What can I add to these parts to improve them?

Will Thayer

Well-Known Member
Hello This is my first post on any forum for about 16 years. I lived in the Netherlands back then and had fun on a seed swapping forum sharing genetics with growers all over the world.

I am a competent gardener and would like to bring myself up to speed with DIY leds.

Parts I have :
10 x CXA2530 4500K
10 x CXA2530 3000K
2 x HLG-185H-C500B
4 x 1000mm x 150mm x 15mm Aluminium heatsinks

From reading over you guys threads I know my parts are not top drawer but I want to use them for now. They were a low cost option inspired by Growmau5's mega panel.
Please help me to decide how I should add to the above parts to get most out of 3x3 space.

Cheers,
Will
 

Rahz

Well-Known Member
I would build two lamps with the emitters in a 5x2 configuration. Join the heatsinks with some angle aluminum and mount the driver in the middle. With that much metal you should be able to run them without fans.
 

Will Thayer

Well-Known Member
Thank you Rahz,
I was wondering if it would be worth my while to add a few strings of monochromes like deep reds and the like. I have only ever grown with HPS/MH in the past and never really considered spectrum beyond Red= flower blue=veg.
I have a small grow I just started with 2 x 140w Plantphotonics panels I bought from the company when they were just getting started. Looking at them showed me that plants see light different than I do.

Cheers,
Will
 

Rahz

Well-Known Member
While I guess customizing the spectrum is a good idea I'd also bet that in practice the gains will be minimal. These white COBs in the 3000-4000K range already have nice peaks in the red/blue. Not sure if you are mixing the 4500 and 3000 together or intend to have two separate lamps with separate functions. I think 3000K CXA already has excellent red/blue ratio.
 

Will Thayer

Well-Known Member
That is good to hear. Less hassle. I was thinking to put 5 cobs on each heatsink evenly spaced and alternate 3000k and 4500k. Run 10 x for each HLG-185H-C500B. I will actively cool the heatsinks.

The area will be modular scrog flower area. I veg in a separate area.

Cheers,
Will
 

littlejacob

Well-Known Member
Bonjour
Could you tell me please how much did you buy the 2530 ? And where?
I guess in EU since you used metric system for heatsink!
I would make 4 pannels of 5 for spread and cob positioning....1 on each side + 1 in the middle! Jmo!
Have a great day ★
 

Will Thayer

Well-Known Member
Bonjour ami, oui, je suis en Europe.
le système métrique est plus logique pour moi:)
Prices:
CXA2530 4500k 10 x $9.68 = $96.80(86.33 euro) https://www.fasttech.com/product/2250000
CXA2530 3000k 10 x $6.60 = $66.0(58.70 euro) http://www.newark.com/cree/cxa2530-0000-000n00s40e7/led-hb-white-3372lm-screw/dp/44W6079
Heatsinks RAD-P3698/1000 4 x 27.25 euro = 109.0 euro www.tme.pl

Pardonnez- moi, même si ma mère est de cannes . Je suis né dans le pays de cheeseburgers et rock n roll.I parler français très très mauvais.

Cheers,
Will
 
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Will Thayer

Well-Known Member
Driving the COBs at 500ma gives me around 17w per COB, does that sound right? I am looking to build two fixtures to cover around 2 maybe 2.5ft by 6ft.
I am starting to think I need to add a few more powerful COBs. Anyone have any thought?

If I put say 3x CXA3070 in the middle would they have to be further away from the canopy?

Cheers,
Will
 

littlejacob

Well-Known Member
Bonjour...mon ami!
Is everything okay for your mom?
We had a terrible storm Saturday...(more than 20 dead!).and I was in the middle of it...frightened!
For bloom people advice here (for cxa/b and vero) is 30w per sq/ft!
So 2.5×6=15sq/ft...15×30=450W
So 1 hlg-185 + 1 hlg-240...sorry I don't know the Vf and Watt of 2530... (or the bin!)
Did you buy the 2530 already?
5.90 € in newark...with shipping?
Have a great day ★
 

HockeyBeard

Well-Known Member
Driving the COBs at 500ma gives me around 17w per COB, does that sound right? I am looking to build two fixtures to cover around 2 maybe 2.5ft by 6ft.
I am starting to think I need to add a few more powerful COBs. Anyone have any thought?

If I put say 3x CXA3070 in the middle would they have to be further away from the canopy?

Cheers,
Will
I'd probably want to drive them a little harder.
 

Randomblame

Well-Known Member
Hey Will!
Nice to meet veterans living not far away!
IMO there is no need to add more cobs or drive them harder, also if the cxa2530 S4 are from the lower binning end.
If the cobs are only 37,5% efficient at 500mA and your tent is 90x 90cm, then you can expect around 700 to 750μMols ppfd.
More than enough to reach 1gpw!
Also you will only need a low driven fan per heatsink because you have less than 60w of heat per heatsink at 500mA.
 

littlejacob

Well-Known Member
"AquariusPanta, post: 11970144, member: 886695"]@Will Thayer

From my experience, you could have a unopticated (bare) COB, running under 30W, as close as 4" or ~11 cm from canopy without bleaching taking place.[/QUOTE]
Bonjour
You mean 4inch from cob.to plant with any cob under 30w?
A cxb 3590 3500ºk 36V cd @700mA (25w) could be close as that?!?
I need a vegg pannel for 12sq/ft...about 200w! But I only have 80cm (31inches) tall so I wanted to be able to put only 4/6inches between cob/plants!
So if you assure me that every cobs under 30w are ok for my height I will be happy!
Have a great day ★
 

Rahz

Well-Known Member
I'm using Vero 18v1 at nominal. Bleaching occurs at about 3 inches. I would love to show a pic, stretchy indica outgrew my space. Since the lamp is passive it's just radial heatsinks on a frame. The lamp is about 5 inches under the canopy! Had a buddy over he busted out laughing when he saw it. I told him this light really penetrates down in the canopy. Consequentially I will probably have my best yield to date from that lamp. 1.2 gpw was my previous best.

CXB 3590 at 25 watts is putting out a good bit more light than my Veros. Probably fine up to about 5 inches I bet.
 

alesh

Well-Known Member
Hey Will!
Nice to meet veterans living not far away!
IMO there is no need to add more cobs or drive them harder, also if the cxa2530 S4 are from the lower binning end.
If the cobs are only 37,5% efficient at 500mA and your tent is 90x 90cm, then you can expect around 700 to 750μMols ppfd.
More than enough to reach 1gpw!
Also you will only need a low driven fan per heatsink because you have less than 60w of heat per heatsink at 500mA.
Higher PPFD will result in smaller g/W figure. It's more like 'Still not too much to reach 1gpw' ;)
 

AquariusPanta

Well-Known Member
Higher PPFD will result in smaller g/W figure. It's more like 'Still not too much to reach 1gpw' ;)
Hey Alesh. Are you referring to dissipated watts or PAR W, which takes into account efficiency? If you get the time, can you please demonstrate your claim in a hypothetical equation?

@littlejacob

You point out something very important. My mentioned experience is solely tied to Vero 18's, ran at 1050mA (~31W), with bleaching taking place directly below the emitter at ~4". That was at around 37% efficiency (light), so any COB running more efficient at similar wattage will more likely need to be raised an extra inch or two for bleach prevention. All plants are different as well, so some strains, such as select landraces, may be better suited for closer interaction with light sources.
 

Will Thayer

Well-Known Member
@littlejacob
Thank you for your concern about My Mom. She is fine she was born in Cannes but now lives in Texas. The cobs from Newark are on the way. They charge $29 for European shipping. (mouser seems better for shipping here.The heatsinks arrived from Tme.pl and they look like a real bargain.

@HockeyBeard
Thanks for the advice, I kinda committed to the 500ma when I bought the drivers. This whole thing is me dipping my toe in the water. Once I build the lights and my confidence in the process I will look to upgrade.

@Randomblame
Thanks for your Info, I think your right. For now I will stick with what I have and see how I get on. I am also running 2x 140w panels from plant photonics in the same room. It will be interesting to compare them with the Cobs. I do plan to run 120mm fans at 5v for each heatsink. 1gpw sounds like a good start! I think I can handle the plants needs, the Led side of things is new to me.

@AquariusPanta
Thank you for this info, my intention was to run them really close and un-opticated (nice word) and your distance measurements appeal to me. I have height restrictions hence the scrog. I will keep an eye on the distance and the plants reaction and find a height that suits.
 

Will Thayer

Well-Known Member
@alesh
What you're saying is that if I ran more efficient Cobs that my gpw would be higher because of a better lm/w conversion. Is this correct.
I must admit when Randomblame mentioned PPFD I had to Google it. Is there a formula to calculate this stuff?

Cheers,
Will
 

littlejacob

Well-Known Member
Bonjour
Is reflector and lenses a good (THE!)choice when you have more cob at lower current to focus the light or Is it better for few cob at higher current?
CU
 

alesh

Well-Known Member
Hey Alesh. Are you referring to dissipated watts or PAR W, which takes into account efficiency? If you get the time, can you please demonstrate your claim in a hypothetical equation?

@littlejacob

You point out something very important. My mentioned experience is solely tied to Vero 18's, ran at 1050mA (~31W), with bleaching taking place directly below the emitter at ~4". That was at around 37% efficiency (light), so any COB running more efficient at similar wattage will more likely need to be raised an extra inch or two for bleach prevention. All plants are different as well, so some strains, such as select landraces, may be better suited for closer interaction with light sources.
No efficiency isn't taken into account.
2 setups, first 500 µmol/s/m^2, second one 1000 µmol/s/m^2. Efficiency is the same which means that the second setup dissipates twice as much energy. Well, while the second one will yield more, it won't yield twice as much and g/W is going to be smaller than the first one.
 
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