cephalopod
Well-Known Member
Are there any legal heads around that can think of any examples of other state laws that are in disaccord with federal law?
State Laws in Conflict with Fed Law
- Thread starter cephalopod
- Start date
Skylor
Well-Known Member
Don't get me started on how twisted the law has become. Its not right yet it goes on. My guess is so the changes will just be temporary and more control the gov. will have. If weed was legally federally, all workers could use weed off duty like they can use alcohol. We got 2 states now that sell weed to any adult yet the government still has control on whom can really use weed.
cephalopod
Well-Known Member
I should have been more specific; are there any fed laws that are often not enforced/completely overlooked in favor of a state law? I think I'm following your line of thought TM13. States rights, 10th amendment (elastic clause)?
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
So basically I was trying to think of a law that is in a similar catch 22 like the med law, but is permitted instead of prohibited?
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
So basically I was trying to think of a law that is in a similar catch 22 like the med law, but is permitted instead of prohibited?
TheMan13
Well-Known Member
cephalopod
Well-Known Member
Any Michigan examples? I had a friend ask me, they have planned a sit down with a trooper and would really like to be able to give an example here in MI.
TheMan13
Well-Known Member
I cannot think of any criminal law except MMMA off hand. There are Usury Laws nationwide that very wildly and seem laughable given the evasive nature of payday loans and such, no less the federal too big to fail types.
Michigan Usury Laws
Michigan has established a fairly restrictive statutory scheme when it comes to usury regulations in that state. Indeed, Michigan currently has one of most restrictive statutes pertaining to usury limits that can be found anywhere in the United States today.
The general usury limit in Michigan has been set at 7%. In other words, if the interest rate on a personal loan in Michigan exceeds the 7% rate, that loan is considered to be in violation of the law. It is considered to be an illegal contract and hence is unenforceable.
One does need to bear in mind that despite the restrictive nature of the usury law in Michigan, the law actually pertains to and governs over only a certain type of loan and lending practice in the state. Generally, the 7% usury cap in Michigan pertains to loans between individuals. The lending practices of state chartered banks, savings and loans, and credit unions are governed by another set of statutes and regulations in Michigan. Under the law, these state chartered institutions have a greater degree of flexibility when it comes to their own lending practices and the interest rates that they can charges to their borrowers.
The rationale behind these two separate interest rate schedules -- usury limitations for individual lenders and greater flexibility for bona fide lending institutions -- centers on the reality that there exists greater governmental authority and oversight in regard to bona fide lending institutions. In reality, if an individual were so inclined, he or she could start lending money on a whim and with not prior certification or approval from any governmental authority. Therefore, the usury laws in Michigan are deemed vital and necessary to control the lending practices of individuals who elect to extend financing to other individuals.
The usury limitations do not extend to instances in which an individual makes a loan to a corporation. Similarly, if an individual establishes a corporation for the sole intended purpose of lending money to an individual or individuals, that corporation essential will be considered a sham and the usury laws will be applicable.
Those statutes that govern usury and usurious lending practices in Michigan can be found codified at Michigan Compiled Laws Sections 438 and 439.
http://usurylaw.com/state/michigan.php
Michigan Usury Laws
Michigan has established a fairly restrictive statutory scheme when it comes to usury regulations in that state. Indeed, Michigan currently has one of most restrictive statutes pertaining to usury limits that can be found anywhere in the United States today.
The general usury limit in Michigan has been set at 7%. In other words, if the interest rate on a personal loan in Michigan exceeds the 7% rate, that loan is considered to be in violation of the law. It is considered to be an illegal contract and hence is unenforceable.
One does need to bear in mind that despite the restrictive nature of the usury law in Michigan, the law actually pertains to and governs over only a certain type of loan and lending practice in the state. Generally, the 7% usury cap in Michigan pertains to loans between individuals. The lending practices of state chartered banks, savings and loans, and credit unions are governed by another set of statutes and regulations in Michigan. Under the law, these state chartered institutions have a greater degree of flexibility when it comes to their own lending practices and the interest rates that they can charges to their borrowers.
The rationale behind these two separate interest rate schedules -- usury limitations for individual lenders and greater flexibility for bona fide lending institutions -- centers on the reality that there exists greater governmental authority and oversight in regard to bona fide lending institutions. In reality, if an individual were so inclined, he or she could start lending money on a whim and with not prior certification or approval from any governmental authority. Therefore, the usury laws in Michigan are deemed vital and necessary to control the lending practices of individuals who elect to extend financing to other individuals.
The usury limitations do not extend to instances in which an individual makes a loan to a corporation. Similarly, if an individual establishes a corporation for the sole intended purpose of lending money to an individual or individuals, that corporation essential will be considered a sham and the usury laws will be applicable.
Those statutes that govern usury and usurious lending practices in Michigan can be found codified at Michigan Compiled Laws Sections 438 and 439.
http://usurylaw.com/state/michigan.php
cephalopod
Well-Known Member
Thx TM13, this is part of an effort to change hearts and minds.
TheMan13
Well-Known Member
There is Capital Punishment or the Death Penalty. Michigan has not killed anyone since joining the Union (1837).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_in_Michigan
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Capital_punishment_in_Michigan
Skylor
Well-Known Member
Michigan is a pretty cool state, we got only one license plate on the cars, we got no DUI check points-the police need to see something illegal to stop and talk with you, can be as easy as you drifting over but they can't just stop everybody on the road like they do in some other states. We got no red light cameras, car pool lanes...its a cool state
Of course its not as cool as it used to be, every place is like that. Sure we got MM now, yet it was still pretty cool back in the 80's. I recall Eliza Howell Park being swap with sellers and users, it was so cool, some dudes had signs, others would yell " I got what you need" since Inxs was always on the radio. (me and my buddies missed out on the mass arrests one summer, we just happen not to be there that day, lol)
Least we are not like pill popping West Virgina, that place must be the pitts. Cops want weed gone and replace it with pills and then cut you off once you are hooked.
Its really ashame what has happen, in some states you can use all the weed you please, in other states, they try to send you up the river. Justice used to be blind but today it matters who you are and where you live. Maybe it always was like that but today its out of hand. I'm just so happy I live in one of the freer states.
Of course its not as cool as it used to be, every place is like that. Sure we got MM now, yet it was still pretty cool back in the 80's. I recall Eliza Howell Park being swap with sellers and users, it was so cool, some dudes had signs, others would yell " I got what you need" since Inxs was always on the radio. (me and my buddies missed out on the mass arrests one summer, we just happen not to be there that day, lol)
Least we are not like pill popping West Virgina, that place must be the pitts. Cops want weed gone and replace it with pills and then cut you off once you are hooked.
Its really ashame what has happen, in some states you can use all the weed you please, in other states, they try to send you up the river. Justice used to be blind but today it matters who you are and where you live. Maybe it always was like that but today its out of hand. I'm just so happy I live in one of the freer states.
Skylor
Well-Known Member
Yes but they are against the state law, the state supreme court ruled way back in the 1990's was it? Its hard to find out facts about it. Was a big deal when the ruling first came out and then was quickly swept under the rug and never talk about. There is good sound reasons DUI check points will not be here in Michigan..maybe its the state constitution, maybe thats has to be changed first, good luck doing that, lol.
Theres been no DUI check points for least 20 years, not here in Michigan. The police need to have a reason to stop you, if they don't and still stop U, any charges should be thrown out of court. Thats one of the few ways still of beating a DUI charge, very hard to but it has happen.
Theres been no DUI check points for least 20 years, not here in Michigan. The police need to have a reason to stop you, if they don't and still stop U, any charges should be thrown out of court. Thats one of the few ways still of beating a DUI charge, very hard to but it has happen.
TheMan13
Well-Known Member
I cannot recall the particulars either, but in return we allowed for the use of 20% less BAL to prove "beyond a reasonable doubt" the charge of DUI. Very similar to the game of simple possession of over an ounce is somehow trafficking narcotics regardless of the facts of the matter. Yet, I know decades long alcoholics (disease victims) that do not even reach parity at that level, they are actually impaired without alcohol. The same can be said to a much further extreme with medical marijuana. That said, the MJ DUI schemes floating around this country scare the hell out of me and I pray to God that does not become a topic to ever face us here ...
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Skylor
Well-Known Member
What happens is some times cities come up with their own ideas and try to do illegal things. We did have "volunteer" car pool lanes, some place put up signs--was it Dearborn ?--but then the state police step in and explained to the city they can't do that, even without giving fines. All roads are to be shared by all motorists.....right now Grand Rapids has a few bus only lanes, so far I heard of no lawsuits to stop them but I'm not sure why not ? Maybe if more cities tried it, somebody would try to stop them. But car pool lanes seem more likely to happen first before DUI check points happen. Obey the traffic laws, wear your seat belt and the police should leave you alone. If they don't and still stop you, be polite about it, don't go saying you should not have stop me but they are targeting you so be on guard, police can be pretty sneaky sometimes, they can even try to do things that are illegal to do yet they still try
Skylor
Well-Known Member
The .08 happen cause of federal highway road fundings, if the state wants the money, they gotta agree to all these things that the feds say to have, having a .08 DUI limit is just one of them. So far, DUI check points are not tied into the highway funds, I guess the feds could make check points happen if they really wanted to.
TheMan13
Well-Known Member
Again, it's all connected to the "negotiations" of the time, something I like to refer to as regulatory capture. The "capture" will occur one way or another playing these games, it's just the public need story line that gets adjusted, or that is the straw man of debate if you will ...
TheMan13
Well-Known Member
Our speed limits are "captured" by the same game, yet we have had differing outcomes at each turn. I get the game brother, it's just a piece of the puzzle (straw man) hiding the true and pervasive problem of regulatory capture. The DUI, MADD, SADD, etc phenomenon of the past couple of decades has produced a very expensive and costly industry within everyone of our communities (nationally/federally) with debatable outcomes and clearly diminishing returns. Does this game sound familiar?
