I think my boss is afraid of losing me...

We have had a few employees leave recently for other companies in the field. Each one that left took a significant pay increase (from 25% to upwards of 60%). The most recent employee quit just before christmas. My bosses called me in their office yesterday to talk about if everyone in the company is happy and stuff, because they don't want to lose any core members of the company. I got the impression they were very scared of me and 2 other people leaving or at least searching for other jobs. I think we are paid below industry standard, and we all tolerate it because of complacency and fringe benefits of the job. I live close to work, have lots of freedom to smoke on the job, come in late, drink beer, wear slippers at work, listen to my heavy metal or hard rock while I do reports, etc. I could probably get another job and possibly get up to a 50% increase in my overall compensation if I left for another company.

They said they wanted me to think about it and talk to them tomorrow (which is today). So I think I need to tell them compensation is the problem, and while i'm not actively applying to jobs like some other coworkers did, that I do have my feelers out there and and my ear to the ground and some companies are hiring, and for a lot better pay. If an opportunity comes up to take a job with a 50% pay increase I would certainly take it, and i'm sure my other co workers would too. I don't quite think they are as valuable as me, but I feel they are also undervalued and could get more.

So how do I approach this, and what realistically should I demand? If feel like they are looking for loyalty, and looking for exactly what they need to do to secure me, so I don't even want to stray. I feel that industry standard for my job, with 5 years of experience, should be about 133-150% of my current base pay. I think I have even more additional value because of skills I bring in that were not part of my job description, but slowly have become part of my regular job. They hired an engineer, an got an IT expert on top of it.

if you find out let me know as I'm paid about 40-50% of market value at the moment lol

Can you go somewhere else?

I have been putting my resume together and talking to different people. I have not actually applied to any jobs, but I do think with some effort I could get market value for myself.

Which was really my plan all along, at least to secure some leverage. If I have an offer in hand for $60,000/yr then I can go in with real leverage, and if they won't meet it I always can accept the offer. I think a pre-emptive salary increase my save me the trouble of doing that though. I think if they won't meet fair market value, or at least a reasonable compromise (I would almost certainly take a little less money to have some freedom and flexibility and be high all the time) I will have to resort to the open market.

Sounds like they're riding their employees to the bank. I would throw that 50% number at em and take it from there.

Tell them that compensation is not the bottom line for you and that you enjoy your employment, but it is important from a morale standpoint that the feeling is reciprocated from them to you, that they enjoy having you in their employ and that an increase in pay would speak volumes from them.

unfortunately where I work I can't just goto my boss and say "hey you pay me like shit...give me a raise or here is my 2 week notice"

Last time I checked inflation keeps going up and pay checks aren't . Tell them you can't afford to live on your current salary

Can you go another company and get a job? if no one is willing to hire you then is that really your fair market value?

I guess that's my concern, I don't have an offer in hand, so while I THINK I know what fair market value for my labor is, the proof is really in the paycheck.

I can easily live on my salary though. I have everything I need or want. Life is good. It could always be better, but really I don't think I can complain about much. But if an offer for 50% more comes along it will be enticing. Even though I have everything I need it would be nice to sock away an additional $15,000-$20,000 a year simply because I have the excess, and eventually that will come in real handy.

I think there are a lot of people in your situation at the moment. I am similar in that i don't get a great pay but it's around the corner from home, benefits, not the strictest of bosses etc. If i were to quit (i legally do not have to give them even 5 minutes notice) then the company literally stalls, without my work they no longer have a product and can't pull any money in, but it is proving a nightmare trying to negotiate a fair compromise. I mean heck, i don't get a single sick day or holliday a year. In my situation i've a feeling they're intentionally trying to cripple and lose the business, none of their methods make sense otherwise.

All i can safely say from my various jobs is that an easy going job is not something you want to throw away, i happily accept minimum wage and a sweet "sorry i'm an hour late i was having a shower" lifestyle as opposed to other jobs where i'd get grief for losing the company 5p of stock or having a slight scuff on my trousers

I would explain that you enjoy working there and would love to stay and contribute, loyalty,...blah, blah, blah

HOWEVER,

They do pay much lower than their competitors and YOU have been recruited by a couple of people. So, the timing of their inquiry is perfect. Tell them you would be happy to stay with a raise and suggest that other smay be too. Then talk about how important it is that they keep their "core" team together because losing everyone all at once could be detrimental to the company and they may never recover, whilethe competition moves forward. Approach it as a concern for you as a team member.

So, basically, let them know you are valuable, you care, they could really screw up by not keeping you and some others, and let them stew in it. You are in control at this point.

guy incognito said:

Can you go another company and get a job? if no one is willing to hire you then is that really your fair market value?

I guess that's my concern, I don't have an offer in hand, so while I THINK I know what fair market value for my labor is, the proof is really in the paycheck.

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I don't live in an area where IT jobs are very prevalent, and I'm not about to drop everything I have going on here and move my wife and kids across country to a place that's hiring, even if the wage is 100% more than what I'm making now.

jpill said:

Last time I checked inflation keeps going up and pay checks aren't . Tell them you can't afford to live on your current salary

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Been there, tried that a few times now, and I just get the same response of "I understand what you are going through..." and that is all...nothing more...

Money talks and bullshit walks!Seriously though i think what you have already said makes perfect sense,the balls in their court now.They obviously know they have to do something but want it to cost them the least amount so ask for a little more than you'd like and settle for whats fair.If they dont agree to anything keep working on that resume.

that sucks. I've been sitting here for 5 years because of complacency. I have no family, I could potentially uproot, but I don't think i need to because I am starting to see opportunities in my local area.

Well i'm off to initiate a meeting. Wish me luck. I will be shuffling out the door as soon as our talk is done. I will try to get on at some point tonight and update. I don't actually anticipate resolution today. More just throwing the ball back in their court, letting them know whats up, and let them think about it.

ClaytonBigsby said:

I would explain that you enjoy working there and would love to stay and contribute, loyalty,...blah, blah, blah

HOWEVER,

They do pay much lower than their competitors and YOU have been recruited by a couple of people. So, the timing of their inquiry is perfect. Tell them you would be happy to stay with a raise and suggest that other smay be too. Then talk about how important it is that they keep their "core" team together because losing everyone all at once could be detrimental to the company and they may never recover, whilethe competition moves forward. Approach it as a concern for you as a team member.

So, basically, let them know you are valuable, you care, they could really screw up by not keeping you and some others, and let them stew in it. You are in control at this point.

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Great post! cn

i was once in this exact same situation. the market was booming and everyone in town was hiring. the company i was with had just spent 6 months training me and i was becoming a valuable asset. i loved my job, was new to it and still hungry. showed up early and stayed late. several people had already left for higher paying jobs. which actually made me happy because it secured my position. i really had no intent or desire to leave. i was pretty much happy with my pay as well. then one morning the boss came up to me and said "so what's it gonna take to keep YOU here?" kinda off the cuff and as a joke i threw out a 30% pay increase. he said "i'll be right back". he walked into the office, spoke with the co-owner (his brother) for a minute and came back out. he looks at me and says "no problem".

damnit!!!!!!! i should have asked for 50%.



don't threaten them, but don't tell them you are happy either. put it out there in such a way that it's on them without risking your own spot.

i wish you the best.

waltz in there and say, "so i hear you've freed up a bunch of payroll..."

in all honesty, if you are part of the nuts and bolts of the company and they are hemmoraging key employees, you pretty much HAVE to ask for a raise. assuming the powers that be have a clue, they will want to keep experienced veterans as they attempt to rebuild. this puts you in a key position, especially since they are going to have to play a fair amount of "catch up" when getting any new employees settled.

i just noticed that you are off to the meeting so i suppose any suggestions would be too late. my .02 anyway.

Well I basically let them know that compensation is not my bottom line. For the most part I am happy, I can pay my bills, but feel i'm being undervalued. I have talked with some other companies and think I could get a job with a 60% pay increase. I may lose some freedoms and it won't be such a lax environment (we all know this). But the freedom and overall happiness with the job doesn't trump an offer for 60% more, and I would have to take that.

So now we play the waiting game. They asked me to wait while they have a meeting.

Hey good luck man my only remark is dont price yourself out of a job your happy at.

First analyze what you think they can or will pay, get facts about current industry standards and their vulnerability. Go in hard and present this to them, then tell them because you like working with them but it won't be responsible to stay long term otherwise you would like to compromise at middle ground, this establishes your power and makes it look like your sacrificing to stay but are on their side. You can either sit down and work out what's fair or set a number and don't budge on it period.