Whats causing these white marks and tiny holes?

Hi,

Would appreciate if a experienced grower would know what it is thats causing the issue prevalent on my plant. One of the pictures with very lights marks was from when plant was 1 week from seedling and I first noticed. Pictures where its more obvious is is 3-4 days from then and 10 days from seedling.

Its a indoor grow with a 138w LED light kept at 30cm away
fabric pot with biobizz all mix fresh from the bag
No other nutes added to date
watered with mineral water that is about 7.5ph since seedling
soil allowed to dry in-between waterings
light fan breeze on plant
smart co2 bag used in sealed grow room

Thanks!

If you're in soil, u want your ph to be around ph6.5. Ph7.5 is too high n most likely locking something out.

As above. Small white/yellow dots looks like thrip damage. Ph 6.5 for soilless mix

You got mites! Bummer. Lower the temperature if you can- slows them down a little. Part of the problem is some strains of mites are becoming resistant to some sprays. I was lucky and a pyrethrum spray took care of my one infestation mites. Even so the harvest was about 1/2 of what I usually get.

DO NOT PUT OFF FOR EVEN ONE DAY, KILLING THOSE LITTLE MF'ERS! They breed like crazy, and suck the life out of your plants amazingly fast! :cursing: I am pretty easy-going, live and let live....but I make a few exception here and there. Spider mites, fleas, mosquitoes and rattlesnakes are on the exceptions list.

Fyi soil less is not 6.5, 6.5 is for soil, soil less is 5.5 I use 5.8 myself. Yes they look like mites and you got a bad case of them, like Lewist says, get rid of them now, the mites Lewist is talking about is the 2 spotted mites they build up a resistance if you don't get rid of them fast, just had a bout of the bastards took over a month to get rid of them, to verify take a magnifying glass - a jeweler's loop would be best but it looks as if you won't have a problem seeing them with the amount of mites you'd have now, take outside and blast those bastards with compressed air, get some captain jacks dead bug it's organic and won't hurt anything, spray (looks as if yours are small enough to make a batch and dunk the plants in the solution) do this every 3 days as 2 spotted mites hatch in 3 days. Captain jacks is only good for 24 hours being premixed so only make up the amount to use in 1 application. Hope this might help and good luck

The OP said he was using biobizz all mix. Its soil. Ph to 6.5. Personally, it looks like lockout from your ph being off. Possibly mites too, check under the leaves (check a bunch of the leaves all over the plant) for really really really tiny black dots that u might even be able to see moving. Get a 30x jewelers loupe or at least a magnifier n check. Also, 30cm is about a 12 inches, id move the light back to 41cm or 16 inches. Just to ease up on the intensity until u get everything back under control.

mites all the way.
1 tsp neem oil/gal, drop of dish soap. spray the leaves with that. make sure you get under ALL the leaves as well as the bottom of the stock. maybe the rim of the pot too, just around the general area of where you're growing.

For spider mites use 2 tsp neem oil, 1/2 tsp dish soap, 1 liter warm water. Shake well while using. Spray both sides of leaves and soil every 3 days for 9 days. This disrupts their cycle. Mites gone!!!

many helpful replies here. everyone of them much appreciated.

I have ordered some neem oil from neemteam and will commence spraying, probably on a 1-2day basis and see if it helps. However I must say I have not seen any mites of any kind or any movement anywhere on the leaves no matter how hard I look. don't have a magnifying glass so will order a jewelers loop in the mean time. however the formation of most of the damaged area is quite uniform and im thinking it may be ph imbalance or maybe light intensity perhaps as it is a small space of 30cm by 30 cm and about 150cm tall and its sealed during 6 hours darkness and also sealed for for the first couple of hours after and just before lights out. New grown leaves seem to be looking healthy at first and then slowly take on a faint discoloration in the same formation as the older damaged ones albeit some random holes here and there which may. suggest some kind of mites. also the older the leaves get the more brittle and crispy feeling they seem to be getting while the newer growth is the normal feel but overtime becoming discolored just like in the pics and brittle I didn't realize growing a plant in a confined space could become so troublesome :-s.

A 60-100x loupe is nice to have, you might want to identify the type of infestation.

Spider mite damage (smaller mottling followed by fine webbing that can be seen after misting under the light)


Thrip damage (bigger, random mottling and holes on & near the damaged areas)

Bummer, fingers crossed you win this battle.

Bio bizz is a soilless mix, i.e. It's man made and not dirt thrown in a bag , it's moss ,perlite ,wood chips etc. The ph in this and soil is 6.5.ideal range. Bag ph is usually around 6.3 from what I remember , definitely I don't recommend phing like coco or hydro at 5.8 but if it works for you great.

PopTop said:

Fyi soil less is not 6.5, 6.5 is for soil, soil less is 5.5 I use 5.8 myself. Yes they look like mites and you got a bad case of them, like Lewist says, get rid of them now, the mites Lewist is talking about is the 2 spotted mites they build up a resistance if you don't get rid of them fast, just had a bout of the bastards took over a month to get rid of them, to verify take a magnifying glass - a jeweler's loop would be best but it looks as if you won't have a problem seeing them with the amount of mites you'd have now, take outside and blast those bastards with compressed air, get some captain jacks dead bug it's organic and won't hurt anything, spray (looks as if yours are small enough to make a batch and dunk the plants in the solution) do this every 3 days as 2 spotted mites hatch in 3 days. Captain jacks is only good for 24 hours being premixed so only make up the amount to use in 1 application. Hope this might help and good luck

Click to expand...

ive checked the plants as closely as possible with a 10x magnifying glass and I cannot see tiny black spots or anything else move around. if it is mites the thrips damage looks the nearest to that ive got and looking online it says the smallest variety is .6mm. surely should I not be able to see them at that size or am I mistaken?

SPLFreak808 said:

A 60-100x loupe is nice to have, you might want to identify the type of infestation.

Spider mite damage (smaller mottling followed by fine webbing that can be seen after misting under the light)
View attachment 4142082 View attachment 4142080

Thrip damage (bigger, random mottling and holes on & near the damaged areas)
View attachment 4142076 View attachment 4142077 View attachment 4142079

Click to expand...

^imo, this is what you got going on, treat your plants ASAP
-best wishes!

JP1 said:

Hi,

Would appreciate if a experienced grower would know what it is thats causing the issue prevalent on my plant. One of the pictures with very lights marks was from when plant was 1 week from seedling and I first noticed. Pictures where its more obvious is is 3-4 days from then and 10 days from seedling.

Its a indoor grow with a 138w LED light kept at 30cm away
fabric pot with biobizz all mix fresh from the bag
No other nutes added to date
watered with mineral water that is about 7.5ph since seedling
soil allowed to dry in-between waterings
light fan breeze on plant
smart co2 bag used in sealed grow room

Thanks!
View attachment 4140729 View attachment 4140730 View attachment 4140731 View attachment 4140732

Click to expand...

tell ya right now that's not mites no way mites do damage that quick.no way in 10 days. lock out of some sort or lack of something

thumper60 said:

tell ya right now that's not mites no way mites do damage that quick.no way in 10 days. lock out of some sort or lack of something

Click to expand...

..plus he swears he isn't finding anything and he's gone over it well? You might be right ? Is bio bizz Coco?

well ive ordered a 60-120x loupe. should be here tomorrow and will give it one more final look over in super zoom mode to see if I see any microscopic sized critters lurking around. regardless ive got neem spray on the way too. if no avail I guess I will have to pay more attention to keep the ph spot on and will also try moving the lights up more but will need to wait for day off as it will take some fair DIY'ing to get the actual fixture from where it hangs moved up. update to follow I guess for now...

JP1 said:

well ive ordered a 60-120x loupe. should be here tomorrow and will give it one more final look over in super zoom mode to see if I see any microscopic sized critters lurking around. regardless ive got neem spray on the way too. if no avail I guess I will have to pay more attention to keep the ph spot on and will also try moving the lights up more but will need to wait for day off as it will take some fair DIY'ing to get the actual fixture from where it hangs moved up. update to follow I guess for now...

Click to expand...

Sounds like the perfect plan forward, taking those steps to me.
Whatever the problem is, even if you dont find it. Taking those steps should fix it

JP1 said:

well ive ordered a 60-120x loupe. should be here tomorrow and will give it one more final look over in super zoom mode to see if I see any microscopic sized critters lurking around. regardless ive got neem spray on the way too. if no avail I guess I will have to pay more attention to keep the ph spot on and will also try moving the lights up more but will need to wait for day off as it will take some fair DIY'ing to get the actual fixture from where it hangs moved up. update to follow I guess for now...

Click to expand...

Look forward to the update. I don't think it's mites or thrips. The damage in the 1st picture looks like early chlorosis between the veins similar to the damage in the older leaves in the second picture but not as advanced.
Good Luck!

after investigating and scrutinising the plant with a 60x-120x microscope there are no mites of any sort to be seen... unless Im seriously blind. following on i've kept a much better consistency with ph levels at 6.2-6.4 and started feeding some nutes, less than advised on bottles. I have noticed a little bit of tip end burn here and there since first nutes feed so will be drawing that back for a week or two but on the other hand the newer leaves are showing much less if barely any of those gastly white markings any more. the affected ones from earlier growth have much become worse and a couple leaves died but the plant itself is continuing to grow and after abit of LST is growing bushy and healthy once again. So conclusion to initial pictures of defect was too high ph for any future reference if any one is reading this and experiencing similar issues.