churchhaze
Well-Known Member
You have a reputation for thinking that HPS lamps aren't very good for growing plants.
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Light ???
- Thread starter RM3
- Start date
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
At least your reputation is intact.You have a reputation for thinking that HPS lamps aren't very good for growing plants.
BobCajun
Well-Known Member
Oh I do not. I hardly ever mention HPS at all. Just doesn't come up that often. I'm just going by experience. I find they burn plants up too much and produce too much heat in general. Just too problematic to deal with compared to LED and CFL.You have a reputation for thinking that HPS lamps aren't very good for growing plants.
Doogan
Well-Known Member
Could you instead lower the power during "midday depression" instead lights off? Or evan shut some off for 30 and leave some on....?
BobCajun
Well-Known Member
All I can tell you is that under 6/2 veg cycle growth is off the chain.
hyroot
Well-Known Member
I tried that in one veg room . A couple strains started flowering in veg. It was 5 out of 20 plants. I went back to 18/6.
BobCajun
Well-Known Member
Weird, but interesting. Mine reveged on it from cuttings taken at 6 weeks flower. Completely vegetative right now. Was it all one strain that flowered?
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hyroot
Well-Known Member
It was blue balls, nightmare cookies, and quantum kush. They started flowering then after pistils started forming. They went through the reveg stage. Then I immediately switched back to 18/6.
BobCajun
Well-Known Member
Sure it wasn't just normal single flowers at nodes? Hard to believe a plant could flower on 2 hours of darkness, in fact impossible to believe. Anyway, probably doesn't make much difference. My plants look healthy though and grow fast. I don't think they like being in the dark for long periods. I think they're growing better than 18/6 but it's just visually.
hyroot
Well-Known Member
They were forming buds at each top.
it takes 2 hours of darkness to send a plant into its phytochrome state. With IR ot takes a few min.
So when the lights came back on. The plants might have thought it was new day.
Like all other training methods and longer day manipulation , it's strain dependent.
Odin*
Well-Known Member
No. You do not want to alter the light cycle to impose an artificial midday depression on the plants. I was referring to the original post, which suggests recreating the midday depression (through darkness, not heat, but that still generates the same result) and applying excessive heat are beneficial. This is not true, both bring photosynthesis to a halt. One of the studies (links) I posted concluded that it is the temperature, not "light saturation" that causes midday depression.
Cool temps, CO2 supplementation, ample water, lots of light, that's what you want.
I wanted to touch on major changes in the light cycle during bloom. Some strains can handle it, if other stressors aren't there to push it beyond it's stress limit. Others cannot, or have already been subjected to enough stress that major changes in the lighting will push it to herm. I know this not only from reading (more below), but first hand experience. I've changed the light cycle in mid bloom before without issue, so when it was becoming exceptionally hot (several years back), I didn't think twice about shutting the lights off for two days, to "reset" and switch it over to "on" at night (it had been "on" during the day). I had neglected to consider my "Mystery". She's high maintenance, isn't afraid to go bananas over the slightest "imperfection" in the environment. The two days off and change in the cycle made her flip her cookie, threw bananas at everybody, and left me with a crap ton of seeds (I kept about 1k).
As I mentioned above, I looked into it to see if I could find anything directly linking the "lights out" to the banana fest. Sure enough, I read (don't remember if it was an excerpt from a book, or the breeder chiming in on one of the Forums) that a well known and respected breeder shut the lights off mid bloom to identify any "sensitive" plants (hermie tendencies) so that they could be eliminated from breeding stock.
RM3
Well-Known Member
Some how you missed that I run a hot canopy, The reason I wrote the post was because lots of folks wanted to know how I get the results I get usin T5's, you may be right bout it shuttin down things but it works a charm, I've been doin it for years
Odin*
Well-Known Member
@RM3 I didn't miss that bit and I don't doubt that you've dialed in your setup to run at, or close to, it's best. With higher temps, the plants will sweat more, this forces them to drink more, which assists in keeping the roots healthier. However, the constant sweating/loss of water is what prevents the buds from developing the bulbous calyxes. The "sweating"/heat also decreases terpene development. This might explain why your garden doesn't "stink". If you cooled your room via AC, the AC would pull water from the room (condenser), maintaining a similar level of soil moisture, but your plant would not be drawing up that water and "sweating". That alone would completely change your "feed" and watering schedule.
To illustrate the drastic difference that temperature makes, here is my GSC, grown in higher temps. Notice the lack of bulbous calyxes, the amount of leaves (in bud), the hairs, the color (which is determined by terpenes, as is scent and flavors).
Here is that exact same strain (my GSC, all from a single original clone), only grown in cooler temps. No other change was made, same medium, same feed schedule, same room. Look at the change in bud structure. Bulbous calyxes, very low leaf count, very few hairs, all purple (increased terpenes). I will also say that the nose is far stronger/complex, flavors are better as well as more complex, and the smoke is more potent, the high more complex and longer in duration. This is the healthier/happier plant and sets the bar that every run with this strain will be measured against. As long as I can maintain those temps, she will come out identical each time, everything else is in perfect order.
Here is some glue from that same run.
You can grow herb in higher temps, I've churned out fire from 88F, but that doesn't mean that it was grown in optimal conditions, or was as good as it could have been. Again, cooler temps, CO2 supplementation, roots, watering, nutrients, etc. at "perfect" levels allow for a greater light saturation threshold, which increases metabolism, resulting in boosted rates of photosynthesis. Higher temps lower the light saturation threshold and slows/stops the metabolism, which decreases/stops photosynthesis.
To illustrate the drastic difference that temperature makes, here is my GSC, grown in higher temps. Notice the lack of bulbous calyxes, the amount of leaves (in bud), the hairs, the color (which is determined by terpenes, as is scent and flavors).
Here is that exact same strain (my GSC, all from a single original clone), only grown in cooler temps. No other change was made, same medium, same feed schedule, same room. Look at the change in bud structure. Bulbous calyxes, very low leaf count, very few hairs, all purple (increased terpenes). I will also say that the nose is far stronger/complex, flavors are better as well as more complex, and the smoke is more potent, the high more complex and longer in duration. This is the healthier/happier plant and sets the bar that every run with this strain will be measured against. As long as I can maintain those temps, she will come out identical each time, everything else is in perfect order.
Here is some glue from that same run.
You can grow herb in higher temps, I've churned out fire from 88F, but that doesn't mean that it was grown in optimal conditions, or was as good as it could have been. Again, cooler temps, CO2 supplementation, roots, watering, nutrients, etc. at "perfect" levels allow for a greater light saturation threshold, which increases metabolism, resulting in boosted rates of photosynthesis. Higher temps lower the light saturation threshold and slows/stops the metabolism, which decreases/stops photosynthesis.
whitebb2727
Well-Known Member
I can tell you it has been right around 100 here this summer. Heat indexes of 115. High humidity.
We went a long spell with no rain and even the big hardwoods were starting to yellow.
We finally got a couple weeks of rain.
Aot of plants in the garden and around the house just curl up mid day.
I've got a few flowering and trucking right along.
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hyroot
Well-Known Member
My outdoor was doing the same. Yellowing and curling and twisting leaves. It's been 105-115 everyday and 85 -105 at night. Even with shade cloth. Since I started watering with activated labs (lactobacillus serum) they have been perky during the day. Which never happens this time of year
whitebb2727
Well-Known Member
I got a sample from rxgreensolutions. It has different bacteria in it. It has made a difference.
Its called root.
https://www.rxgreensolutions.com/root.html
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
@RM3 runs his RH quite low, so this doesn't become a problem in his application.@RM3 I didn't miss that bit and I don't doubt that you've dialed in your setup to run at, or close to, it's best. With higher temps, the plants will sweat more, this forces them to drink more, which assists in keeping the roots healthier. However, the constant sweating/loss of water is what prevents the buds from developing the bulbous calyxes. The "sweating"/heat also decreases terpene development. This might explain why your garden doesn't "stink". If you cooled your room via AC, the AC would pull water from the room (condenser), maintaining a similar level of soil moisture, but your plant would not be drawing up that water and "sweating". That alone would completely change your "feed" and watering schedule.
To illustrate the drastic difference that temperature makes, here is my GSC, grown in higher temps. Notice the lack of bulbous calyxes, the amount of leaves (in bud), the hairs, the color (which is determined by terpenes, as is scent and flavors).
Here is that exact same strain (my GSC, all from a single original clone), only grown in cooler temps. No other change was made, same medium, same feed schedule, same room. Look at the change in bud structure. Bulbous calyxes, very low leaf count, very few hairs, all purple (increased terpenes). I will also say that the nose is far stronger/complex, flavors are better as well as more complex, and the smoke is more potent, the high more complex and longer in duration. This is the healthier/happier plant and sets the bar that every run with this strain will be measured against. As long as I can maintain those temps, she will come out identical each time, everything else is in perfect order.
Here is some glue from that same run.
You can grow herb in higher temps, I've churned out fire from 88F, but that doesn't mean that it was grown in optimal conditions, or was as good as it could have been. Again, cooler temps, CO2 supplementation, roots, watering, nutrients, etc. at "perfect" levels allow for a greater light saturation threshold, which increases metabolism, resulting in boosted rates of photosynthesis. Higher temps lower the light saturation threshold and slows/stops the metabolism, which decreases/stops photosynthesis.
He's after resin maximization, not yield. It's a different mindset.
