riddleme
Well-Known Member
I need to start out by explaining how I got the idea for this experiment in the first place. Back in the day (before HID) we used flouros and incandesents to grow, I know this does not jive with what we all say today but that was what we had, the flouros were for spectrum and the incandesents were for heat (cause the flouros did not put off any heat). Now back then I could not of explained the why of it, it was what the published books said back then, so we did it, and it worked.
Having this experience and now constantly reading the tidbits of info here, I keep seeing that to adjust your light you should use your hand to gauge the heat and that 1000 watters grow tighter nugs than 400 watters. Pretty much everyone says this, since I have no such experience, I am pretty much taking thier word for it???
Now, I gotta tell ya that I do not for one second believe that it is the spectrum or the lumens that cause this, The spectrum of most HPS lights sucks IMO as far as plants are concerned and the plant can only process so much light. In my mind, with my way of thinking, I had the idea that what actually made the difference was the heat that the bigger bulbs produce. It was kinda like one of those AhHa moments that make you say Huuummmm?
This and the fact that plants do better in sunlight where I have already shown does not cram lumens up the plants ass. We all know that the sun puts off HEAT and that it is from the far infrared spectrum, so off I went to see if I could find anything to explain my new notion?
I googled the term "infrared plants" now most of what came up was about photography and taking infrared pictures, some of that was interesting but did not really apply too much other than it showed how plants store/collect heat and then give it back off once the sun goes down.
The second most common info that came up was how modern day greenhouses use infrared heat so that they can grow year round, there was also a site that talked about greenhouses using infrared filters (to block it) to keep the plants from getting bigger, this allowed them to harden off more for resale in a given area. This was an interesting tidbit of info as it points out that infrared heat/light has something to do with growth?
Then I found an Ask Ed article from 2005 that was MJ specific and explained exactly what I was starting to see, here is the quote,,,,
I will be putting it on a timer so that the heater comes on 15 minutes before the lights and shuts off 15 minutes after lights out. As this is what plants see under the sun. My CMH bulb has plenty of red spectrum so not expecting to see out of control stretching like you would with incandesents, though there may be some?
And we will see what happens? If I am correct this will very much change the way we grow indoors
Having this experience and now constantly reading the tidbits of info here, I keep seeing that to adjust your light you should use your hand to gauge the heat and that 1000 watters grow tighter nugs than 400 watters. Pretty much everyone says this, since I have no such experience, I am pretty much taking thier word for it???
Now, I gotta tell ya that I do not for one second believe that it is the spectrum or the lumens that cause this, The spectrum of most HPS lights sucks IMO as far as plants are concerned and the plant can only process so much light. In my mind, with my way of thinking, I had the idea that what actually made the difference was the heat that the bigger bulbs produce. It was kinda like one of those AhHa moments that make you say Huuummmm?
This and the fact that plants do better in sunlight where I have already shown does not cram lumens up the plants ass. We all know that the sun puts off HEAT and that it is from the far infrared spectrum, so off I went to see if I could find anything to explain my new notion?
I googled the term "infrared plants" now most of what came up was about photography and taking infrared pictures, some of that was interesting but did not really apply too much other than it showed how plants store/collect heat and then give it back off once the sun goes down.
The second most common info that came up was how modern day greenhouses use infrared heat so that they can grow year round, there was also a site that talked about greenhouses using infrared filters (to block it) to keep the plants from getting bigger, this allowed them to harden off more for resale in a given area. This was an interesting tidbit of info as it points out that infrared heat/light has something to do with growth?
Then I found an Ask Ed article from 2005 that was MJ specific and explained exactly what I was starting to see, here is the quote,,,,
I have bolded the part that made me decide to do this. So in an effort to re-create the sun in my basement and add infrared heat/light to my garden I installed the Presto heat dish and made it temp controlled with it aimed at what will be my canopy and the thermostat on the opposite wall. This will allow me to adjust the light for proper lumens (intensity) at the canopy and still have the effects of heat.Infrared light
By Ed Rosenthal - Monday, November 7 2005 Tags:
Can my plants detect infrared light?
I want to use an infrared camera to keep tabs on my grow room during the dark phase. How does the camera work? Is infrared within the spectrum that the plant can see?
Porcelli Giovanni,
Internet
The electromagnetic spectrum is categorized by wavelength. The longer the wave, the less energy it holds. So blue light, which has a short wavelength of 475 nanometers, has more energy than red light, which has a wavelength of 660 nm. Infrared light is just beyond the range of human vision at 730nm. Although we cannot see it, we can feel infrared radiation as warmth. For instance, a glowing charcoal emits red light in the visible spectrum and infrared light that we sense as heat.
Every object emits infrared radiation from its surface. So an object with a cold surface emits less and an object with a warm surface emits more. That's how an infrared camera works. It records a photo of the infrared rays emitted by the objects in the picture. Plants are usually a little warmer than the surrounding environment, so they are lighter. Water and moist objects such as soil are often cooler and darker. Even a totally dark room yields an infrared picture.
Since the camera is only recording waves that are already there and is not projecting any light into the space, it has no effect on the plants. If you take an infrared photo outside your space, you can see how much heat is escaping and how it's leaving. You might find that of interest also.
The plants use red and infrared light to regulate stem growth and flowering response. Plant cells produce a chemical called a phytochrome, which has two versions. One version, PR, is sensitive to red light (660 nm). Red light converts PR into PFR. PFR signals the plant to grow short stocky stems and also helps the plant grow into specific shapes. The plants also use red and infrared light to measure uninterrupted darkness. As far as plants are concerned in terms of flowering, if there's no red light, it's dark.
PFR is sensitive to infrared light (730 nm), which converts it into PR. When PR levels build to a critical amount, scientists hypothesize that a hormone called floragen becomes active and induces the plant to flower. The reason floragen is called hypothetical is that researchers can see its effects, but they haven't found it yet.
PFR reverts to PR naturally. For PFR to be present, it must be renewed continuously by the presence of red light. When plants are shaded, they get less of the needed red light. In the absence of red light, the PR version predominates and the stem stretches to reach the light. Lower side branches shaded by leaves
from above have PR and grow longer until they reach the light. Then they modify their growth in the presence of PFR.
Outdoors during the day, there is more red light than infrared. However, at dawn and dusk the first and last light from the sun isn't the visible red of the rising or setting sun, but infrared, which is at the far end of the electromagnetic spectrum. The infrared converts the PFR to PR and the critical dark-time begins or ends its countdown.
This has too many implications for them all to be discussed here. For instance, it explains why plants grown under incandescent lamps stretch (more infrared than red light). The effects of the two spectrums can also be used in innovative indoor lighting programs.
Readers with grow questions (or answers) should send them to Ed at: Ask Ed, PMB 147, 530 Divisadero St., San Francisco, California 94117, USA
You can also email Ed at [email protected], and send queries via his websites at www.ask-ed.net.
All featured questions will be rewarded with a copy of Ed's new book, Best of Ask Ed: Your Marijuana Questions Answered. Sorry, Ed cannot send personal replies to your questions.
I will be putting it on a timer so that the heater comes on 15 minutes before the lights and shuts off 15 minutes after lights out. As this is what plants see under the sun. My CMH bulb has plenty of red spectrum so not expecting to see out of control stretching like you would with incandesents, though there may be some?
And we will see what happens? If I am correct this will very much change the way we grow indoors
Kinda like 3 grew together. It seems cooler than the MH, and if it's cooler than the HPS, it's not by much. I think it would give you a sunburn given a bit too long. 
