Joseph Stiglitz: Trickle-down economics is 'absolutely wrong'
- Thread starter Padawanbater2
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tangerinegreen555
Well-Known Member
Voodoo Econ 101.
Of course it doesn't work for the majority...it works for the 1% though, and since they control the system...
Of course it doesn't work for the majority...it works for the 1% though, and since they control the system...
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
...yes, but let's not erroneously blame "the free market" .
Most people have little understanding of "economics" or what a free market REALLY is. Economics is the study of economic behavior and how people as individuals interact and how the sum of those individuals interactions create an aggregate. If the individual trade interactions people would make are altered by an unwanted third party, the aggregate becomes skewed as well, hence a free market is not the apt term to use in that instance.
Of course "trickle down" won't work, since it implies that government protected companies can use coercion based means (government sponsored protection) and then somehow by using those means create a just end.
Controlled economies like the USA's use perverse and unnatural incentives and will always create unintended consequences.
The best economic model (most just) is in the micro mode, two people both agree to an exchange of something and they conduct their interaction on the basis they both agree to, absent intervention from a third party and absent infliction UPON a third party.
You're welcome.
Most people have little understanding of "economics" or what a free market REALLY is. Economics is the study of economic behavior and how people as individuals interact and how the sum of those individuals interactions create an aggregate. If the individual trade interactions people would make are altered by an unwanted third party, the aggregate becomes skewed as well, hence a free market is not the apt term to use in that instance.
Of course "trickle down" won't work, since it implies that government protected companies can use coercion based means (government sponsored protection) and then somehow by using those means create a just end.
Controlled economies like the USA's use perverse and unnatural incentives and will always create unintended consequences.
The best economic model (most just) is in the micro mode, two people both agree to an exchange of something and they conduct their interaction on the basis they both agree to, absent intervention from a third party and absent infliction UPON a third party.
You're welcome.
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
Your favored personal philosophy about government comes down to individual liberty, my personal philosophy about government comes down to a more utilitarian system of management. So we will never agree on certain things, economics being one of them. I don't believe there is much to gain from going over the same things with you again and again since we already both understand each others position.
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
Sounds like you would have made a good overseer on a slave plantation and would have implemented very effective utilitarian policies.
You can disagree with me on economics, but that's only because you fail to understand supply and demand and the inter-relationship of individual choices to the whole. When you intervene in consensual human trade relationships and try to establish a command model, it starts smelling alot like the old USSR.
In a libertarian based world, you'd be free to form a cooperative with any people that voluntarily wanted to join you. In a socialist / communist model it's one size fits all. Good luck wearing those XXXL pajamas, Comrade.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
aren't you the guy who stated that it is "polite and reasonable" for you to hang a sign that bars blacks and jews from your store?
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
No, but if you repeat a lie often enough Herr Goebells it might work for you.
What I tried to convey was that if a person was going to use their property how they see fit, it is reasonable for them to notice others of how they intend the use of their property. For instance, a NO TRESPASSING SIGN is a reasonable thing to post if you don't want others on your property.
You are trying to imply that because I think noticing people of your bigotry is reasonable, that I agree with that bigotry. They are two separate things.
tangerinegreen555
Well-Known Member
...and THAT goes a long way explaining why stupid middle class people vote for 'trickle down' loving candidates...
Use attack ads & point out the benefits of the big 'trickle'
Then people wonder why they feel pissed on?
hotrodharley
Well-Known Member
hotrodharley
Well-Known Member
MuyLocoNC
Well-Known Member
Trickle down worked fantastically for me and mine as well as millions of others who actually jumped in and participated enthusiastically, rather than standing on the sidelines bitching about the referees.
The 80's fucking rocked, 90's were just as good and I never made more money than I did between 2000 and 2009. If you didn't, I would suggest you get your head out of your ass and start listening to different people than you did then and now.
The 80's fucking rocked, 90's were just as good and I never made more money than I did between 2000 and 2009. If you didn't, I would suggest you get your head out of your ass and start listening to different people than you did then and now.
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
If the stated goal of supply-side economics was to increase the size of the economy so that the prosperity would spread to all classes, then it has been a failure by every measure. The economic gains went to the top 1%-10% of earners while the bottom 90% of Americans saw their incomes decline.
Siino Gardens
Well-Known Member
Power corrupts, money has power due to perception.
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
The problem most people have when discussing economics is they think government is required to regulate economic activity and they fail to understand how a free market is self regulating. Government picks winners and losers when it gets involved, a free market doesn't stifle opportunity it IS opportunity.
No, I am not talking about a crony market, when I refer to a "free market" so please don't confuse that with my point.
No, I am not talking about a crony market, when I refer to a "free market" so please don't confuse that with my point.
The_Herban_Legend
Well-Known Member
What measures would be in place with a "free market", absent of government, to recover from an economic recession or depression?
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
The_Herban_Legend
Well-Known Member
Elaborate.
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
You'll get an F in every economics class I've ever taken, which should tell you something about how far off base your views are. This is why no one who DOES have a background in economics will ever take you seriously, and why if you'd really like to change people's perception of markets and economics of large systems, you're the one who needs an education. Until then, languish on the ignore setting of everyone with an actual grasp of the science.
Bye, Rob.
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
Classic tactics of concentration of power at the top by misleading everyone into going along with it.
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