's grow and bloom into a gallon of water nets a final ppm (on the 442 scale or .7 conversion) of 220. 1 ml of Connoisseur A&B into a gallon of water nets a final ppm of 140 (on the 442 scale or .7 conversion), making DynaGro 157% more concentrated than Connoisseur. In other words, 2 gallons of DynaGro would last me about seven grow cycles whereas Connoisseur A&B would last just a touch over 5 grow cycles.

    As much as I’d like to report that Connoisseur is highly diluted, their concentration levels seem to be about average based on other fertilizers that I own.

    Cost: I don’t like the fact that with Connoisseur, one needs to buy both A & B to properly flower plants. I paid $75 for these 2 liters of base nutrients but the price comparisons below will be using the 1 gallon price of $85 per bottle ($170 for the pair). While each bottle of DynaGro grow and bloom are 100% complete and are excellent stand-alone fertilizers, I do use them together all the way though flower so in essence, I use it as a two-part as well.

    Assuming I was only using base nutrients for this entire grow and assuming the same feeding levels and flowering period, DynaGro would cost $14.09 for the entire flowering cycle versus Connoisseur A&B which would cost $32.17. The $18 difference per flowering period could easily be negated should Connoisseur be the superior yielding fertilizer. We shall see.
     
  4.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    These AK47's are from Serious Seeds and the quality of any given strain depends on personal preference, but as a whole, I really like this strain. I selected the most sativa-dominant phenotype in my pack of seeds because that's what I prefer. It yields really well, grows nice and bushy, smells great, has a flowering period just over 60 days, has a high that is more social and energetic and is fairly easy to trim, all these things make this a great strain to own. It's also very popular among my patients.
     
  5.  
    bestbuds09

    bestbuds09 Well-Known Member

    I'm liking what I'm reading about sensis ak.... more than likely that's the one ill be purchasing..... thanks man..
     
  6.  
    maphisto

    maphisto Well-Known Member

    YO!! good stuff as always h/b.
     
  7.  
    Encomium

    Encomium Active Member

    This is going to be an awesome show hb. I've already switched to DG nutes in large part due to your earlier journal. I love the simplicity and low maintenance that I've had using the DG line of nutes. The only thing I've added to the 3 main bottles is a FloraNectar from GH as I noticed that the DG line really didn't address sugar additives. At any rate, I'm along for the full ride this time :)
     
  8.  
    maphisto

    maphisto Well-Known Member

    so h/b we all know d/g has a complete nutrition what about Connoisseur how much nutrition between both bottles?
     
  9.  
    mr.smileyface

    mr.smileyface Well-Known Member

    I would max connie out at 950. Even tho its not as concentrated, its potent.
    How can you tell a differnce with seeds? Or am i wrong?
    I think Part A is The same as there micro. Prettty much same thing just one cost 4 times as much. It looks the same tho. I stop using conn and just use GMB and b52 by advanced. I get the same results so why should i pay more? The GMB make my buds so sticky and smelly.
    Btw connie isnt sappose to be used in early bud. Week4 is when most a+b are ran.
    What do you think? Is connoisseur the same as micro? maybe more chelates? im subbed
     
  10.  
    Illumination

    Illumination New Member

    You know I am here...lol

    Namaste':leaf:
     
  11.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    From a nutrition perspective, I honestly don’t know what AN is thinking with Connoisseur. They list seven total essential elements on the back of the bottle, 3 of which are chelated. DynaGro lists 14 with 4 being chelated. Both companies could be supplying more minerals than are listed as they may not be present in the amount that allows them to be under the Guaranteed Analysis. I know DynaGro offers sulfur and nickel which brings them up to 16 essential elements, both of which are not listed on the bottle but are on their site. According to AN’s website, Connoisseur contains a total of 13 essential elements if you dig though the derived from section. For $50 a gallon, DynaGro can supply essential elements in the amounts that meet the listing requirements, at $170 for the Connoisseur gallon set, I don’t see why they cannot. They do claim to chelate a few additional minerals in the derived from section which may be why they are present in smaller amounts and therefore not listed in the Guaranteed Analysis. From a bottling perspective, maybe those chelates present an issue as I cannot figure out why AN couldn't have condensed parts A&B. DynaGro chelates four minerals, offers more total essential elements in greater amounts and is in one bottle at a lower cost.

    In addition, I’m also not crazy about the 1-1-2 NPK ratio offered by Connoisseur. I’ve had the best results emulating a 1-3-2 ratio during flower but according to fat mike at AN, that’s too much phosphorus (according to tissue samples). From the AN site….

    So this should be interesting as I honestly don’t see Connoisseur doing that well from a yield perspective given the NPK ratio. But we’re putting their hype and their ‘cannabis-specific tissue samples’ to the test so stick around and we shall see.
     
  12.  
    rosecitypapa

    rosecitypapa Active Member

    Hey Homebrewer,

    What's the NPK of the Dyna-gro? Are you using their gro formula 7-9-5 or the bloom one? Also, have you experienced any mag def when using this formulation. I know it's a complete formulation, however my plants are showing magnesium deficiency unless I amp up the cal/mag. What's the starting TDS of your water?

    The foliage pro product is hard to find at grow shops. Even though is has that ideal NPK, it's interesting in that no one carries it.
     
  13.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    I use the 7-9-5 grow along with the 3-12-6 Bloom and when mixed together, I can achieve very close to a 1-3-2 ratio. Because I use RO water, I use Magpro in hydro and have not had any issues with deficiencies at all. In dirt however, I usually feed, feed, water and on my 'water' days, I'll mix in about 3mls per gallon of calmag because RO is not ideal with my peat-based soil-less mix. DynaGro for me has been a very trouble free nutrient to use in both dirt and hydro.
     
  14.  
    upthearsenal

    upthearsenal Well-Known Member

    Awesome.

    I'm thinking of using Dynagro in soil-less soon and will then be using it in ebb and flow whenever I get the system built. I'm not a fan of AN one bit yet this should still be informational.

    I'm subbed, looking forward to another one of your journals.

    Cheers homebrewer!
     
  15.  
    rosecitypapa

    rosecitypapa Active Member

    When you are vegging out your plants do you use the 7-9-5 exclusively (besides the magpro)?
     
  16.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    Actually, I just use the grow and protekt in veg, that's it.
     
  17.  
    maphisto

    maphisto Well-Known Member

    yo!! h/b, you are gonna expose a/n.but i bet there's gonna be a down fall.your probably get all this crap about "you should have used big bud, overdrive,etc" but these people who are gonna say this are gonna forget that this is a base test.hell you might even get lucky and big mike at a/n will see this thread and wanna challenge ya to a grow off.best of luck to ya.
    M
     
  18.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    If the plants are getting what they need from the base nutrients, boosters are not needed. The goal first-and-foremost is to keep the plants healthy so the first thing I'll be looking for are deficiencies related to the use of RO water. I have magpro and calmag at my disposal should issues arise. The bigger issue IMO is their higher potassium philosophy so we'll see how that works out for them with Conni's NPK ratio.
     
    coffeeanyone likes this.
  19.  
    mr.smileyface

    mr.smileyface Well-Known Member

    I think connoisseur is sappose to be used with the whole line up. Because powderd big bud containes sulphates as connoisseur doesnt. This is why i stick to gmb with calmag and b52.
    AN does state that it should yeild more alone than any other base with additives.
    I guess we will find out.
     
  20.  
    homebrewer

    homebrewer Well-Known Member

    I don't use NPK additives with DynaGro* so to make it fair, I wont be using them here. I do use and could use magpro as it has sulfur and magnesium as well as a booster-like NPK ratio, though fat mike doesn't agree with the higher phosphorus content of that product. So to stay true to AN's philosophy of higher potassium and not so high phosphorus, I'll probably add nothing at all as sulfates are not going to make the difference either way in this grow. As you said, AN claims that Connoisseur is the top-of-the-line nutrient on the market which was supposedly put together by a team of 12 PhD's. We shall see if the performance matches the hype :).

    In regards to any 3 part, DG proved itself vastly superior during the time period where I ran them side-by-side. So much so that I've got about 5 gallons of 3-part that will never be used indoors again.


    *full disclosure, I am using ProTekt (0-0-3) in this grow.
     

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