Obama's Certificate of Live Birth...

hanimmal said:

Nope but it does deal with the "Innocent until proven guilty" thing.

Click to expand...

fdd2blk said:

are you defending the globe?

Click to expand...

CrackerJax said:

You're becoming more obtuse every day.



In a way, yes. Any newspaper is capable of putting out serious stories and the Globe has broken big stories before. They know this subject sells their newspapers and you can bet your bottom dollar they would love to scoop it. I do chuckle at the cover whenever I encounter it, but i can't dismiss the capabilities. In this case, I figure since something is truly fishy, someone will break the story sometime....perhaps. the Globe could be that newspaper to break it. Rest assured it won't be CNN, or ABC.

Click to expand...

You're becoming more obtuse every day.

Click to expand...

hanimmal said:

Are you a republican plant? Seriously you are still not answering Jrh.

Click to expand...

jrh72582 said:

Okay, let me explain my view AGAIN because I want to hear your response. Here's how I see this issue:

Let's say Obama was born in Kenya. Let's say his parents wanted to make sure of his citizenship by getting him a COLB from Hawaii and by announcing the birth in the newspapers. Then, let's say Obama was told he was born in Kenya by his grandmother and told he was born in Hawaii by his parents. Or, let's even assume that both his parents and his grandma told him he was born in Kenya, but they assured him he had a COLB from Hawaii as well.

Now, he goes to college and all that good stuff... Let's assume he puts Kenya as his place of birth on all his records. Time lapses, etc, until he's elected to the senate and eventually to the presidency. People start to ask - where are you from Obama? He doesn't know. His staffers cannot say for sure. BUT, they do have a COLB from Hawaii. So they issue the COLB and stick to the story that he was born in Hawaii. Keep in mind his staffers have no clue. Obama has no clue either. He was, after all, one day old at the time. So they issue the COLB, seal all other records which may indicate that he was born in Kenya, and proceed. Now, this COLB is not good enough for some people, even though it fills legal requirements, so they challenge it. The courts rule that it's legit and rule accordingly. So the COLB stands.

Let's say the issue is pressed further and somehow the college records are released. Let's say they list his birthplace as Kenya. What happens? Well, Obama says that he doesn't know where he was born - he was told Kenya, he was told Hawaii, etc.....so he just listed Kenya to get more aid, to get easier admissions, etc... We don't know the reason, but he put Kenya (keep in mind, we're assuming). Now what happens? There's a COLB from Hawaii, college records stating Kenya, and both his parents and grandma are dead. Well, the COLB is a legal document and the courts did rule on the issue. Also, considering the fact that his mother was a legal citizen (although she was 1, they will most assuredly grant him citizenship. So, the issue is over.

Now, this hypothetical situation follows EVERY claim you've made, assuming that you're correct (which is a stretch). Even when we follow it out to it's logical end, Obama is still a citizen and still president. So what changes? Why the fuss? What does it matter? Unless your real motives are rooted in a dislike of foreigners, I cannot understand why you would press this issue when it's a dead end. You sound like the people who constantly cried after Bush stole the election from Gore in 2000. The issue was over, the courts had ruled, but people kept crying...

Click to expand...

The Constitution is quite clear.

Click to expand...

CrackerJax said:

Ahhh, except for one thing.... the COLB was obtained fraudulently by his father. In the end once Obama is declared to have either a dual citizenship, or one foreign nationality (take ur pick), it's over for him

There is no wiggle room. The Constitution is quite clear. You can play all the games you want, but if he cannot produce a verifiable ORIGINAL BC from the United States and prove that he SHARES NO OTHER LOYALTIES (any other BC from any other country), then he is toast according to the Constitution.

It's simple and straightforward. He must have ONE origin of Birth and it MUST be from the US. The COLB cannot stand on its own. It won't stand on its own if it ever gets to court...and thats what TEAM OBAMA is constantly fighting....to stay out of court. Must be a VERY GOOD reason why he wants to stay out of court.........:lol:

Click to expand...

TheBrutalTruth said:

Actually the Kenya BC was proven to be fraudulent a couple days after it made an appearance.

Of course that doesn't mean that Obama wasn't born in Kenya, it just means that both sides are capable of fraud (the COLB of course was also fraudulent.)

Now, Obama should just release the records and save everyone time, but maybe he's afraid he's not a citizen and he'll be laughed out of office (after being impeached.)

Then there's the entire vulnerability to right around 100 Million Civil Lawsuits if he's impeached (or the moment he steps out of office and is no longer protected by his office.)

If he's not a citizen, it certainly explains why he refuses to release the records.

The other alternative is that he's a dumb ass (which would also explain why he refuses to release the records.)

Click to expand...

jrh72582 said:

False. He does NOT have to prove no other loyalties. And there's no way of knowing the COLB was fraudulently obtained. His father is dead. His mother is dead. His grandmother is dead.

Here's how I see it (and I'd bet money this is how it plays out)...

I personally think people will continue pressing the issue, but the courts have ruled. Unless a valid BC from Kenya shows up, the birthers will continue to be rejected by the courts, as Obama has a legal document and substantiating evidence, which will hold up in court. If Obama releases the college admissions records and it says Kenya anywhere on the form, he need only claim ignorance on the matter. "Well I assumed I was born in Kenya, but my parents told me I was born in Hawaii, I have a COLB from Hawaii, I have newspaper articles claiming birth in Hawaii, I have no BC from Kenya, and cannot find an original BC from Hawaii, so after being cleared up on the issue, I realized my true place of birth was Hawaii".

But as I said, I don't think it will ever come to this. I don't see the intentionally treacherous underpinnings that you do. I think he was honestly born in Hawaii. There's NO way to prove he wasn't, NO WAY. So with a COLB, issue is OVER, legally speaking.

Click to expand...

purplekitty7772008 said:

Jhr, ok...just answer this...

Why is he hiding it?

He's obviously hiding something, and if its not a fake COLB, then
what is it?

Just please answer it straight forward without writing 3 paragraphs....

Click to expand...

jrh72582 said:

Here's honestly why I think he's not releasing (I hate the word 'hiding', because it presumes guilt) his college records. He was a revolutionary in college. He was involved with some out there fellas and wrote some revolutionary shit. I think staunchy old conservatives would be afraid of his flirtation with the extreme. I think much of what he did in college would be used as fodder for insurrection by the right.

Did he put Kenya as his place of birth? No, I don't think so. I don't think it has anything to do with that. But you never know. Personally, I could care less. The people voted for Obama and the only concept higher than the constitution is PEOPLE. People wrote the constitution, people amend the constitution, and people (in large majorities) can ultimately demand that the constitution adapt with their ideals. The people overwhelming voted for Obama, knowing he had ties to Kenya. So who cares? Not the people (the majority) who voted Obama in. Only the others care. And their muscles aren't strong enough, even while fully flexed, to negate the will of the majority. That's why I think most don't care about this issue.

There. Two paragraphs (and one sentence) . Keep in mind, it's just my opinion...

Click to expand...

CrackerJax said:

You may not have a dual citizenship and be President of the United States.

You must have an original BC from the United States of America. You may not possess two BC's. It's pretty simple and clear and MANDATED (wisely I might add) by the Founding Fathers.

The big reason why Obama spends so much money staying out of court is perjury. He will not willingly give up the mantle and of course the mere testimony and questions will show him to have been lying to the country all along (not good if you want to lead).

There are more military cases coming up and it will be fun to see what happens. A military court is the last place Obama wants to be in.

Click to expand...

jrh72582 said:

Okay, let me explain my view AGAIN because I want to hear your response. Here's how I see this issue:

Let's say Obama was born in Kenya. Let's say his parents wanted to make sure of his citizenship by getting him a COLB from Hawaii and by announcing the birth in the newspapers. Then, let's say Obama was told he was born in Kenya by his grandmother and told he was born in Hawaii by his parents. Or, let's even assume that both his parents and his grandma told him he was born in Kenya, but they assured him he had a COLB from Hawaii as well.

Now, he goes to college and all that good stuff... Let's assume he puts Kenya as his place of birth on all his records. Time lapses, etc, until he's elected to the senate and eventually to the presidency. People start to ask - where are you from Obama? He doesn't know. His staffers cannot say for sure. BUT, they do have a COLB from Hawaii. So they issue the COLB and stick to the story that he was born in Hawaii. Keep in mind his staffers have no clue. Obama has no clue either. He was, after all, one day old at the time. So they issue the COLB, seal all other records which may indicate that he was born in Kenya, and proceed. Now, this COLB is not good enough for some people, even though it fills legal requirements, so they challenge it. The courts rule that it's legit and rule accordingly. So the COLB stands.

Let's say the issue is pressed further and somehow the college records are released. Let's say they list his birthplace as Kenya. What happens? Well, Obama says that he doesn't know where he was born - he was told Kenya, he was told Hawaii, etc.....so he just listed Kenya to get more aid, to get easier admissions, etc... We don't know the reason, but he put Kenya (keep in mind, we're assuming). Now what happens? There's a COLB from Hawaii, college records stating Kenya, and both his parents and grandma are dead. Well, the COLB is a legal document and the courts did rule on the issue. Also, considering the fact that his mother was a legal citizen (although she was 1, they will most assuredly grant him citizenship. So, the issue is over.

Now, this hypothetical situation follows EVERY claim you've made, assuming that you're correct (which is a stretch). Even when we follow it out to it's logical end, Obama is still a citizen and still president. So what changes? Why the fuss? What does it matter? Unless your real motives are rooted in a dislike of foreigners, I cannot understand why you would press this issue when it's a dead end. You sound like the people who constantly cried after Bush stole the election from Gore in 2000. The issue was over, the courts had ruled, but people kept crying...

Click to expand...

jrh72582 said:

Ha - Obama runs the military, as mandated by the people of the United States. Commander in chief. He doesn't need to take the stand to prove he's commander. He was voted in and the court has backed him 100%. Issue OVER. Soldiers looking for excuses to recant on their commitment are not taken very seriously, as their intentions are crystal clear, my friend. I've never seen such weak evidence presented for ANY claim on this forum. Even the truthers conjure evidence that's worthy of consideration. Yours.........nope. Military men looking for an easy road out just won't suffice.

Oh, and Obama doesn't have dual citizenship. It cannot proved that he was born in Kenya. It has been 'proved' (according to the courts) that he was born in Hawaii. Dead issue.

Click to expand...