Pelosis' cure

medicineman

medicineman

New Member
Maybe there's hope yet:
Pelosi: Nation Needs a Healthy Debate on How to Lower the Number of Uninsured Americans

Washington, D.C. – House Democratic Leader Nancy Pelosi released the following statement today on America’s Health Insurance Plans’ (AHIP) proposal to extend health insurance to all Americans:
"I strongly commend the leaders of the nation’s health insurers for their proposal to help ensure every American has access to health care coverage. Considering that nearly 47 million Americans are without health insurance, including more than 8 million children, we must consider closely any plans that would dramatically and quickly lower the number of uninsured.
"There are parts of the proposal by America’s Health Insurance Plans (AHIP) that I strongly endorse, particularly those relating to SCHIP and Medicaid, and other parts with which I disagree, including Universal Health Accounts. This nation needs a healthy debate on how we lower the number of uninsured, and I urge other stakeholders in the health arena to come forward with proposals that address this urgent problem.
"The American people are demanding a new direction – and Democrats will provide one with a commitment to more affordable health care and life-saving science. We will start by lowering drug prices by requiring the federal government to negotiate for better prices, and removing the restriction on stem cell research to offer real hope to the millions of American families who suffer from devastating diseases."
 
ViRedd

ViRedd

New Member
In other words, "We will ratchet up the power that the federal government has over the people until they submit to our desires."

Vi
 
Dankdude

Dankdude

Well-Known Member
Yes but with 46% of the nation without health insurance and the prices of health insurance out of control, something has to be done. Either there has to be price control on Medical Insurance or the Government is going to have to take over. Neither one of you has come up with an alternative.
 
ViRedd

ViRedd

New Member
First of all, I don't believe that 46% is the number, Dank. The figures I've heard over and over are 40 million.

On price controls: That would be an absolute disaster. Remember the price controls on gasoline? Shortages of gasoline, right? Artificial pricing, through government controls, ALWAYS produce shortages, no matter if the product is toilet paper in the Soviet Union, or medical care here in the U.S.

On turning it over to the governmet: Central planning and centralized control doesn't work either. Remember the stark differences between East and West Berlin? How about North Korea and South Korea? For a closer example of central planning and its devistating results, just cross the border from El Paso into Mexico.

The solution? Get government the hell out of our lives and let free market competition do its work.

Vi
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
ViRedd said:
First of all, I don't believe that 46% is the number, Dank. The figures I've heard over and over are 40 million.

On price controls: That would be an absolute disaster. Remember the price controls on gasoline? Shortages of gasoline, right? Artificial pricing, through government controls, ALWAYS produce shortages, no matter if the product is toilet paper in the Soviet Union, or medical care here in the U.S.

On turning it over to the governmet: Central planning and centralized control doesn't work either. Remember the stark differences between East and West Berlin? How about North Korea and South Korea? For a closer example of central planning and its devistating results, just cross the border from El Paso into Mexico.

The solution? Get government the hell out of our lives and let free market competition do its work.

Vi
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And what free market entity would pay for the uninsureds medical and the people that have none and can''t afford any? would they just be swept under your free market rug? like the Law of the jungle, only the strong survive, in this case you could substitute Rich for strong! Where are your christian values, like help the weak and downtrodden. It's the same old bullshit, I've got mine, fuck you!
 
ViRedd

ViRedd

New Member
Dankdude said:
You still haven’t come up with a solution Vi.

Number of Uninsured Americans Rises to 45 Million | Physicians for a National Health Program
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Like I said, Dank .... get the government out of health care and let free market competition do its work.

If medical care is so important that it can only succeed through central planning and control, why not have government control food production and distribution as well? After all, won't we all be starving to death soon unless government takes over? Surely, if we have the "right" to "free" medical care, we should also have the "right" to a Porterhouse steak ... no?

Vi
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
ViRedd said:
Like I said, Dank .... get the government out of health care and let free market competition do its work.

If medical care is so important that it can only succeed through central planning and control, why not have them control food production and distribution as well? After all, won't we all be starving to death soon unless government takes over? Surely, if we have the "right" to "free" medical care, we should also have the "right" to a Porterhouse steak ... no?

Vi
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The only thing in your post that makes sense is the right to free medical care, and whether you know it or not, obviously not, there is a modicum of starvation in this country. So how do you propose to take care of the sick under your freee market competition? I'm sure the corporations will be lined up to help those people, Not!
 
Dankdude

Dankdude

Well-Known Member
You still haven't solved the problem, all you would be doing is making the problem worse, great for the stock holder, bad for the regular everyday person. It seems now days with Health Care Companies they are in compitition to see who can make thier price the highest.
 
ViRedd

ViRedd

New Member
"The only thing in your post that makes sense is the right to free medical care."

And to date, Med ... you have failed to point out the section of the Constitution that gives the power to the federal government to PROVIDE for that "free" medical care.

"So how do you propose to take care of the sick under your freee market competition?"

First, I would create more competition for patients among the medical community. You may be not aware that the numbers of doctors coming through medical school are artificially limited, thereby creating a shortage of doctors. More doctors seeking a static number of patients would bring prices down. I would limit the power of the FDA and streamline their operations. It takes hundreds of millions of dollars to get a new treatment or drug approved by that bureaucratic agency. Its antiquated and needs to be modernized. I would institute tax incentives to save for medical emergencies. I would start a publicity campaine to reverse the entitlement mentality that has overcome Americans who were at one time proud of their independence. I would promote charity through personal responsibility, local oranizations and churches. There's lots that can be done besides laying in a prone position in front of government bureaucrats with your hat in your hand begging for handouts, Med.

Vi
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
ViRedd said:
"The only thing in your post that makes sense is the right to free medical care."

And to date, Med ... you have failed to point out the section of the Constitution that gives the power to the federal government to PROVIDE for that "free" medical care.

"So how do you propose to take care of the sick under your freee market competition?"

First, I would create more competition for patients among the medical community. You may be not aware that the numbers of doctors coming through medical school are artificially limited, thereby creating a shortage of doctors. More doctors seeking a static number of patients would bring prices down. I would limit the power of the FDA and streamline their operations. It takes hundreds of millions of dollars to get a new treatment or drug approved by that bureaucratic agency. Its antiquated and needs to be modernized. I would institute tax incentives to save for medical emergencies. I would start a publicity campaine to reverse the entitlement mentality that has overcome Americans who were at one time proud of their independence. I would promote charity through personal responsibility, local oranizations and churches. There's lots that can be done besides laying in a prone position in front of government bureaucrats with your hat in your hand begging for handouts, Med.

Vi
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And what about the hoplessly poor? What about all the people with no medical options, do you suppose the rich corporations that are now cutting medical benefits to their employees would step up and foot the bill for medical care for the indigent. Are you on acid? What personal responsibility does someone have when they're flat broke from working a minimum wage job and their child is sick. If you go to a dr. without some form of insurance, you're turned away. Under your plan everyone would be turned away if they didn't have money. Brilliant! Save the rich some more taxes and let the children just suffer and die. I think you are a sick individual to even come up with this free market idea. A society has a responsibility to take care of its lessor endowed citizens. If you can't see this, why don't you and your cronies move to a place where they'll let you start this plutocracy and live happily ever after?
 
Dankdude

Dankdude

Well-Known Member
Again, You still haven't solved the problem, all you would be doing is making the problem worse, great for the stock holder, bad for the regular everyday person. It seems now days with Health Care Companies they are in compitition to see who can make thier price the highest.
 
Smirgen

Smirgen

Well-Known Member
I think Dave Chappelle had the best Idea which is to make fake canadian I.D's and get medical care in Canada.:mrgreen:
 
ViRedd

ViRedd

New Member
"And what about the hoplessly poor?"

The "hopeless" have always been with us, Med. We have charities for them.

And again ... you have failed to point out the provision in the Constitution that gives the federal government the power to PROVIDE "free" medical to "The Hopeless."

Vi
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
Dankdude said:
Again, You still haven't solved the problem, all you would be doing is making the problem worse, great for the stock holder, bad for the regular everyday person. It seems now days with Health Care Companies they are in compitition to see who can make thier price the highest.
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Aint that the truth. When I retired, a month before the date, they changed my free retirement medical Program to a 450.00 a month premium. Then when I turned 65 and medicare kicked in, they reduced it to 123.00 a month.. 6 Months later they raised it up to 256.00 a month and I see no end in site> Meanwhile my retirement income is set at a fixed rate, so every time they raise it, they take money right out of my pocket. If I didn't have my union medical, my wife who's a diabetic would have no coverage as her job offers none and any private ones that even come close to what we already have are over a grand a month. Gee isn't health care wonderful, and Vi would further privatize it, how much would it be then 2,000, 3,000, 4,000 a month. Greed knows no limits and he calls me greedy because I want to raise taxes on the rich. If that is not pure insanity then I guess I'm fucking crazy!
 
ViRedd

ViRedd

New Member
"When I retired, a month before the date, they changed my free retirement medical Program to a 450.00 a month premium."

Free retirement medical program? Gimme a break, Med. I was just reading that the cost of "free" medical for the auto workers adds an average of $1000.00 to the cost of each new car made by American manufacturers. Free, indeed.

Vi

PS: I heard somewhere that there is no free lunch.
 
medicineman

medicineman

New Member
ViRedd said:
"When I retired, a month before the date, they changed my free retirement medical Program to a 450.00 a month premium."

Free retirement medical program? Gimme a break, Med. I was just reading that the cost of "free" medical for the auto workers adds an average of $1000.00 to the cost of each new car made by American manufacturers. Free, indeed.

Vi

PS: I heard somewhere that there is no free lunch.
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So genius, who is going to fund the medical care system in your free market utopia?
 
ViRedd

ViRedd

New Member
Med ...

You have yet to point out the provision in the Constitution that hands to the federal government the power to PROVIDE "free" medical to "The Hopeless."

Vi
 
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