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COMPLETELY NEW HERE.. need suggestions and advice.......

Discussion in 'Grow Room Design & Setup' started by TheStealthyUnknown, Feb 1, 2013.


    TheStealthyUnknown Member

    New here, so suggestions and constructive criticism are appreciated.

    I am to set up a pretty small closet. Right around 7.2[SUP]2 [/SUP]ft.
    approx. 3.6ft x 2ft x 8ft..

    I am to start with a digital ballast 600w w/ MH & HPS combo with the 6" cool tube ran with an inline fan running/exhausting straight out at the top or the ceiling.
    (Mh for veg and HPS for flower)

    -I need suggestions on fresh air techniques and adequate heat and odor ventilation.. new to HID and that whole scene-

    (Not really worried about cutting holes in drywall or anything, those are simple repairs)
    -Cutting a 6"hole in the wall towards the bottom to run a 6" fresh air line. (suggestions)
    -Thinking about pulling the fresh air from outside of the closet from the bedroom the closet is located in.
    -Would this work? right?.. It will be cooler in the room then outside in summer. I'm thinking of having a inline fan(if req)to push air in. But I have heard this is not mandatory as it will already suck air in..? so do I need to push air into the room or just create a 6" or 8"line towards the bottom and run through the wall and to the inside of the closet.
    I have seen fans hooked up on the outside pumping air into a 6" line going to the room too.. so whats your take on this?

    -Also an exhaust 6" hole cut at the top corner of the wall or into the ceiling
    - with a 470cfm rated carbon filter mounted in the highest and out of the way spot
    -with a 400cfm inline fan pulling air through the carbon filter/air scrubber and exhausting the odor free air out most likely into the bedroom ? Or should it go out to the attic? Exhausting it out of a window is not really an option.

    -Exhausting air from carbon filter up to the attic vs back into the bedroom (suggestions from your knowledge or experience and or your opinions..)
    I have heard of causing mold with the attic but I don't think i'd have to worry about that too much about mold as it has a few different places to open the attic and let breathe around the house.. which is better though.. routing the carbon filtered air being pulled through from the inline fan and out through a 6" hole in the top of the wall and back into the bedroom or going to the attic..
    -Leaning towards the routing it through back into the bedroom as house is fully air conditioned in the summer and I could leave the door open on the bedroom for more air and leave the door open on the grow room during lights on for even more air or at least open it for a few hours a day.
    But I am more worried about when flower time rolls around and having all the ventilation and everything perfect as I do not want any light interrupting my beauties sleep:bigjoint:and I know they need a lot of fresh air so whats the best technique for thus getting fresh air into the room ..
    I know fresh air should come from the bottom so it will be cooler and then exhaust the hot air from the top of the room with a carbon filter and fan back into the bedroom. Any problems with that? I could even put a vent cover over the holes in the bedroom and make them look as normal as possible or appear as if registers. But i am not too concerned with appearance and the privacy issue. I do not really have any privacy concerns besides odor really for that matter. (FYI)

    So exhausting the hot air from the top of the room through a carbon filter and inline fan sucking air through the air scrubber and blowing it back into the bedroom.
    Fresh air running from the outside of the closet through 6"hole hooked up to another inline fan. Maybe adjoining the fan so that the fresh air and the lights cool tube is together, separated by a Y connection splitting them off. One going to the bottom hole for the fresh air. Pumping in air and one to the upper hole for the light cool tube then back out exhausting into the bedroom

    Here is my thoughts
    ... since I am going to run a 6" cool tube for the light and have air coming from the bedroom from a inline fan at about 400-720cfm (6"=400cfm or 8"=720cfm)..Could I just split off of this cool tube air line and make it have another 6" hose running the fresh air into the bottom.. using like a Y connector to split it off the line from the air pump.. One connection going to upwards to the upper 6"hole for the cool tube 600w MH and HPS. and the other 6"hose running into the lower bottom 6" hole, pumping cool fresh air from the bedroom inline air pump. (Any problems with this idea?)
    (only issues I see is that I will have to always cool the light too and cannot pump air in just by itself but that would not really matter to me as I will keep the light on 20/0 hrs - 24/0 hrs for VEG anyway. So it will need cooled, But flower time it will just run 12 hours for really no point but that is really no big deal at all to me. Not a huge concern. But Do you think a Y split connection would work good for fresh air flow? ..
    21UVC1n+hwL._SL500_SS100_.jpg I am thinking using the hydrofarm active air 8" inline fan rated at 720cfm to pump air through the light's cool tube line and out and also to pump the fresh air into the closet through the bottom hole ran from a separate line off the Y through the wall from the bedroom. I'm thinking just having the inline fan hooked up on the outside of the closet and installing some sort of a Y connector to it
    If I use the 8" I will have to bottleneck it down to 6" to fit the cool tube I was planning for, or I could just find a 600w with 8inch cool tube possibly. Idk
    Maybe when I find a Y connector they will have one that goes from an 8" hose down to two 6 inches. Its possible, but Any way whats your suggestions on pumping fresh air in and exhausting and all this. I'm new to all this HID and heat and ventilation and everything.
    I know all the basic stuff though and have had a few runs(CFL)before but now I want to have some real dank medicinalbongsmilie.. and I know there are plenty experts on here so I could use the advice and some pointers. Thanks


    $160 on amazon (great start, good product reviews)

    51xkHlIdV9L._SL500_AA300_.jpg -Digital ballast 600w MH & HPS with both bulbs they just switch right out with one another.
    I am going 600w because of the small area+less heat and because you can get it closer to the plant and therefore the plant getting more lumens + can also build on and add more later but right now focusing on right now and going with what budget can allow.
    -What seed bank do you prefer and have had good experience with ?.. which ones would you stay away from..
    I'm thinking of getting some feminized pineapple chunk and some feminized LSD. any suggestions
    ceiling is 8' and with the air tubed light and carbon filter and inline fan all installed inside I do not think I will want anything getting much over 5' or much close to 6' for tops
    ( I want a decent yielding quantity bud and exceptional dank quality) (Personal medicinal USE ONLY)
    not to sale!
    -Mylar to cover all walls
    -Thinking of adding some extra CFL lighting mounted on the walls. I have a few cabinet sized 75w output grow purpose CFLs left over from a few years ago .. maybe 2 or 3 on each wall to support healthy side and steam growth and developments along with the blazing 600w MH & HPS mini sun lol.
    -Fox farm ocean forest soil- has 30 days worth of nutes then I have seen some peoples suggestions say to not use any more until last week?
    (is this the best soil) what is the best soil if you think it is not and maybe tell me why you believe the way you do
    (no budget for hydroponic at this time, maybe next time)
    So unsure on the nutes. So suggestions.. heard good things and bad things and everything in-between lol
    soiltabs-10-tablets.jpg flowertabs-10-tablets.jpg vs View attachment 2505826 Soiltabs and flowertabs ? vs Fox farm nutes ? (big bloom, grow big and tiger bloom)

    I have heard not using any nutes until the last week of flowering and I have seen people use them all the way through..
    What do you think? Which is better ? What were your results

    -Reverse osmosis water or distilled water ? prob R-0 right

    -0[SUB]2 [/SUB]? what is your experience with it, how should it be used / should I use it...

    probably max of 6 plants at once in the small space. Probably go with like 5 for starters. Probably as many pots as will fit lol
    all feminized seeds(atleast as of right now) I don't want to waste any time or space with the males. I dont swing that way lol
    about 2+months for veg
    about 2+months for flower (what ever the strain recommends)
    Thinking that while I am flowering I will eventually get another 600w ballast or another whole setup for the MH that is not in use and veg with it in separate area so that when the others are done flowering, I can just put the newly veg'd young-ins in the place of them under the HPS under the 12/12 cycle and keep harvesting like that about every 2 months and repeating the process with different strains and so forth.

    Basically from your perspective, what would you do if it was you. I want to make sure everything is right . I am planing to get started very soon and I do not want to mess anything up. I want to run through as perfect as possible. Help is greatly appreciated

    TheStealthyUnknown Member

    maybe exhausting the 600w light cool tube air line out to the attic and exhaust the separate carbon filtered air back into the bedroom, to keep heat down.. I think I have access to the attic..sounds like a better plan then exhausting them both into the bedroom. But if I cant get access to attic I will be doing it that way.

    ROFLhacks Active Member

    I would have to say NO to Flowertabs. And RO water is better but if your tap water is under 200 ppm id would just use that other then that look pretty good. :bigjoint:

    Dmarsh Member

    Worst comes to worst, get a air purifier unit to purify the room being used to exhaust into haha.

    ROFLhacks Active Member

    Also if you going use a Fox Farm Soil there is no reason to buy the 3-part as it will cause you problems later.
    TheStealthyUnknown likes this.

    TheStealthyUnknown Member

    Thanks for the replies fellas. I will make sure to post some updates and i'm sure i'll have some more questions along the way.:joint::weed:

    Nol Member

    I would go 1000 ~ just me !
    I Have a Some What Similar Set up Heres Some of My Thoughts

    heats not gonna be huge issue w/ ur 600 Depending on where this Room Is & How Cool The Air Your Pulling From & How Hot It get in Summer~ you could get away w/o the Inline
    have a Air Vent from floor or low on wall then have an Exit Vent for heat on roof ot top or wall

    You might Be Fine ~ but If you plan on adding more lights Id get it ~ one light Grow ~ NAH

    but foxfarm soil is great stuff ~ I have use FF nuts ~ there Simple ~ EarthWorm castings Are the Best.
    As for the rest of the line its simple & cheap & puts out good results
    Only Down fall Is over Feed ~ My Fault But Seem to be Pretty Eay W/ FF
    I just got some AD (Advance Nut.) Really Like the Results ~Pricey if you have to buy them ! i git some friends he didnt want So i scored Big
    Some of the Bottles Can run 100+$ & theres Alot shet to the Line
    My Babys Are Suckking thos Nuts down ~ have had any over feeding issues ~ & I felt like I Over feed couple times
    ~ haven Shown Any Neg Results
    As for FF SOIL IT my #1 Soil

    I usally start it in pure Fox Farm soil 2 pint / solo plastic cups work great as well
    I Trasplant 3 Times total In a Grow
    2pint/ solo cup For Seed/Clone
    Then It I give Them For it to Streach out But not Entirely ~ 1/2 gal to Maybe a gal ~ enought to GRow for 2-1/2 weeks in
    Then to its Final Pot ~ About 1moth away into going into Flower ~ Depending on room ~ I Either do 2 Plant under one 1000watt in 30 gal (BIGGER PLANTS) usally Higher Yeild LB's a Plnt ( my Pref Way )
    OR 4-6 Plants In 5 Gal ~ Med Size Plant ~ Decelt Yeilds Depending On traing Tec. & Strain ~ Id say 2-6 Oz a Plnt

    Also When i Transplate From Solo Cup/ 2 Pint I Trans. to a 50 /50 mix of FF & Black gold Also add a Little More Perlite
    ~ I find Using 100% FF causes Them To Grow to long/ Streach when trying to get them to bloom
    Its Comes W/ Alot good Nuts In it already.

    & STAY ON YOUR 600w ~ W/ 2 Moth Veg
    6 Plants Is Alot For one 600Watt ~
    ItCan Be Done But Results May vary!
    I Suggest a Max of 4 Plants in 5 Gal Buckt For a 600
    Or Better Yet 2 30 gals ~ Will Give You Best Result W/ 2 1/2 Month veg
    Any Whoot ~Thats My 2 Cents
    TheStealthyUnknown likes this.

    TheStealthyUnknown Member

    Yeah i'm actually thinking about doing a similar one but the 1000w MH and HPS combo instead of the 600w .$254 for 1000w with complete everything vs $164 for the 600w with complete everything. I don't think it should have too much problems with the heat of 1000w which was my concern but with the light having a separate environment from the actual grow room itself in the sealed cool tube with 720cfm air being pumped through from the outside air conditioned bedroom. I was leaning towards 600w because I have seen threads people saying they measured like 20-30,000 more lumens at the top of the plant because the light is able to be closer to the plant. And lights lose a certain amount of lumens the further you get away. But I have also seen some pictures of people having their 1000w just as close. So I think I will probably go with 1000w and hope for a bigger bang/bigger yield/better plant. Right?

    1000w vs 600w for 7.2 sq ft
    is the 1000w going to produce more ?
    probably a dumb question right lol

    And yes I was considering doing all FoxFarm ocean forest soil for the medium but I have seen places say that it might be a little too hot in nutes for the young-n's and to mix it with a little bit of light warrior and some a little perlite.. What do you think ? maybe doing a blend like 2/3 parts OceanForest and 1/3 part LightWarrior..

    I am really unsure the most on nutes..
    And what are the advantages of using nute vs not using nutes.
    I've never added any nutes to anything previously so i'm new to that.
    I've seen suggestions to not use any nutes until the last week before harvest or it will taste like chemicals
    and also I've suggestions to not use any at all and others that use them all the way through..
    regardless I would probably end up only using 1/4 or 1/2 of the recommended dose on the bottle of nutes as I hear they tend to be a little strong, if I did use them.
    What should I do though, get ocean forest and the light warrior and mix them up with a little bit of perlite ? or whats best soil and how you set your pots up.. like perlite at the bottom then soil on top or what.
    What nutes or no nutes ? how do you use them and how is that working out for you?

    And as for mentioning transplanting your plants. I plan on getting them started using those pods that the roots grow right through and then planting them into a smaller pot and then one final transplant into their final bigger home. Like you said Nol..
    I am in-experienced when it comes to transplanting and proper procedures and any tips that would be helpful or help you out would be nice

    TheStealthyUnknown Member

    I'm hearing good things about ocean forest..
    but even better about ocean forest and light warrior mix:joint:

    Nol Member

    I find my plants dont grow As big As they would when i start clone or seed in those Pod things
    I say 2 pints / solo Cup Size ~ & no Smaller ~ Just my Pref.
    both lights will Grow That Size of area 7.2 sq ft
    600watt 3x3- 9sq ft
    1000watt 4x4- 12sq ft
    As for Light warrior ~ never used it. ~ I alway by FF Ocen Forest Mix Then mix W/ Something Cheaper ~ My Fav ~ BlackGold

    Also 1000 is going to go deeper into your plants then a 600 ~ it is hotter & cant get AS close But 1000's R were its At
    If You have a Vented hood W/ Glass Between the bulb & Plant ~ you cant Get Pretty Close ( Closer When Vented )
    But I have had any issue Before Where I didnt feel like My 1000's wernt Close enought ~
    I suggest 600watts for Hanging ~ No Hoods
    I use a 600 to get the popcorn Nugs Nice & Chuny Like the tops ~ i Hang down like a Vertical Grow

    R you going to have 2 rooms Grow & Bud? Or just One Room & Switch out Bulbs?
    I suggest Having a Designated 8x8 BLOOM Room Give you some Space to Move around Plants&
    5x5 grow area ~ This Will Help keep The nugs Flowing ~ As you can throw a New Plant in every time you harvest One

    And Last but not least ~ Nuts ~ i would Start 1/4 or 1/2 dose
    Every Strain is gonna React little Diffrent to The nuts ~ So it finding the Stain that work well in your Nuts & growing conditions.
    MAINLY TRIAL & ERROR! ANy Whoot GL hope to see some photos when ur done

    TheStealthyUnknown Member

    Have got some good info over the past few days
    Thanks for the replies
    A little late as I have been a little busy the past couple days.

    I can always add on and build up later but now I am dealing with the limited space for the time being
    and yes I am defiantly hoping to get a separate veg chamber going
    (hopefully sometime during the very near future)
    something about like you said Nol about a 5 x 5 grow area and a 8 x 8 bloom room:bigjoint:
    But for now I am working with an area of 3.6 x 2 x 7 ft = 7.2 sq ft for both
    (I know it is a little small now but I will have more space later)
    In 2 months or so when my ladies are about to flower I should have a vegatation setup with a sepatate 600w+ MH so I can keep the good times rolling(probably 1000w+)
    1000w should provide more then enough to power this 7.2 sq ft space, easily in fact so I know that should not be an issue
    I also know I could use a 600w in the same exact space and be alright and I know a 400w would even work the same(not produce the same but functionality wise)
    but from what I hear and going for the best bang and that is the denser buds as 1000w penetrates deeper+more lumens
    and with a cool tube being ran with inline fan to exhaust heat straight out I do not think heat should be much of an issue
    and I should be able to keep the light pretty close if not just as close as a 600w to the beauties as it will be cool tubed
    A lot of what I am hearing is that 600w vs 1000w is more like a Ford vs Chevy thing. about $90 difference for nearly double.
    600w is a little bit more efficient on the lumens per watt ratio but 1000w still has more lumens all together and should be the bigger bread winner.
    Everybody is trying to achieve the same common goal though so to each is own.
    I think some lights are more suitable for situations then others but from most of my knowledge 1000w will make bigger and better yield hands down every time

    If I knew it would work in the space available for the time being I would not hesitate to get 2 600 watts though or probably more likely even 2 1000 watts but with measurements of everything in the space adding up it does not seem as if 2 lights would fit or really be necessary for the space anyway.
    As space grows though I will be adding on.

    On to soil

    I have heard good results of people using fox farm ocean forest all the way through.
    But others have said that it is a little hot in nutes for the germ so they mix it with FF light warrior which is best for germination process.
    (have not heard too many good things about FF happy frog by the way)
    A buddy of mine also told me has been using 100% ocean forest all the way and has had pretty good success in doing so.
    and for the Black gold I had never heard of so I might just throw that in the mix and give that a try as well (seems to have pretty good reviews as well)
    :joint:My plan is probably get a bag of light warrior (maybe 2) and a few bags of ocean forest.

    For the Germ

    I will mix up in a tub consisting of 2 parts ocean forest & 1 part light warrior
    another tub of 100% Ocean forest
    another tub of 2 parts light warrior and 1 part ocean forest
    :arrow:Since I have decided to grow more then one plant of the same strain at the same time
    I might experiment a little.
    (see which does better in what soil you plant in and if it does make a difference)
    I will mark which is which and keep track of which is which.
    I will plant one in the mix of 2 parts ocean forest and 1 part light warrior.
    I will plant another of the same strain in the different mix of 2 parts light warrior and 1 part ocean forest
    If I happen to have 3 of the same strain I will plant one in a 100% ocean forest
    and if I have more of the same strain, You probably see the pattern developing..
    I will plant in all different types of the blends and see which ones seem to "thrive" in what.
    (keeping track of results)
    As plant strains are different they might be different as to which soil each will thrive in.
    So it is sort of like a trial and error type of thing
    For the second transplant I will most likely switch to 100% FF ocean forest and perlite mixed in and perlite layer on the bottom and throughout the rest of the life.

    For the LIFE
    I will probably re-pot / transplant each plant at least 3 times during its life.
    (want to give the roots plenty of room to build a strong and healthy beauty)
    once from germ - in a small cup to big cup for about a week
    once for veg - in a medium bucket/pot for about a month-month and a week of veg
    once for flower - in a large sized bucket/pot before flowering and for the rest of its life

    (I previously made mistakes my first grow of not giving my ladies roots enough room. I planted them very close and more then one in one each pot. NOOB. LOL with regular old CFLs and they went through some struggles during their lifespan(drought and famine):cry: and I was surprised to see that they actually even lived and went through flowering:shock:)

    I don't have too much knowledge on transplants so any "pro" tips would probably be helpful.
    I know it cannot be that hard to do but I sort of believe the earlier the better, as you do not want to stress your ladies out
    and when they start getting bigger the harder I see it becoming
    But you do not want to do it too soon as you want too keep good fresh soil for the whole life of your plants to stay healthy

    I plan on putting about 10% perlite in the bottom of each pot and mixing some extra with the soil to help with drainage

    This grows strains are down to :

    Bomb THC Bomb feminized- Strong ,short and nice large yield
    Barneys farm LSD feminized- Very Strong , easy to grow
    Reserva Privada Kosher Kush feminize- Nice and Strong
    :hump: probably 4 at once .. 2 of each or similar
    I will be getting a couple seeds of each strain above and all feminized and also some freebies that are feminized as well
    & I will most likely be using the next round:
    Mazar Kush
    Pineapple Skunk
    Blue Dream
    OG Kush
    & an AUTO flower Critical Jack Herer (don't know much on auto flower)

    I plan on making a journal for the grow later as well. As time progresses that will come.

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