The Best N-P-K

Uncle Ben

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
Moldy said:
The old Fox Farm trio. I go to the bloom formula after going to 12/12 which of course is lacking in N. They always say the yellowing of the fan leaves is normal but it went against common sense... to me anyway. I feel I'm not getting that by letting leaves die so the plant doesn't fully mature before it starts to die. This is what I getting from this thread.
Click to expand...


Yep, when you're selling something that induces premature leaf drop, you've got to come up with some kind of lame excuse. Good on ya for seeing thru their bullshit.

So when I get into flowering I will watch for yellowing and keep the N value up to prevent yellowing. Sounds logical.
Click to expand...
You got it.

Pix of last yellow grow... again they probably never really matured?
Click to expand...
Perhaps not. I call it "proper hang time". If you have green healthy leaves by harvest, then rest assured you gave your plants all they could hope to be, and that's all you can do as a grower.

Dankster4Life said:
Just to be sure......one ? wasn't given a direct answer(i think)

If i have a 5-1-1 and say a 1-5-1 product and mix them in a jug is my final npk 6-6-2?
Just want to make sure there is nothing i'm missing......no crazy math formula i don't know of or some thing.Thanks
Click to expand...
Yep, if in equal amounts.
 
Y

YouGrowBoy

Well-Known Member
Dankster4Life said:
If i have a 5-1-1 and say a 1-5-1 product and mix them in a jug is my final npk 6-6-2?
Just want to make sure there is nothing i'm missing......no crazy math formula i don't know of or some thing.Thanks
Uncle Ben said:
Yep, if in equal amounts.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
Are you sure of this? The numbers in NPK are usually a percentage of that substance in the mix. According to this statement of simple addition if I take 20 products with an NPK of 5-5-5 (5%N-5%P-5%K, leaving 85% other stuff) and mix them together that gives me an NPK of 100-100-100 or 100% of each element totaling 300% NPK and 1700% other stuff. How can this be?

If I have a mixture of 5% salt and 95% sugar (5-95) and another mixture of 95% sugar and 5% salt (95-5) and mix them together I don't get 100% salt and 100% sugar (100-100) I get 50% of each. or 50-50.:wall:

Another example using the addition logic, taking 2 bottles of the same 5-5-5 fert and mixing them together will give you a 10-10-10 fert. Obviously, you only get twice as much of the 5-5-5. It seems to me you must divide by the volume added to get accurate NPK.

Now if you are only adding NPK and removing the other stuff to maintain the original volume then you are increasing NPK by simple addition.
 
Uncle Ben

Uncle Ben

Well-Known Member
YouGrowBoy said:
Are you sure of this? The numbers in NPK are usually a percentage of that substance in the mix. According to this statement of simple addition if I take 20 products with an NPK of 5-5-5 (5%N-5%P-5%K, leaving 85% other stuff) and mix them together that gives me an NPK of 100-100-100 or 100% of each element totaling 300% NPK and 1700% other stuff. How can this be?

If I have a mixture of 5% salt and 95% sugar (5-95) and another mixture of 95% sugar and 5% salt (95-5) and mix them together I don't get 100% salt and 100% sugar (100-100) I get 50% of each. or 50-50.:wall:

Another example using the addition logic, taking 2 bottles of the same 5-5-5 fert and mixing them together will give you a 10-10-10 fert. Obviously, you only get twice as much of the 5-5-5. It seems to me you must divide by the volume added to get accurate NPK.

Now if you are only adding NPK and removing the other stuff to maintain the original volume then you are increasing NPK by simple addition.
Click to expand...
Yes, you have to cut your volume accordingly. IOW, if you want a final ratio of 1 tsp but you want to mix two different products with different NPK values, then you use 1/2 tsp of each and divide the total NPK by 2. The values stated in NPK are percentages, not whole. IOW in 10lbs. of a 30-10-10, you get 3 lbs. of actual N, 1 lb. of the other two. The rest will be stuff like sulfur.
 
W

Wetdog

Well-Known Member
Uncle Ben said:
Someone pissed off alot of money:
Sure seems that way.:wall:


With coco and soil-less mixes, you need 16 essential elements with no one element "outweighing" the other. The only one-for-all product I know of is Dyna-Gro. IOW, for $26 you can have a liter each of a 9-3-6 and a 3-12-6 of a very complete, well designed food which doesn't scam you into buying alot of other crap because the base products are incomplete. Remember, the cannabis industry is all about the money. Profits are OK in my book, scams aimed at noobs who don't know any better are not.

With well prepared potting soils - additional compost, worm castings, peat moss, alfalfa meal and such, you should be using a food designed for such soils like Peters or Schultz. Cheap and it works great. You'll find they have up to 12 essential elements. For example, look at this food's profile:
http://petersabc.com/PDFs/Peters Pro/99720ppro24-8-16FPL.pdf

UB
Click to expand...
Thanks, I've noticed that also, the incredible scamming going on.:fire:

I've been growing 'stuff' for close to 40 years, starting off with platycerium (staghorn), ferns then orchids and veggies and some pot back in the early '90s.

Just got back into mj when I sprouted out some 'special' bag seeds that were given to me that turned out to be a pure indica with very little odor and total couch lock with 3 hits.:weed:

Anyway, I started lurking in the forums and reading and reading then visiting different nute sites that I had read about on the forums.:dunce:

I was astounded at not only the prices but the amount of bullshit in the ad copy.:finger:

Even more amazing was the noobs not only forking over these large sums of money, but doing it with a smile on the face and convinced of the great deal they had gotten.:wall:

For my first grow in the early 90s, I used what I had, which was Peters (now Jack's Classic), standard, orchid special, and bloom booster. They worked great with no deficiency's and cost, IIRC ~$35/25lb bag. I also had several thousand orchids and ferns to feed, thus the 25# bags.;-)

BTW, my favorite so far, is the ~$15 for a fancy labeled bottle of molasses that I get in the local grocery store for ~$2.25.:finger:

ARRRRUUUGGGGGG !!!!! All this typing and I get a 'server not responding' message.:wall:

Wet
 
dirrtyd

dirrtyd

Well-Known Member
Uncle Ben can you tell me about boron and what other ways can you feed the plant this nutrient. I found another 30-10-10 but it is lacking in boron. I'm going to try it and I will post results just was curious after doing the comparison. Thanks for your advice and many helpful articles on here.
 
Y

YouGrowBoy

Well-Known Member
Well with all the talk going on we've still not settled on the right "The Best N-P-K" as the thread title asks.

If you look at Jack's classic website http://www.jacksclassic.com/ you'll see different NPK mixes for different plants. Orchids are different from African Violets so they need a different blend. This shows us that different plants have different NPK requirements. I have not seen any consensus at ANY website what the best NPK for cannabis is. I know you need different ratios for the stage of growth. Some people say use 20-20-20, others say 30-10-10 and one guy said Lucas 5-10-9. The answers are all over the map with no real agreement other then more N during veg and more P during Flower.

There's a lot of great info on what to do if you see deficiencies or what's needed during veg or bloom, just not good ratios that we all agree on.

This is not an exact science but If Jack's Classic was to make a Cannabis blend what do you think their ratio would be for veg and bloom?
 
riddleme

riddleme

Well-Known Member
YouGrowBoy said:
Well with all the talk going on we've still not settled on the right "The Best N-P-K" as the thread title asks.

If you look at Jack's classic website http://www.jacksclassic.com/ you'll see different NPK mixes for different plants. Orchids are different from African Violets so they need a different blend. This shows us that different plants have different NPK requirements. I have not seen any consensus at ANY website what the best NPK for cannabis is. I know you need different ratios for the stage of growth. Some people say use 20-20-20, others say 30-10-10 and one guy said Lucas 5-10-9. The answers are all over the map with no real agreement other then more N during veg and more P during Flower.

There's a lot of great info on what to do if you see deficiencies or what's needed during veg or bloom, just not good ratios that we all agree on.

This is not an exact science but If Jack's Classic was to make a Cannabis blend what do you think their ratio would be for veg and bloom?
Click to expand...
It would be what it is a 1-3-2 ratio this bud has only been fed with Jack's Classic
 

Attachments

W

Wetdog

Well-Known Member
riddleme said:
It would be what it is a 1-3-2 ratio this bud has only been fed with Jack's Classic
Click to expand...
Looks and sounds good to me.:bigjoint:

Jack's Classic has been poo pooed so much by company's who charge too much and people who have spent too much on other stuff, to admit it actually works at a fraction of the cost.

Wet
 
Phelps

Phelps

Well-Known Member
Im a firm believer that nutes can be applied very cheaply. I have seen amazing growth as low as .7ec and as high as 2.5ec hydroponicaly on fully rooted plants.
Hydro I prefer Flora Nova Grow for vegging, and FLora Nova Bloom for blooming. Its stable, requires very little attention, and its one thing to add, not 20 like most do.
For soil, Im not too sure, but I have had great results with MG and Fox Farm, no difference imo, I'd take MG for the cost any day. Most people use tap water with it and blame the soil. Then they buy Fox Farm, good water and a ph meter at the same time and rave about how much better the soil is.
 
Enigma

Enigma

Well-Known Member
General Hydroponics ATW.. check out MaxiGrow, MaxiBloom, and KoolBloom. They have everything your plants need. The dry mix lasts a long time ;)

:joint:

E
 
riddleme

riddleme

Well-Known Member
doc111 said:
Why is that flowering plant all wet? :confused:
Click to expand...
Cause I gave her a shower

yeah lots of folks have yelled at me but as I have told everyone she is dry and happy now

folks don't seem to get that I have my area dialed in for perfect transpiration, she wicked the water from the shower in only 24 hours

She was dusty and needed a shower, her transpiration time had increased due to the dust on her leaves and I didn't soak em they were under water for less than 10 seconds

I know folks are worried about bud rot and mold but under optimum conditions the chances are pretty slim that it would happen and my conditions are optimized :bigjoint:
 
Enigma

Enigma

Well-Known Member
riddleme said:
Cause I gave her a shower

yeah lots of folks have yelled at me but as I have told everyone she is dry and happy now
Click to expand...
I used to shower my plants when I flushed them. Then I used expensive water to flush, and I went back to the shower.

Some places have some hard water, some may need to compensate.

Other than that.. she is an inspiration!

:joint:

E
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top