An All Powerful Being

Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
All powerful, meaning always perfect, perfect meaning the best, nothing better.

Wouldn't you expect an all powerful being who is always perfect to devise a system of belief based on an always perfect set of standards?

An all powerful being. Think about what that would take.. Always right, always just, always perfect. No matter what logical hypothetical you could come up with, he's always got an answer, and it's always the right answer, no matter what. Whatever it is, if it seems inconsistent, you were wrong.


.. would an all powerful being support slavery? Genocide? Disease? Epidemics?

.. would an all powerful being allow global catastrophic events? World war? Poverty?


If such a being exists, why do those things also exist? What answer does organized religion provide?
 
cannawizard

cannawizard

Well-Known Member
I usually stay away from this section of RIU like it was a plague but after a couple of soju bottles, i'll take a bite..

(no offence to any religious fanboys/girls out there, but this is my point of view)

There is no all powerful being out there watching us like some kid staring at an ant hill.. God works in mysterious ways my ass, how convenient is that logic when there is so much bloodshed--pain--hate--confusion on this planet happening 24/7.. Yea, its called free will right? God is letting us do whatever we please, then afterwards, whoever fucked-up goes to hell.. Like I said, how convenient..

I was raised a catholic, baptize as a child without my consent-- because if I had a choice I wouldn't have agreed to this religious bullshit.. The bible wasn't written by god or inspired by angels.. nah, it was written by humans with an agenda.. The church masquerades around the globe preaching rainbows and holy happiness, but in the past they were having orgies, promoting the wholesale slaughter of people (crusades/inquisition), and accumulating wealth thru land conquests and taxes-- follow our religion or be killed off~ How "christ like" of them.. And how many versions of the bible is there? Shouldn't one version be good enough since it was written by god? Guess not.

And i'm against ALL religions not just christianity, its all the same anyways-- just different authors, different stories, but same message-- "Let us do the thinking for you" ;)

I remember sitting in sunday school thinking shit just doesn't add up.. How "god" can just sit on his ass fapping to kim kardashian's sextape while genocides happen, yea.. forgot.. he works in mysterious ways.. riiight~ In the old testament he was always up in human affairs, then it got changed to the new testament where he just lets shit happen since he gave us "freewill".. I guess its just easier to just judge us in the end, instead of guiding us the whole way, --heaven or hell --end of story (sounds like a lazy mfkr to me)

My words probably won't sit well for the righteous few who follow the word of god-- the christ like individuals, probably gonna reply with some bible verses --save it, your only quoting empty words regurgitate by those who can't think for themsevles.. Wanna know what hell is? its this planet and the perpetual ignorance that envelops it.. And heaven, well I thought about heaven being an eternity of fluffy clouds with 24/7 happiness, umm I think I'll skip (its like that movie the matrix, when the machines made the first world too perfect, the inhabitants went mad, you need ying&yang-- living in a world filled with mr. rogers forever would also drive me insane..

So to sum things up, god = man made , bible/quran/etc = man made , religion = to keep slaves in check, what better system than the one you can't prove or disprove~

**no wonder the original buddha left as soon as he saw the universal truth, who would want to stay on this F'd up planet full of confused inmates..

#cheers
 
Dislexicmidget2021

Dislexicmidget2021

Well-Known Member
The very notion of perfection is a man made one.Then theres the idea of God,it is made up of all that is supposedly perfect and infallible.How can anyone say they know God?, yet he is not available objectively to interact with as a person is?He is no more substantiable than a 7 year olds imaginary friend named Tod.Its a bunch of conjecture and nonesense.
 
J

JesterDev

Active Member
I don't normally get involved in these topics, but figured I'd throw, or shove depending on your perspective in my two cents, my perspective.

When asked about "God" by religious people I often explain that "God" is more like a cube. Each facet holds a different view, a different perspective, Buddha, Jesus, what have you. All the same being, just different ways of seeing the same thing.

Personally I am not religious by any means. I am more spiritual. I don't believe that there are any mistakes, no wrong answers and no wrong paths, just different perspectives. It's all about how you see things, how you react to them. I believe that we must all experience all that there is to experience, life, death, pain, happiness etc. One life we are the abusers, the next we are on the receiving end. How else can we truly say that we have lived?

Life is about the experiences and how you react to them.

Perfection is a matter of personal opinion not a matter of fact.

A divine being cannot be perfect in every way to everyone.

The idea of God is sort of ridiculous to me. I don't worship anything or anyone. I'm a soul having a human experience, not a slave. Not a slave to some God who has a giant ego and needs billions of people kissing his feet 24/7.

I mean no disrespect to anyone, it's just my opinion. There are many paths, but one center.
 
eye exaggerate

eye exaggerate

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
All powerful, meaning always perfect, perfect meaning the best, nothing better.

Wouldn't you expect an all powerful being who is always perfect to devise a system of belief based on an always perfect set of standards?

An all powerful being. Think about what that would take.. Always right, always just, always perfect. No matter what logical hypothetical you could come up with, he's always got an answer, and it's always the right answer, no matter what. Whatever it is, if it seems inconsistent, you were wrong.


.. would an all powerful being support slavery? Genocide? Disease? Epidemics?

.. would an all powerful being allow global catastrophic events? World war? Poverty?


If such a being exists, why do those things also exist? What answer does organized religion provide?
Click to expand...
...'God' needs people to be an all powerful being.
 
420IAMthatIAM

420IAMthatIAM

Active Member
Padawanbater2 said:
All powerful, meaning always perfect, perfect meaning the best, nothing better.

Wouldn't you expect an all powerful being who is always perfect to devise a system of belief based on an always perfect set of standards?

An all powerful being. Think about what that would take.. Always right, always just, always perfect. No matter what logical hypothetical you could come up with, he's always got an answer, and it's always the right answer, no matter what. Whatever it is, if it seems inconsistent, you were wrong.


.. would an all powerful being support slavery? Genocide? Disease? Epidemics?

.. would an all powerful being allow global catastrophic events? World war? Poverty?


If such a being exists, why do those things also exist? What answer does organized religion provide?
Click to expand...
here is my understanding on this... he is the essence of all that exist...he is the power and the essence of the power...its not a matter of would he allow these events. he is the essence of all events and without that essence we would not be.:idea::idea::idea:
 
Mister Sister

Mister Sister

Active Member
Padawanbater2 said:
All powerful, meaning always perfect, perfect meaning the best, nothing better.

Wouldn't you expect an all powerful being who is always perfect to devise a system of belief based on an always perfect set of standards?

An all powerful being. Think about what that would take.. Always right, always just, always perfect. No matter what logical hypothetical you could come up with, he's always got an answer, and it's always the right answer, no matter what. Whatever it is, if it seems inconsistent, you were wrong.


.. would an all powerful being support slavery? Genocide? Disease? Epidemics?

.. would an all powerful being allow global catastrophic events? World war? Poverty?


If such a being exists, why do those things also exist? What answer does organized religion provide?
Click to expand...
I want to start by saying that I believe religion is inherently flawed. I believe in an ever-changing reality, set rules eventually limit the potential in a person or being's evolution.

To the extent of an all powerful being, to me it makes perfect sense why this being would allow war and disease. In my eyes, allowing free will is a very deep way to love somebody. It is saying, I will not judge you, and will forever accept you as you are. I believe this is where Christianity is limiting people. It is forcing a person to feel 'guilty' for a sin, or believe they will burn forever. God accepts us as we are, the truth is that most people don't accept themselves for what they are, and that is actually what makes our problems worse.

We have a huge variety of circumstances in which we experience the ability to make a choice. Why are we choosing the reality we are choosing? When will we choose not to kill?

This planet is potentially a living paradise - I believe we will eventually choose to see it that way. That's my dream anyways.
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
Mister Sister said:
I want to start by saying that I believe religion is inherently flawed. I believe in an ever-changing reality, set rules eventually limit the potential in a person or being's evolution.

To the extent of an all powerful being, to me it makes perfect sense why this being would allow war and disease. In my eyes, allowing free will is a very deep way to love somebody. It is saying, I will not judge you, and will forever accept you as you are. I believe this is where Christianity is limiting people. It is forcing a person to feel 'guilty' for a sin, or believe they will burn forever. God accepts us as we are, the truth is that most people don't accept themselves for what they are, and that is actually what makes our problems worse.

We have a huge variety of circumstances in which we experience the ability to make a choice. Why are we choosing the reality we are choosing? When will we choose not to kill?

This planet is potentially a living paradise - I believe we will eventually choose to see it that way. That's my dream anyways.
Click to expand...
But it isn't a choice, choice is defined as two or more equal options, Heaven and Hell are not equal consequences of belief. One is a punishment and the other a reward, no different than Eddie Izzard's 'cake or death' bit;

[youtube]DFyuhTwi_OE[/youtube]

So how can it really be called free choice when in theory you have freedom of choice, but in practice, you have the freedom to choose the correct choice?
 
mindphuk

mindphuk

Well-Known Member
Mister Sister said:
I want to start by saying that I believe religion is inherently flawed. I believe in an ever-changing reality, set rules eventually limit the potential in a person or being's evolution.

To the extent of an all powerful being, to me it makes perfect sense why this being would allow war and disease. In my eyes, allowing free will is a very deep way to love somebody. It is saying, I will not judge you, and will forever accept you as you are. I believe this is where Christianity is limiting people. It is forcing a person to feel 'guilty' for a sin, or believe they will burn forever. God accepts us as we are, the truth is that most people don't accept themselves for what they are, and that is actually what makes our problems worse.

We have a huge variety of circumstances in which we experience the ability to make a choice. Why are we choosing the reality we are choosing? When will we choose not to kill?

This planet is potentially a living paradise - I believe we will eventually choose to see it that way. That's my dream anyways.
Click to expand...
The Judeo-Christian god has examples of removing free will in order to get what he wants. In the case of the Pharaoh, this god goes so far as to admit to doing it just so he can have a show of power. This sounds more like a drunk politician rather than a loving deity that wants what's best for us. These types of contradictions can only be explained away by apologists by wrangling and twisting the meaning of what seems painfully obvious to most normal people.
 
H

heathen

Member
Padawanbater2 said:
But it isn't a choice, choice is defined as two or more equal options, Heaven and Hell are not equal consequences of belief. One is a punishment and the other a reward, no different than Eddie Izzard's 'cake or death' bit;

So how can it really be called free choice when in theory you have freedom of choice, but in practice, you have the freedom to choose the correct choice?
Click to expand...
To me heaven and hell are the same thing really.

If you go to heaven you have to praise the lord all the time for eternity. Like being in church 24/7 for eternity. Sound fun ? Nuh Uh !!
I would go crazy saying "Allah Akbar" (god is great) all the damn time I would prolly take a swing at Jesus just to get outta there.

If you go to hell you get punished for eternity, how bad could it be ? Whats Satan gonna do ? kill you ? lol nope its for eternity.
I would be like yeah yeah whatever Satan, see ya tomorrow and don't be late faggot.

Basically either option is very ambitious for a carbon based life form to achieve.

But religion is a valuable tool for humanity. Because people are people and will act the fool if nobodies watching them. So religion instills a belief that someone is watching and you will be rewarded or punished for your actions even if no mortal saw your good deeds or your transgressions.

Not everyone can be good for goodness sake :)

We may be very close to not needing a supernatural being watching over everyone because humans are watching and posts that shit to facebook / instagram and will tweet you out. If something goes down they just have to check the tape lol

Go here and be god, watch over the earth yourself. http://www.earthcam.com/
 
Padawanbater2

Padawanbater2

Well-Known Member
heathen said:
But religion is a valuable tool for humanity. Because people are people and will act the fool if nobodies watching them. So religion instills a belief that someone is watching and you will be rewarded or punished for your actions even if no mortal saw your good deeds or your transgressions.

Not everyone can be good for goodness sake :)
Click to expand...
People act the fool whether someone is watching them regardless. I would agree religion would be valuable if it actually prevented people from committing crime, but it doesn't.

Why can't everyone be good because being good is the right thing to do? What is preventing someone from that?
 
Mister Sister

Mister Sister

Active Member
Padawanbater2 said:
But it isn't a choice, choice is defined as two or more equal options, Heaven and Hell are not equal consequences of belief. One is a punishment and the other a reward, no different than Eddie Izzard's 'cake or death' bit;

[youtube]DFyuhTwi_OE[/youtube]

So how can it really be called free choice when in theory you have freedom of choice, but in practice, you have the freedom to choose the correct choice?
Click to expand...
Humbly disagree Pad.

Choice doesn't mean equal, it means one over the other. However, I believe punishment and reward are equal, albeit opposite (ie North vs South).

To me, heaven and hell aren't punishment and reward. "Correct" has nothing to do with it. Failure is a great teacher actually, and I believe right now we are finding ourselves in a very auspicious opportunity to realize the error of our ways, and to set foot on a new path of evolution.

What I'm sayin is that there isn't an incorrect choice. At the end of the day, we define ourselves as a species not by where we are, but where we are going. Right now, we're headed towards the edge of a cliff at a good pace. Can we really call ourselves intelligent if the path we are choosing lands us in a future of destruction? I am simply advocating for a different choice. Hope that makes sense!
 
mindphuk

mindphuk

Well-Known Member
Mister Sister said:
Right now, we're headed towards the edge of a cliff at a good pace. Can we really call ourselves intelligent if the path we are choosing lands us in a future of destruction? I am simply advocating for a different choice. Hope that makes sense!
Click to expand...
I disagree with your assessment. In spite of appearances, which are often colored by media, we have less violence, fewer wars and more cooperation among larger, diverse groups than any time in history. In fact it is science that seems to do the most in bringing together people and cultures that traditionally would not get along. It is science that let's us recognize that we are more similar than different. It shows us what we can accomplish, both good and bad and lets us make the choices that will preserve our species rather than destroy it. I see religious enlightenment as a way to bring people together, as long as they agree with us, but is ultimately divisive if it leads one to believe there is only one god and one correct theology.
 
420IAMthatIAM

420IAMthatIAM

Active Member
mindphuk said:
I disagree with your assessment. In spite of appearances, which are often colored by media, we have less violence, fewer wars and more cooperation among larger, diverse groups than any time in history. In fact it is science that seems to do the most in bringing together people and cultures that traditionally would not get along. It is science that let's us recognize that we are more similar than different. It shows us what we can accomplish, both good and bad and lets us make the choices that will preserve our species rather than destroy it. I see religious enlightenment as a way to bring people together, as long as they agree with us, but is ultimately divisive if it leads one to believe there is only one god and one correct theology.
Click to expand...
my understanding: is that there is one god but many truths but, my beliefs seem to change more every day or may life becomes a little more clear as the physical body starts going down hill. anyway I think that god is the essence of the very air that we all breathe even the essence that we are rather it be good or bad...:bigjoint:
 
Beefbisquit

Beefbisquit

Well-Known Member
Padawanbater2 said:
All powerful, meaning always perfect, perfect meaning the best, nothing better.

Wouldn't you expect an all powerful being who is always perfect to devise a system of belief based on an always perfect set of standards?

An all powerful being. Think about what that would take.. Always right, always just, always perfect. No matter what logical hypothetical you could come up with, he's always got an answer, and it's always the right answer, no matter what. Whatever it is, if it seems inconsistent, you were wrong.


.. would an all powerful being support slavery? Genocide? Disease? Epidemics?

.. would an all powerful being allow global catastrophic events? World war? Poverty?


If such a being exists, why do those things also exist? What answer does organized religion provide?
Click to expand...
I believe The Riddle of Epicurus sums it up succinctly;

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent.

Is he able, but not willing?
Then he is malevolent.

Is he both able and willing?
Then whence cometh evil?

Is he neither able nor willing?
Then why call him God?
 
mindphuk

mindphuk

Well-Known Member
420IAMthatIAM said:
my understanding: is that there is one god but many truths but, my beliefs seem to change more every day or may life becomes a little more clear as the physical body starts going down hill. anyway I think that god is the essence of the very air that we all breathe even the essence that we are rather it be good or bad...:bigjoint:
Click to expand...
What definition of truth are you using? Of course there are many truths if the questions are different but what you seem to be implying that there is more than one truth for a single question. Personally, I equate truth with reality. Although no one knows ultimate reality, I believe we have some good approximations and they are all based on science, none are based on theology.

Back to the point though, what do you think about mankind's path? Are we more destructive now than earlier in history? Of course technology gives us the ability to do more harm with less effort but I think overall, we are learning to be better, take care of all people, not just those in our tribe, and take care of the planet. I think we have, and will continue to make progress toward a time where humans killing each other in wars will become a thing of the past.
 
Mister Sister

Mister Sister

Active Member
mindphuk said:
I disagree with your assessment. In spite of appearances, which are often colored by media, we have less violence, fewer wars and more cooperation among larger, diverse groups than any time in history. In fact it is science that seems to do the most in bringing together people and cultures that traditionally would not get along. It is science that let's us recognize that we are more similar than different. It shows us what we can accomplish, both good and bad and lets us make the choices that will preserve our species rather than destroy it. I see religious enlightenment as a way to bring people together, as long as they agree with us, but is ultimately divisive if it leads one to believe there is only one god and one correct theology.
Click to expand...
Very cool perspective.

I tip my hat to your optimism, that is something many people just don't have. Science can absolutely bring people together in ways previously undiscovered; science meaning a method of inquiry, recognizing it's own falsehood but being ever in the pursuit of truth.

Technology and science sometimes get used interchangeably in people's minds I think too, which makes this 'debate' a little foggy at times. I see technology as the spawn of science, and can be used for either good or evil.

I still stand by my original post. We are still dependent on fossil fuels; we still mine the earth incessantly in the name of 'whatever-we-deem-necessary'. Most people still do not understand the importance of taking care of their own waste, let alone the problems we face on a national and/or global scale. We are still cutting down rainforests to provide for our consumption-based lifestyles.

However

I agree with you that the tides are turning. Lots of old folks are getting older, and the younger generations are silently coming to center stage. Again, we live in a time of 'darkness' but it is allowing us to see it and say "hey that's fucked up". Our arrogance is being reborn into something more sustainable. Which brings me to the all-powerful-being allowing 'bad' stuff to happen. 'Bad' happenings are only a pin-point snapshot of a story that stretches into both the past and the future, with no end in sight at either pole.
 
Heisenberg

Heisenberg

Well-Known Member
mindphuk said:
I disagree with your assessment. In spite of appearances, which are often colored by media, we have less violence, fewer wars and more cooperation among larger, diverse groups than any time in history. In fact it is science that seems to do the most in bringing together people and cultures that traditionally would not get along. It is science that let's us recognize that we are more similar than different. It shows us what we can accomplish, both good and bad and lets us make the choices that will preserve our species rather than destroy it. I see religious enlightenment as a way to bring people together, as long as they agree with us, but is ultimately divisive if it leads one to believe there is only one god and one correct theology.
Click to expand...
Hope you don't mind if I paraphrase this elsewhere.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top