The Great T5 Adventure!!!!

Hello everyone, this is the maiden post for my new grow journal, "The Great T5 Adventure." So, before I start in earnest, here's a bit of background:

Background
I'm what could be considered an "intermediate" level grower. I've had several successful grows under my belt. They have been medium sized (30 plant) medical grows. As you can see from the pictures, the set up I've been using is quite successful, averaging 6-8 oz. per plant after 4 months of growth. However, the setup I've been using is also highly conventional. I use T5's to veg, and 4,000 watts of HPS to flower, and keep things cool with a big AC and extensive ducting. We use soil, and the Botanicare Pure Blend Family of nutrients.

Since my old grow is now running like a well-oiled machine, I figure its time to try something new. And that "something new" is The Great T5 Adventure!

The Task At Hand
Basically, I wanted to set up a 6 plant micro-grow in my 2 bedroom condo (which is where I actually live, not the location where the 30 plants are). While it is medical (and therefore legal) I still don't want all of my neighbors smelling pot whenever they walk into the hallway, so discretion is a top priority. As well, I have very unusual windows in my home. This makes it literally impossible to install window AC units, and very difficult (though not impossible) to run heat vents to the outside. So, I must have a system that is relatively cool-running. As well, since I only have 2 bedrooms, I wanted to make sure that my grow did NOT take up a whole room/make it unusable. Space is at a premium here! Finally, I wanted to experiment with some different ideas/ newer technologies. I've done the tried and true, balls-out 10,000 watt power-grow, so this time, I wanted to try something different. In short, I want to create a sleek, modern, efficient way of growing plants in as discrete a fashion as possible. So, after doing some research, and spending a considerable amount of time chatting with the dudes @ my favorite grow store, I hatched a plan...which I will discuss in my next post

Stay tuned for the next post (should be up soon). There, I will discuss my progress so far, as well as some of the details of my set up. Until Next Time...

wow nice grow man

why thank you!

Entry #2: Going Towards The White Lights...
Ok, so I'm back with the second installment.

So after doing a bit of research, I had an idea. Basically, I decided I wanted to grow hydroponically, using only T5 lights (hence the name of the Journal). Now, before someone calls me crazy, hear me out! T5s are cool running, meaning that the air temp isn't going to get much over 80, which is perfect for a room with limited ventilation options. Secondly, I'm growing hydro in a closed space, meaning that water temperature might become an issue if I try to use HID lights. Finally, I like T5's because they are super-efficient, last forever, and provide a tremendous amount of light when used properly (40,000 lumens!!!). They are also good for tight spaces, since they can be placed a couple of inches above the canopy. As a matter of fact, the only major grievance I hear about T5s is that that aren't good for flowering because they produce the wrong type of whitish colored light (6500k). This is easy to fix, as my local hydro shop carries red-spectrum 3000k bulbs for 4' T5s. So when it is time to flower, I can just switch out some of the 6500k bulbs, and have a single fixture producing a perfectly mixed spectrum! However, since I will only be using T5's I made sure not to skimp on the lights. I purchased 2 higher-end T5's (see pictures). They're 48x27x2 8-bulb fixtures, divided into 2 4-light banks (meaning you can switch on 4 bulbs at a time).
Well, that's all for this post, next time I'll talk a bit about the hydro system I'm using, and I'll have some pictures of my sweet baby girls!

Subscribed, i've been thinking of going T5 for a mother plant, but if this goes well, maybe i can convert to complete T5 setup too!

Good Luck!

nice man good look this will be interesting to see

Entry #3: Testing the Waters...

Ok, so now that I've gone on my diatribe about why T5's rock, let's talk Hydroponics. I've had limited experience w/ hydro before. I've checked out some of my friends' hydro set ups, and used to grow out of a pre-fab hydro set up I bought from Sunlight Sheds (waste of money!). However, in terms of my bigger, more serious grows, I've only used soil. So, although I know my way around the grow room, I'll be the first to admit that hydro takes me a bit out of my comfort zone. Despite this lack of familiarity, I decided to go 'dro for several reasons.

Logistically speaking, it would be easier. Since I live in a high-rise in the middle of a city, it would be difficult/conspicuous for me to move in large bags of dirt through the lobbies, elevators, etc. without drawing attention to myself. As well, there is the question of how to dispose of said dirt once I'm done with a harvest. Finally, dirt is messy. As you can see in the pictures, I am growing in a carpeted bedroom. Admittedly, I've made giant wooden cabinets in the carpeted bedroom, but still, I don't want to get dirt everywhere.

Conversely, hydroponics lend themselves to situations like mine. I can use my bathtub to fill/drain my reservoirs, so there is no need to worry about having to haul stuff up to my unit. As well, I don't need to worry about making a huge mess spilling dirt everywhere and ruining my carpet. An added bonus is that hydro cuts down on the smell; in my experience, dirt can smell pretty strongly, and to be honest, I'm pretty sick of it!

Sooooo, since I decided to go the hydro route, here are some pictures of what I'm working with. Basically, I'm doing the classic DWC power-bucket set up. In each 5 gallon bucket, I have a 6" airstone hooked up to a pretty large 4-hose air pump (one of the hoses isn't being used at this time). I have to duct vans providing external ventilation (can be seen on the left) and 3 clip fans that provide internal air circulation. My air temp hovers between 78-83 with a humidity of 28-35%, while my water temp is now stabilized at about 71-74 (more on my water problems later).

The clones I'm using are Big Bud. To be honest, these are my second choice of clones. At my other grow, we grow two strains: Sour Diesel, and Big Bud. I personally feel that Sour Diesel is hands down a better strain, in terms of the high, taste/smell, quality of smoke, etc. However, Big Bud produces 30-50% bigger yields (and is still very good pot in its own right). So, when I asked the person who manages my grow house to make me some clones, they made clones of the Big Bud since I didn't specify. So, I'll probably go with Big Bud for this first run, then switch to Sour Diesel afterwords. Unfortunately, I don't have pictures of finished Big Bug, but I'll throw in some Sour Diesel pics just for the fun of it.

Entry #4: Troubled Waters

So, I started my grow about 10 days ago, and immediately started having problems w/ my reservoir temp. The first night I put the buckets under the light, the temperature got very high, up to around 28-30 degrees centigrade. I quickly took steps to lower the reservoir temp. I placed a fan directly in front of my air pump, so it would pump cooler air bubbles through the water. As well, I wrapped the sides of my gray 5 gallon buckets with Mylar, to prevent the dark color from heating up. Finally, I have been placing 20 oz bottles of frozen water into the reservoirs every 6ish hours. Now, my water temperature is down to around 20-22 degrees centigrade.

I'm a bit concerned, as I'm worried my clones will have developed a fungus problem due to the high water temp. They were a little weak looking when I got them, so I've also been giving them a very weak nutrient solution, only 230ish ppm of Pure Blend Veg formula. One of my plants is a bit yellowish (see the picture), which leads me to think its underfed, but at the same time, I don't want to stress the plant out by shocking it with a sudden nutrient increase at such an early stage.

I'm in the process of upgrading my reservoir system so I'll be able to keep it cool without having to drop ice packs into every few hours. Instead of using 3 5-gallon buckets, I'm going to use a single 27.5 gallon sterlite tub, wrapped completely in Mylar. It's roughly 36"x18"x12". Having one resevoir instead of three will make the water temperature more stable. As well, it will allow me to install the chiller i just ordered, the CoolWorks Ice Probe (check out the link: http://www.novatecproducts.com/iceprobe.htm ). This chiller is super small, pretty cheap, and just perfect for the 10-15 gallons of water I'll be needing it to chill. I'm hoping that once I install the chiller in the new res, that I won't have to pay constant attention to the water temp.

As always, feel free to post questions or comments! Until next time...

Entry #5: Upgrading My Reservoir
So, its been roughly 12ish days since I brought home my 3 Big Bud clones. They looked kind of sick when I got them, but I have been slowly nursing them back to health. Today, I completed step 1 of my reservoir upgrade (see photos). I removed my 3 5-gallon buckets, and replaced them with a single 27.5 gallon sterlite tub. I covered the tub with mylar, so there would be no light contamination. I added attached a 4th airstone to my 4 socket air pump, so I'm now using 4 6-inch airstones in roughly 15 gallons of water. I upped the nutrient level to about 450-475 ppm, I'm still only using Botanicare Pure Blend veg. I also added some pH up/down, and finally brought the pH to an acceptable 5.89. I've been good about keeping my res temperature down, to around 21 degrees centigrade. I haven't needed to add nay ice packs to the new res (it's only been there for 2 hours), but I will probably have to tonight or tomorrow morning. I will be curious to see how quickly the reservoir takes to heat up, since the larger body of water will be more difficult to warm.

I'm looking forward to "phase 2" of my reservoir upgrade plan, when I install my CoolWorks Ice Probe. This should finally put an end to my reservoir temperature problems. I should be getting the chiller in 3 days, so I'll let you all know how it works out.

As always, comments and suggestions are very appreciated!

i cant wait to see the end results mate keep going

Entry #6 Nutrient Issues?
So, 2 of my 3 plants are looking a bit weak. One is looking pretty sick, the other is only a bit yellow around the edges. I think this could be due to a lack of nutrients (I'm only @ like 450-500ppm), but one of the clones is doing just fine (big roots, green healthy leaves, etc.) So, now I'm a bit concerned that the 2 sick plants have some sort of root fungus caused by my high water temp in the first couple days of this grow. I'm planning on raising the nutrient levels up tomorrow to roughly 800-900ppm when I clean and drain the reservoir to install my new chilling unit.

Check out the pictures. As you can see, the roots seem to be developing alright (although they are kind of hard to see through the hydroton pellets). However, the leaves of two of the plants look yellowish. Hopefully this is just nutrient deficiency.

Feel free to comment!

Entry #7: Things Get Complicated
Oh man, where to begin? So, as you can see in the photos, I received and installed my CoolWorks Ice Probe. The probe is working pretty well, it's keeping my reservoir at a pretty steady 21 degrees centigrade (like 69-70 degrees). I plan on breaking apart some disposable foam coolers, and using the pieces to further insulate my res. This way, I should be able to drop the temp to around 67ish degrees, perhaps lower if I'm lucky.

However, there is a problem. The way the chiller works is basically like a heat sync in a computer. Because of this, the chiller generates hot air. So after I installed the chiller, I closed up my cabinet, and ran some errands. I came back, and the internal air temperature of my box was 86 degrees! So I left the door open for a a while, and adjusted the bungee cord to leave one of the doors slightly ajar so more cool air could come in.

So, it seems that while I've got my water temperature problem solved, I now need to deal with the air temp problem. I'm guessing the duct fans I use as ventilation are not powerful enough to exchange the needed amount of air. In the next week I'll probably go to my grow store in get a very powerful "ecoplus supreme" inline fan. At my other grow site, we use one of these to vent the veg room, which is considerably larger than my grow closet, so hopefully that will do the trick.

To make matters worse, I'm now positive I have root rot. Whether or not the clones already had it, or whether it developed in my res the first day or two, I can't tell. So, I was about to use a solution of h2o2 (hydrogen peroxide) to help eliminate the rot, when I read that I cannot use h2o2 because I use organic nutrients (Pure Blend Pro). Since I only have a little PBP left anyways, and I've only been feeding these plants for a week and a half, I'm considering just switching the nutrients and using h2o2 to fix the rot. I'm thinking about going with an advanced nutrients regimen, so feel free to let me know if you've had a good/bad experience with AN products.


P.S. Today I drained/cleaned the tub when I installed the chiller. Refilled res to around 16ish gallons. Made the solution 450 ppm, with a pH of 6.0-6.1. It looks like some of the plants have nutrient burn, but I didn't think 450 ppm around week 2 was that much...
Feel free to comment!

Entry #8 Back to the Drawing Board

Last night, I made the decision to let the plants die; I'll pull the plug in the next day or two. The root rot is progressing, and I've decided not to waste my time trying to fight it. The plants were only 2 weeks old, and I have an endless supply of clones. So rather than waste my time trying to revive sick 2 week old plants, I'm just going to make myself some new, strong, healthy clones.

However, at this point, I am pleased that I have worked out many of the kinks in this project. As you can see in the pictures, I installed a MUCH more powerful exhaust fan. Now, the internal temp. doesn't get above 80, despite the fact that it is sealed airtight (with the exception of the intake/outtake fans). The chiller I have been using for my reservoir is also working well. My water temp is still a bit high, about 69-70 degrees, but once I add some insulation to the res, things should drop to about 67-68 degrees.

Going forward, the one issue I am concerned about is how I will be able to use a co2 tank if I must rely on my exhaust fan to keep the air temperature in check. I can't use an AC for space/window reasons. I've considered buying an evaporative/swamp cooler, but I'm worried it will create too much humidity in such a confined space. If anyone has experience with co2/ventilation issues in confined spaces, let me know!

Entry #9 Chilling Out

So, as you can see in the photos, I have insulated my reservoir. It was relatively simple: I went to the local Fred Meyer (NW represent! ), and purchased one of those Styrofoam coolers that you bring to picnics and stuff. I basically cut it in to sections, and then duct-taped the hell out of everything. Overnight, my temperature dropped 2 degrees centigrade!!! So now, finally, my reservoir is the proper temperature, a nice, cool, 66-67 degrees Fahrenheit (19 centigrade)! Combined with an air temp in the high 70's, and a humidity between 40-50%, I'm feeling pretty good about finally getting a handle on my climate control issues.

Unfortunately, this does not solve my root rot problem. It's going to take me roughly a week to get some more clones, so in the meantime, I'm just going to use this opportunity to mess around a bit with my set up and work out any potential kinks. As you can see in the other photo, I definitely need to figure out what to do about my exhaust vent, because it looks pretty shabby as of now. I have what I believe are refered to as "European windows", which means they can swing open both vertically and horizontally, but they cannot be propped open like conventional square windows.

As always, suggestions are welcome!

Hey, just a quick update on the reservoir insulation: My res is now down to 17 celsius (like 63 F), the insulation seems to be working pretty well. I HIGHLY recommend trying this out to all who are having water temp problems!

Hey my Man!

Thought Id stop by and check out your grow since we have a lot of simularities in our grows--and I think we are at the same stage--you might be a week or two ahead.

Anyways...just a couple of thoughts: Although Im a new grower too--so hopefully this isn't a case of the blind leading the blind-lol

I had the exact same problem as your plants did. Here was my thinking.

I know I had some problems with my first two plants because I was screwing around with nutes--but I had designated them as my Test-Plants because I was worried about the transition from seedling to Ebb and Flow.

Now--although I really thought it was a nute burn--but I found pictures with the same characteristics (as my sick plants) on this site. That is, yellowing leaves...but the veins were green. If I go by that: it was a Potassium problem (K)--and it wasn’t taking up enough. Which made sense because at that time I wasn’t using Lucas’s formula and I was only using Grow Nova (GH). Now although I may end up throwing them out eventually...you can lean alot about what’s happening in your garden. I just watched the tips of my new growth to find out what’s happening `now kind of thing. The old leaves...well you can trim them later (or even sooner).

When I looked at a chart I saw that K is best taken up at 5.9--where I had been 5.7-5.8--so I upped the Ph a little and I have had great results. Anyways when plants are this young--have faith. I mean they aren’t even a 10th of there size. They have many more leaves to grow and shed.

I'd just hate to see you throw out a plant too early.

Besides...you know the urban legend...don’t you? It's that sick and struggling plant that grows up to be the biggest most badass girl in your garden

EDIT: I know you were talking root rot--but I didn't see any signs of root rot from your pics

Entry #10 It's ALIVE!

So, I left my plants alone for 10 days, as in I literally did not check a single thing (air/water temp, pH, nutrient levels, humidity, etc.) Surprisingly, I came beck to check on them, and they grew a significant amount, despite the intentional neglect (check the photos). I'm taking this as a sign that I should not give up on these plants. As well, they are currently much larger than any clone I could swap in,so I might as well go for it.

Since I've decided not to give up on these fine ladies just yet, here is what I've done:

1) Fighting the rot
Completely emptied/cleaned/sterilized the reservoir. I used 3% h2o2 (hydrogen peroxide) to make sure any trace of bacteria/rot is gone. Then, I filled my reservoir up with about 12-13 gallons of water, and then added roughly 160-180 ml of3% h2o2. After rinsing my hydroton buckets w/ a similar water/h2o2 solution, I'm letting them flush for roughly 36 hours in the res. I balanced out my pH at like 5.55ish. The water temp spiked when I changed out the old water, so I dropped in some icepacks and lowered back to around 17 celsius. My chiller can maintain a cold temperature, it just takes awhile to make the temp DROP without the help of ice.

In 36 hours, I'll begin using my new nutrient solution: advanced nutrients grow-micro-bloom (1-1-1), plus Thrive Alive (which is a root booster/b1 supplement). I'm hoping that this new nutrient regimen, combined w/ the flush, will help to eliminate whatever nutrient issue is making my leaves burn. As well, I will be using 11ml/gallon of h2o2; this will keep my environment sterile.

2) Toying with my air system
(I'll include pictures of this in my next post)
I've added a 2nd intake fan to my cabinet. Now I have 2 forced air intake fans (which are pretty weak, only like 30-60 cfm), and one pretty powerful centrifugal exhaust fan (its like 200ish cfm). Hopefully this will make the temperature difference between the room and the cabinet more even. I've also dealt with my window issue. I basically stuck an exhaust tube in the gap, and then used really thick painter's plastic (basically 6mil poly) and duct tape to seal the window. This solution was cheap, easy to "install", and can easily be removed or modified down the road.

Finally, I'd just like to give a shout out to Tee Five (+ rep). You were spot on about keeping those plants alive; they were clearly more resilient than I gave them credit for. Thanks for the advice!
-CDXX

You hadn't left an update for such a long time I was like--uh oh...I pissed him off.


But im glad to hear it turned out well. That is fanastic news.


Well Done !!

Entry #11 Dinner Time!

So, today I finished flushing the plants, and started the new feeding program. I have abandoned botanicare, because organic nutes are incompatible with h2o2, which I need to kill my root rot. So, I'm using advanced nutrients Grow-Micro-Bloom, following the ratios on the chart. As well, I used thrive alive to help grow stronger healthier roots. I used slightly less than the suggested, because I did not want to shock the roots, so my total ppm is now around 900ish My pH had crept up to 5.9-6.0, so I brought it back down to 5.6. I added 160 ml of h2o2 to help combat my rotting issues. My water temp is at a cool 18 celsius.

Now, on to my problem of the week. Air temperature. As you can see in the photos, the interior temperature of my cabinet is 85 degrees, which is about 5-7 degrees hotter than I would like. The room temp outside of the box is usually in the high 60's to low 70's, so clearly the problem is that not enough air exchange is taking place between the box and the surrounding room. But, I feel like I've installed a decent amount of ventilation equipment, so I'm not entirely sure what I' doing wrong. I've installed to forced intake fans, and one powerful centrifugal exhaust fan, plus I have a small circular fan pointed at each plant, that's 6 fans total...how many more fans will I need? In my previous grows, we just used big AC units, so we never really had temperature problems; if it got too hot, we'd just crank things up.

So, if anyone has any suggestions, let me know. I'm considering cutting some passive intake hole on the opposite side of the box, or perhaps getting a tall, column style fan to help provide better internal circulation.

The first thing---check the thermometer. Put it in the fridge. The Humidity should drop to almost zero and the temp to about four degrees.

Do you run your squirrel cage fan 24 hours a day? You probably should consider that if you don't.

But those T5's run very cool (as you know). I have the same and they really only heat up my tent a couple of degrees. (Lets take a moment and imagine if you had HID's that run over 212 degrees [Grimmace])

Im just throwing some ideas out here.

Check the outlet hose from your fan (the laundry ducting) sometimes that hose can rip fairly easy, and it only takes a tap to do it. If you find a tearing--use duct tape or aluminium tape to seal it. Wet your hand and carefully go over the ducting to check.

Once you know that your thermometer is functioning and that there are no leaks for the outlet....well then you have to adjust your enviroment. You may try sticking multiple thermometers through out the grow room (I have 3). Find out where the heat is accumulating. put them everywhere. Up high ..Low...Mid. Then try to make you squirel cage focus on that area. Move the fans around. Use your thermometers and try and locate the problem.

That's what I'd try to do.

Good luck my man!
Let us know!