Clincial Depression vs everyday depression

Hobbes said:

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"hobbes you dont receive PMs anymore? That's annoying"

I know, sorry. I forget to check my messages and have a mailbox full of month old emails from people who are pissed at me for ignoring them. I just forget so I got rid of my email the same time I took the answering machine off my telephone. Same problem.

I'm glad to hear about the testosterone test, it is at least SOMETHING in this insane disease that has a quantitative measurement - I have never had a needled stuck into my brain to measure my neurotransmitter levels - and trial and error is just such a medieval method of treatment from a subset of people who consider themselves to be the most educated beings on our planet. One person who I supply with tincture and bud had his testosterone levels checked and while artificial testosterone has not cured him it has improved his life incredibly.

If you want to get ahold of me any time please post in the Grow Lab thread linked at the bottom of this post - I'm there throughout the day and night, from the time I open my eyes until I can't do another Volcano bag. I'm away for several hours at a time, sometimes days, but that's where I'll end up while I'm still on this forum. If there's something private that anyone wants to talk about we can exchange emails.

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Thanks for the info, I'll remember that .

One person who I supply with tincture and bud had his testosterone levels checked and while artificial testosterone has not cured him it has improved his life incredibly.

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Good to hear!

Speaking of volcano bags I'm doing a few right now, setting the digital at 392F to finish

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"I was first diagnosed last year, and I really felt better through the summer, but this time of year just depresses me now for some reason. Its strange because fall is actually my favorite time of year for weather and scenery. But, just the shorter days, and colder temps are somewhat depressing, in a few years I'll be moving to the southern hemisphere from october-february to see if the summer like seasons down there keep my mood up, or if its something else completely."

Jhopkins have you ever heard of kindling theory? Basically its like the washboard road effect on dirt roads - a car hits a little bump and the wheels are slightly unweighted. When gravity returns the weight a small depression is made and a slight amount of dirt removed from the depression. Each vehicle that comes along repeats the cycle, but with each cycle the depression becomes deeper, each ride over the ridge more bumpy and jarring than the last. A second depression is started, then a third. Each new depression in the road causing a subsequent in front, worsened by the one behind.

This effect is more common in bipolar mood disorders, but often depression is accompanied by a manic phase that the depressive does not notice because it is such a relief from the chronic pain. The ride over the ridge is often more personally destructive than the depression, destroying relationships and finances, causing unfortunate sexual and violent behavior.

Many people get depressed in the fall and this is often blamed on Seasonally Affective Disorder (SAD) or lack of natural sunlight in the fall and winter. While I find the high RSI index of a 10,000K CFL light to be very uplifting when depressed I feel that the kindling of the fall depression is blue light poisoning in the summer and through our mechanical home and work environment. Combined with marijuana and music therapy I've used Kelvin temperature control of my light environment to completely eliminate the depression phase of whatever is wrong with me.

I have gone from a near catatonic state of constant pain to knowing nothing, and while it is improbable that my regime will help you I believe that it is possible to customize a treatment plan with the resources that we have available to us NOW to improve the lives of many mentally ill people. I will transcribe my theory and practice for anyone interested - it will not work for you but we will work together to find something that will improve your life in some way. We may not be able to eliminate your depression, but if we can lift you one rung on your ladder to hell it will seem like a heaven to you.

For people interested in light therapy - red in the morning, blue through the day, red at night. If you forget look out the window and see what colour the sun is. Blue light invigorates us, gets our minds working - blue electronic TV and computer monitor light at night is not what our brain needs to wind down. The blue light AT NIGHT is kindling to start a fire that will consume your mind. Like CCOB gardening look to amplify nature in your living environment rather than forcing millions of years of evolution to fit into a shape thats convenient for our massive society.

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I have seen 2 psychiatrist and have been on several different medications. I had to go get my blood taken every week!
I stopped going because those medications were messing me up!

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There's some highlights in the video concerning clinical depression, I though that it would go well with the thread.

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Weed Science

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Much in life doesn't make sense to me, like a dance who's steps I can memorize but the purpose seems to be to dance as fast as one can. My mind freezes on the WHY people work the way they do and I don't achieve the results that I intend. Marijuana gardening has been the first thing in my life that has been entirely under my control, including my mind. The simple logic of physics and biology are sometimes head bangingly frustrating, but they are always simple and logical, and once deciphered pedestrian.

Not only the produce, but the procedure of my garden has given me control of my mind and a slowly increasing influence of the world around me - yet I'm completely bewildered at the simplest motivation of another human being. The moderators on RUI have never been anything but the most kind to me, civil and helpful in every way - denying no reasonable request while asking nothing in return. If there is a hippie on RUI it is me - I want something from you, not the moderators, and I have not been able to find out how to provide you with fair trade without asking directly.

For those who've been following the thread for sometime, (Saladman, Shortbus, J.Cun, Mae, and too many others to mention) you may have noticed that I don't ask for help easily, I'm asking now. Everything in this thread has been given freely with no obligation of remuneration, I am humbly asking for your help:

1. Watch Hobbes 11:9 (Adajio For Strings). If the video evokes an emotional response please post and tell me about it - good or bad. If you're offended by some parts that is important for me to know as well - the video is a work in progress, intended first for you and later for the larger community. I need feedback about what the video says to you. If someone posts a negative comment - PLEASE - do not respond. I am asking for the negative comments. As well, its time for us to fight the good fight - to save every resource for the important battles, not the ones that go away when our monitor is turned off.

2. Tell your friends about the video, email them my video page URL (Only In Dreams - signature section of post) and ask them to drop into the thread. Marijuana grower or tea toddler, we need everyone but the hippie.

3. Copy and paste the message at the bottom of this post to the RIU contact address at the bottom of this post, add a few words of your own if you like. Ask your friends to do the same. We need a forum to expand Crop Circle Of Bud, I'm at the point in technology and technique that I'm comfortable brining in people from outside of our thread - people who haven't had the time to absorb what we are doing and why simple simple changes in environmental variables can make such huge changes in results.

I need to be able to license CCOB technology so The Academy can benefit from the sale of products and marijuana seeds that the tens of thousands of views of our thread can provide. The Academy must at sometime support itself, this is central to the CCOB philosophy. At this point in time my only resource to finance The Academy is you, not from your money (I wouldn't / can't take a dime) but from the sale of seeds and technology that the success of your grows will bring.

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Please copy and paste this message to the RUI contact email below.

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I support the formation of a Crop Circle Of Bud sub forum for the purpose of developing techniques and alternative technology for refugees and developing countries. Please contact Hobbes in the Grow Lab thread in the Newbie forum.

Thank you

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RUI Email Contact

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bobhead said:

I had to go get my blood taken every week!

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been there too

Hobbes said:

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Hey VarmintCong, welcome to RUI!


"Dysthymia - A milder form of depression, in which you never sink permanently into the depths, but you just sort of experience a perpetual disappointment and humdrum over everything."

Was it constant or did you cycle out and have mild highs as well? My mood cycles have always been to the extremes, the low offset by a more destructive high.

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"My doctor is not supportive of the use of mj for depression or anxiety, as I have both conditions."

Did your doctor prescribe medical marijuana? What country are you in?

Have you researched strains to relieve anxiety? There are many strains that will reduce or eliminate even severe anxiety - Strawberry Cough, Kali Mist ... there are excellent functional and sedative strains with anti anxiety properties, I can make up a list of options if you're still looking for strains.

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"My point of view is this: Nobody else knows what my mind is like except for me."

I'm with you 100%.

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"The road back from madness is a struggle. Only the luckiest of people find their way, more or less, back to the world you live in." - Dr Walter Bishop, Frnge​

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"In 6 months time from starting MJ therapy:

1) I lost 35 pounds. I am wearing jeans that would have fit me in high school. I am almost 40 years old.

2) My lower back inflammations are almost non-existent. My neck inflammations are nearly always there, but the mj makes it more bearable.

3) Depression is gone. I have periods where I still hit a doldrum, but nothing like it used to be. I can experience joy.

4) Anxiety is always there. This is mainly about having my mind well-ordered. I take Paxil as well. The combination of MJ + Paxil has been good for me.

Treatment with only one of the two meds isn't as effective in my experience.

5) I have more self-confidence than I did. Not trying to be all "touchy-feeley" but anybody who doesn't know what its like to watch your career dwindle without any good explanation other than how you feel...

6) Much more energy."

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VarminCong you are a walking medical marijuana success story. Thank you for the example that you've set with the way that you live your life.



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HA! I love Fringe. What a great show! Thank you for the welcome as well.

Sorry, didn't mean to be aloof. Just been high and working. Only now found the time to come back and post.

I would have mild highs, but I would generally never see the point in doing anything, or why other people did anything. KnowhutImean?

I am learning as I go. I am in the lone star state. It will be a long time before its medically available here. Who knows. No, I am forced to go to the black market.

I haven't targeted the anxiety strains. I kind of get whatever I can get around here. I only have one hookup, but he always has it and its ALWAYS good. But you pay for it. I am getting what I pay for I think.

I wish I could be more vocal about my success. I have three kids, I cannot afford to go to jail. It makes me sad because I hate not being able to stand up for what is just and right.

Hobbes said:

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There have been a few threads by/about people with clinical depression - but very few people know how clinical depression differs from having the blues. I'd like people to give their experience and understanding, if you know someone that you think is clinically depressed - or if you think that you are - ask some questions if you're up to it. Say Hi if you're not.

No one will ridicule on this thread without the post being reported and dealt with by RUI staff immediately, if you find this forum too open please private message me and I will at least be a supportive person that you can talk to. I'm running this thread to reach out to the people who need help but have been scared into silence by forum bullies. And for healthy people who want to understand clinical depression.

I've been dealing with my own depression (bi polar + rage) for 25 years and give bud for medical purposes to 3 people who are battling clinical depression. I'm not a medical professional but I can listen, confidentially, and help you to get the help you need.

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I've found that there are two reasons that people do not understand clinical depression:

1. Depression can mean many things, like different types of snow the word means different things to different people.

Everyone gets depressed now and again - feel bad, things aren't going great, broke up with girlfriend, broke $. The mind is depressed and can be taken to a different state by changing environment or life circumstances.

2. Clinical Depression, however started, results in a change in the way the brain works - chemically, electrically, there is no physical test on brain chemistry (blood, urine, brain fluid, rarely an EEG) but psychiatrists give their best guess and prescribe meds without sticking a needle in the patients brain to see if their brain chemistry is actually out of wack. When the brain doesn't work properly it is hard to make the mind work properly.

Once this change in brain chemistry/brain wave activity happens telling the clinically depressive to use their will power and positive thinking is like telling a double amputee to stop being so lazy and get up and walk - the physical ability to be happy is no longer there for the clinically depressive.

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We all look for cause and effect - he's sad so there must be something wrong so: fix it, tough it out, be a man (or a butch woman). Unfortunately a lack of understanding leads us in the wrong direction because the cause is not (or is no longer from) circumstances or environment but is actually physical - the problem is in the brain now, not just the mind.

The computer's hardware is faulty and is making the software work improperly. We can never make the program work like it would on another computer until we fix our hardware or modify the program to work around the physical fault. And that patch is difficult to write. To be fully depressed, manic or in rage and to be able to function in society takes years of your own type of meditation and training. I'm constantly rewriting the patch, but I'm functional - and 3 weeks without attacking a client. Be content and take pride in small successes.

The brain must be fixed before the mind can work properly, or the mind must be taught how to be functional with a broken brain.

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"The road back from madness is a struggle. Only the luckiest of people find their way, more or less, back to the world you live in." - Dr Bishop, Fringe.

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Depression and anxiety are a hell of a disease really. For years I just viewed it as something in the head thats a weakness, something Ive never had thus I figured if you didnt want to be depressed you just fixed it yourself. Mind over matter and all that.

That changed when I met my GF that ive been with close to 4 years now. Shes had a panic disorder since she was 9 years old and its rather debilitating in some situations. She is a tough girl but seeing things get away from her control like anxiety and her depression does is rather disheartening. She exercises a lot and uses whatever happy actions she enjoys to keep it at bay, and I try to help as well.

Anyways What im trying to say is i think shes come a long way in learning to cope with her "broken brain" (love the term) and its a really real problem. It makes me sad when I see some people just hide behind depression as a means to not work and waste their life away .... it makes the real people suffer.

I found this thread to be interesting.. Having dealt with depression myself and especially having a friend who depends on antidepressants... The withdrawals from getting off those seem terrible. They tried to put me on antidepressants several times throughout my life but each time it ultimately came to me refusing to be medicated against my will... Somehow I overcame depression which consumed me for such a long time, but it still creeps back every once in a while. I know it's nothing to lose much hope over though.. I feel a lot of empathy for those struggling with depression, and wish I could help. Or let them know it's not so bad.
But meh, people will handle themselves. Hopefully most people who are depressed can grow from it.

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I've suffered pretty much suicidal clinical depression for the past 7 years. In the end i just said fuck it, what happens will happen, so just get on with ya life. Things aren't happy and smiley 99% of the time but i've just learnt to accept it as the norm.

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tip top toker said:

I've suffered pretty much suicidal clinical depression for the past 7 years. In the end i just said fuck it, what happens will happen, so just get on with ya life. Things aren't happy and smiley 99% of the time but i've just learnt to accept it as the norm.

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TTT not to be dismissive but that sounds like everyday depression. Clinical depression is a physical ailment the same as cancer and lower back pain.

My depression is not being unhappy, my depression is a physical pain akin to water torture at the best of times and at the worst of times like being on fire.

'Suck it up princess' as a medication only goes so far and is a heavy pill to carry.

Marijuana should be considered as a first treatment option for all depressives, long before neurotransmitter medications are prescribed.

One of my projects is to grow 144' of Flo stem under a 600 watt light as promotion of using marijuana as a first treatment option. The impossible.

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I really don't mean to be aggressive, its just too often that we hear people say suck it up because they don't understand the spectrum of pain that the disease can cause, and that it is not a cause and effect disease at all for some people. There are no life triggers, sometimes we're just fucked regardless.

It may well be so, i've no document to tell me otherwise, but at the end of the day everyday depression, well it's been every day for 7 years odd without any discernible reason or cause nor any apparent remedy, cannabis worked for about a year and then quickly grew less effective. As i say, i've learnt to live with it, not well, but i get by, i will spend most of my spare time lay on my back on the floor unable to make a choice or a decision and totally lost, a total feeling of hopelessness and pointlessness. So who knows what it is but it came from nowhere and it doesn't want to go away regardless of where i am in life. I've never tried any meds, i tend to flat refuse any chemical prescriptions, i like to maintain an immune system and will happily find natural alternatives, i'll even resort to drinking tea before i consider something like paracetamol

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"As i say, i've learnt to live with it, not well, but i get by, i will spend most of my spare time lay on my back on the floor unable to make a choice or a decision and totally lost, a total feeling of hopelessness and pointlessness."

Now I am corrected an shammed. You just wrote the story of clinical depression down to the last punctuation, it's just at a different point on the 3d continuum of pain than what I experience. To each of us the worst pain imaginable at the time because the disease first takes away our will to fight against it.

I apologize for being judgemental.

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TTT I've been putting together an aggressive campaign for medical marijuana, it's coming through in my posts. Please do you best not to take anything I said to heart in anyway, I'm subconsciously redirecting my anger to the Hippie-Nazis to people around me.

Sorry.

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Haha, no offence or anything taken. I often rephrase my feelings on the spot and don't often come across as clear working on it

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Thanks TTT.

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Nice thread Hobbes, I thought I'd say hi and throw in my two cents on the subject RIU style.

I've struggled with depression and anxiety my whole life and have had to take meds for the past decade. I'm 100% disabled now due to these mental issues and chronic pain due to a seriously screwed up spine. It does help with the depression/chronic pain/anxiety/rage issues for sure but I think the main thing smoking does for me is give me something to look forward to and be passinate about. Mentally my wife has had severe issues as well and she absolutely benefits from it, it's literally like night and day when she's really having a rough day.

If it weren't for smoking I KNOW I would be on at least double the meds I am now. Sometimes I wonder how far some of my manic episodes would have gone without being able to medicate and chill the funk out. Would I still be here today? I dunno, but there's that at least. Peace. =)

Hobbes said:

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For the litterary crowd I suggest The Long Walk from King's Bauchman's Books. A bleak future where a group of boys strive to survive a long walk for prizes, a Death Race in slow motion. King does a phenomenal job of making the reader feel the exhaustion and hopelessness.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Long_Walk

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I loved the Bachman books! =D

Hobbes said:

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Thanks TTT.

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No worries man. In the past i explained my issues on these forums in a bit of detail and it was concluded that there was no such thing as clinical depression, and that i was ust a loser loner fuck face that deserved all i got i kinda gave up on informing people of my mentality after that and just dummed it down to "had a bad day today" didn't mention but i really like the disabled guy in the wheel chair poster

brownbearclan said:

Nice thread Hobbes, I thought I'd say hi and throw in my two cents on the subject RIU style.

I've struggled with depression and anxiety my whole life and have had to take meds for the past decade. I'm 100% disabled now due to these mental issues and chronic pain due to a seriously screwed up spine. It does help with the depression/chronic pain/anxiety/rage issues for sure but I think the main thing smoking does for me is give me something to look forward to and be passinate about. Mentally my wife has had severe issues as well and she absolutely benefits from it, it's literally like night and day when she's really having a rough day.

If it weren't for smoking I KNOW I would be on at least double the meds I am now. Sometimes I wonder how far some of my manic episodes would have gone without being able to medicate and chill the funk out. Would I still be here today? I dunno, but there's that at least. Peace. =)



I loved the Bachman books! =D

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I really hear you on the question of where would i be without pot. I smoked pot for a year when i was 17, and it was purely recreational, nothing more. A few years after that and i was pretty much a certified alcoholic, It wasn't until i was in the doctors surgery with rasher slashed up wrists that i was offered prescription anti-depressants, he told me i would not get them free, he told me that most likely they would make the following month even worse, so considering why i was with him, i figured that really wasn't a smart thing to do, get worse. So a friend of mine who knew just the basics of my feelings popped over one afternoon with a teenth and gave me a little bit of good info on it's non-recreational uses. From then on i started smoking it for emdical reasons and the difference was almost instantaneous. I stand by the statement that it unequivocally saved my life. It certainly hasn't cured the depression, but well the best way i can put it in few words is that i really allows me to introspectively question and examine my life without heavy negative emotions It has been one of my main angers with regard to it's illegal nature, it saved my life, fact, so as far as the governemnt care, there is no medical use, they would rather i had died than broken the law. Who is anyone to tell me how i can or cannot tend to my ailments.

bump bump bump - need the top spot for the next post

tip top toker said:

I stand by the statement that (marijuana) unequivocally saved my life. It certainly hasn't cured the depression, but well the best way i can put it in few words is that i really allows me to introspectively question and examine my life without heavy negative emotions It has been one of my main angers with regard to it's illegal nature, it saved my life, fact, so as far as the governemnt care, there is no medical use, they would rather i had died than broken the law. Who is anyone to tell me how i can or cannot tend to my ailments.

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This is how I've felt. Exactly. If I had come by that post with my name instead of TTT's I would have thought that it was one that I had forgotten about writing.

One of my goals with my medical marijuana campaign is to make marijuana a first choice option for doctors to prescribe for depression. In our unending experience with a disease, that while depressed I would swap for the final day of a depression free terminal disease, it becomes so incredibly evident that marijuana is the one drug that can offer immediate, lasting, addiction free pain relief to virtually every depressive that uses it as medication. And the walking medical databases (doctors) haven't been able to download the simple logic from from the central medical computer because the information in that computer is controlled by the fucking hippie-nazis in government.

And the hippie-nazis in government control the people who should control them - the hippie-masses. Close minded slovenly troglodytes who can't get their act together to make simple changes to benefit everyone - including the hippie-nazis. Us, we ARE the hippie masses, you and I. And that realization drives me to the same hopelessness as the deepest depression.

If we cannot bind together as a community to do something so simple as entice some weak minded hippie like Dr Greenthumb to improve his seed bank operation then we may as well just all pack it in and wait for the hippie-nazis to send their mindless DEA drones to our door.

I want to get Doc to do one simple thing for the medical marijuana community - give away one free seed, that he randomly pics up off his grow room floor instead of sweeping it up and throwing it away - and give that seed FOR FREE to anyone who prints out a Dr Greenthumb Seed Breeder Collectable Trading Card. We get the free seed and get to make fun of a thin skinned hippie while he thanks us through smiling gritted teeth, Doc gets both awareness of his business and immediate sales - CASH - the hippie panacea. Should be easy - everybody wins. Why isn't it happening?

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If we cannot get together to make simple changes within our community - for the benefit of all parties involved - marijuana will stay illegal until some random winds of change briefly bring the illusion of sanity to the world before we let it all be torn away from us again. If you want marijuana to be legal some day simple do this:

- Copy the paragraph bolded and in quotations directly below
- click on the link to my Dr Greenthumb - The Dope - thread
- paste the paragraph into the text box and click "Post Quick Reply"



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You are my people. Of all the posts in all the marijuana forums across the internet - when I read the posts in this thread I understand that I am not the only person who is going through this disease with a blindfold finally half off. I read your posts and I see the story of my life in every one - if we cannot get together to help one person to improve his business - to make himself more money, to bring potential customers to his web site and keep them there, to help others without costing himself a penny - we will continue to make our medicine in the shadows and we have doomed millions to suffer fully blindfolded.

I'm in the process of writing an ebook for new growers to help them get to their first harvest and to make portable medicine from that harvest - there are pictorials from seed germination to making sublingual tincture - but I cannot get the moderators to even let me edit my old posts to make the thread more acessable for new growers. It took me 11 months from finding that there were online marijuana cultivation forum to making my fist harvest because my mind was too destroyed by this disease to make a coherent system of what dozens of helpful growers were telling me through the forums.

The sick need a timeline guide for: selecting strains and ordering seeds; to making tincture or a simple vaporizer if they cannot afford to. Weed Science is free for anyone who wants to download it, it's not finished and perhaps never will be, but there are 1000+ pages of pictorials, music videos, Philisophicals (posters) that I have written with the medical patient in mind. And even on a marijuana forum with a medical sub forum I cannot get the hippy moderators to let me organize a thread so the information is more accesable for new growers.

If this is all we are we are doomed, we have to become more than this. PLEASE!!!! Copy and paste the paragraph to the Dr Greenthumb thread, take 9 seconds and give me some feedback to let me know if I'm banging my head against the fucking wall for no reason. For the right people (those suffering) but against the wrong wall (marijuana).

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Dr Greenthumb

I will not consider buying seeds from your website until you:

1. Offer 1 free 'Mystery X' (floor) seed with every order accompanied by a Dr Greenthumb Seed Breeder Collectable Card
2. Post this offer on your web site
3. Post Hobbes' avatar with the offer

This offer will cost you nothing but the effort to bend down and pick a random seed from your floor and will create interest in your excellent breeding as well as your thin skinned nature. Hippie.

Thank You

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Protest!: Dr Greenthumb free Mystery X seed for Seed Breeder Collectable.

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If a few people from this thread will post in Doc's thread I'll know that the message is reaching a someone and I'll develop it to expand into a thread of it's own. Doc's strain are world class, The Dope is neck and neck with Jack The Ripper as the most potent strain in my garden. His business practices are impeccable, he's just a thin skinned hippie so I like to fuck with him.

I make no money, get no free seeds for this. I have sent Doc $225 for the free The Dope seeds that he sent me because taking freebies doesn't fit with the philosophy that I am building for The Academy, a project that will transfer our marijuana growing skills to edible vegetables for women refuges caring for children - the people who are hardest hit by suffering. You can learn to grow a bucket of corn in your grow room, then transfer those skills to someone over the internet - in a community centre in a developing nation - just as you do here for new growers.

Some Marijuana growers will teach the hungry to feed themselves, even if the process requires my blood to live. Just as we all have had no choice but to live with the pain of depression these people have to suffer for the same reason - apathy, ignorance, hippies. Needless suffering.

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I have over a quarter million views on threads in this forum, threads that the forum owners make money from per view clicks; threads that will be clicked more often if the readers can access the information more readily; - if you are a hippie just browsing our thread this means that the forum owners make more money by letting me do more work that helps other people while costing them nothing. And it's free to both parties - weather the new growers or the forum owners understand the material or not.

I've spent hundreds of hours expanding DJ Shorts Spectrum Of Effects article into a report for medical patients (Jack The Ripper link, bottom of each of my posts) - I can't get a single seed bank or breeder to list a pdf form on their sites so medical patients can save and edit Spectrum reports so other medial patients can pick the strains that will help to relieve their suffering. I made the reports, I'll do or pay for the web site work, the growers/med patients will fill out the reports and growers will read the reports to make better informed seed purchases. The seedbanks make more money; it cost them nothing; they help people. Apathy - the title song in the hippie anthem.

How can one ignore something that will help others while costing them nothing. I do not understand the world we live in. I've spent my life coping with constant, unending, eternal pain - and when I finally find and make a medicine that will allow me to enjoy life I find that I live in a world of insanity. A world that doesn't follow the simple logic that if something benefits everyone and costs no one anything than perhaps we should just go with the Flo.

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