AM I GOING CRAZY?!?!? Decriminalization of Marijuana

monkeyboy22

Active Member
.... #5- Please, please tell me when Obama has ever said anything about bringing about smaller government????? Every plan the man has laid out involves growing the size of government. If your refering to his pledge of going "line by line" through the budget and eliminating or shrinking programs that "aren't working for the people" please be aware that he only pledges to do this so he can enlarge other departments or areas of government. At this point we don't know what his plans are in regards to marijuana or any other drug but to say he has pledged to bring "small government" is just not accurate. i'd like to see your source on that in case i missed something.
dont really have time atm to deal with your other points and I do applaud you for doing your part however I never ever ever once stated anything about smaller gov... rather I said SMARTER. I guess if you were really blazed while reading my post you could have thought you saw the word small instead of smart since the normal arguementis for smaller or bigger gov. but in this case I am talking purely about Obama's want for SMARTER gov bongsmilie
 

unforgiven1420

Well-Known Member
dont really have time atm to deal with your other points and I do applaud you for doing your part however I never ever ever once stated anything about smaller gov... rather I said SMARTER. I guess if you were really blazed while reading my post you could have thought you saw the word small instead of smart since the normal arguementis for smaller or bigger gov. but in this case I am talking purely about Obama's want for SMARTER gov bongsmilie
yup there i go again reading too quick and flying off the handle. my sincerest apologies. :)
 

monkeyboy22

Active Member
ok#1 - I worked very hard in massachusetts this past election helping to pass a new decrim law and i'm still working hard to make sure the law that was passed will go into effect rather than being altered or eliminated by the state legislature (as they've done before with previous ballot measures passed by the peoples vote).
I addressed this but I will again thank you for doing your part.

...#2 - I did not say that one person cannot make a difference. I said politians do not care about the will of the people, as evidenced by the numerous return emails written by politians and posted on this very thread. Until 50% or more of their constituants are writing to them about this issue they DO NOT and WILL NOT see it as their jobs being on the line.
while you didnt come out and say that your statement came accross that way and its best (as I am sure you know) to stay positive about this subject.

... #3 - My personal belief is that 50% of the constituants in a given district will not send these letters to their representatives. Not because they think their view doersn't matter but because a letter to a congressman or senator that has no name on it doesn't mean anything to them and the vast majority are afraid to associate themselves publicly with decriminalizing or legalizing marijuana for fear of reprocusions. Its sad but it true.
it doesnt actually take a true 50% to make things happen.. this is because everytime you, me or anyone else contacts a state rep 9 times out of 10 all that is done is their secretary writes down something along the lines of "yes on bill X" no name is taken and so all that is left is basically a tally sheet that tells the rep at a glance how the majority in his/her disctrict feels about that particular bill/subject. Its certainly not a fair system but it is the way things are and as a result this can either work for or against us depending on what we do with this info ;)

...#4 - The media has played a huge roll in this. Constantly reiterating the government propoganda rather than reporting real news. the way to turn it around is to get t.v. and radio stations involved when a congressman or senator has made it clear that they do not believe there is anything wrong with the system of laws currently in place. Start petitions, get signatures, send the results to that elected official and if their views do not change it should become public knowledge that they "do not want to keep their jobs".
I agree and the only way to change this is to keep after those who are on our side in the media to keep backing us and pushing harder. Fact is that more and more people everyday are seeing the truth about this subject. case in point a pot doc on National Geographic the other day called marijuana nation actually seemed to almost call for the legalization. another thing to note is that CNN and other news organizations have blogs and so does the new administration so why not bring our fight to the media rather than waiting for the media to cover our fight??

and #5

shit happens i missread info sometimes too... glad that is was a simple missunderstanding.. no hard feelings.

:blsmoke:

since we are on the subject... how many reading this are donating members of NORML? (www.norml.org) If you arent then you may want to get on that ;)
 

Tomogchi

Well-Known Member
Okay. As stupid as this sounds, im going to say it.
What do I, a normal tax paying citizen, have to do in order to get my voice heard??
It seems as though when i call Mrs. Gillabrand she has just enough time to tell me that if marijuana were legalized we would see an uproar in criminal activity......
So how do we get them by the balls instead of them having us by the balls?
For the people, by the people...... my ass..
 

unforgiven1420

Well-Known Member
Okay. As stupid as this sounds, im going to say it.
What do I, a normal tax paying citizen, have to do in order to get my voice heard??
It seems as though when i call Mrs. Gillabrand she has just enough time to tell me that if marijuana were legalized we would see an uproar in criminal activity......
So how do we get them by the balls instead of them having us by the balls?
For the people, by the people...... my ass..
start a petition in the district. get signatures from people that want it legalied or at least decriminalixed. send her 1000 names. if she still refuses to see the light of day contact anty and all local radio and t.v. stations and get the word out there that the woman refuses to see reason and think logically. get the community behind you. and vote her stupid small minded ass out of office!!!
 

Tomogchi

Well-Known Member
Stolen from http://www.ultimate-guitar.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-960134.html
and if you dont want to read it all, i grabbed the "best" part...

Why Illegal Drugs Should Be Legalized (copy paste)

1) Regulation. Illegal drugs are cut with all kinds of harmful substances. Legalized drugs would be regulated and so wouldn't be full of crap. This makes them much, much safer for use. The impurities in drugs are harmful and cause (extra) damage. Varying levels of concentration are also to blame for lots of OD's.

2) Tax; speaks for itself. Alcohol and tobacco more than make up in tax revenue what they cost the NHS. Something like 2 billion a year in cost, 6 billion a year in tax revenue. There is no reason why illegal drugs would be different.

3) Saves money. The War on Drugs is astronomically expensive and the police can focus time, money and effort on catching real criminals rather than pursuing addicts.

4) There is no reason to believe it will increase the number of users. In the UK when marijuana was re-classified to C instead of B, the number of users fell from 11% to 8%. In Holland, marijuana usage fell after its decriminalization. In Geneva a test program where heroin users were given safe drugs and a place to do it in caused the number of new users to fall by 80%. If you ask someone why they don't do crack it's usually because they don't want to be a crack head, not because the police might lock them up.

5) Lowers crime. I don't just mean drug possession/dealing. Drug dealing gangs are responsible for huge amounts of crime. Cutting out a major source of their income will cut crime.

6) Drug barons go bust/legit. Drug barons aren't nice people. This would put the money into the hands of CEO's instead. Not a huge improvement I must say but most CEO's aren't quite as bad as drug barons. Either that or drug barons will go legit. Not an ideal solution but it would still cut crime.

7) Free up prison space. The UK prison system is dangerously overcrowded and the less said about the size of the US prison system the better. Suffice to say that there will be far more room in prisons when we stop locking people up for having an addiction.

8) Hypocrisy. There is no reason why tobacco and alcohol should be legal and acceptable and other drugs shouldn't be. Far more people are killed by those two. Far more violence is caused by alcohol etc. It doesn't make sense and tradition is not a reason for anything.

9) Cheaper. If drugs are legal then they'd be cheaper (even when taxed). This would mean that drug addicts wouldn't have to steal (or would have to steal less) to obtain drugs. Lots of crime is caused by this and getting rid of it can only be beneficiary.

10) People will be less afraid of getting help for their addictions and will make it easier for people to get into rehab or whatever. As it stands, it's kind of awkward given the illegal status of drugs. It's easier to quit tobacco and alcohol because you can get lots of help from the NHS and lots of other charities. Illegal drugs don't have this.

11) Freedom. Even without the other 10 reasons (which IMO are more than enough to warrant legalization) I would still advocate legalization for the very simple reason that it is the not the government's place to tell me what I can do to myself for my own enjoyment. I can slice a razorblade across my arm, why I can't I stick a syringe full of heroin in? It seems ridiculous that there are actually chemicals which are banned. This is a somewhat backwards view for the 21st century.

We spend $50 billion per year trying to eradicate drugs from this country. According to DEA estimates we capture less than 10 percent of all illicit drugs. In this regard, I have a two part question 1) How much do you think it will cost to stop the other ninety percent? 2) Does $50 billion a year for a 90% failure rate seem like a good investment to you?

White people buy most of the illegal drugs in this country. Yet, seventy four percent of those receiving prison sentences for drug possession are African-American and other minorities. Is race a factor in the enforcement of drug laws, and if not, how can we prove that to skeptics?

Has the cost of the War on Drugs in terms of billions of dollars, blighted lives, jammed prisons, intensified racism, needless deaths, loss of freedom etc., produced any significant change in drug availability or perceived patterns of drug use?

Someone once said "Prohibition goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation and make crime out of things that are not crimes." How do you respond to this statement?

It is estimated that 77 million U.S. citizens have tried an illicit drug at least once. How many of the 77 million drug users do you feel we must incarcerate in order to win the war on drugs?

Why does the FDA stand up for the right of adults to smoke tobacco, which is highly addictive and causes over 400,000 deaths per year, while decreeing that adults have no right to smoke marijuana, which is non-addictive and kills no one?

Drug use is an acknowledged fact of life in every prison in the country. If we can't stop prisoner' use of drugs, how can we rationally expect to stop average free citizens from using them?

What lessons from alcohol prohibition lead you to believe that the current drug war will end in victory?

Fifty-two federal judges, the district attorney of San Francisco, The mayor of Baltimore, the vast majority of prison wardens, and numerous other respected officials consider the war on drugs an abject failure. More than a few important Americans are opposed to the drug war. Since no other US laws or policies are inspiring such resistance, shouldn't we be listening to the many voices which are saying that continuing the war on drugs may be a grave threat to the long-term health of this nation?

At a time when working people are being asked to tighten our belts in order to help balance the budget, how do you justify increasing the funding to the drug law enforcement bureaucracy? Explain why supporting a failed policy of drug law enforcement has a greater priority than student loans or drug education programs.

What do you conclude from the experience of Holland--a country where drugs fall under the jurisdiction of health agencies, not law enforcement--which has seen a decline in chronic use of hard drugs and casual use of soft drugs since de-criminalization?

If illegal drugs are so obviously harmful to people's health, why is it necessary to put so many American adults in prison to prevent them from using these drugs?

In drug policy discussions we hear a lot about the "message" that certain policies may send to children. What message is sent to inner city children who witness illegal drug sales on their way to school each day?

The modern drug war began in the 1960s, and for thirty five years it has failed to reduce drug access to school-aged children. Which is better for America during the next 35 years, prohibition with continued school-aged access to drugs OR reform policies that ease prohibition but reduce school-age access?

Drug prohibition has been one of the biggest U.S. domestic policy failures of the late twentieth century. Why is a perpetuation of this failure more desirable than serious consideration of alternative policy options?

Why should 270 million citizens continue to pay $50 billion per year to try to change the habits of 20 million people, considering that this policy has not been able to change those habits in 82 years and at a total cost of nearly one trillion dollars?

Even granting these drugs are as harmful as claimed, how does persistence in the policy which created and perpetuates the lucrative criminal markets now supplying them make any sense; especially in light of all the collateral damage done by our (unsuccessful) attempt to control them and the abundant historical record that such markets have never been controlled?

For what other health issues do we use police, prosecutors, and prisons as the primary means of 'helping' a sick person? Isn't that just as silly as using a baseball bat to cure someone of clinical depression? (Smile and get happy or I'll whack you again)

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/17438347/how_america_lost_the_war_on_drugs

http://norml.org/

http://blogs.salon.com/0002762/stories/2003/12/22/whyIsMarijuanaIllegal.html
 

Canon Smoke

Active Member
i know i wanna see one supporting it too. i have a question what the hell do we have to do to have our thoughts and opinions heard by the powers that be???/
Once they (Big Government) realizes that we are right and that "Big Money" can be generated by the Controll, Legalization, and Decriminalation of Cannabis, but you have to remember that they make money for everyone who is languishing behind bars and cell'd up with Murderers and Rapists, untill they have been enlighted, they will resist, Honest education to the benifits of Cannabis is our best tool, be smart, and vote out the Kook's with narrow minds and vote in some one who is enough of a "Free thinker" to Not follow the BS like Scared sheep like the encumbant lawmakers. Just my two pennies !
 

misshestermoffitt

New Member
The tide is turning, the government is strapped for cash. Pretty soon they won't be able to afford to keep marijuana users in prison. The DEA is living on borrowed time. It's coming.........
 
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