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Do NOT vote against I-502... hear me out.

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forums; To all who have read the initiative, and been disappointed with DUI provisions, know that law enforcement still must bide ...
  1. #1
    Stranger Stranger
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    Default Do NOT vote against I-502... hear me out.

    To all who have read the initiative, and been disappointed with DUI provisions, know that law enforcement still must bide by probable cause. A LEO can not force a marijuana test upon you without probable cause (NOT reasonable suspicion). To have probable cause that you are committing DUI; your vehicle must reek of weed (however that alone could not convict you), you must be visually impaired, or you must be noticeably driving recklessly or poorly. Be aware, the provisions explicitly exclude testing for the presence of marijuana metabolites, in pursuit of gathering evidence for a DUI charge. Furthermore, I am confident it would be very hard to convict a marijuana user of a DUI, even if you were guilty and high as a kite, there is little evidence marijuana impairs driving ability. A DUI charge should be able to be easily defeated, by a competent attorney, if you invest in your legal defense. If you are a legitimate serious chronic medical patient, you could easily mount a defense that you will ALWAYS have more than 5ng/l in your system. For you to actually get charged with a DUI the arresting officer would have to be corrupt and intentionally trying to cause you harm, and a corrupt police officer doesn't need this DUI provision to harass you, he has many tools in his belt.

    This initiative is an important first step, even if it is badly structured. Many people are blowing the DUI provision out of proportion, claiming this was intentionally placed in the bill as way to harass marijuana users. If a LEO wanted to harass you, he would regardless. I hope no one on this forum votes No, as I fear public outrage is waning with the constant onslaught of bad press the medical community seems to be getting.

    Let me hear what you think, do I have too much faith in the legislature? I just don't see this provision as being all that bad, I see it as being unenforceable.
    Be realistic, it is unlikely we are going to get a perfect piece of legislature, this one ain't that bad, I say we take it.

    This provision doesn't change anything, you can get charged with DUI tomorrow if an officer notices you're visibly high. This provision introduces no new law, driving under the influence of cannabis is already illegal, but it does shed more spotlight on the issue and therefore increase police awareness.
    http://www.washingtondui.com/seattle...g-dui-attorney

    by the way, the latest poll (June 19) shows 50% support, 37% oppose.. every vote counts guys.

    Please read: NORML's Official Reply to 'Patients Against I-502'
    http://blog.norml.org/2012/02/24/normls-official-reply-to-patients-against-i-502/

    We would urge those who support marijuana legalization, but oppose specific provision of I-502, to nonetheless support this initiative because of the importance of 1.) having one state actually approve legalization and confront the federal government on this issue, and 2.) stopping thousands of expensive and damaging arrests, prosecutions and incarcerations annually in WA for cannabis-related offenses, notably for simple possession.

    For those who feel they cannot support the current initiative, because it is not perfect, we would hope they would step aside and take no public position, in order not to undermine what is an historic opportunity to end marijuana prohibition, by popular vote, under state law.
    Last edited by soburntoutman; 08-05-2012 at 08:33 AM.
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  2. #2
    Learning How To Roll Learning How To Roll
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    Why would you think that this is a good thing? The lesser of two evils???? Bullshi*!!!!! We all know that when a bill comes to pass, it is loaded with "earmarks" that have NOTHING to do with the bill in the first place. It's just layers and layers of crap. It up to interpretation as to who is going to benefit, how it's going to be implemented, if they are going to enforce it etc etc....I am not confident of how this would be handled by our states and local government, how can YOU be confident in it? I live in a country that doesn't approve of it, I live in a state that did approved medical marijuana but I live in a city that has a ban on any new medical marijuana businesses. Go figure! The law needs to be clear and simple and NOT open to interpretation by some ego maniac attorney general or mayor.

  3. #3
    Stranger Stranger
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    When did I say this way a good thing? I think it's absolutely idiotic. The initiative is NOT full of earmarks, how about you read it? I am saying it would be nearly impossible for any court to convict you of a DUI, and furthermore for you to be so stoned you actually get pulled over for your shit driving, you shouldn't be on the road.

    Even if I'm wrong, this changes nothing. Driving under the influence of any level of cannabis is illegal NOW, this makes it more legal.
    coolkid.02 and VLRD.Kush like this.

  4. #4
    Ganja Smoker Pot Head CharlieBud's Avatar
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    My body may not testify against me without my permission. I'm pretty sure the Founding Fathers would consider per se DUI laws as outlandish and illegal as making their hemp crops a felony. Its bad enough when the politicians give us bad laws, inexcusable when we initiative in our own for the purposes of corporate special interests.

    All 502 gives you is the "freedom" to buy an ounce of cannabis from the State. This is not liberty, but it IS idiotic.

    Only in 2012 do people think their freedom looks like a law that lets you acquire something from, or with the permission of, the State.
    Thou shalt not ban God's creation!
    "a free people [claim] their rights as derived from the laws of nature, and not as the gift of their chief magistrate." - Thomas Jefferson, 1774

  5. #5
    Ganja Smoker Pot Head coolkid.02's Avatar
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    The benefits of this Initiative far out-weigh the negatives in my opinion. Vote Yes!

    This is clearly a personal decision everyone must make.

    However, I wish to see less people going to jail for marijuana...this will certainly drastically decrease that number.

  6. #6
    Teaching How To Roll Mr. Ganja colonuggs's Avatar
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    No it wont...Why would anyone vote YES for something that only monoplizes weed sales and distribution... only the State will profit from this

    If you can NOT grow marijuana in the privacy of your own home LEGALLY without penalty...then its NOT legalization...PERIOD

    VOTE YES ON I - 514.

    So to recap I-502 ....WE are legalizing marijuana...you can buy only it from us .... dont you grow it yourself and try to cut us out.... thats illegal

    If I relied on others for my marijuana I would have spent $100s of 1000s over the past 25 yrs....... insted I have saved that
    Last edited by colonuggs; 08-08-2012 at 04:49 AM.

  7. #7
    Stranger Stranger SinisterBuds's Avatar
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    Default No on I-502

    I agree 100% Colonuggs. Its NOT legalization when they tell you, you CANT do something.

    F**k I-502 when they tell me I cant grow a plant that helps my dad walk without pain, and F**k I-502 when they wanna charge $300-400/ounce to help him get out of bed.

    There's an even better chance that the "store fronts" wont come to existance because Washington state wont put their state employees into a position that violates Federal Law.

    coolkid.02...people will still be going to jail if they didnt buy their pot from the state run stores, because the likelyhood of them being open is slim. So that bag you got from your buddy...The one who is growing a plant illegally, is still gonna be illegal...Not because its pot, but because you didnt give your money to the state.

    And soburntoutman...driving under the influence is irresponsible...no matter what the substance. If you're drozy because of a Benadryl, you can still kill somebody when you fall asleep at the wheel.

    "Driving under the influence of any level of cannabis is illegal NOW, this makes it more legal." So you're alright with irresponsible behavior being more legal, even though its still dangerous and irresponsible? Like those ads for "Buzzed Driving" say...You can still kill somebody when you're buzzed. 5ng/l is a ridiculously low amount, and most heavy smokers will have that much THC in their system for a month after they last smoked. But focusing on the DUI aspect of I-502 because it'll give people a way to get out of a ticket for irresponsible behavior is just wrong.

    I-502 is a way for the state to squeeze out money from its citizens, and its money they will never see...Because marijuana is still a Schedule 1 drug, and profiting from the sale of that substance is illegal on a federal level. I-502 is a lose lose for everybody...But especially the people who need medical marijuana the most.

    Vote NO on I-502
    Last edited by SinisterBuds; 08-08-2012 at 05:52 PM.

  8. #8
    420 TIME Stoner WaxxyNuggets's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by coolkid.02 View Post
    The benefits of this Initiative far out-weigh the negatives in my opinion. Vote Yes!

    This is clearly a personal decision everyone must make.

    However, I wish to see less people going to jail for marijuana...this will certainly drastically decrease that number.
    Its people like you who are gonna get this passed, don't be stupid, tell everyone you know NO on 502, you are wrong in your position if you care about your "freedom"
    tryingtogrow89 and joefarmer like this.

  9. #9
    Ganja Smoker Pot Head coolkid.02's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WaxxyNuggets View Post
    Its people like you who are gonna get this passed, don't be stupid, tell everyone you know NO on 502, you are wrong in your position if you care about your "freedom"
    It's a difference of opinion.

    Keep it classy

    There is no such thing as true "freedom"

    I will admit this is not a very good bill for those of us with Authorizations

    However, if you are not Authorized in this state I see no pitfall...

  10. #10
    Stranger Stranger SinisterBuds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by coolkid.02 View Post
    It's a difference of opinion.

    Keep it classy

    There is no such thing as true "freedom"

    I will admit this is not a very good bill for those of us with Authorizations

    However, if you are not Authorized in this state I see no pitfall...
    True "freedom" is anarchy...
    The state of Washington cant even get the laws straight for medical marijuana users and growers. Making it available to everybody over the age of 21 is only asking for a pitfall for everyone involved, and the people who will suffer most will be the people who need it the most...Not the recreational user, or the person who just loves to get high and veg on the couch every day. Its the person who cant get out of bed because their Rheumatoid Arthritis makes it too painful to walk or the person who cant get out of the house due to their Crohns. I'm all for decriminalization and legalization, but we need to step carefully through this mine field, and avoid running through it...or it'll take our legs out from under us, and I-502 is a step in the wrong direction that will leave us surrounded by issues which will blow up in our faces.

    Again, please Vote No on I-502
    Last edited by SinisterBuds; 08-08-2012 at 10:29 PM.

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