Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
You are defining Christians as something they are not. It is very clear that Christians are in politics, as T.D. pointed out, you're using the 'no true Scotsman' fallacy to explain your position.
Zero respect
- Thread starter Someacdude
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Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
Unless you're a hippy, that gives all worldly possessions away, and follows all the rules of the O.T., you're not a real Christian.
Jesus didn't appear to change the laws of the old testament (John 14:15), Jesus appeared as a sword of his father to kill and vanquish non-Christians/blasphemers. (Matthew 10:34)
If you actually read the bible, there aren't any real Christians because we would throw them all in jail for killing anyone wearing a cotton blend t-shirt or for working on the sabbath.... that is real Christianity. Straight from the bible.
Jesus didn't appear to change the laws of the old testament (John 14:15), Jesus appeared as a sword of his father to kill and vanquish non-Christians/blasphemers. (Matthew 10:34)
If you actually read the bible, there aren't any real Christians because we would throw them all in jail for killing anyone wearing a cotton blend t-shirt or for working on the sabbath.... that is real Christianity. Straight from the bible.
eye exaggerate
Well-Known Member
It is not a material view that will provide satisfaction about these subjects. Your view is more material and you're talking about spiritual subjects.
Consciousness sees without any conditioning. Someone who is really 'awake' knows that the material and the void have their existence in the same moment.
Too spiritual / one-sided
Too material / one-sided
No one wins.
[video=youtube;YNBTKFQzjq8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNBTKFQzjq8&feature=kp[/video]
(hehe)
eye exaggerate
Well-Known Member
Here is something I find curious. Many people are apt to call-out those in the past who took scriptures literally - while doing the exact same thing themselves.
*actually, that literal perspective is their platform for argument
*actually, that literal perspective is their platform for argument
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
If every Christian said the bible was fables, there would be no issue. The problem is, most Christians don't.Here is something I find curious. Many people are apt to call-out those in the past who took scriptures literally - while doing the exact same thing themselves.
*actually, that literal perspective is their platform for argument
Or they take some things literally, like kill homosexuals, but they're totally cool with working on Sunday and not owning slaves.
It's hypocrisy at its finest.
Sand4x105
Well-Known Member
I just wanted to make sure everyone that read that would read it twice...
Christians need a cross over...
Someone that says: New Testament Bible mostly happened, believe on jesus....
And, well, the old testament is not true and just a collection of stories about another time...
The bible is obviously not a factual book... however, if christians believe it's the 'word of god'...
well then they must believe the word of god as is or it will be an affront to their own 'faith'...
for if you only have the faith [the size of] a mustard seed....
Bla...bla...bla...
I escaped an christian upbringing....
Christians... you can too, if you put your hand right on the computer screen right now...
I will through the wonders of radio frequency, transform your mind to a reality based one...
Amen... and amen...
Praise be to god on the highest... amen and amen...
in all things,....
eye exaggerate
Well-Known Member
And the rest of the world has no hypocrites? Most televised 'Christians' have their own agenda, not the ones I know personally.
The originating concept vs. how people respond to it are 2 different things.
Nuclear power as the prime example.
Beefbisquit
Well-Known Member
I didn't say the rest of the world didn't have hypocrites. Are you suggesting that because they're Christian we should let it slide? See what I did there?
I can't speak to the Christians you know personally, I can however, speak to the ones I know.
They follow the bits and pieces of the bible that they want to, and cast the rest aside, all the while demanding it's the perfect (yet seemingly un-followed) word of god.
IMO, once you're a Christian, you don't need 'your own agenda', you already have the churches.
NietzscheKeen
Well-Known Member
When I was studying to become a pastor, I realized that most people hadn't read the Bible in it's entirety and even fewer knew the TRUE origin of the books of the Bible. If they knew the real story, there would be many fewer christians around today.
tyler.durden
Well-Known Member
Hey, Eye. Sorry to jump in. Don't all christians have the same agenda? Cheat death (and worse, hell) by believing in christ, therefore get to go to heaven? Are there any christians who's agenda is not to attain the goal of heaven?
Skuxx
Well-Known Member
There are so many types of people and groups of people that call themselves christians. There are surely some that don't believe in the stereotypical heaven or afterlife beliefs. I know many personally that don't believe in any kind of hell. I think some might say "heaven and hell are in your head" or something... but holding onto a christian label for whatever reason.
eye exaggerate
Well-Known Member
Dude
Yes, the agenda is Heaven. However, the agenda has different skins, so to speak. I was not taught to cheat death, but instead to try and be less fearful of it so as to live.
It always seems like scriptures take place outside but the inside is where it all happens first. It's not just about believing in Christ, we all have to walk the walk. Believing in 'Him' is not the end of religious attainment it is more like the beginning. Finding Him is the quest. That happens in the world inside, in the mind. We're all fighting for peace of mind. The mind fights back because of past conditioning.
ftr - Christ is not the only term I would use to explain the idea. That name happens to be the West's way of talking about consciousness. Consciousness has no name, but we need one to be able to relate it. I see heaven as pure consciousness that we cannot comprehend while tending to the desires of the (negative aspects of) ego.
Someacdude
Active Member
Thats old worn out nonsense.
Prove it with the bible.
Again, religion and God are completely different things, Most religions teach iots ok to kill as long as its in war, whats the Bible say?
Jesus said that true Christians would be known by there works, and im not talking about so called christians who go on their Church mission to Hati to 'help' with rebuilding, then post 100 pics of them at the beach and 10 of them feeding starving children.
Believe it or not i despise religion because it has simply turned into big business, i believe the Catholic Church has amassed so much wealth it was the earths 4th largest land owner, Ask yourself, when Jesus was on earth, he was a carpenter, he dressed,,,,,,as a carpenter, he didnt wear a crown until the end and that one was made of thorns. Now even that is suspect to weather one believes ib the Bible, But, there a hundreds of scrolls that mention him NOT in the bible. Jesus didnt own anything, look at The Bakers tammy fae and her gay husband , actually gay and he was a minister.
I get it, i really do, but because of all those people so many wont even open the book and so many despise it for no other reason thaqn that number 1, they have never read it, and lets be honest, it in fashion.
It is a awesome historical text , maybe not through and through, it also tells its story warts and all, imagine temple prostitutes , fratricide , murders, rapes, theft , King David had one of his 10 mighty men basically murdered so he could have his wife and those people where united under one religion and they got into that much trouble.
If people really followed the scripture there would be no war, no greed , no hunger and yet so many chose to make a dollar off it, i get it.
But arent you curious about whats REALLY in it? Why it was a offense punishable by death to even own one all the while they where burning witches at the stake?
The way it was held from people and translated by tensdale who was ,,,,,,,,,,,put to death.
Throughout history there have been true Christians, they arent the majority and they dont use it to gain power or money.
There is a difference
I think its important, i think people deserve to know that the Bible and religion and NOT the same thing.
tyler.durden
Well-Known Member
Hey Skuxx. That's interesting. My mother was christian scientist, and they believe heaven is all around us and that this material world is an illusion. When you die, you simply slip into the plane of heaven and lose this illusion. Or some such shit. I know that the Vatican recently decreed (by fiat, as usual) that there is no hell. I did a cursory google search and couldn't find christian sects that don't believe in heaven, could you provide some links?
tyler.durden
Well-Known Member
GroovyDude
Yes, the agenda is Heaven. However, the agenda has different skins, so to speak. I was not taught to cheat death, but instead to try and be less fearful of it so as to live.
It always seems like scriptures take place outside but the inside is where it all happens first. It's not just about believing in Christ, we all have to walk the walk. Believing in 'Him' is not the end of religious attainment it is more like the beginning. Finding Him is the quest. That happens in the world inside, in the mind. We're all fighting for peace of mind. The mind fights back because of past conditioning.
ftr - Christ is not the only term I would use to explain the idea. That name happens to be the West's way of talking about consciousness. Consciousness has no name, but we need one to be able to relate it. I see heaven as pure consciousness that we cannot comprehend while tending to the desires of the (negative aspects of) ego.
.....
tyler.durden
Well-Known Member
What is? The NTS fallacy?
Prove what with the bible? What a true christian is? I don't think one can objectively do that...
The bible says a lot of stuff, much of it contradictory...
He also said that the only way through heaven is through belief in him, and how one should treat one's slaves...
LOL...
Would you provide links to the bolded above? I wasn't aware of any text outside of the bible that mentions him at the time...
Atheists like to joke that the quickest cure for christianity is to actually sit down and read the bible cover to cover
IMO, It is an arduous, boring, confusing and horrifying read. I've done it twice...I'm not sure awesome is the best adjective to describe the bible. I'd say it's more aweful, as in causing feeling of fear and wonder. In just looking up these two words, they both seem to be based in fear. Interesting...
It would be okay for the in group, not so much for anyone outside of it. There would also be brutal slayings for petty transgressions, slavery, rampant misogyny, and acceptable bigotry toward minority groups...
True dat...
Not anymore, been through it a lot...
There's that True Christians phrase again. Would you kindly post the parts of the bible that state what it takes to be one of those?
No, but both have some pretty negative consequences...
kpmarine
Well-Known Member
The bible has multiple accounts of god commanding war against people. From what I remember from my strong's concordance; "murder" is what the 10 commandments spoke of. Ignoring self defense, the bible says it's cool to beat your slave to death; provided he dies a few days later.
It's a crap historical text. Many events it claims to have happened have no other recorded record. If egypt had a period where frogs rained from the sky; rivers turned to friggin blood; there were days of darkness; every firstborn died; pillars of fire came down from the sky; and their pharoah and most of their elite forces were killed while riding though a path in the red sea; they would have written that down. That would have destroyed that region in a rather significant way.
NietzscheKeen
Well-Known Member
Jesus never claimed divinity. All the theology we get about the resurrection, etc comes from Paul and those forging his name and does not come from Jesus. Jesus never came to save the world from their sins as so many people like to think. Jesus was merely an apocalyptic preacher. His message was that the time is near, God is coming back soon. Get right with each other and live a good life. He is NOT the son of man that is spoken of in the old testament and he never claims to be. In fact he speaks about someone else coming after him.
The Bible never says we will go live in heaven and the traditional christian concept of hell is a Greek addition not one you will find in the Bible.
The Bible never says we will go live in heaven and the traditional christian concept of hell is a Greek addition not one you will find in the Bible.
kpmarine
Well-Known Member
He claims to be the son of god multiple times. Unless you feel the bible is fallacious. I don't see a reason to disagree that the bible is flawed; given its generally contradictory nature.
kpmarine
Well-Known Member
How is that white separatist group faring, by the way?