Too early for fertilizer? Is this yellowing from too little N? Time for P?

burjzyntski

Well-Known Member
Okay, so I've had my plant on strictly organic nutrients (compost supplements) so far, but this yellowing isn't going away and I have two fertilizer options available without buying anything new.

I've got a 15-35-10 that I thought would be good for the P addition, but I've also got an 18-10-16 that I thought might help with the yellowing leaves.

She's reached the first stages of flowering so I don't know which fertilizer I should use for her first time...
 

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Wow, that plant is flowering already? Sure looks young. I'd give it a half dose of the higher N fert, myself. But you may not want to listen to me, I fucked up even though I knew it was gonna happen.
 
How did you fuck up? Was it by adding too much of the wrong fert at early flowering?

I just read up on a page with some disorders+solutions, and it hinted that I might have a Mg deficiency, so I took about 1/9th of a tablespoon of epsom salt, mixed it with another teaspoon of water, added only 5 of those little fertilizer ball things (of the 18-10-16 fert, much less than recommended) to the epsom salt+water mix, and added it around the base of my plant. The skies tell me it is going to rain in about an hour, so this will all be even more diluted.

I thought I'd take it slow at first and see what happens.
I don't want to fuck up my only plant :-/

(oh, and Seamaiden, I read one of your threads about LST yesterday and tied my girl down today. Just slightly bent, but hopefully enough to add some more light to the pre-bud sites. So I'm anxious to see how this all turns out :D )
 
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to be honest that plant looks pretty bad. you for sure have a nit. deficiency. and the plant does look a bit lanky to me, althought it looks to be a sativa which could account a bit for that. either way it cold probably use a better spot with more light.

how old is it? it does look like ist goin into flower by one of those pics, which is odd for so early in the year. the pot is also a bit small for an outdoor plant that girl will need root room.

im not tryin to bomb on your grow, just giving my input.

either of those ferts will help, id go with the latter for a few feedings as its higher in nit. then switch to the other one.
 
Erys, don't you think the leaf lobes (individual lobes) are kinda fat for a Sativa? That's one of the phenotype markers I've been using to separate the different plants grown from my bagseed. Leaf shape, density, and node spacing.
How did you fuck up? Was it by adding too much of the wrong fert at early flowering?
All my plants were showing N deficiency, I'd spent a few days studying this and other plant species just to be sure. So, I had begun a regiment of ferts (we're well into veg, outdoor growing under the sun, but in pots), and it was progressing. So, one evening, I gave it about 50% more fert than was recommended, partly because I felt that daily fertilization meant way too much water and I hate overwatering. Well, that did it, even though it was fish emulsion I pretty much nuked the poor things. I have a thread about it, with sad pix an' ever'thang. :roll: (Dead and Dying is in the title)
(oh, and Seamaiden, I read one of your threads about LST yesterday and tied my girl down today. Just slightly bent, but hopefully enough to add some more light to the pre-bud sites. So I'm anxious to see how this all turns out :D )
Yes it will! And the plant WILL push everything up to equalize. But, it's not a good idea to LST green stalks planted in dirt. sheesh.

News said there was a slight chance of rain in the Sierra, but I don't think we're getting any in this neck. Sure would be nice, though, it's warm.
 
My plant is in a spot that definitely gets plenty of light, but I do know that it needs a bigger pot. I plan on transplanting tomorrow.

I'm not sure exactly how old she is, but somewhere around 3-4 months. I know, she definitely looks lanky, but that is in part because a lot of the lower leaves turned yellow and I removed them, hoping it would help the plant survive, and partly because, as you said, it is in the nature of Sativa.

So the 18-10-16 would be better to start off with, even at this point?
Would it be better to transplant before the rain? (supposed 80% chance tomorrow during the day)

EDIT: When I add this fertilizer, it says to mix 2tsp / gal, and I want to start at half that, so 1tsp / gal...but should I only water it ~1/8gal - 1/4gal? ...not the entire gallon, correct?
 
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Personally, yes, I would go with the food that's got that higher nitrogen content. The plant needs 5-7 hours of direct sunlight per day. Mine are only getting afternoon light, and they're not doing too badly as far as leaf density. I would love to give them full sun all day, but, I have neighbors.

At this point, I would just start with, say, a quart at most. Definitely not the entire gallon. Since it's better to mix it up as you need it, then... (brain gears working on calculations and figuring...)
1t/gal = 1/4t/quart. Yep, a quarter teaspoon per quart to start. :) WhatEVER you do, don't do what I did and think that bumping it up 50% past the recommended dosage won't hurt.
 
i was thinkin sativa cuz some of the top leaves look pretty long and thin to me, the lower leaves to look kinda fat. i dunno. if its over 3 months in that pot its gonna be hella root bound which could have been causing you some grief too.
 
wow...........ummmmmmm.......yeah........first thing i would do is repot into some better soil....maybe some black gold with nitrogen...add about 25% perilite for awesome drainage.....then i would start watering every other day with superthrive and the 18-10-16 at half strength....thats the way i would handle this.....and keep the garbage out of the pot..it will attract bugs...
 
It's all compost in the pot...lettuce/spinach/celery leaves (for N), banana peels/mango bits/peach bits (for P & K)....but yeah, it is attracting bugs...mosquitoes all over the place.

She definitely gets at least 9 hours of sunlight each day.

What's another good aeration ingredient to use besides perlite/rockwool?
I'm trying to keep this cost at $0.00, so things around the house are ideal. I live in a pretty sandy area where small pebbles, gravel, mulch, tree trimmings and leaves are readily available...so all of these mixed together, I would think, would make for some well-draining soil.

She's getting a little too big for where she is right now, so tomorrow's project is...
- mixing new soil (all i have i some leftover manure compost soil + topsoil + jungle potting soil + small rocks on bottom of pot)
- transplanting to larger pot (5gal -vs- 5gal w/drainage holes -vs- 2.5gal)
- moving to nearby location (a few thousand acres to choose from)
 
im not to familliar with organic growing...and i can only give you advice from my own experience....but a bump in nitro and move to a 5 gal with the drainge holes is definatley a good start....do some reaserch on the rocks....i think i read somewhere that they are bad for the ph level....or i might be making that up im not sure:joint::mrgreen:......i would go over to the organics room and ask around in there...ive got a buddy that does a small organic along with his reg op and he is always telling me what a pain in the ass it is..but he says it smokes better......i cant tell the difference...but then again...im not a sophisticated as most:mrgreen::twisted::mrgreen:
 
Damn, I just checked my fert selections again, and I was wrong, it's actually 18-6-12 versus 10-35-15...so which would be best to go with at this stage?

I need a healthy amount of N, P, and K! Is there anything I can do about this? What would be the best route?
 
Right now you're most concerned with Nitrogen. Don't worry so much about phosphorous and potassium. Use the 18-6-12.
It's all compost in the pot...lettuce/spinach/celery leaves (for N), banana peels/mango bits/peach bits (for P & K)....but yeah, it is attracting bugs...mosquitoes all over the place.
It's not compost til it's broken down and becomes, well, compost. Otherwise, it's garbage.
She definitely gets at least 9 hours of sunlight each day.
Damn.. better'n mine. wow.
What's another good aeration ingredient to use besides perlite/rockwool?
I'm trying to keep this cost at $0.00, so things around the house are ideal. I live in a pretty sandy area where small pebbles, gravel, mulch, tree trimmings and leaves are readily available...so all of these mixed together, I would think, would make for some well-draining soil.
Sand. Mine LOVE having sand in the soil, honestly, almost better than perlite, but sand is heavy and I'm moving the pots around (if you click my gallery link you'll see where I have my garden).

Nick, the rocks are going to affect the pH if they're calcaerous, at least in my (aquarium) experience. Dolomite, aragonite, limestone, marble, those sorts of things. Quartz, granite, and that sort of thing is likely not to. Rocks high in iron may also have an effect, but I have not seen any shift in pH when using, for instance, volcanic rock that is clearly high in iron or manganese.
 
Thanks for letting me know about the sand. As I was out there earlier, transplanting and moving, I ended up being about a half-gallon of soil short, so I put some sand (white sugar sand...it's everywhere) around the plant for added stability instead.

The 18-6-12 package said:
2tsp for a 1gal pot (1tsp if indoors)
2tbsp for a 3gal pot (1tbsp if indoors)

I used 1/2tsp in my ~1.5gal pot.
I'm also sure that my girl is 'praying for magnesium', so I added a tiny little pinch of epsom salt to the surrounding sand knowing that it would be raining later to dilute & distribute it...and sure enough, it is raining right now.

EDIT: Did I mention that the fertilizer I used says that it's "Time-Released UP TO 9 MONTHS!"...will this make a difference with anything?

Thanks for the help guys.
I'll be checking on her again tomorrow to see how she's taking to the Mg, fertz, and her new location.
 
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The sugar sand may be a coral-based sand (by the way, coral sand is actually coral-eating fish poop, all the coral sand beaches of the world are fish poop, and it's funny to watch them on the reef pooping puffs of sand), so be aware that if it is coral or calcareous-based sand it will buffer the pH UP.

I only use time release ferts on my trees. They're encapsulated for that slower release I believe, so you may not see the results you want.
 
Can you crush the slow-release fertilizer balls to make them release quicker? If not, should I add some dried grass cuttings for more N? I think I'm going to make shrimp for dinner just so I can use their heads after being dried.

Shrimp heads, dried 7.82 - 4.20 - 0
( N-P-K Values for making your home made Nutes! - Cannabis.com Forums Message Boards - Medical Marijuana, Cannabis Club, Dispensary, News )

The Mg has definitely helped already, and after the rains (with a more flexible stem) I was able to tie her down to expose those little pre-bud sites to more light in her new location...so hopefully things will be looking better over the next few days.
 
I thought that the dried grass and shrimp heads would probably have to break down before they can release any nitrogen, but I could be wrong. I don't see why you CAN'T crush the little fertilizer balls, then you'll get an instant charge of the ferts I'm thinking (looking at my shake 'n' feed stuff I used when planting the trees). Whatever you do, go slow.

Tobacco is on that list, you should know it's an excellent pesticide. I would be careful using it. I wish that whoever posted it said how to extract these values and how to use these things.
 
That's good to hear!
I usually smoke a cig on the walk out to my site and by the time I get there I'm just finishing it, so I've been putting it out and spreading the rest of the butt remains around the area, thinking it would at least repel rabbits and deer. It's nice to hear that it actually is doing what I was hoping it would.

I sort of think that it wasn't just an Mg deficiency...the bottommost leaves (not fanleaves, little budsite leaves on the trunk where a fanleaf stem once was) are pretty new growth and they too are yellow. Is this a K deficiency that is only visibly killing the smallest leaves? The Mg has definitely helped bring some green to a once-dying leaf, so I think I can rule that out...And an N deficiency would just make all of the leaves pretty yellow, veins and all, correct? I know it will be needing some more P (shrimp heads, sardine scraps?) in the next few weeks/months, so I'm leaning more towards K...which is strange, because I've left banana peels in the pot before, so I thought it was getting enough K, but apparently not?

Nutrients PH Problems On Marijuana Plants Spots Symptoms That Appear Indicates that I may have a sulphur deficiency...so does anyone know of a safe way to add sulphur?

The pics aren't the best quality, but you can see the yellow areas that I'm referring to.
 

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Yeah, I sure can, those are good pix. I don't see anything like pine needles around (pine can be problematic for some plants, but being acidic weed should be ok I think) on the ground, but your pix are always in the shade or something. You said that this plant is getting full sunlight for 9 hours each day? Because if you're adding fertilizers to something that's planted in what appears to be decent ground, the damn thing should grow. I'm having N deficiency issues with some plants, but they're potted, it's hot, they get afternoon sun, and I used cheap soil.

I ask about the light and how intense it is because some plants just can't use the nutrients if they don't have enough light to power the engine. Even with the N deficiency I thought new growth would come in light green, if it was really bad anyway. I'm drawing a blank, have you checked those plant problem links? (I think I linked them, if not let me know.) Based on your link along with your pix, I still think it's nitrogen. It's definitely not anything like zinc, the sulfur deficiency shows mature leaves at differing heights and maturity levels.

Here's an idea, since you're in an area with other plants already growing. First, make sure there's nothing directly above the plant, and then find some organic fert or soil that has microbes. You want to look for micorrhizae or micorrhizal fungi. Search it on Google and look at the images, these critters are being used by all sorts of horticulturists, nurseries, arborists, and farmers. It helps the plant make better roots for absorbing water and nutrients, and helps those roots do it more efficiently.
 
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