Sealed GR for Cold Enviroment (Help)

NailHash

NailHash

New Member
Hello people! I hope you are doing great and your buds are sticky.

Is building a sealed grow room a good alternative if you dont have access to warm air from your house?

I got an empty 2x2x2.6m room next to my garage and i would like to grow throughout the year. Only way to heat it during winter is with el. heaters since its not close to the house. Pulling hunderds of cubic feet of cold winter air just to heat and vent it out seems stupid and very expensive.

I would like to know if sealing the room and using 20 pound co2 tank would be a good alternative for winter growing.
I assume that 20 pound tank in such a small room would last quite a long time and would be much less expensive to run it along a small heater than being Greta Thunbergs worst nightmare.

Thank you!

P.S. No, i cant grow in my house.
 

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NailHash said:
Pulling hunderds of cubic feet of cold winter air just to heat and vent it out seems stupid and very expensive.
Click to expand...
i suck cold air in here to keep room temps acceptable. i have trouble running in the summer w/o A/C so i'm doing all my grows from fall to spring.
 
rkymtnman said:
i suck cold air in here to keep room temps acceptable. i have trouble running in the summer w/o A/C so i'm doing all my grows from fall to spring.
Click to expand...
You ever hav issues with condensation by pulling in cold air? I'm getting ready to that in one of my rooms and was wondering how people dealt with it? We have pretty extreme temps here.
 
Apalchen said:
You ever hav issues with condensation by pulling in cold air? I'm getting ready to that in one of my rooms and was wondering how people dealt with it? We have pretty extreme temps here.
Click to expand...
i've had a bit on my in line fan but it's in our mechanical closet so it just drips onto the floor into the drain.

it would probably be worse if I was venting 80F to below 32F outside temps.
 
NailHash said:
How big is your grow? I assume you are using HPS.
I was planning to use LED lights because of low power consumption and they seem easier to cool during summer.
Click to expand...
nope, i switched to leds a few years ago. it's 12 sq ft. i used to just have the walls painted white but after i installed that diamond foil, i couldn't control my temps in summer. even running at night.
now with a temp controller, it's easy peasy. and they basically have a constant and FREE source of CO2
 
rkymtnman said:
nope, i switched to leds a few years ago. it's 12 sq ft. i used to just have the walls painted white but after i installed that diamond foil, i couldn't control my temps in summer. even running at night.
now with a temp controller, it's easy peasy. and they basically have a constant and FREE source of CO2
Click to expand...

Bruh where do you live? California? Sahara? Or am i misjudging how much heat leds actually put out? Also how many wats and what are you running?
 
NailHash said:
Hello people! I hope you are doing great and your buds are sticky.

Is building a sealed grow room a good alternative if you dont have access to warm air from your house?

I got an empty 2x2x2.6m room next to my garage and i would like to grow throughout the year. Only way to heat it during winter is with el. heaters since its not close to the house. Pulling hunderds of cubic feet of cold winter air just to heat and vent it out seems stupid and very expensive.

I would like to know if sealing the room and using 20 pound co2 tank would be a good alternative for winter growing.
I assume that 20 pound tank in such a small room would last quite a long time and would be much less expensive to run it along a small heater than being Greta Thunbergs worst nightmare.

Thank you!

P.S. No, i cant grow in my house.
Click to expand...


for cold climates sealed room are the most efficient option
but you need a reversible air conditionner, a good dehumidifier (a real one, with compressor) and if possible a small liquid propane/ng burner
it will allow you to keep warm temperatures by using the less electricity possible

during the rooting when only quarter or half of the bulbs are lit the AC in heat mode will keep temperature warmer, the pilot light on the gas burner will also help.
when plants grow bigger and all the lights are lit the AC will go in cold mode and dehumidify the room by itself if its well sized.

during night you always want to heat the room because lamps are off, so the AC will run slowly in heat mode. the dehumdifier will also run because you need to absorb all that water vapor, and at the same time it will add a bit of heat too the room

you can use co2 tank but its a pain in the as and cost too much for what it is, and in your case (mine too) co2 burner are an advantage because it add heat and humidity ( very useful at the beginning of the cycle)

and if you're good you can recover condensate water from AC/dehumifier and will never need to open you tap during the grow. ( i do it)
just need to open the tap to soak the rockwool at the beginning

all these infos are for hydroponic growing, if you plan to do dirt it can work less good
 
BIGBALLSJOE said:
for cold climates sealed room are the most efficient option
but you need a reversible air conditionner, a good dehumidifier (a real one, with compressor) and if possible a small liquid propane/ng burner
it will allow you to keep warm temperatures by using the less electricity possible

during the rooting when only quarter or half of the bulbs are lit the AC in heat mode will keep temperature warmer, the pilot light on the gas burner will also help.
when plants grow bigger and all the lights are lit the AC will go in cold mode and dehumidify the room by itself if its well sized.

during night you always want to heat the room because lamps are off, so the AC will run slowly in heat mode. the dehumdifier will also run because you need to absorb all that water vapor, and at the same time it will add a bit of heat too the room

you can use co2 tank but its a pain in the as and cost too much for what it is, and in your case (mine too) co2 burner are an advantage because it add heat and humidity ( very useful at the beginning of the cycle)

and if you're good you can recover condensate water from AC/dehumifier and will never need to open you tap during the grow. ( i do it)
just need to open the tap to soak the rockwool at the beginning

all these infos are for hydroponic growing, if you plan to do dirt it can work less good
Click to expand...

Thats some good info. Thank you very much.

I was thinking about using a small burner for heat and co2 but im afraid of carbon monoxide especially in such a small room, so id rather use co2 tank and an AC or el. heater.

Any good recommendations for portable AC. What do you use? I hear people say those arent that good and to go with a mini split but im not sure what to think.
 
NailHash said:
Bruh where do you live? California? Sahara? Or am i misjudging how much heat leds actually put out? Also how many wats and what are you running?
Click to expand...
the mtns of Colorado. 480watts in 12 sq ft. drivers are inside there too.
during summer i was sucking in 50ish F air and i couldn't keep it below 85F in the room. that foil was what put me over the edge but the increased reflectivity was/is worth it.
 
NailHash said:
Thats some good info. Thank you very much.

I was thinking about using a small burner for heat and co2 but im afraid of carbon monoxide especially in such a small room, so id rather use co2 tank and an AC or el. heater.

Any good recommendations for portable AC. What do you use? I hear people say those arent that good and to go with a mini split but im not sure what to think.
Click to expand...
where you gonna put your plants with all that stuff in there??? lol.
 
NailHash said:
Thats some good info. Thank you very much.

I was thinking about using a small burner for heat and co2 but im afraid of carbon monoxide especially in such a small room, so id rather use co2 tank and an AC or el. heater.

Any good recommendations for portable AC. What do you use? I hear people say those arent that good and to go with a mini split but im not sure what to think.
Click to expand...
carbon monoxide is only a problem with incomplete combustion of the gas
as long as you get a nice blue flame you will only produce co2 and h2o

portable air conditionner dont work for sealed environnement because they vent all the hot air outside
plus they dont have a heat mode, which is a way more efficient heat production method than electric heaters
 
NailHash said:
-5C to +5C 23-41F

How big is your grow? I assume you are using HPS.
I was planning to use LED lights because of low power consumption and they seem easier to cool during summer.
Click to expand...


Then you might want to think of 1" of foam insulation. A intake that blows over the leds to cool them in the warmer weather, temper the incoming air in the winter. A thermostat obviously for the heater, a humidistat would be good for the winter with the fan on it.
 
when outside air is really cold, its mission impossible to keep propitious temperatures, except if you have several lights
in this case the problem is that plants will quickly deplete ambiant co2 forcing you to intake more fresh air

and then its the snake that bites its tail

and if you use a electric heater its very painful to throw all that expensive heat through the exhaust
 
So if we are thinking 35W/sq ft in flower, 36 sq ft, roughly 1200W, would do a fair amount concerning heat loss. Thought about going outside the house but my lows are -20 - -40, don't even get me talking wind chill. Opening a door and letting some -5 air in will not kill the plants. Humidity control comes into play, don't want it to go up above 60%. Probably will get condensation on a uninsulated intake duct which would reduce the air changes nesisary to get rid of the humidity. Then it is a question of co2, if you add it then the less need for outside air. To balance these things to get the maximum return is an interesting problem. If anyone nows what the plants use in co2 per sq ft?
 
printer said:
Then you might want to think of 1" of foam insulation. A intake that blows over the leds to cool them in the warmer weather, temper the incoming air in the winter. A thermostat obviously for the heater, a humidistat would be good for the winter with the fan on it.
Click to expand...

I was considering using 600w HPS in a cooltube as my intake to warm up the air during winter and during hotter months i would vent cooltube to the outside and have a seperate intake. I was planning to put up some foam insulation in any case.

rkymtnman said:
where you gonna put your plants with all that stuff in there??? lol.
Click to expand...

Im a small European, we are used to tight spaces :lol:. How often do you vent your room? It sounds crazy to me that replacing all air every 1-2 minutes with 50F air cant keep your temps under 85F.

BIGBALLSJOE said:
when outside air is really cold, its mission impossible to keep propitious temperatures, except if you have several lights
in this case the problem is that plants will quickly deplete ambiant co2 forcing you to intake more fresh air

and then its the snake that bites its tail

and if you use a electric heater its very painful to throw all that expensive heat through the exhaust
Click to expand...

Yup, thats why i was thinking about sealing the room to keep it warm and using tanks for co2 but i guess i underestimated how much heat lights actually produce.
 
NailHash said:
I was considering using 600w HPS in a cooltube as my intake to warm up the air during winter and during hotter months i would vent cooltube to the outside and have a seperate intake. I was planning to put up some foam insulation in any case.



Im a small European, we are used to tight spaces :lol:. How often do you vent your room? It sounds crazy to me that replacing all air every 1-2 minutes with 50F air cant keep your temps under 85F.



Yup, thats why i was thinking about sealing the room to keep it warm and using tanks for co2 but i guess i underestimated how much heat lights actually produce.
Click to expand...
depends on how much lights you want in your space
i you only use 2x600w you will not need any cooling because of the cold radiating through the walls
but a dehumidifier will be needed for sure
in this case you can use bottled co2, dehumdifier and no AC. but once the winter will be finished your setup will not work anymore, and during the interseason either
Air conditionners give you flexibility for change of seasons

ideally for actively growing plants you want to refresh the room air volume between 15 to 60 times per hour( depends on how much your room is filled with plants)
below this you will get under the 400ppm of atmoshperic co2 and get stunted growth
 
printer said:
So if we are thinking 35W/sq ft in flower, 36 sq ft, roughly 1200W, would do a fair amount concerning heat loss. Thought about going outside the house but my lows are -20 - -40, don't even get me talking wind chill. Opening a door and letting some -5 air in will not kill the plants. Humidity control comes into play, don't want it to go up above 60%. Probably will get condensation on a uninsulated intake duct which would reduce the air changes nesisary to get rid of the humidity. Then it is a question of co2, if you add it then the less need for outside air. To balance these things to get the maximum return is an interesting problem. If anyone nows what the plants use in co2 per sq ft?
Click to expand...

Eh, as soon as i saw your profile pic i knew you are going to hit me with some crazy low temps.

I thought i wrote it in original post, my bad. To be more clear im planing to use only half of my space for plants so something like two 3x3 tents which is 18sq feet (22sq feet if i truly use half of my space) so thats about 630-770W required(35w/sq ft), and i guess i can go a little lower if i use efficient leds.

printer said:
Big question, how much you want to spend? How much you want to harvest?
Click to expand...

Im looking to get at least 10oz but I would love to hit somewhere around a pound if im using all of my grow space for flowering and not just one 3x3.

How much can i spend. Probably around $1500.
I will probably make tents myself since dimensions i want are a little bigger than 3x3. So im hoping i will save some money there and im trying to avoid getting a mini split....but to be honest....it looks like i wont be doing any year round growing without it especially if i want a sealed GR.
 
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