Yellowing and drying leaves in soil

Z

Zefito

Well-Known Member
Hello

First to thank you all for the great info on this site. I have spent hours reading this valuable info.

I have tried growing for 3 years about 5 grows with all similar outcomes.

I have opted for the organic grow with the biobizz range for not needing to check ph and ppm (which in the beginning I did do)

Everything is beautiful until around 4 weeks into veg, where a nitrogen deficiency seems to be always the problem( I assume). Now it hase arrived 3 weeks into flowering, yellowing leaves and drying out.I follow the biobizz feeding schedule.

Tap water ppm is 450ppm and cistern water is 150ppm much softer.

My temps are on the higher side, but could this cause so much damage?

Thank you Zeus

Here is the set up

LIGHTS

DIY Vero 29 @ 150watts

TENT

LightHouse MAX 0.5m

VENTILATION

TD-160/100 TD SILENT

SOIL

Bio bizz All-mix

FERTILIZERS

1ml- 2 ml biobizz grow-heaven-Acti Vera

POT

14LT

TEMPS

26-29c

RH

40-50%

TIME

3 Weeks Flowering

WATER

1lt every two days (cistern rainwater)





 
ShLUbY

ShLUbY

Well-Known Member
Zefito said:
yeah did that too water would go in with nutes at 6.5ph and runoff about 7-7.5 with same results.Biobizz should stabilize the ph to about 6,5 or they don't..im going with canna next..im not convinced
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A couple things stick out to me here....

Is your 1-2mL of fert per L or per Gal? if it's per gal... that seems like a very very low dose of food.

But i'm thinking it could be your water though... 450 out of the tap is really high, and even though filtered is 150ppm... could still contain a lot of calcium or other minerals that are more oxidized which is driving up your soil pH. If you have more positively charged minerals (like Ca++) in your water they will drive out the H+ ions by outcompeting for ionic bonding surfaces, which are crucial to maintaining soil acidity. I'd get your water tested if I were you or look into a more efficient filter that gets the ppm count to sub-50. you could get a 2nd filter to filter your filtered water to extend the life of a better filter.
 
Z

Zefito

Well-Known Member
ShLUbY said:
A couple things stick out to me here....

Is your 1-2mL of fert per L or per Gal? if it's per gal... that seems like a very very low dose of food.

But i'm thinking it could be your water though... 450 out of the tap is really high, and even though filtered is 150ppm... could still contain a lot of calcium or other minerals that are more oxidized which is driving up your soil pH. If you have more positively charged minerals (like Ca++) in your water they will drive out the H+ ions by outcompeting for ionic bonding surfaces, which are crucial to maintaining soil acidity. I'd get your water tested if I were you or look into a more efficient filter that gets the ppm count to sub-50. you could get a 2nd filter to filter your filtered water to extend the life of a better filter.
Click to expand...
Sorry yeah per litre...wow sub 50ppm i have never seen..i have a semi pro brita filter under my tap...but never such a low number..they want 150 euros for the water test..bit steep..thanks
 
ShLUbY

ShLUbY

Well-Known Member
Zefito said:
Sorry yeah per litre...wow sub 50ppm i have never seen..i have a semi pro brita filter under my tap...but never such a low number..they want 150 euros for the water test..bit steep..thanks
Click to expand...
reverse osmosis filters are cheap nowadays. you can get a decent filter set up for 150$ US. that'll get your ppm to <10.

well your medium pH definitely seems too high based on your runoff. so i would bet good money that that's the issue you need to solve. it's not the nutes, it's likely your water source. having pH that high affects important available nutrients like iron and potassium. Iron is very insoluble at pH above 7, and iron is key to having green healthy plants.
 
Z

Zefito

Well-Known Member
ShLUbY said:
reverse osmosis filters are cheap nowadays. you can get a decent filter set up for 150$ US. that'll get your ppm to <10.

well your medium pH definitely seems too high based on your runoff. so i would bet good money that that's the issue you need to solve. it's not the nutes, it's likely your water source. having pH that high affects important available nutrients like iron and potassium. Iron is very insoluble at pH above 7, and iron is key to having green healthy plants.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the info..unfortunately here in Europe the cheapest RO is around 300-400 euros.The municipality water here is from a desalination plant so, my guess it is RO, but with the old piping ppm varies today 300ppm.
The base soil is supposed to regulate the PH levels here is the site http://www.biobizz.com/products/#all-mix
thanks again
 
ShLUbY

ShLUbY

Well-Known Member
Zefito said:
Thanks for the info..unfortunately here in Europe the cheapest RO is around 300-400 euros.The municipality water here is from a desalination plant so, my guess it is RO, but with the old piping ppm varies today 300ppm.
The base soil is supposed to regulate the PH levels here is the site http://www.biobizz.com/products/#all-mix
thanks again
Click to expand...
yeah but if the water supply is not great, then it can only regulate so much before its buffering capabilities wear out. i didn't realize the cistern water was rain water... and that's coming in at 150ppm?? that seems high for rain. rain should be like less than 10ppm
 
polishpollack

polishpollack

Well-Known Member
This could be over ferting if you're doing that every watering. Does that soil have fert in it already? If so you might be over doing the fert and it looks like you are with dying leaf tips. This is just my opinion now. I could be wrong. Can you get pics in white light as it looks like that might be sodium.
 
Z

Zefito

Well-Known Member
ShLUbY said:
yeah but if the water supply is not great, then it can only regulate so much before its buffering capabilities wear out. i didn't realize the cistern water was rain water... and that's coming in at 150ppm?? that seems high for rain. rain should be like less than 10ppm
Click to expand...
yeah i know my tds meter is no state of the art just a chep one...i can't re-calibrate so maybe accuracy is questionable?
 
ShLUbY

ShLUbY

Well-Known Member
Definitely not over fertilizing. She’s consuming herself from the bottom up. Light green color indicates Fe and Mg are unavailable, N is not being uptaken (lower big fan leaves bright yellow and necrotic). But with a soil pH of >7, it doesn’t matter how much you feed it, it’s still not going to get fed.

So you have to figure out this water thing. TDS meters are super cheap. Go buy another one and compare it to the one you have. If the reading is correct, then your cistern is A) dirty as hell and needs cleaned or B) you have very poor air quality in your region (highly unlikely it’s that poor).

Now regarding your soil pH... if it’s supposed to adjust itself, it’s definitely not doing it. I do have a question for you though. Since this is “all mix”, an amended soil mix, how long do you wait before you start using bottled nutrients? This should be a water only soil for the first couple weeks. But the pH should still not be so far out of whack. Honestly your soil pH is your biggest problem at this point as far as I can tell.
 
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Z

Zefito

Well-Known Member
ShLUbY said:
Definitely not over fertilizing. She’s consuming herself from the bottom up. Light green color indicates Fe and Mg are unavailable, N is not being uptaken (lower big fan leaves bright yellow and necrotic). But with a soil pH of >7, it doesn’t matter how much you feed it, it’s still not going to get fed.

So you have to figure out this water thing. TDS meters are super cheap. Go buy another one and compare it to the one you have. If the reading is correct, then your cistern is A) dirty as hell and needs cleaned or B) you have very poor air quality in your region (highly unlikely it’s that poor).

Now regarding your soil pH... if it’s supposed to adjust itself, it’s definitely not doing it. I do have a question for you though. Since this is “all mix”, an amended soil mix, how long do you wait before you start using bottled nutrients? This should be a water only soil for the first couple weeks. But the pH should still not be so far out of whack. Honestly your soil pH is your biggest problem at this point as far as I can tell.
Click to expand...
Ok will buy an new TDS meter...I decided to switch to cistern water cause was worried the tap water was too hard..i have to say the cystern is closed off and water is abit on the cloudy side.

With my previous grows and same soil have adjusted the ph with vinegar and had similar results.

I use the companys biobizz fertilizers about two weeks after trasplant into final pot.

I mean i only have 150 watt so i was expecting less feed for the plant.

Thank a million
 
ShLUbY

ShLUbY

Well-Known Member
Zefito said:
Ok will buy an new TDS meter...I decided to switch to cistern water cause was worried the tap water was too hard..i have to say the cystern is closed off and water is abit on the cloudy side.

With my previous grows and same soil have adjusted the ph with vinegar and had similar results.

I use the companys biobizz fertilizers about two weeks after trasplant into final pot.

I mean i only have 150 watt so i was expecting less feed for the plant.

Thank a million
Click to expand...
yeah clean that cistern or look into ways of filtering your tap water. after you clean the cistern, hook up an air pump to it to keep the water aerobic. that way it will have a harder time getting funky. an aquarium air pump is pretty cheap, and just get an air stone to diffuse the air into the water.

other than the water, I just don't understand why your medium is so alkaline. but you have to resolve that issue or you're going to keep seeing the same results over and over. if you keep seeing problems, i would start to source a different medium. a peat based mix, like promix, with some extra drainage and about a 1/4cup of dolomite lime per 7.5gal does a good job at maintaining the right pH. the peat is acidic, and the lime will help keep it from dropping too low.

the problem with the biobizz link is that they don't actually tell you what's in the soil mix, so i can't get a good idea of why your mix is so alkaline other than a poor water source.

your pH going in is 6-6.5, and the runoff is 7.5... that means your soil is actually higher than 7.5 which is waaaaayy too high. anything near or above 7 is going to highly limit solubility of certain key minerals. that's why you keep seeing starving plants even though you're feeding them.
 
Z

Zefito

Well-Known Member
ShLUbY said:
yeah clean that cistern or look into ways of filtering your tap water. after you clean the cistern, hook up an air pump to it to keep the water aerobic. that way it will have a harder time getting funky. an aquarium air pump is pretty cheap, and just get an air stone to diffuse the air into the water.

other than the water, I just don't understand why your medium is so alkaline. but you have to resolve that issue or you're going to keep seeing the same results over and over. if you keep seeing problems, i would start to source a different medium. a peat based mix, like promix, with some extra drainage and about a 1/4cup of dolomite lime per 7.5gal does a good job at maintaining the right pH. the peat is acidic, and the lime will help keep it from dropping too low.

the problem with the biobizz link is that they don't actually tell you what's in the soil mix, so i can't get a good idea of why your mix is so alkaline other than a poor water source.

your pH going in is 6-6.5, and the runoff is 7.5... that means your soil is actually higher than 7.5 which is waaaaayy too high. anything near or above 7 is going to highly limit solubility of certain key minerals. that's why you keep seeing starving plants even though you're feeding them.
Click to expand...


Ok it would be hard to clean the cistern, since im renting .I’m not conviced that the water is to blame.I have this filter in the mail, will it help?

https://www.brita.co.uk/purity-c1000-ac#to-productdetails

I’ve never have used any type of soil, just the light mix and the all mix so my next grow i will be using this,im scraping the bio bizz

http://www.canna-uk.com/terra_professional_plus

what do you think ?, i would like not to buy additons if possible as neebie have bought lots of things i dont need.

The runoff does fluctioate due to microbial activity ,that is the biobizz company claim...smells like bullshitJ

Cheers
 
Z

Zefito

Well-Known Member
So it seems the organic route is demanding for the newbie, should i scrap the lot and start with some mineral nutes and the terra canna soil,Yes?
 
MyFloridaGreen360

MyFloridaGreen360

Member
better believe it did that excessively water would run in with nutes at 6.5ph and spillover around 7-7.5 with same results.Biobizz ought to settle the ph to around 6,5 or they don't..im running with canna next..im not persuaded
 
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