Root Rot, help!

Joint Monster

Well-Known Member
That light brown colour of the roots you can call nute stained. However the black-dark-matter in the middle I feel is definitely not just root stain.

Did you mention exactly which GH nutrients you are using of theirs? Also as mentioned earlier change those airlines or cover them up.

If that brown washed away, and comes back quicker or worse tomorrow it's definitely something ...rot, slime, algae?

I myself had something similar going on after dealing with Brown Slime! (My pictures do not look nearly as bad as yours.) I sanitized EVERYTHING and she looked clean. Then I hit her with the tea and she got a little of that brown gunk (which looks somewhat similar to what you have) BUT that is supposed to happen with the Tea. Plus they LOVED it and roots Exploded! and their all healthy now! :bigjoint:
>Check out my thread and see if you think it looks similar to what you're dealing with.
> https://www.rollitup.org/t/camg-deficiency-and-brown-roots-dwc.959698/
 

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
Looking pretty good actually.. Now, for future grows make sure your water level is maintained at the bottom of the net pot so the root ball develops as close as possible to the main stalk. This will eliminate the small number of feeder roots above it. Think a traffic jam being funneled into just a few lanes. Here it creates a nutrient dam. The root ball has ~ 10xs the roots as the feeders above it

hth
 

MASSgreen

Member
*Update*
What a difference a week makes!
Swapped out GH Floranova for Flora duo. Also, started back on UC Roots and have noticed a huge change in the right direction. Huge change in growth and how much water she's drinking. (the leaf problems are still from the H2O2 burn)
Thanks for all the advice!
 

Attachments

Last edited:

Kove

Member
I been running perpetual Dwc for 5 years now what I learned NOT to do res change in veg till roots are ready about 4 to 6 weeks or at flower time
the plant above in my post stained roots that plant is about 5 weeks no res change yet

( OP your roots looked great till first res change ..? )
Just my 2 cent
Your saying to not ever change Rez in veg ??? I have definitely noticed I have a pissed plants when I change water in veg
 

OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
I do whole DWC grows without ever changing nutes and get great root growth. Done about 50 tubs worth and only had rot twice many years ago before I built a chiller out of an old water cooler. Both times I had the rot I beat it back with peroxide and never lost a plant. 5 - 8ml/L of 35% every day for a week then 2ml/L every couple of days until I was sure all the rot was gone and new roots growing well. Then 0.5ml/L twice a week for maintenance.

Roots.jpg
Air lines don't need to be covered or coloured. All they have in them is air. The nute lines from and to the chiller need to be protected from light tho. Ask me how I know. ;)
 

graying.geek

Well-Known Member
I do whole DWC grows without ever changing nutes and get great root growth. Done about 50 tubs worth and only had rot twice many years ago before I built a chiller out of an old water cooler. Both times I had the rot I beat it back with peroxide and never lost a plant. 5 - 8ml/L of 35% every day for a week then 2ml/L every couple of days until I was sure all the rot was gone and new roots growing well. Then 0.5ml/L twice a week for maintenance.
@OldMedUser, I adopted 35% peroxide and a clean res about a year ago after reading one of your earlier posts in another thread. Been happily throwing 40-60 ml H2O2 into the res twice a week and everything's been sparkling clean and healthy through 2 grows, but my latest has been a PITA. Roots have been developing slowly and i have my first sign of slime in the res. So, if I can tap your experience, a couple of questions:

1) According the literature, the half life of H2O2 is relatively short, so leaving it on the shelf or even in the refrigerator for an extended period (months) should give you a weak solution, at best. Do you find this to be true? I'm suspicious this is the reason of my latest res infection.

2) In light of my potentially degraded peroxide, I'm considering switching to PoolShock, but am concerned about the reaction with any remaining peroxide. Any idea of the half life of peroxide in our res environment and when i can safely make the switch?

Thanx for any advice.
 

Renfro

Well-Known Member
@OldMedUser, I adopted 35% peroxide and a clean res about a year ago after reading one of your earlier posts in another thread. Been happily throwing 40-60 ml H2O2 into the res twice a week and everything's been sparkling clean and healthy through 2 grows, but my latest has been a PITA. Roots have been developing slowly and i have my first sign of slime in the res. So, if I can tap your experience, a couple of questions:

1) According the literature, the half life of H2O2 is relatively short, so leaving it on the shelf or even in the refrigerator for an extended period (months) should give you a weak solution, at best. Do you find this to be true? I'm suspicious this is the reason of my latest res infection.

2) In light of my potentially degraded peroxide, I'm considering switching to PoolShock, but am concerned about the reaction with any remaining peroxide. Any idea of the half life of peroxide in our res environment and when i can safely make the switch?

Thanx for any advice.
"Hydrogen peroxide half-life in freshwater ranged from 8 hours to 20 days" thats what I get from google
 

Renfro

Well-Known Member
Right. So that strongly suggests that peroxide sitting around for a couple of months should probably go down the drain, right?
Well there is a shelf life indeed.

Again google to the rescue lol

"You need to replace hydrogen peroxide six months after opening it, but it will last for three years unopened."
 

OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
1) According the literature, the half life of H2O2 is relatively short, so leaving it on the shelf or even in the refrigerator for an extended period (months) should give you a weak solution, at best. Do you find this to be true? I'm suspicious this is the reason of my latest res infection.

2) In light of my potentially degraded peroxide, I'm considering switching to PoolShock, but am concerned about the reaction with any remaining peroxide. Any idea of the half life of peroxide in our res environment and when i can safely make the switch?
I'm at the bottom of a gallon of 29% and just today mixed up a 500ml bottle of 3% from it for household use and it still foams if put on skin so I don't think it's lost potency and it's at least 2 years old.

There's no reaction to pool shock at low concentrations and peroxide is often added to chlorinated water to drive out the chlorine. Sodium thiosulfate is sold as a dechlorinator for aquariums and is Part A of making silver thiosulfate used to resex females to get fem pollen to make fem seeds. Just need a little silver nitrate and you're good to go.

The thing I don't like about pool shock is all the chlorine. Many times higher concentration than will be found in chlorinated tap water which everyone works at getting rid of before use. Peroxide leaves no nasty residue. Breaks down into water and a radical O+ atom that's just dying to attach itself to some nasty anaerobic bacteria that's causing the rot. If you think yours is degraded then just increase the amount you use. The higher the concentration the slower it breaks down. The 3% that you get at the drug store has stabilizers added to slow down it's degredation so food grade peroxide is the one to get. Health food stores or hydro shops usually have it.

You can add the pool shock any time and good luck getting rid of the rot. I have no idea how much of it to use tho.
 

OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
"Hydrogen peroxide half-life in freshwater ranged from 8 hours to 20 days" thats what I get from google
Right. So that strongly suggests that peroxide sitting around for a couple of months should probably go down the drain, right?
The unused peroxide still in the bottle will be good for a year or more. When used in the rez it's gone in a few days and why I would add 0.5ml/L twice a week to keep a very low level of it active in the tub to prevent rot taking hold. The early years of doing DWC I never even thought to check nute temps but they must have been in the 80s in the garage my grow room was in. My guardian angel must have been watching my back in those days. :)

I've never tried using any type of beneficials.
 

graying.geek

Well-Known Member
I'm at the bottom of a gallon of 29% and just today mixed up a 500ml bottle of 3% from it for household use and it still foams if put on skin so I don't think it's lost potency and it's at least 2 years old.
Yeah, I have a year-old gallon bottle of 35% that still bleaches my skin in short order so it seems plenty viable. My concern arose when rot took hold on my most recent grow and I'm concerned the H2O2 lost most of it's punch. I too had found the info on the link that @Renfro posted where the half life at 20'C ranges as high as 20 days but is extended in the fridge by about double for every -10'C, so if these numbers are correct, even at 0'C 35% H2O2 will degrade to <3% after a year. While calcium hypochlorite will reportedly also degrade significantly sitting around for a year, it's only 10% of the cost of H2O2, so easier to toss out.

: said:
The thing I don't like about pool shock is all the chlorine. Many times higher concentration than will be found in chlorinated tap water which everyone works at getting rid of before use.
I'm of the belief that the chlorine in tap water is not nearly as big a deal as some OCD folks make it out to be. Yeah, it kills stuff, but that's the point in hydro. I accept that in soil it's "better" to de-chlorinate your tap water first, but there are actually scientific studies on this topic and it's been found that while drenching with tap water will kill 20-40% of the soil's biota, when compared to soil irrigated with r/o water 24 hrs later the two are indistinguishable. IOW, the flora and fauna bounce back very quickly, so even in soil the cost and trouble of using r/o doesn't wash. In hydro, it's a non-issue as long as you stay below 5 PPM CL2, it's doing what it's supposed to and NOT harming your plants.

: said:
You can add the pool shock any time and good luck getting rid of the rot. I have no idea how much of it to use tho.
The recommended concentration is 4-5 PPM, so for my 80 liter res I'll make up a stock soln of 4.4 g 73% Ca(OCl)2 in 100 ml H2O, then add 10 ml of that stock solution to my res to get 4+ PPM every 2-3 days.
 
Last edited:

Halman9000

Well-Known Member
Hey mate.
If i had a root pathogen, id remove the plant temporarily, clean and sanitize EVEREYTHING. First. Lines, pumps, res, drippers tent everything. When ive had it in the past, id just buy new lines and feeders aswell to be safe.
ill just list what id do concrning each points you raised 1-6.
1. Temperature reservoir - keep it between 18-20 degrees c
2. Light leaks - IMHO by the sounds of the see through guage you have on the sides of your res/buckets, is our problem.
3. Hydroguard - i dont think it could hurt but i havnt used it before
4. Slf 100 - dont think it would hurt either.
5. Watter swapping - Id be swapping it 1-2 times a day, fresh. You have rot. You cant let it fester. Also reduce the nutes a little and lower the res in the dwc. To give the roots some oxygen to help the plants try and fight it off.
6. Id still be weary about not enough oxygen though. They cant really have too much unless its like a washing machine in there.
If it kept comimg back, id be sus on my water.
Hope this helps dude.
Tim
I transplanted plants in soil , to coir ( still got root rot in coco coir ) and then I went to 90% perlite 10% coco coir . To get rid of my root rot , I discovered a new technique to water , feed , and air out roots , and apply root rot medicine ; that is probably how I ended up with powdery milder and black wet mildew ( I am guessing the root rot pathogens can move up the plant into the leaves and look like white or black or brown mildew ) . At any rate I found out that I could use calcium nitrate and two amino acids L-Glycine and Glutamic Acid , for white powdery mildew , so I figured it would probably cure my root root , the theory being that sometimes they might be inter-connected . So first of all , the perlite enabled treating a plant , watering it , and feed it things like nutrients or other products , in rapid order because the perlite drains so fast that I can go through all of the cycles in about an hour , So first I treat the plant with the calcium Nitrate and the Amino acids in a water solution and pour through the perlite . Place a container around your pot so that no drainage occurs and let the plant perlite root zone sit in the solution for 15 minutes . Next I drain the perlite growth medium of the plant and let it get air on the roots for 15 minutes , Next I do the same thing , but with water . Let the plant drink water for 15 minutes . Next drain for 15 minutes to air out the roots allowing the plant to uptake oxygen and for the roots to absorb oxygen . Next I submerge my pot of perlite plant in my nutrient solution for 15 minutes submerging the roots . Next drain the nutrient solution and air the roots for 15 minutes . Next I look at the color of the leaves and see if they are faded green or sea green ( my nutrient solution includes kelp or seaweed and seems to make my leaves a somewhat dark green ) , If the leaves looks flushed of nutrients I repeat the feeding of nutrient 15 minute root submergal again and then drain for 15 minutes to air out the roots . This now usually means my plants have enough nutrients to last a few hours or move . I am assuming my root rot is healing and I am seeing much less powdery white mildew and less brown rot on some lower leaves . As it turns out , going through this many step sequence method , I end up with a rapid growth result for my plants because I now believe you can dramitically speed up robust plant growth by shorten the water , feeding , drying of roots to get air , flushing , this entire routine that you get with soil can be speeded up in perlite to one hour , that which takes a week in soil . And since I am stressing the plant some with my method , I treat my plants once a day with my calcium nitrate amino acid solution once a day . The draw back is I am wasting a lot of water and dumping nutrient water waste into the sewage system . Now all I got to do is automate the entire process and find a way to purify my water waste and desalinate the salts in fertilyzers , I end up with the fastest most robust healthy looking plants with fast branching and fast leaf growth . We will see how my buds look when I get there . I am writing a computer flow chart and figure out what equipment I would need to automate the process I am using , but the basic concept allows for periodic root drying time in almost pure perlite or entirely perlite , in 15 minute intervals for each step . Based on that , you would never have gotten root rot with this method I fell upon , but I used it initially to heal the root rot . In other words , i gave up on soil or coco medium , ( I use coco coir medium to clone but perlite to grow in ) .

It might take me a year or two to figure out how to automate the process , because doing this method manually is almost a full time job . After I go through the cycle to my satisfaction , I take a rest by placing each plant in water so that the bottom of all the perlite of the plant pots are submerged in a half inch or one inch of water , but the roots not submerged in water and the wicking action of the perlites keep the roots moist . This is to prevent the leaves from getting too dry ; where the curl up and look half dead.

I know that my system will take about a year to automate , but one can find other ways to use perlite as a growing medium. Either way , growing in perlite makes it almost impossible to get root rot . You can suffocate a plant if left in water submerged for too long , but at least it would not die of root rot . LOL

Halman9000
 
Last edited:
Top