have you guys seen this youtube video

Venus55

Venus55

Well-Known Member
mustbetribbin said:
I'm as real as anyone of you/ or anyone else here.
Hannimal same question why don't you believe in God and what is the core reasoning behind your belief?
Click to expand...
Probably not the appropriate sub forum for this discussion but the two do go hand in hand imo.

You answered your own question earlier.. “Intelligent creation”, yes.
“God”; the image of a man nailed to a cross, who acted on behalf of and represented the father son and holy spirit (of god?), and who was born from a woman who had never had sex.. well that’s just absurdity.

The bible was written to give humans faith. A reason to be here, a direction, something to cling to, guidance. And it worked for the herds who needed it. (The weak minded.)

The bibles version of god is utter bull shit.

Have faith in yourself. Believe in yourself. Believe in intelligent creation. Don’t believe in the bible.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
Venus55 said:
Probably not the appropriate sub forum for this discussion but the two do go hand in hand imo.

You answered your own question earlier.. “Intelligent creation”, yes.
“God”; the image of a man nailed to a cross, who acted on behalf of and represented the father son and holy spirit (of god?), and who was born from a woman who had never had sex.. well that’s just absurdity.

The bible was written to give humans faith. A reason to be here, a direction, something to cling to, guidance. And it worked for the herds who needed it. (The weak minded.)

The bibles version of god is utter bull shit.

Have faith in yourself. Believe in yourself. Believe in intelligent creation. Don’t believe in the bible.
Click to expand...
snicker
 
S

schuylaar

Well-Known Member
mustbetribbin said:
Ok, so what is your theory on how life began, what is the core reasoning behind why you don't believe a God could exist?

Besides the evolution 'theory' for animals, how did seeds evolve from out of nowhere?

How could vegetation just magically appear from primordial soup? We still have phytoplankton, if that's where you believe plants originated from, but how can you get multicelled lifeforms to evolve from a single celled organism? How do you get waterborne lifeform that asexually replicates itself to begin the make seeds on land, (why so much variation everywhere you look), and from there begin to change to male and female seeds suddenly? How did something that didn't have and orifice or flowering abilities of any kind suddenly gain the ability to become impregnated from an outward pollen source intelligently on its own? Why would an asexual lifeform need to divide apart and decrease it's own chances of survival by creating an appendage that releases or receives outwardly sourced cells in order to replicate itself, when it is already guaranteed 100% success rate by replicating internally?

Do you understand extinction? It means a lifeform that once existed has failed to replicate itself for whatever reason, and has now been lost from existing again, or into the future. If microbiologist could create new, NEW! Viruses from thin air, then why wouldn't they have brought back an extinct animal of any kind back again? Even an extinct plankton or single celled organism of any kind, because they have not, where is one example that isn't pure BS? No extinct flowers or anything like that has been brought to life that wasn't discovered frozen already or encapsulated somehow in order to germinate, therefore already existed before, just as the Bible says.

There aren't new anything else in existence anywhere on earth, No new plants, No new animals, scientists have 'attempted' to mix genes of certain animals but they end up dying prematurely. You have things like mules or ligers but so far in the known history of human existence have they ever been successfully turned into a breeding species, always born sterile, and not evolving any further.

Lastly we have a plant here on this site called Cannabis that we all enjoy, it has cannabinoids inside of it that match to our our own endocannabinoid receptors perfectly, how did a random plant species become a borderline cellular symbiotic relationship type of species that our bodies receive with precise specificity? Why the exact match at the cellular level from a completely different lifeform, why would a lifeform care to make an exact match on its own, what's in it for a plant to concern itself with another lifeforms (humans) cellular receptors suddenly, it's not like the plants were forced to because we'd go extinct if they didn't exist, what else could cause that to occur other than intelligent creation?

So year besides, the air we breathe, the ozone & atmosphere that protects us almost perfectly, and the Sun and Moon being the exact same size from our viewpoint, and the sun's temperature keeping life in balance so precisely that if it gets off by just a few degrees then the whole Earth changes, and the years being and exact number of days, and they seasons occurring exactly on time each year always, and the solar system being perfectly in balance and held in place for millions of years and our planet being the only planet with any measurable amount of water on their surface and things like that, then how did the plants begin to make their own seeds from out of a single celled organism that still exists simultaneously? Plankton are like the cockroaches of the sea if all other life died off, plankton of some kind would probably still survive somehow.

Anyways answer a few questions if you wouldn't mind I'm curious as to why a God couldn't exist when so many things line up, yet with evolution there's so many holes in the 'theory' no consistency anywhere really, just like lines on a chalkboard type of scrabble and digging in the dark, no formulas line up, no big bangs, and how do you get gravity to be perfectly balanced like it is? What's keeping us from flying into our Sun for eons of time? Why do plants line up in hours of sunlight perfectly with our Sun, when other planets discovered have crazy long days or crazy short days around their orbiting stars? Not to mention inhospitable atmospheres if they even have one and temperatures that are known to not allow for life to exist, temp extremes and mineral deficiencies.


Oh and no the Bible is not entirely man made, humans worked in unison with Angelic guidance and introspection through the third eye (and through dreams) in order to write the Bible, yes the flesh of a human being pressed an ancient writing utensil to an ancient type of paper or papyrus sheet, but without God's guidance such a work of extreme Importance and Intelligence would have never been conceived, and only through previous ancient Bible's that had been erased from time did any other religious books of any kind become into existence either, well other than through the works of satan that is.

Thanks for any answers or insight you might be able to share, thx...
Click to expand...
it's called evolution..it has to do with science and facts (things that are true)..actually 'formulas' do line up it's called physics and math. that's how we know certain things are true without 'seeing'..you didn't see anything that's in the Bible, but you'll bet the farm that it all is literal and happened in the past- it didn't.
 
mustbetribbin

mustbetribbin

Well-Known Member
hanimmal said:
Religion has been a focal point of hateful trolling being used by the Republicans since at least 2006.

All of the anti-gay/anti Women's rights memes have been used (with very great effect) to paint Democrats as killers of children and deviants who are trying to steal their kids from their cults. And once you have painted a political party into one that kid naps and murders children with the most vile pictures possible, voting for an 'imperfect vessel' ends up being the only choice.

And Trump is using the fact it is so easy to brainwash people with this propaganda and having his foreign and domestic trolls militarized by countries like Russia use it to try to get re-elected.

If you have people trolling you use your ignore button. If you want to call people out on religion, go make a thread in religion and call them out there. This is a political forum and people like to thrust their religious cult logic into it is just wrong. We shouldn't have to make fun of you based on your religion in a non-religious thread.
Click to expand...
I appreciate both your replies you've just written out to me Hanimmal thank you for taking the time to converse about this topic like adults, if you check post #51 again I went on with quite a bit of science oriented types of questions that I would like anyone to attempt to answer if they're able, I'm not going full blown religious on this thread, I'm just a different individual who happens to understand things from a different mindset, as I don't believe in evolution, I believe in God (YHWH), I can't be somebody that I am not, No matter how hard I attempt or try to digest the information that I'm receiving from the news and media I still see things in a different way, we must accept that there is diversity here on the forum, different views focused on similar/ or the same topics and different opinions are going to arise here or there, imo it's what makes us a great online community, afterall we are a forum dedicated to growing Cannabis and using it as medicine, this isn't a strictly politics only forum, it's one that revolves around plant life and soil health, not every thread is going to go exactly as planned when we've got so much information being shared in one space, if I may include there is not a conspiracy section on the forum, yet that's been part of the discussion on National news and at the white house press conferences even, as you can see there are variables in play that have distorted what would typically be said in the politics section because of this, I just don't want to be placed between a rock and a hard place, I feel I'm am a worthy member here on this site and I do try and answer newbie questions when I am able, I try and offer help where I can.

Please everyone, let us understand that this thread was formed from another thread that was pertaining to a global crisis, now is the time to accept one another for who we are and what we have to say, hard times are upon us, a crisis like none of us have seen or lived through before, we must have patience please..... look people are dying because of what's going on, its not an easy time for anyone right now, I'm hurt by what's going on, they've declared war on the population, they are lying to us, blocking people from seeds? Closing down stores, 30% unemployment? How's that not War? I believe that my Bible is the absolute Truth, And it does upset me because I believe soo intensely that it's the truth that tears are flowing down my face, I God doesn't lie, he's says that nothing new can exist under the Sun, and it hurts to be told that it's not the truth when I know to the maximum of what I can comprehend that it's the truth, and it hurts to see everyone get lied to, and see people suffering, and children not allowed to play, and people's lives being ruined, people getting forces injections, and fathers getting arrested for playing outside with their children, I'm not OK with that!!! And I'm very serious, now look corona viruses do exist, but influenza viruses have done far more damage and killed more people throughout time, yet we live with those season after season, year after year and no global shutdowns occur, no quarantines, no locked down in your own homes, no elderly told they won't get ventilators and to just die at home.

This is something new being broadcasted, the news and media are attempting to brainwash us, and gain mind control over us, just look at how many stories that are coming at us all day everyday for weeks/months, it's like on every morning show on the radio, every traffic report, every commercial, nothing but stacked commercials talking about corona virus, every TV news cast has like 8 Covid segments without saying a single other thing about World news, social distancing/virus signs everywhere, that's mind control, it's mind control right in front of your eyes, they are blatantly blocking you from thinking logically through fear 24/7, and dammit that is painful for me to see everyone succumb to such deception, they are lying to you, and I HATE IT, I want people to know the truth, I don't want anyone misled, my blood is boiling inside because I care so much about everyone being lied to and I'm breathing heavily and my heart hurts and I want you to know this is effecting me to even type this out, but I don't want to stop because I support God's Word, It hurts worse to just sit silently while people are being lied to and to know it's because of a false reason and agenda that's occurring because or along with a supposed 'unknown' virus that I know can't exist, if it's New, then it's a lie according to what the Bible teaches, I'm not going to switch my religious beliefs over any topic, let alone a virus, and I can't be who I am not.

So please realize that there are no other options for people like me, and in the middle of this crisis there is no other place to discuss this but here, if I took it to the spirituality section they'd say hey keep politics out of this section that belongs in politics, we have to accept that this is new territory that none of us have dealt with before, it's not time to get overly critical of one another, this crisis has just begun, everyone needs room to breathe and talk this through, so I do hope that we can try and find common ground and allow for a more broadened discussion for this current situation, I feel we owe it to ourselves to keep digging until we get the full details and are able to know the truth behind what we're not being told as a community here.

I've calmed down again, I'm relaxed now, I got upset thinking about how they were forcing people to believes something that the Bible advocates to being the opposite, that causes fire to build up inside me, please just understand it's not me, it's my soul inside that's angry with those who make attempts to go against what God says is true, and lie to millions/billions of people, it goes way beyond politics when you've got people dying, and others with the blood of innocent ones on their hands, there's nothing anyone could do to stop me from hurting because of what's going on.

I'm sorry if I went overboard with anything I've said, but during this new stage in time that we are in, everything has changed, it's going to boil out into new aspects that are not part of normal discussion, this is not normal what is occurring to the US and various other countries worldwide, change has arrived, your going to get different reactions from people as this type of thing occurs, normality has left the building and someone else would come along saying things similar to what I've written here in this thread previously in my place if I weren't here voicing this very same belief/opinion, it's called global consciousness and it is a real phenomena among human beings.

So thank you for hearing me out and allowing me to speak up as to what I feel is right, and I will willfully allow anyone who chooses to share what they see occurring from this situation freely and without any restraints placed on them for speaking their opinion during this time of serious contemplation and crisis.

Cheers.
 
Fogdog

Fogdog

Well-Known Member
mustbetribbin said:
Ok, so what is your theory on how life began, what is the core reasoning behind why you don't believe a God could exist?

Besides the evolution 'theory' for animals, how did seeds evolve from out of nowhere?

How could vegetation just magically appear from primordial soup? We still have phytoplankton, if that's where you believe plants originated from, but how can you get multicelled lifeforms to evolve from a single celled organism? How do you get waterborne lifeform that asexually replicates itself to begin the make seeds on land, (why so much variation everywhere you look), and from there begin to change to male and female seeds suddenly? How did something that didn't have and orifice or flowering abilities of any kind suddenly gain the ability to become impregnated from an outward pollen source intelligently on its own? Why would an asexual lifeform need to divide apart and decrease it's own chances of survival by creating an appendage that releases or receives outwardly sourced cells in order to replicate itself, when it is already guaranteed 100% success rate by replicating internally?

Do you understand extinction? It means a lifeform that once existed has failed to replicate itself for whatever reason, and has now been lost from existing again, or into the future. If microbiologist could create new, NEW! Viruses from thin air, then why wouldn't they have brought back an extinct animal of any kind back again? Even an extinct plankton or single celled organism of any kind, because they have not, where is one example that isn't pure BS? No extinct flowers or anything like that has been brought to life that wasn't discovered frozen already or encapsulated somehow in order to germinate, therefore already existed before, just as the Bible says.

There aren't new anything else in existence anywhere on earth, No new plants, No new animals, scientists have 'attempted' to mix genes of certain animals but they end up dying prematurely. You have things like mules or ligers but so far in the known history of human existence have they ever been successfully turned into a breeding species, always born sterile, and not evolving any further.

Lastly we have a plant here on this site called Cannabis that we all enjoy, it has cannabinoids inside of it that match to our our own endocannabinoid receptors perfectly, how did a random plant species become a borderline cellular symbiotic relationship type of species that our bodies receive with precise specificity? Why the exact match at the cellular level from a completely different lifeform, why would a lifeform care to make an exact match on its own, what's in it for a plant to concern itself with another lifeforms (humans) cellular receptors suddenly, it's not like the plants were forced to because we'd go extinct if they didn't exist, what else could cause that to occur other than intelligent creation?

So year besides, the air we breathe, the ozone & atmosphere that protects us almost perfectly, and the Sun and Moon being the exact same size from our viewpoint, and the sun's temperature keeping life in balance so precisely that if it gets off by just a few degrees then the whole Earth changes, and the years being and exact number of days, and they seasons occurring exactly on time each year always, and the solar system being perfectly in balance and held in place for millions of years and our planet being the only planet with any measurable amount of water on their surface and things like that, then how did the plants begin to make their own seeds from out of a single celled organism that still exists simultaneously? Plankton are like the cockroaches of the sea if all other life died off, plankton of some kind would probably still survive somehow.

Anyways answer a few questions if you wouldn't mind I'm curious as to why a God couldn't exist when so many things line up, yet with evolution there's so many holes in the 'theory' no consistency anywhere really, just like lines on a chalkboard type of scrabble and digging in the dark, no formulas line up, no big bangs, and how do you get gravity to be perfectly balanced like it is? What's keeping us from flying into our Sun for eons of time? Why do plants line up in hours of sunlight perfectly with our Sun, when other planets discovered have crazy long days or crazy short days around their orbiting stars? Not to mention inhospitable atmospheres if they even have one and temperatures that are known to not allow for life to exist, temp extremes and mineral deficiencies.


Oh and no the Bible is not entirely man made, humans worked in unison with Angelic guidance and introspection through the third eye (and through dreams) in order to write the Bible, yes the flesh of a human being pressed an ancient writing utensil to an ancient type of paper or papyrus sheet, but without God's guidance such a work of extreme Importance and Intelligence would have never been conceived, and only through previous ancient Bible's that had been erased from time did any other religious books of any kind become into existence either, well other than through the works of satan that is.

Thanks for any answers or insight you might be able to share, thx...
Click to expand...
The bible was written by men. It's historical fact.

The theory that a god created everything is useless. Can't be proven. Not necessary to explain the workings of this universe. Therefore the theory should be discarded for better ones. That life is complex doesn't require a god to explain its complexity.

So, let's run your theory through the baloney detection kit.

Your theory, if I may boil it down to be less verbose, is that because the earth is the perfect environment for life and because life is complex beyond our imagination, god must exist.

That assertion fits the baloney detection tool number 9, "Always ask whether the hypothesis can be, at least in principle, falsified. Propositions that are untestable, unfalsifiable are not worth much. You must be able to check assertions out. Inveterate skeptics must be given the chance to follow your reasoning, to duplicate your experiments and see if they get the same result. " Your theory also fails due to Baloney Detection toolkit's fallacy of logic number 11, Non-sequitur -- Latin for "it does not follow".

Non-Sequitur. That we don't understand our existence, it does not follow that therefore there is a god. That is just a belief and not a useful one at that. Not too different from @Venus55 's mentioning of the Great Spaghetti Monster or as she put it Intelligent Design. What does one even do with that theory? If one can't prove that God exists -- and one can't prove it -- what good is that theory? For example, if an intelligent designer put this virus in the world, he can remove it just as simply or can change it as soon as we figure out a cure. So, why do anything about it? Just let Gramma die because its Gods will. I oversimplify to make a point. We not only can but will figure out a cure. Meanwhile, we know the virus will mutate, have already spotted variants and we are tracking them in case they become something even worse. Our use of science is the tool we can use to prosper beyond this event. Your religion stultifies and impedes our ability to adapt.

So, we don't know "where our universe came from". So what? We can work hard to understand our universe though. Most often, people who are trying to understand the workings of the world are interfered with by religious zealots. Be it viruses, time, weather, or the cosmos, people of faith have done horrible things to those who eventually were proved to be correct. Global warming is most definitely being caused by human activity. Yet religious zealots are doing their utmost to stop people from taking action to slow down carbon emissions. Antivaxxers (if there were a Hell, they have their own space reserved for them) are most often religious zealots who would let their infected kids get mine sick. Fuck that.

We can reject the theory that there is a God or "intelligent design" because the existence of God is not necessary for the universe to exist. Also, no path forward because we can't prove there is a god or know what they are going to do next. The alternate theory -- that the universe exists and we need to learn more to understand how -- is simpler. It also gives us a path forward. It's a better theory. Therefore we may discard yours.
 
Last edited:
UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
mustbetribbin said:
I appreciate both your replies you've just written out to me Hanimmal thank you for taking the time to converse about this topic like adults, if you check post #51 again I went on with quite a bit of science oriented types of questions that I would like anyone to attempt to answer if they're able, I'm not going full blown religious on this thread, I'm just a different individual who happens to understand things from a different mindset, as I don't believe in evolution, I believe in God (YHWH), I can't be somebody that I am not, No matter how hard I attempt or try to digest the information that I'm receiving from the news and media I still see things in a different way, we must accept that there is diversity here on the forum, different views focused on similar/ or the same topics and different opinions are going to arise here or there, imo it's what makes us a great online community, afterall we are a forum dedicated to growing Cannabis and using it as medicine, this isn't a strictly politics only forum, it's one that revolves around plant life and soil health, not every thread is going to go exactly as planned when we've got so much information being shared in one space, if I may include there is not a conspiracy section on the forum, yet that's been part of the discussion on National news and at the white house press conferences even, as you can see there are variables in play that have distorted what would typically be said in the politics section because of this, I just don't want to be placed between a rock and a hard place, I feel I'm am a worthy member here on this site and I do try and answer newbie questions when I am able, I try and offer help where I can.

Please everyone, let us understand that this thread was formed from another thread that was pertaining to a global crisis, now is the time to accept one another for who we are and what we have to say, hard times are upon us, a crisis like none of us have seen or lived through before, we must have patience please..... look people are dying because of what's going on, its not an easy time for anyone right now, I'm hurt by what's going on, they've declared war on the population, they are lying to us, blocking people from seeds? Closing down stores, 30% unemployment? How's that not War? I believe that my Bible is the absolute Truth, And it does upset me because I believe soo intensely that it's the truth that tears are flowing down my face, I God doesn't lie, he's says that nothing new can exist under the Sun, and it hurts to be told that it's not the truth when I know to the maximum of what I can comprehend that it's the truth, and it hurts to see everyone get lied to, and see people suffering, and children not allowed to play, and people's lives being ruined, people getting forces injections, and fathers getting arrested for playing outside with their children, I'm not OK with that!!! And I'm very serious, now look corona viruses do exist, but influenza viruses have done far more damage and killed more people throughout time, yet we live with those season after season, year after year and no global shutdowns occur, no quarantines, no locked down in your own homes, no elderly told they won't get ventilators and to just die at home.

This is something new being broadcasted, the news and media are attempting to brainwash us, and gain mind control over us, just look at how many stories that are coming at us all day everyday for weeks/months, it's like on every morning show on the radio, every traffic report, every commercial, nothing but stacked commercials talking about corona virus, every TV news cast has like 8 Covid segments without saying a single other thing about World news, social distancing/virus signs everywhere, that's mind control, it's mind control right in front of your eyes, they are blatantly blocking you from thinking logically through fear 24/7, and dammit that is painful for me to see everyone succumb to such deception, they are lying to you, and I HATE IT, I want people to know the truth, I don't want anyone misled, my blood is boiling inside because I care so much about everyone being lied to and I'm breathing heavily and my heart hurts and I want you to know this is effecting me to even type this out, but I don't want to stop because I support God's Word, It hurts worse to just sit silently while people are being lied to and to know it's because of a false reason and agenda that's occurring because or along with a supposed 'unknown' virus that I know can't exist, if it's New, then it's a lie according to what the Bible teaches, I'm not going to switch my religious beliefs over any topic, let alone a virus, and I can't be who I am not.

So please realize that there are no other options for people like me, and in the middle of this crisis there is no other place to discuss this but here, if I took it to the spirituality section they'd say hey keep politics out of this section that belongs in politics, we have to accept that this is new territory that none of us have dealt with before, it's not time to get overly critical of one another, this crisis has just begun, everyone needs room to breathe and talk this through, so I do hope that we can try and find common ground and allow for a more broadened discussion for this current situation, I feel we owe it to ourselves to keep digging until we get the full details and are able to know the truth behind what we're not being told as a community here.

I've calmed down again, I'm relaxed now, I got upset thinking about how they were forcing people to believes something that the Bible advocates to being the opposite, that causes fire to build up inside me, please just understand it's not me, it's my soul inside that's angry with those who make attempts to go against what God says is true, and lie to millions/billions of people, it goes way beyond politics when you've got people dying, and others with the blood of innocent ones on their hands, there's nothing anyone could do to stop me from hurting because of what's going on.

I'm sorry if I went overboard with anything I've said, but during this new stage in time that we are in, everything has changed, it's going to boil out into new aspects that are not part of normal discussion, this is not normal what is occurring to the US and various other countries worldwide, change has arrived, your going to get different reactions from people as this type of thing occurs, normality has left the building and someone else would come along saying things similar to what I've written here in this thread previously in my place if I weren't here voicing this very same belief/opinion, it's called global consciousness and it is a real phenomena among human beings.

So thank you for hearing me out and allowing me to speak up as to what I feel is right, and I will willfully allow anyone who chooses to share what they see occurring from this situation freely and without any restraints placed on them for speaking their opinion during this time of serious contemplation and crisis.

Cheers.
Click to expand...
tard
 
mustbetribbin

mustbetribbin

Well-Known Member
Venus55 said:
Probably not the appropriate sub forum for this discussion but the two do go hand in hand imo.

You answered your own question earlier.. “Intelligent creation”, yes.
“God”; the image of a man nailed to a cross, who acted on behalf of and represented the father son and holy spirit (of god?), and who was born from a woman who had never had sex.. well that’s just absurdity.

The bible was written to give humans faith. A reason to be here, a direction, something to cling to, guidance. And it worked for the herds who needed it. (The weak minded.)

The bibles version of god is utter bull shit.

Have faith in yourself. Believe in yourself. Believe in intelligent creation. Don’t believe in the bible.
Click to expand...
I respectfully disagree, but I do appreciate you bringing forth your opinion on this matter up to the surface for us to ponder upon.

Thank You Venus55.
 
mustbetribbin

mustbetribbin

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
The bible was written by men. It's historical fact.

The theory that a god created everything is useless. Can't be proven. Not necessary to explain the workings of this universe. Therefore the theory should be discarded for better ones. That life is complex doesn't require a god to explain its complexity.

So, let's run your theory through the baloney detection kit.

Your theory, if I may boil it down to be less verbose, is that because the earth is the perfect environment for life and because life is complex beyond our imagination, god must exist.

That assertion fits the baloney detection tool number 9, "Always ask whether the hypothesis can be, at least in principle, falsified. Propositions that are untestable, unfalsifiable are not worth much. You must be able to check assertions out. Inveterate skeptics must be given the chance to follow your reasoning, to duplicate your experiments and see if they get the same result. " Your theory also fails due to Baloney Detection toolkit's fallacy of logic number 11, Non-sequitur -- Latin for "it does not follow".

Non-Sequitur. That we don't understand our existence, it does not follow that therefore there is a god. That is just a belief and not a useful one at that. Not too different from @Venus55 's mentioning of the Great Spaghetti Monster or as she put it Intelligent Design. What does one even do with that theory? If one can't prove that God exists -- and one can't prove it -- what good is that theory? For example, if an intelligent designer put this virus in the world, he can remove it just as simply or can change it as soon as we figure out a cure. So, why do anything about it? Just let Gramma die because its Gods will. I oversimplify to make a point. We not only can but will figure out a cure. Meanwhile, we know the virus will mutate, have already spotted variants and we are tracking them in case they become something even worse. Our use of science is the tool we can use to prosper beyond this event. Your religion stultifies and impedes our ability to adapt.

So, we don't know "where our universe came from". So what? We can work hard to understand our universe though. Most often, people who are trying to understand the workings of the world are interfered with by religious zealots. Be it viruses, time, weather, or the cosmos, people of faith have done horrible things to those who eventually were proved to be correct. Global warming is most definitely being caused by human activity. Yet religious zealots are doing their utmost to stop people from taking action to slow down carbon emissions. Antivaxxers (if there were a Hell, they have their own space reserved for them) are most often religious zealots who would let their infected kids get mine sick. Fuck that.

We can reject the theory that there is a God or "intelligent design" because the existence of God is not necessary for the universe to exist. Also, no path forward because we can't prove there is a god or know what they are going to do next. The alternate theory -- that the universe exists and we just need to learn more to understand how -- is simpler. It also gives us a path forward. It's a better theory. Therefore we may discard yours.
Click to expand...
I am impressed to see that you've taken the time to write a noteworthy response to me on this subject, however I feel what you are telling me is of a very modernized opinion and subjugation theory that comes from a predisposed origin in that we modern human beings are somehow the pinnacle of what it means to be human, and that we are somehow superior in our own intelligence compared to those who have come before us.

I disagree, because I do not choose to believe that civilizations throughout time in our human history of existence could all be wrong, I do not place my intelligence above what the eyes and minds of our ancient forefathers and I do not take what they saw, felt and thought for granted, I don't presume that what they encountered during their lives while here on Earth is simply illogical scribbling and gibberish that should be tossed out the window without any second guess or ponderance.

I don't believe that cultures throughout time would have searched continuously for a higher understanding than their own Human understanding without the inclination that some hidden or literal force somehow inspiring them to do so, look at every single ancient culture, look at the pyramids, look at the cave drawings and hieroglyphs, look at the ancient carvings that were made, I cannot look past what their flesh and blood position of being from those ancient times was trying to send forth in a message to their future generations and offspring, I don't feel and think that the presumption that we can overlook what these ancient people's were trying to tell us is of wise origin, to overlook and make rational attempts to compensate for them just because a belief has been put in place that their time of existence was futile just because they didn't have modern conveniences and worldwide intelligence at their finger tips, I don't feel it is wise to discount their reasoning to make such a big deal out from what does not exist visibly from our material world and the metaphysics behind the depictions that they chose to write or draw/carve throughout time could somehow not hold any water in the real world, and without some derivative purpose as to why they would've spent time trying to educate us their offspring however they could by sending us a message from the past as a warning or something of great importance beyond their own existence.

The truth is they were made from the very same blood and bones that we now inhabit in our own bodies in these modern ages, the blood, time and effort that these ones spent to project a message into the future has to have had some originating reason as to why people's and cultures throughout time and history held onto such thoughts and safeguarded what they felt to be truth or reality, however they may have presented it, they without fail did leave traces of their existence behind for us to learn from, and I don't believe that what these ancient ones spent time trying to tell us should be overlooked and taken for granted, to do so is to look past our own existence and inherit wisdom that was gifted to us from our ancient forefathers (and mothers) from a time that is unbeknownst to us, I feel to place our own thoughts above those who came before us places us in peril from discovering the truth about our true history as human beings, I believe it is a pathological downfall to presume that we can overlook what our own flesh and blood historical accounts that were passed down to us had no purpose, because I feel the people of ancient times did have great intelligence and insight, and they knew that putting their perspective down for future generations to accept was a worthwhile endeavour, and worth the trouble, especially if their message was collected from a God given ordained message that they were gifted to protect and shield from becoming erased because of the great importance that was found therein.

But I do understand your opinion @Fogdog and I thank you for voicing and sharing your opinion, thank you friend, I am enjoying this conversation. Cheers.
 
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mustbetribbin

mustbetribbin

Well-Known Member
UncleBuck said:
This thread sucks now
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How about posting a video then, bring some life back into the party? I will if you won't...

Share a video that you enjoy that parallels with the subjects that are being spoken about, or about this Virus outbreak, if you believe in it go ahead I won't judge you, be free to be who you are UB, this the time to accept one another and share what we think to be correct, this is about reaching a higher conclusion as a whole/community, please don't resist to share what you are able, you're only holding yourself back if you show restraint during a time of crisis and embracement of who we all are inside, and who you are as an individual inside, I welcome you to please share my friend.
 
UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
mustbetribbin said:
How about posting a video then, bring some life back into the party? I will if you won't...

Share a video that you enjoy that parallels with the subjects that are being spoken about, or about this Virus outbreak, if you believe in it go ahead I won't judge you, be free to be who you are UB, this the time to accept one another and share what we think to be correct, this is about reaching a higher conclusion as a whole/community, please don't resist to share what you are able, you're only holding yourself back if you show restraint during a time of crisis and embracement of who we all are inside, and who you are as an individual inside, I welcome you to please share my friend.
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you are a gay homosexual
 
Venus55

Venus55

Well-Known Member
Fogdog said:
The bible was written by men. It's historical fact.

The theory that a god created everything is useless. Can't be proven. Not necessary to explain the workings of this universe. Therefore the theory should be discarded for better ones. That life is complex doesn't require a god to explain its complexity.

So, let's run your theory through the baloney detection kit.

Your theory, if I may boil it down to be less verbose, is that because the earth is the perfect environment for life and because life is complex beyond our imagination, god must exist.

That assertion fits the baloney detection tool number 9, "Always ask whether the hypothesis can be, at least in principle, falsified. Propositions that are untestable, unfalsifiable are not worth much. You must be able to check assertions out. Inveterate skeptics must be given the chance to follow your reasoning, to duplicate your experiments and see if they get the same result. " Your theory also fails due to Baloney Detection toolkit's fallacy of logic number 11, Non-sequitur -- Latin for "it does not follow".

Non-Sequitur. That we don't understand our existence, it does not follow that therefore there is a god. That is just a belief and not a useful one at that. Not too different from @Venus55 's mentioning of the Great Spaghetti Monster or as she put it Intelligent Design. What does one even do with that theory? If one can't prove that God exists -- and one can't prove it -- what good is that theory? For example, if an intelligent designer put this virus in the world, he can remove it just as simply or can change it as soon as we figure out a cure. So, why do anything about it? Just let Gramma die because its Gods will. I oversimplify to make a point. We not only can but will figure out a cure. Meanwhile, we know the virus will mutate, have already spotted variants and we are tracking them in case they become something even worse. Our use of science is the tool we can use to prosper beyond this event. Your religion stultifies and impedes our ability to adapt.

So, we don't know "where our universe came from". So what? We can work hard to understand our universe though. Most often, people who are trying to understand the workings of the world are interfered with by religious zealots. Be it viruses, time, weather, or the cosmos, people of faith have done horrible things to those who eventually were proved to be correct. Global warming is most definitely being caused by human activity. Yet religious zealots are doing their utmost to stop people from taking action to slow down carbon emissions. Antivaxxers (if there were a Hell, they have their own space reserved for them) are most often religious zealots who would let their infected kids get mine sick. Fuck that.

We can reject the theory that there is a God or "intelligent design" because the existence of God is not necessary for the universe to exist. Also, no path forward because we can't prove there is a god or know what they are going to do next. The alternate theory -- that the universe exists and we need to learn more to understand how -- is simpler. It also gives us a path forward. It's a better theory. Therefore we may discard yours.
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You can’t resist can u?
 
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