Wholesale cannabis prices hit historic lows in January

since1991

Well-Known Member
While the pain for the average person has been growing for decades, the sheeple have shown a remarkable tolerance for pain over time, much of which, imo, is because the powers that be have kept them supplied with enough diversions (sports, soaps and reality TV), legal drugs to dull said pain (BEER, liquor, anti-depressants and sleeping pills) along with a healthy dose of brain-washing (Fox News, conservative talk radio and more recently all the bullshit online, conservative, fake news sites like Breitbart and Drudge).

The majority have been so well-controlled that, like the story of the frog placed in a pot of water and slowly boiled to death, they haven't realized what's happening, or have been made so cynical and apathetic that they don't believe they can do anything about it. But the pain is beginning to get to a level that is getting their attention, I think, and hopefully the pendulum will finally start to swing the other way. And the rich had better realize this, that for their own survival it is better to tax the rich than have to eat them, lol.

And btw, before any conservatives start frothing at the mouth ranting about the typical libtard bullshit let me explain one way of looking at it.

Between the two "camps" you have:

Conservatives and Libertarians largely believe that all the systems financial problems are created by big government stealing money from hard-working Americans in order to redistribute wealth to the lazy, poor, moocher-class who are happy to exist simply as leaches on society (because they live sooo comfortably at the poverty level ;?).
And their solution is to give more tax breaks to the wealthy and benevolent corporations so that they will run out and spend that money creating jobs (where no demand exists) which will create more products which people (who don't have any more money to spend) will buy and THAT grows the economy. Meanwhile the poor, the disabled, the physically/mentally handicapped, the single mom's, the elderly and all the rest of the moocher class will be forced to get jobs and stop leaching off society so the government will be able to cut entitlements and give more tax cuts, etc.
Their core beliefs are that we are a nation of strong independent, hardworking people, that we're the best in the world at everything we do. They also believe that there is plenty of opportunity for anyone willing to work hard enough for it, which conversely means that while some in need may be deserving of financial help, the majority of poor are poor simply due to their unwillingness to work hard enough (ergo lazy), and that poverty, for the most part, is a condition that you most likely deserve.

Btw, I've always found conservatives attitudes towards the poor to be hypocritical considering how they also boast so loudly about their strong Christian beliefs. I believe Christ did admonish his followers quite frequently that they are their brothers keeper, that their concern should INDEED be for the welfare of their poorer brethren, and that any who turned a blind eye to the plight of the poor would not enter the gates of heaven. Amazingly unChristian-like attitude, lol.

* * * * * * *

Liberals and Independents for the most part, have a more complex view of the problems, and do not tend to believe that big government is the problem in and of itself, but do want government to spend taxpayer's money wisely and not waste it. They understand that a nation as large and complex as ours (which in NO WAY resembles the America of the 50s and 60's and never will again) NEEDS a strong central government, but not an invasive one (perhaps an oxymoron).
As such they understand, as apparently MOST other highly developed nations do, that while higher taxes are a necessary evil, that money must be spent in ways that DIRECTLY BENEFIT THE PEOPLE and NOT to give away or shrink the National Budget by handing out welfare to corporations and the rich! Nor should it be spent on bloated government waste, excessive military spending or exorbitant salaries and perks (i.e. free first class travel, platinum healthcare and outrageous retirement salaries) for elected officials.
That means that corporations MUST be fairly taxed because they depend absolutely on the infrastructure that is built and maintained at taxpayers expense. And FAIRLY may indeed mean lower corporate tax rates, BUT with zero loopholes to avoid said taxes. Same for the rich - know what the tax rate for the top 1% was in the 1940's? It was NINETY PERCENT (on income over $200k or the modern equivalent of $2MM), but now due to all the tax cuts for the wealthy, they are paying less taxes than ever before (save for a period under Reagan)!!
Yet between them and us, the shrinking middle class, who THE FUCK and better afford to pay more taxes??? Sure ain't me, and millionaires and billionaires aren't going to disappear if their taxes were returned to say the 50% level (remember Reagan started this mess by cutting top tax rates from 70% to 28%) AND invented VOODOO ECONOMICS, otherwise known as trickle-down theory of giving huge tax breaks to the rich in order to stimulate the economy, which instead massively ballooned the national debt (btw which Bush Jr. tried and failed and as the Idiot in Chief Trump is trying AGAIN, and doomed to fail as well).
And today the government needs more not less money, in order to sustain our growing/crumbling infrastructure (bridges, road, power grid, telecommunications and a thousand others important items) and YES to maintain an adequate system to protect the poor and elderly so that they are not forced to live in poverty, forced to choose between food or medication or DIE because they couldn't afford health care.
This is actually a core belief for a majority in this country when asked about these questions, that as a nation of compassionate and caring people, we believe that the RICHEST COUNTRY ON EARTH should not allow it's citizens to suffer needlessly. That's why we did away with things like poor houses and debtors prisons, because we as a whole understand that financial hardship can befall ANY ONE OF US, and that we will stand together and help those in need.
Of course liberals and independents are not blind to the fact that money gets wasted even in these programs, there's ALWAYS those who will game the system and look for a free ride at taxpayers expense, but the answer is to find ways TO IMPROVE these programs, not cut or destroy them and throwing the proverbial baby out with the bath water. Millions of Americans should not be punished and forced to live in desperate poverty simply because 10% of them do so fraudulently.

* * * * * * * *

Bottom line - we all know that corporations are NOT benevolent powerful entities who have our best interests at heart. We've all seen countless examples that their one and only concern is $$$. That is their God, their sole driving priority, and if people get crushed under the heel of progress, that's just the cost of doing business. So WHO are you going to trust - those who the biggest and wealthiest corporations on Earth openly support, or those who are fighting for the rights and benefit of the average person??? Flawed as some of their ideas may be, certainly with room for improvement, the underlying idea of compassion and fairness for all, as opposed to the harsh conservative ideals of economic Darwinism, i.e. to those deserving goes everything, and to those undeserving nothing.

Well I could continue this rant, lol, but it's a waste of breath. Those who get it do, and those that don't are simply brain-washed tools of the rich and powerful, in my opinion, lol.
Damn. Preach it bro. Preach it. Iam with you 100%
 

Sour Wreck

Well-Known Member
While the pain for the average person has been growing for decades, the sheeple have shown a remarkable tolerance for pain over time, much of which, imo, is because the powers that be have kept them supplied with enough diversions (sports, soaps and reality TV), legal drugs to dull said pain (BEER, liquor, anti-depressants and sleeping pills) along with a healthy dose of brain-washing (Fox News, conservative talk radio and more recently all the bullshit online, conservative, fake news sites like Breitbart and Drudge).

The majority have been so well-controlled that, like the story of the frog placed in a pot of water and slowly boiled to death, they haven't realized what's happening, or have been made so cynical and apathetic that they don't believe they can do anything about it. But the pain is beginning to get to a level that is getting their attention, I think, and hopefully the pendulum will finally start to swing the other way. And the rich had better realize this, that for their own survival it is better to tax the rich than have to eat them, lol.

And btw, before any conservatives start frothing at the mouth ranting about the typical libtard bullshit let me explain one way of looking at it.

Between the two "camps" you have:

Conservatives and Libertarians largely believe that all the systems financial problems are created by big government stealing money from hard-working Americans in order to redistribute wealth to the lazy, poor, moocher-class who are happy to exist simply as leaches on society (because they live sooo comfortably at the poverty level ;?).
And their solution is to give more tax breaks to the wealthy and benevolent corporations so that they will run out and spend that money creating jobs (where no demand exists) which will create more products which people (who don't have any more money to spend) will buy and THAT grows the economy. Meanwhile the poor, the disabled, the physically/mentally handicapped, the single mom's, the elderly and all the rest of the moocher class will be forced to get jobs and stop leaching off society so the government will be able to cut entitlements and give more tax cuts, etc.
Their core beliefs are that we are a nation of strong independent, hardworking people, that we're the best in the world at everything we do. They also believe that there is plenty of opportunity for anyone willing to work hard enough for it, which conversely means that while some in need may be deserving of financial help, the majority of poor are poor simply due to their unwillingness to work hard enough (ergo lazy), and that poverty, for the most part, is a condition that you most likely deserve.

Btw, I've always found conservatives attitudes towards the poor to be hypocritical considering how they also boast so loudly about their strong Christian beliefs. I believe Christ did admonish his followers quite frequently that they are their brothers keeper, that their concern should INDEED be for the welfare of their poorer brethren, and that any who turned a blind eye to the plight of the poor would not enter the gates of heaven. Amazingly unChristian-like attitude, lol.

* * * * * * *

Liberals and Independents for the most part, have a more complex view of the problems, and do not tend to believe that big government is the problem in and of itself, but do want government to spend taxpayer's money wisely and not waste it. They understand that a nation as large and complex as ours (which in NO WAY resembles the America of the 50s and 60's and never will again) NEEDS a strong central government, but not an invasive one (perhaps an oxymoron).
As such they understand, as apparently MOST other highly developed nations do, that while higher taxes are a necessary evil, that money must be spent in ways that DIRECTLY BENEFIT THE PEOPLE and NOT to give away or shrink the National Budget by handing out welfare to corporations and the rich! Nor should it be spent on bloated government waste, excessive military spending or exorbitant salaries and perks (i.e. free first class travel, platinum healthcare and outrageous retirement salaries) for elected officials.
That means that corporations MUST be fairly taxed because they depend absolutely on the infrastructure that is built and maintained at taxpayers expense. And FAIRLY may indeed mean lower corporate tax rates, BUT with zero loopholes to avoid said taxes. Same for the rich - know what the tax rate for the top 1% was in the 1940's? It was NINETY PERCENT (on income over $200k or the modern equivalent of $2MM), but now due to all the tax cuts for the wealthy, they are paying less taxes than ever before (save for a period under Reagan)!!
Yet between them and us, the shrinking middle class, who THE FUCK and better afford to pay more taxes??? Sure ain't me, and millionaires and billionaires aren't going to disappear if their taxes were returned to say the 50% level (remember Reagan started this mess by cutting top tax rates from 70% to 28%) AND invented VOODOO ECONOMICS, otherwise known as trickle-down theory of giving huge tax breaks to the rich in order to stimulate the economy, which instead massively ballooned the national debt (btw which Bush Jr. tried and failed and as the Idiot in Chief Trump is trying AGAIN, and doomed to fail as well).
And today the government needs more not less money, in order to sustain our growing/crumbling infrastructure (bridges, road, power grid, telecommunications and a thousand others important items) and YES to maintain an adequate system to protect the poor and elderly so that they are not forced to live in poverty, forced to choose between food or medication or DIE because they couldn't afford health care.
This is actually a core belief for a majority in this country when asked about these questions, that as a nation of compassionate and caring people, we believe that the RICHEST COUNTRY ON EARTH should not allow it's citizens to suffer needlessly. That's why we did away with things like poor houses and debtors prisons, because we as a whole understand that financial hardship can befall ANY ONE OF US, and that we will stand together and help those in need.
Of course liberals and independents are not blind to the fact that money gets wasted even in these programs, there's ALWAYS those who will game the system and look for a free ride at taxpayers expense, but the answer is to find ways TO IMPROVE these programs, not cut or destroy them and throwing the proverbial baby out with the bath water. Millions of Americans should not be punished and forced to live in desperate poverty simply because 10% of them do so fraudulently.

* * * * * * * *

Bottom line - we all know that corporations are NOT benevolent powerful entities who have our best interests at heart. We've all seen countless examples that their one and only concern is $$$. That is their God, their sole driving priority, and if people get crushed under the heel of progress, that's just the cost of doing business. So WHO are you going to trust - those who the biggest and wealthiest corporations on Earth openly support, or those who are fighting for the rights and benefit of the average person??? Flawed as some of their ideas may be, certainly with room for improvement, the underlying idea of compassion and fairness for all, as opposed to the harsh conservative ideals of economic Darwinism, i.e. to those deserving goes everything, and to those undeserving nothing.

Well I could continue this rant, lol, but it's a waste of breath. Those who get it do, and those that don't are simply brain-washed tools of the rich and powerful, in my opinion, lol.

you need to run for office :clap::clap::clap:
 

see4

Well-Known Member
Sorry, but no, most people can't grow their own tobacco to make their own cigarettes, so not an apt analogy. But once legalization is nation-wide in the next ten years (could be a few stubborn hold-outs for longer) anyone WILL be able to grow it, and it could actually become nearly as ubiquitous as tomatoes are in the family garden (although probably more like broccoli, lol).
well, it's all speculation until it actually happens.

people can grow their own tobacco. they choose not to because the alternative is far cheaper. the analogy was not about the growing of, but rather the access to.

i highly doubt marihuana will be as ubiquitous as tomatoes. there is absolutely no evidence to support that theory, and a preponderance to the aforementioned theory that it will be legal, but regulated.

I just picked up an lb of mixed varieties for $900. Half of it indoor the other half top shelf outdoor. 4 different strains. The recreational grow market hasn't even gone through one cycle. By this time next year I'll be paying half that. Why even bother growing it if I can just buy it for a reasonable price?
And this was the point I was trying to make. marijuana prices will fall dramatically but will likely still be regulated.
 

fearnoevil

Well-Known Member
you need to run for office :clap::clap::clap:
Lol, the thought had occasionally crossed my mind, but I know I don't have the temperament for it - when I get emotional during a political debate (as in always ;?) I start to sound like Lewis Black, dropping F-bombs and waving my arms like a madman :cuss::twisted::fire:

Plus I have no patience for ignorance and stupidity, although at least one of which is curable, while the other is a disease that seems to be sweeping the nation like some pandemic. For that I blame the marvels of modern medicine, which unfortunately don't discriminate, and saves stupid people from their own fatal mistakes thus subverting the Darwinian principle of survival of the fittest, lol (which I have no objection to on a biological level :bigjoint:) leading to the dumbing down of human race as a whole. One can only hope that science finds the "stupid gene" and comes up with a gene therapy ASAP, or we're all doomed to live in a real-life version of Idiocracy, lol.
 

fearnoevil

Well-Known Member
well, it's all speculation until it actually happens.

people can grow their own tobacco. they choose not to because the alternative is far cheaper. the analogy was not about the growing of, but rather the access to.

i highly doubt marihuana will be as ubiquitous as tomatoes. there is absolutely no evidence to support that theory, and a preponderance to the aforementioned theory that it will be legal, but regulated.

And this was the point I was trying to make. marijuana prices will fall dramatically but will likely still be regulated.
First point is just silly - you ever actually try and grow and process your own tobacco? It ain't easy and harder to process and age properly, although neither is cannabis, but cigarettes are dirt cheap compared to good bud, so the labor vs reward is not worth it.

Second, once recreational is legal, being able to grow it usually comes with the territory (although somehow Washington state managed to deny folks this right, which makes you wonder what influenced that decision, lol). SOOOO therefore, yes just about anyone who wants will likely be able to grow their own at some point in the not-too-distant future and as long as they stay within legal limits (4-6 plants at a time in most states, waaayy more than any but the heaviest smoker could consume).

That's what I meant by as "ubiquitous as tomatoes" because if you want to grow it you will be able to. That said, because it IS harder to grow really primo bud, many will try and fail, so those folks will either get it from friends who do grow or buy it from the nearest dispensary, or liquor store or maybe even the local farmers market.

But just like we probably all know someone with a green thumb who grows more veggies than they need, so too will the vast majority of smokers and that might keep a kind of semi-black or gray market going - if I didn't grow I know I'd much prefer to get mine from a trusted friend, and fresh too as opposed to processed by big agro-growers. But if the big commercial companies do come into the market, there just won't be room for the majority of small growers to make any kind of a living on at all, so much for my retirement plans, sigh :sad::cuss::wall:

Ultimately I don't have a crystal ball, things could take a different turn, might be some uber-conservative backlash that might slow legalization down, but in the end I don't see those forces winning out over plain old-fashioned greed, and I think your problem is that you're just not looking far enough down the road.
 
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see4

Well-Known Member
I dont agree with rules and regs on weed, if you support that were two different kinds of stoners with two different beliefs...
i certainly don't agree with regulating a plant. but getting it off schedule 1, first step will likely be regulation.

nobody really knows whats going to happen in the near future for regulation of marijuana or the completely unilateral legalization thereof, making as ubiquitous as tomatoes. everything that anyone says about it right now is just conjecture and speculation.

im just stating an opinion, an educated guess as to what the likely outcome will be in the near future, my personal opinion of the matter is moot.
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
i certainly don't agree with regulating a plant. but getting it off schedule 1, first step will likely be regulation.

nobody really knows whats going to happen in the near future for regulation of marijuana or the completely unilateral legalization thereof, making as ubiquitous as tomatoes. everything that anyone says about it right now is just conjecture and speculation.

im just stating an opinion, an educated guess as to what the likely outcome will be in the near future, my personal opinion of the matter is moot.
You mention a very valid point with it being a schedule one drug, these were your reasons for legalization and not legalization itself.

So why didnt you just relax your weed laws like in the UK and not a whole load of rules and regs bs.

I get caught with a roomfull here and ill get a fine possibly community service at worst, this feels much better than legal states, no price drop, no big companies, no worries and most importantly no plant count.

Id put it to you lot that you went down the complete wrong path and hence all the problems, also you killed a lot of growers like me off over there, no way i could live by them laws.
 

Sour Wreck

Well-Known Member
Lol, the thought had occasionally crossed my mind, but I know I don't have the temperament for it - when I get emotional during a political debate (as in always ;?) I start to sound like Lewis Black, dropping F-bombs and waving my arms like a madman :cuss::twisted::fire:

Plus I have no patience for ignorance and stupidity, although at least one of which is curable, while the other is a disease that seems to be sweeping the nation like some pandemic. For that I blame the marvels of modern medicine, which unfortunately don't discriminate, and saves stupid people from their own fatal mistakes thus subverting the Darwinian principle of survival of the fittest, lol (which I have no objection to on a biological level :bigjoint:) leading to the dumbing down of human race as a whole. One can only hope that science finds the "stupid gene" and comes up with a gene therapy ASAP, or we're all doomed to live in a real-life version of Idiocracy, lol.
well said. while i used to enjoy a good debate and brought logic and facts into it, these days debating repubs is like pulling teeth. i am right there with you. i can't stand those a-holes so badly today, f-bombs become every other word in my vocabulary, including talk of mothers and cocksuckers.:cuss::cuss::cuss:
 

Sour Wreck

Well-Known Member
Id put it to you lot that you went down the complete wrong path and hence all the problems, also you killed a lot of growers like me off over there, no way i could live by them laws.

lol, so you are blame american weed growers for your problems? am i understanding?
 

since1991

Well-Known Member
You mention a very valid point with it being a schedule one drug, these were your reasons for legalization and not legalization itself.

So why didnt you just relax your weed laws like in the UK and not a whole load of rules and regs bs.

I get caught with a roomfull here and ill get a fine possibly community service at worst, this feels much better than legal states, no price drop, no big companies, no worries and most importantly no plant count.

Id put it to you lot that you went down the complete wrong path and hence all the problems, also you killed a lot of growers like me off over there, no way i could live by them laws.
It was always there in the back of my mind...but the law was the least of my worries growing dope for a long time. I knew I could go to prison all them years ago....I did it anyways. Fuk em was and still is my attitude. I wouldnt be where Iam today (not much but proud) if I let the law scare my cannabis greethumb away decades ago. Helluva ride. One helluva ride.
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
lol, so you are blame american weed growers for your problems? am i understanding?
No i blame those that think legalization helped to produce the climate of free weed that we all use to support when in fact it just put more rules and regs on it.

Rules and regs are anti cannabis, we been preaching this for decades but all of a sudden you sell out and glorify your small plant count and legal status, pitifull.
 

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
It was always there in the back of my mind...but the law was the least of my worries growing dope for a long time. I knew I could go to prison all them years ago....I did it anyways. Fuk em was and still is my attitude. I wouldnt be where Iam today (not much but proud) if I let the law scare my cannabis greethumb away decades ago. Helluva ride. One helluva ride.
Yer i did it too, fuck the law. Apparently thats too scary for most now and they love being law aboding plant count growers....

How times and fickle people change...
 

Gorillaglue4u

Well-Known Member
1300 for a pound? Shit who's sending me them prices? Around my parts they still going for 3 bands. 1700 profit every flip I'll stop growing and sell your stuff
 

MichiganMedGrower

Well-Known Member
Yer i did it too, fuck the law. Apparently thats too scary for most now and they love being law aboding plant count growers....

How times and fickle people change...

So you think being an illegal cash cropper is somehow better for weed than having a legal medical grow? We tend to grow better, cleaner weed in low counts. I have never even needed to use a pesticide yet.

And I dealt with big Growers for decades and most of the weed has contained chemicles and poisons for many years. Regulations are actually cleaning it up chemical product wise.

You are casting an opinion that I feel should be about legal cash crops. Those are the downfall of quality and only exist for profit.
 

since1991

Well-Known Member
No i blame those that think legalization helped to produce the climate of free weed that we all use to support when in fact it just put more rules and regs on it.

Rules and regs are anti cannabis, we been preaching this for decades but all of a sudden you sell out and glorify your small plant count and legal status, pitifull.
Good point
 

since1991

Well-Known Member
So you think being an illegal cash cropper is somehow better for weed than having a legal medical grow? We tend to grow better, cleaner weed in low counts. I have never even needed to use a pesticide yet.

And I dealt with big Growers for decades and most of the weed has contained chemicles and poisons for many years. Regulations are actually cleaning it up chemical product wise.

You are casting an opinion that I feel should be about legal cash crops. Those are the downfall of quality and only exist for profit.
Alls I know is if the cannabis plant had a voice and could speak..it would tell us to keep money away from it as far as possible. Whether good or bad...the money we involve into this plant has done nothing but harm. Iam one to talk..as I do this for profit but the righteous thing to do is completely take it off the books and let it grow like the scrubby little plant it always was. No rules. No regulation. None of it. The whole reason we have prohibition..rules.. quasi legality..is because we have been placing a monetary value on this plant. Its ths whole reason there is a problem to begin with. The plant will do just fine...even better...without the money.
 

Ryante55

Well-Known Member
Black market prices will jump back up. the taxes on bud are ridiculous and all the "top shelf" is mids at best at least thats the case in the bay area. All the good growers aren't legal anymore haha
 
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