ditching hps for quantum lights

Discussion in 'Grow Room Design & Setup' started by cobber, Mar 6, 2018.

  1.  
    cobber

    cobber Member

    currently im running dual cheapo 1k hps setups in a 4x8 footprint ive bought a hlg 550 and im looking for opinions on what i should do. im running aircooled lights and feel like im losing a ton of light with the glass what are your guys thoughts on shutting one of the hps hoods down and replacing it with the quantum or should i just finnish up my run until i get a second hlg light
     

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    Tx-Peanutt likes this.
  2.  
    Viceman666

    Viceman666 Well-Known Member

    1000w hps and hlg 550 should be pretty similar in terms of perfomance and yield with the main difference being that the hlg 550 will draw almost half the wattage of your hps.. you seemed pretty advanced in your grow so I wouldnt change the hps at this point to not light stress your plant but thats up to you if you want to take the risk. At the end of the day they will do the exact same thing just one is almost twice as efficient compred to the other.. I love the quantum boards! If you use the same strain it would be great if you compare the result sode by side between hps and quantum... hopefully you will share your result with the community :-)

    Also consider that when you will switch your hps you will probably get lower temps (less heat) so I dont know what the temp in your area/room/tent but keep that in mind! Keep us posted!
     
  3.  
    eyderbuddy

    eyderbuddy Well-Known Member

    I'd play the risk taker and change one of the HPS for the boards just to see what happens. I think that as long as the amount of light doesn't drastically change overnight (it shouldn't) there shouldn't be a bad effect on the plants
     
    medicman69 likes this.
  4.  
    CCCmints

    CCCmints Well-Known Member

    There would absolutely be a drastic change in the amount of light the plants receive. I tested 1000w HPS @ 24" and it produced 892.79 µmoles/m2/s on a 49 point photometric uniformity test. On the 33 point test HLG showcases on their HLG-550 product page, the HLG-550 produced 625µmoles/m2/s. That's a 267.79µmoles/m2/s difference in photons produced. 30% less light output.

    Not to mention the HLG-550 has very poor performance in terms of uniform light distribution.
    1'x1' = 866.66
    2'x2' = 774.11
    3'x3' = 688.80
    4'x4' = 625.00

    Even just calculating the HLG-550's coverage of a 1'x1' space produces lesser results than 1000w HPS over a 4'x4' space.

    This information isn't esoteric. HLG showcases this data on their website. Its not yet possible to succeed 1000w HPS with 50% less power. I'm not sure how that claim isn't a blaring red flag for anyone looking to invest in a lighting system. 50% less power draw, 30% less light output.
     
  5.  
    OldMedUser

    OldMedUser Well-Known Member

    I would have invested in a Light Rail® like the one I bought. Planning to use 1 - 1000W Super HPS on it to light up an 8x4 space. Would prefer two 600W back to back for 50% more light for just 20% more power but I got 2 - 1000W so might as well use one. The Rail only uses 9W so cheap to run.

    :peace:
     
    Chunky Stool likes this.
  6.  
    OldMedUser

    OldMedUser Well-Known Member

    Forgot to mention it will run in an open hood so no glass in the way.
     
  7.  
    Viceman666

    Viceman666 Well-Known Member

    http://www.cree.com/led-components/media/documents/HorticultureReferenceDesign.pdf

    Happy reading ! Stop telling people bullshit because you hate LED.. 500w cob or lm561c is roughly the same as a 1000w hps.. im not saying hps is a bad choice.. with quality LED you just get more efficient and within a few grow at most you get your money back easily.

    What you did is what i call misinformation! Your numbers dont take into account height, spread (better uniformity accross the canopy) and less heat too for LED
     
  8.  
    CCCmints

    CCCmints Well-Known Member

    I don't hate LED. I'm a proponent for LED. Data for the HLG-550 was collected from their website. Data for 1000w HPS was collected using the SQ-500 quantum sensor from Apogee Instruments at a mounting distance of 24".

    The HLG-550 is not a successor to 1000w HPS, it is inferior. If you want to succeed 1000w HPS, you're going to need more than 500w LED. I'll let you figure out the winning number on your own.
     
  9.  
    IndoorScore

    IndoorScore Active Member

    I have to agree with this here. I have two hlg 550s in a 5×10 tent and while I chose the LEDs for power consumption, quality of light output, heat output and the lack of bulb replacement I was looking to maximize grams/watt in a city setting. I just set my harvest down to cure today, and while it will probably dry a touch more but I got 1450 grams off of two 550s with no CO2, no AC, and no trelising from seeds, albiet fire genetics. G/watt is hard to be in such a relatively unadulterated enviornment.

    They work the best or close to it for my space for these various reasons but they are not direct 1k replacements. I love them, and they're nice on the bill and I like reducing my carbon footprint and not spending 180-250 bucks on bulbs a year, but 1ks just put out more juice. I'm guessing 650-700w LEDs in whichever fashion would probably do it.

    Just my 2c
     
  10.  
    CCCmints

    CCCmints Well-Known Member

    All of those reasons are why HLG has satisfied customers. LED truly does bring so many amazing things to the table. However, there is no excuse to base your entire marketing strategy off of a blatant lie. The HLG-550 is not powerful enough to replace 1000w HPS. HLG knows this.

    [​IMG]
    1000w EyeHortilux Super HPS with a 1000w Vivosun digital ballast in a Blockbuster reflector. Data collected with the SQ-500 quantum sensor from Apogee Instruments. Data for the HLG-550 was pulled from its product page.

    The benefits LED provides can create the illusion that you're buying something somewhat as powerful as 1000w HPS. Quantum boards are overpriced for what they are. China is already copying their products and HLG-550s are a whopping 20% off at the moment.

    They're probably great lights for the veg room, but if you're looking to replace 1000w HPS, I wouldn't waste time experimenting with the HLG-550.
     
  11.  
    IndoorScore

    IndoorScore Active Member

    This is also failing to take into account bulb degradation. After a couple hundred hours those HPS bulbs aren't going to be at peak output anymore. I'd be willing to bet the 550 puts out light just as well if not better than the bulb most people have running right now, assuming it's not brand new.

    Lots of ways to skin a cat, but I think discounting the panels in totality based solely off of initial lumens seems a bit shortsighted.
     
  12.  
    CCCmints

    CCCmints Well-Known Member

    I'm not discounting them entirely. That's why I made the comment about how they're probably great in the veg room. But as a 1000w HPS replacement, they do not have what it takes. Anyone can find this information themselves with a quantum sensor and 1000w bulb. HLG-550 doesn't spread well enough to cover a 4x4 space. You can see that in the data above.

    Light degradation is a huge factor. Its something I plan to test. That is one of the reasons I said when running a quantum board as a replacement for your 1000w HPS, you might perceive the HLG-550 to be almost as powerful as your HPS setup. But in reality its just your bulbs have degraded.
     
    boilingoil likes this.
  13.  
    Viceman666

    Viceman666 Well-Known Member

    Just so I understand.. how is that possible that 1152 LED spread over a 2x2 area (or aprox for the hlg 550) have a lower spread than a single light point in a HPS light?

    I just feel its the same debate over and over again but results are there.. hps you will get from 0.5 to 1 g/w and with quality LED (not talking about blurple here) you get 1 to 2 g/w..

    In fact 650-700w in a 4x4 is all you need to get 1000ppfd at any place over all your canopy if you use something like strips (which use same led than quantum board) which would match a DE HPS.. so 500-550w quantum should get you pretty close to a 1000w SE HPS

    You dont believe in LED thats fine but no need to disinform everyone looking for good advice on their next light.

    There has been already a few side by side done but lets be realistic.. in 10 yrs from now we will still have the same debate because its almost impossible to do 2 grow exactly the same way.. and then compare results.. so unless you prove me there is a significant difference between HLG-550 and a 1000w HPS The total Lumen output is about the same keeping in mind that the hps is 360 degrees and loosing light power off the reflection

    Thats just my 2 cents! LED for the win :fire:
     
  14.  
    CCCmints

    CCCmints Well-Known Member

    You're either completely blind or you're not even reading the posts on this thread before replying...No one, not even once, said 1x 1000w HPS could hang with 2x HLG-550s. Your statements are based on nothing. You just randomly come up with stuff like, "..so 500-550w quantum should get you pretty close". I've posted the data. Observe it, note the differences. You've got graphs for 1000w HPS in a 4x4 reflective area and the HLG-550 in a 4x4 reflective area, in this very thread. There is no debate. The HLG-550 has 30% less output over a 4x4 space than 1000w HPS, and nearly the same light uniformity. I've done the tests, you have not.

    I've already stated I'm a proponent for LED. Are you reading my posts? I don't believe in HLG's claims that they've succeeded 1000w HPS with 50% less power draw. That's all.

    I've literally proved it in this thread. The HLG-550 is inferior to 1000w HPS in terms of light output. That is a 100% fact, which you can verify yourself by purchasing a quantum sensor, 1000w setup, and conducting your own photometric uniformity test. Until you've done that, stop posting on this topic. No one needs the opinion of someone who just pulls random data/information out of their ass.
     
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  15.  
    NGA

    NGA Well-Known Member

    I would love to save 50% on my bill but I've been reading for months on led and so on but your looking at $1500 plus on one led , that compares to a1k hps ,1k hps cheap $60 hps bulbs $ 35
     
    Tx-Peanutt likes this.
  16.  
    NGA

    NGA Well-Known Member

    I would love to save 50% on my bill but I've been reading for months on led and so on but your looking at $1500 plus on one led , that compares to a1k hps ,1k hps cheap $60 hps bulbs $ 35
     
    Tx-Peanutt likes this.
  17.  
    NGA

    NGA Well-Known Member

    I would love to save 50% on my bill but I've been reading for months on led and so on but your looking at $1500 plus on one led , that compares to a1k hps ,1k hps cheap $60 hps bulbs $ 35
     
    Tx-Peanutt likes this.
  18.  
    Hotwired

    Hotwired Well-Known Member

    triple post FTW :blsmoke:
     
  19.  
    Hotwired

    Hotwired Well-Known Member

    After reading so many of these LED threads all I'm getting is that watt for watt LED's are better. So the HLG 550 should easily beat a 600 hps but not a 1000.
     
  20.  
    GreenHighlander

    GreenHighlander Well-Known Member

    I always love it when someone with less grows then fingers on most peoples hand, comes around talking like an expert because they read this study and that study online lol
    Please do share your vast knowledge with us humble folk........
    Cheers :)
     
    Tx-Peanutt, AutoNorCal and NGA like this.

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