Thoughts on this new organic mix, veterans et al? For a 100L no till bed on wheels

DonTesla

DonTesla

Well-Known Member
Hey folks, DT here, with a little challenge for yall..
If you can, let me know your thoughts on this next batch..
Looking to up the TRIA a bit, dusts, pho and calcium too

Thinking 85 L base plus 6 L amendments plus 10L AACT for a hi end organic ~100L no till
Here's the theory so far..

Base:
22L Coir
23L dons poop mix (~15% EWC, 10% O/CManure, of total)
20L humus dirt black earth
20L perlite

Rocks:
3 cups glacial rock dust
1 cup rock phos
2 cups de rocks
3 cups semi-ground shells
1.5 cups greensand
2 cups bio char
(Thats 12.5 cups total or 3.6% of base volume)
14 cups total if I can good gypsum (would add ~1.5 cups)
Would 15 or 16 cups be better? Somehow..lol

Meals:
1.5 cups kelp meal
2.5 cups alfalfa meal (too much? The rev would do 3, jus FYI)
1 cup neem meal
1 cup fish bone meal
2 cups crust or shell crab meal (if I can find)

Fungal food:
1 cup Organic oat groats (chitinase source too, big up@coughphee.connoiseur for dat)
3 cups rice hulls, whole
1 cup rice and oat flour, on top
1 cup myco fungi, granular, post mellow

Flowering:
Onetime (1x) TRIA aact tea (with alfalfa seed)
1x Diy Pho-cal app
1x coconut water app
1x aloe misting, All in 1st week

Microbes/bene's:
10 L BSM Ewc AACT
(Diy Lacto bact.)

Bed Mulch:
White clover

Respect, mon, and thanks in advance!
 
DonTesla

DonTesla

Well-Known Member
Thinking 6 cups of Glacial Rock dust now, which brings the rock mix up to 15.5 cups or a sweet 4.20% of volume.
thanks DonPetro
..
@Pattahabi @st0wandgrow
Any of the heavy weights wanna chime in here?
Would be much love

Props,
DT
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
DonTesla said:
Thinking 6 cups of Glacial Rock dust now, which brings the rock mix up to 15.5 cups or a sweet 4.20% of volume.
thanks DonPetro
..
@Pattahabi @st0wandgrow
Any of the heavy weights wanna chime in here?
Would be much love

Props,
DT
Click to expand...
that looks pretty good man, I like the usage of greensand for the future, langbeinite is good for that as well.
Only thing i'd do differently is replace the coco with peat (and add oyster shells and flour for ph control). replace the perlite with volcanic rock or pumice.
but those are minor things, your recipe is perfectly fine.
Although i'm confused on the application rates, the ingredients are perfect, but i'm sorta confused on the amounts.
Just not sure if that's per cubic meter? or??
 
DonTesla

DonTesla

Well-Known Member
greasemonkeymann said:
that looks pretty good man, I like the usage of greensand for the future, langbeinite is good for that as well.
Only thing i'd do differently is replace the coco with peat (and add oyster shells and flour for ph control). replace the perlite with volcanic rock or pumice.
but those are minor things, your recipe is perfectly fine.
Although i'm confused on the application rates, the ingredients are perfect, but i'm sorta confused on the amounts.
Just not sure if that's per cubic meter? or??
Click to expand...
What's good, GreaseMonk!?
The first heavyweight chimes in..

Gotta use up what I got but yeah looking forward to eliminating perlite after this last batch here for sure.
Oyster shells might go in if I can get them this week too.

But yea size wise that be per the whole bed / batch bruh,
so 3.67 cubic feet. Used to do 3 cubic foot but upped it to fill the totes that We mellow in..may as well maximize right.

So yea 90L if that helps. Bout 22.5 us gallons

You can always just drop your thoughts on what you think is good per cubic metre or whatever your batches are and I can do the conversions, that's cool.

Basically these are my sourced amendments for this round ATM, and I want to get it mellowing so it can be used in June.

Its the ideal meal and rock ratios I otta hone in on..
Thanks for dropping in,
DT
 
st0wandgrow

st0wandgrow

Well-Known Member
Looks great DT! Even though I'm a Canuck I haven't used the metric system in ages.... so I figure everything by gallon, cubic foot, etc.

Coot recomends around 2 cups per cubic foot (7.5 gallons) of your meals, and 3-4 cups per cubic foot of your minerals. Looks like you're pretty damn close to that.

The only new thing that I'm messing with now is bokashi bran. I've been adding 1 cup per cubic foot of this. You'll get some crazy fungal action from this input. Here's a couple links on how to make the serum, which you then add to your substrate (bran, rice hulls, shredded news paper.... pretty much any carbon-rich substance). You can also use the serum/LAB as a soil drench or foliar too. Similar concept to AACT's, but you will be cultivating different, anaerobic microbes with this.

Serum:

http://theunconventionalfarmer.com/recipes/lactobacillus-serum/

Bokashi Bran:

http://theunconventionalfarmer.com/how-to-make-bokashi-bran/
 
DonTesla

DonTesla

Well-Known Member
st0wandgrow said:
Looks great DT! Even though I'm a Canuck I haven't used the metric system in ages.... so I figure everything by gallon, cubic foot, etc.

Coot recomends around 2 cups per cubic foot (7.5 gallons) of your meals, and 3-4 cups per cubic foot of your minerals. Looks like you're pretty damn close to that.

The only new thing that I'm messing with now is bokashi bran. I've been adding 1 cup per cubic foot of this. You'll get some crazy fungal action from this input. Here's a couple links on how to make the serum, which you then add to your substrate (bran, rice hulls, shredded news paper.... pretty much any carbon-rich substance). You can also use the serum/LAB as a soil drench or foliar too. Similar concept to AACT's, but you will be cultivating different, anaerobic microbes with this.

Serum:

http://theunconventionalfarmer.com/recipes/lactobacillus-serum/

Bokashi Bran:

http://theunconventionalfarmer.com/how-to-make-bokashi-bran/
Click to expand...
Sweet tits buddy! More next level skills fo ya boy!! Ye!
Everyone likes Us gallons, eh, lol, np np, I can work with that..
So double checked volume, its a 3.2 cubic foot batch or 24 us gallons

So 2 cups of meal per ft3, would be 6.4 cups.. I'm at 6 cups without shell or crust crab meal, which I don't have, atm, so that's not bad eh

And 3.5 cups of minerals per ft3, would be 11.2..
I'm at 15.5 or 12.5 if u don't include egg /oyster shells .. Since we talking 6 cups of GRD now vs just 3.
Are eggshells considered minerals? Yes, right.

I gotta eat mad omelettes for the next few weeks to get my shell count up, or I need them damn oyster shells already, lol.

Either way tho, looking better than ever..
Thanks for chiming in big guy
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
DonTesla said:
What's good, GreaseMonk!?
The first heavyweight chimes in..

Gotta use up what I got but yeah looking forward to eliminating perlite after this last batch here for sure.
Oyster shells might go in if I can get them this week too.

But yea size wise that be per the whole bed / batch bruh,
so 3.67 cubic feet. Used to do 3 cubic foot but upped it to fill the totes that We mellow in..may as well maximize right.

So yea 90L if that helps. Bout 22.5 us gallons

You can always just drop your thoughts on what you think is good per cubic metre or whatever your batches are and I can do the conversions, that's cool.

Basically these are my sourced amendments for this round ATM, and I want to get it mellowing so it can be used in June.

Its the ideal meal and rock ratios I otta hone in on..
Thanks for dropping in,
DT
Click to expand...
if you do use the coco, you will be ok without the oyster stuff, I personally like the look of oyster shells in my soil.... me like shiny stuff..:eyesmoke:
Nah, seriously though, it does help drainage, and soil tension too, we all know peat likes to "contract" a lil when it dries, I have some odd techniques that I like to use, one is to buy the thick coco"wool", the stuff they use to line baskets with, look almost like a bird nest, then I cut those into strips (about 6 inches long and one inch wide) and have them in my soil when I re-amend/fluff, I use them vertically (like five or so) and it helps a TON on the soils drainage, and the roots fill the "wool" with super white hairs, i'm ALLLL about drainage and aeration, I think it's probably a good 50% of my mix, when you count the biochar, the pumice, volcanic rock, leftover perlite (from the original vermifire), the rotted treelogs (my fav, the roots go NUTS over those) and the coco wool strips and my soil has TONS of oxygen in it.
Between the aeration and my homemade compost, and I swear I could have a 5yr old grow this
I just sit back and try not to interfere, I swear they grow themselves.
I think your recipe is pretty good man.
Maybe add a lil more aeration to help with that manure, that can be thick stuff..
Seven cups of amendments IS on the low side, BUT, that on a typical recipe that doesn't have manure, so I think you are good man.:clap:
I would do more aeration though.
but like I said, i'm a lil nutty with my aeration..
Maybe more biochar, I have MUCH more biochar than 3-4%
I have probably at least 2 cups per cubic foot, so i'd add maybe another liter of biochar (maybe two), charge it first though, don't forget about that part.
Alfalfa tea, urine tea, blood meal tea, comfrey tea, all those work, for charging.
I'd do alfalfa, urine or comfrey.
And yea, I've gotten shit over the urine thing, but whatever.
 
green_machine_two9er

green_machine_two9er

Well-Known Member
greasemonkeymann said:
if you do use the coco, you will be ok without the oyster stuff, I personally like the look of oyster shells in my soil.... me like shiny stuff..:eyesmoke:
Nah, seriously though, it does help drainage, and soil tension too, we all know peat likes to "contract" a lil when it dries, I have some odd techniques that I like to use, one is to buy the thick coco"wool", the stuff they use to line baskets with, look almost like a bird nest, then I cut those into strips (about 6 inches long and one inch wide) and have them in my soil when I re-amend/fluff, I use them vertically (like five or so) and it helps a TON on the soils drainage, and the roots fill the "wool" with super white hairs, i'm ALLLL about drainage and aeration, I think it's probably a good 50% of my mix, when you count the biochar, the pumice, volcanic rock, leftover perlite (from the original vermifire), the rotted treelogs (my fav, the roots go NUTS over those) and the coco wool strips and my soil has TONS of oxygen in it.
Between the aeration and my homemade compost, and I swear I could have a 5yr old grow this
I just sit back and try not to interfere, I swear they grow themselves.
I think your recipe is pretty good man.
Maybe add a lil more aeration to help with that manure, that can be thick stuff..
Seven cups of amendments IS on the low side, BUT, that on a typical recipe that doesn't have manure, so I think you are good man.:clap:
I would do more aeration though.
but like I said, i'm a lil nutty with my aeration..
Maybe more biochar, I have MUCH more biochar than 3-4%
I have probably at least 2 cups per cubic foot, so i'd add maybe another liter of biochar (maybe two), charge it first though, don't forget about that part.
Alfalfa tea, urine tea, blood meal tea, comfrey tea, all those work, for charging.
I'd do alfalfa, urine or comfrey.
And yea, I've gotten shit over the urine thing, but whatever.
Click to expand...
charging biochar is just mxing with a tea for a day or so before mixing into soil??
 
st0wandgrow

st0wandgrow

Well-Known Member
greasemonkeymann said:
I don't even think it's needed to do it that long, I soaked them for like 2 hrs, and they are full of enough nitrogen to where it won't take any from your soil,, I do the same for my rotted tree chunks too, only that one is more of an AACT.
Click to expand...
The article I linked recommends charging the biochar for 14 days
 
DonTesla

DonTesla

Well-Known Member
greasemonkeymann said:
.... me like shiny stuff..:eyesmoke:
Nah, seriously though..
I'd do alfalfa, urine or comfrey.
And yea, I've gotten shit over the urine thing, but whatever.
Click to expand...
Hahaha.. I bet time flies at your mechanic shop, Gmonk!

st0wandgrow said:
The article I linked recommends charging the biochar for 14 days
Click to expand...
Yeah 2 weeks minimum hey? Or a year if dry composting without an airtight foil.. It's a moist, anaerobic process ideally right..
Can I just pee on them chunks and put them in? I think not..Lol

From stow's article link..
"Principles of biochar charging

If biochar is incorporated pure and without activation into the soil, its high adsorption capacity and increasing CEC will result in the absorption and fixing of available nutrients and water in the soil. This in turn may lead to inhibition of plant growth, at least in the beginning (several months to a year) and depending on the soil's nutrient content. To prevent this, it is recommended that prior to biochar's application, biochar should be:

1. loaded with nutrients and water
2. colonized with microorganisms, so that the fixed nutrients are more easily available to plants
3. aged by oxidation, to bring CEC close to its maximum "

What about an AACT? They go anaerobic at about 42 hours right.. so can I not just soak and bubble some char chunks in there for say 2 days? Would that not be satisfying the above 3 points?

That'd be great, and save me a good 11 days

Let me know your thoughts, boys..
Thanks,
DonTe
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
st0wandgrow said:
The article I linked recommends charging the biochar for 14 days
Click to expand...
holy crap!
I mean... how much can you "soak" it
after its saturated...
Seems to be ok in my soil though, that's the first I've heard of such a long soak.
I imagine it'd be a smelly bitch... a high nitrogen fermented biochar tea.... yumm
Unless it's aerated, I admit I haven't read the article yet
-----edit---
Ok I did read it, but its a lil confusing, it also says you can use it with a "liquid nutrient" and that, that procedure would only be two days..
I'm confused..
Either way, Biochar RULES, i'll never go without it again, and even if it did sequester nutrients, BFD, it'll just leach it back into the soil, it's not like the biochar eats it.
Interesting article though, good find stow
 
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greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
DonTesla said:
Hahaha.. I bet time flies at your mechanic shop, Gmonk!



Yeah 2 weeks minimum hey? Or a year if dry composting without an airtight foil.. It's a moist, anaerobic process ideally right..
Can I just pee on them chunks and put them in? I think not..Lol

From stow's article link..
"Principles of biochar charging

If biochar is incorporated pure and without activation into the soil, its high adsorption capacity and increasing CEC will result in the absorption and fixing of available nutrients and water in the soil. This in turn may lead to inhibition of plant growth, at least in the beginning (several months to a year) and depending on the soil's nutrient content. To prevent this, it is recommended that prior to biochar's application, biochar should be:

1. loaded with nutrients and water
2. colonized with microorganisms, so that the fixed nutrients are more easily available to plants
3. aged by oxidation, to bring CEC close to its maximum "

What about an AACT? They go anaerobic at about 42 hours right.. so can I not just soak and bubble some char chunks in there for say 2 days? Would that not be satisfying the above 3 points?

That'd be great, and save me a good 11 days

Let me know your thoughts, boys..
Thanks,
DonTe
Click to expand...
precisely why I didn't do it a long time, I made an AACT and then soaked em with that and a lil dandelion/comfrey tea.
I don't know, i'm sorta new at the biochar thing, I've only done three runs with it, but they all look magnificent, course all three runs I've used the tree chunks too, and those do a damn amazing job at keeping my soil a perfect humid state for the roots.
 
DonTesla

DonTesla

Well-Known Member
greasemonkeymann said:
precisely why I didn't do it a long time, I made an AACT and then soaked em with that and a lil dandelion/comfrey tea.
I don't know, i'm sorta new at the biochar thing, I've only done three runs with it, but they all look magnificent, course all three runs I've used the tree chunks too, and those do a damn amazing job at keeping my soil a perfect humid state for the roots.
Click to expand...
AACT first then soak, interesting. I was thinking the other way around.
And you're right,
It's not the most focused clearest article but great info none the less. Thanks Stow
If we re write that list, it has four prerequisites, basically..
1) saturate
2) colonize
3) nutritionize (new word, lol)
4) oxidize / age

So what if soak em in rusty (urine?) water made from soaking coins, and run em thru an AACT.. It seems the fastest, most simple way..

I also wonder.. maybe it should be oxidize/age, then saturate,
then colonize and nutritionize right before adding..
So the micro life is more abundant..
Or is it, the more anaerobic the better (and therefore minimize the aerobic)

Hmm.. i need to read more, fuck

Lmao
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
DonTesla said:
AACT first then soak, interesting. I was thinking the other way around.
And you're right,
It's not the most focused clearest article but great info none the less. Thanks Stow
If we re write that list, it has four prerequisites, basically..
1) saturate
2) colonize
3) nutritionize (new word, lol)
4) oxidize / age

So what if soak em in rusty (urine?) water made from soaking coins, and run em thru an AACT.. It seems the fastest, most simple way..

I also wonder.. maybe it should be oxidize/age, then saturate,
then colonize and nutritionize right before adding..
So the micro life is more abundant..
Or is it, the more anaerobic the better (and therefore minimize the aerobic)

Hmm.. i need to read more, fuck

Lmao
Click to expand...
maybe i'm being too simple but I look at it like this..
they are sponges, if they aren't soaked with something, then they will soak up the surrounding nutrients and sequester them for up to a yr.
So if I soak them, I figure how much water/microbes/nitrogen can it really absorb?
NOW, my caveat is that I simply don't know S H I T. So keep that in mind...
I can explain everything about your automobile though...
:mrgreen:
 
Midwest Weedist

Midwest Weedist

Well-Known Member
greasemonkeymann said:
if you do use the coco, you will be ok without the oyster stuff, I personally like the look of oyster shells in my soil.... me like shiny stuff..:eyesmoke:
Nah, seriously though, it does help drainage, and soil tension too, we all know peat likes to "contract" a lil when it dries, I have some odd techniques that I like to use, one is to buy the thick coco"wool", the stuff they use to line baskets with, look almost like a bird nest, then I cut those into strips (about 6 inches long and one inch wide) and have them in my soil when I re-amend/fluff, I use them vertically (like five or so) and it helps a TON on the soils drainage, and the roots fill the "wool" with super white hairs, i'm ALLLL about drainage and aeration, I think it's probably a good 50% of my mix, when you count the biochar, the pumice, volcanic rock, leftover perlite (from the original vermifire), the rotted treelogs (my fav, the roots go NUTS over those) and the coco wool strips and my soil has TONS of oxygen in it.
Between the aeration and my homemade compost, and I swear I could have a 5yr old grow this
I just sit back and try not to interfere, I swear they grow themselves.
I think your recipe is pretty good man.
Maybe add a lil more aeration to help with that manure, that can be thick stuff..
Seven cups of amendments IS on the low side, BUT, that on a typical recipe that doesn't have manure, so I think you are good man.:clap:
I would do more aeration though.
but like I said, i'm a lil nutty with my aeration..
Maybe more biochar, I have MUCH more biochar than 3-4%
I have probably at least 2 cups per cubic foot, so i'd add maybe another liter of biochar (maybe two), charge it first though, don't forget about that part.
Alfalfa tea, urine tea, blood meal tea, comfrey tea, all those work, for charging.
I'd do alfalfa, urine or comfrey.
And yea, I've gotten shit over the urine thing, but whatever.
Click to expand...
What's your method for charging with urine? I alreasy water my house plants with a diluted "piss-tea", as my girl calls it lol, so I'm not against its use at all. The rotten wood is definitely my favorite amendment now. After seeing the side by side of a plant with it in its soil and without, I will never go without it. I forgot to water for about 60 hours recently (12+ hour work days) and the ladies with the rotten wood around their feet never showed a single sign of drought stress. Even my Chinese indica heirloom was unphased. Not so much for the unlucky girls, especially those in fabric planters...
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
Midwest Weedist said:
What's your method for charging with urine? I alreasy water my house plants with a diluted "piss-tea", as my girl calls it lol, so I'm not against its use at all. The rotten wood is definitely my favorite amendment now. After seeing the side by side of a plant with it in its soil and without, I will never go without it. I forgot to water for about 60 hours recently (12+ hour work days) and the ladies with the rotten wood around their feet never showed a single sign of drought stress. Even my Chinese indica heirloom was unphased. Not so much for the unlucky girls, especially those in fabric planters...
Click to expand...
I have used, and also heard from a grower that uses it often, as one bladder full per five gallon bucket (so really probably 4 gallons)
he swears by taking a few multivitamins too, to make it ultra neon yellow... have no idea if that maters but I suppose it could be better..
EDIT-- somehow I misread that, I haven't charged my biochar with urine, I have used urine as a nutrient.
BUT, if I remember correctly, urine is like the oldest method of charging it, I've read that from multiple biochar articles
 
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DonTesla

DonTesla

Well-Known Member
greasemonkeymann said:
maybe i'm being too simple but I look at it like this..
they are sponges, if they aren't soaked with something, then they will soak up the surrounding nutrients and sequester them for up to a yr.
So if I soak them, I figure how much water/microbes/nitrogen can it really absorb?
NOW, my caveat is that I simply don't know S H I T. So keep that in mind...
I can explain everything about your automobile though...
:mrgreen:
Click to expand...
Lmao.
I wish u were closer so u could be my mechanic ! Haha
Between us, and people that actually, know, we are gonna do great.
Our theory kicks ass, man!
 
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