Lollipopping
- Thread starter Fred Flintstoner
- Start date
mr.smileyface
Well-Known Member
Lollipopping is done so you can get more circulation, easyer access to water them. and easy to keep clean. You can controll bugs better aswell
pointswest
Active Member
There is so much concern because of the misconception by apprentice growers that the light has to hit the flower to make it grow. The real facts of science are that the leaf is producing and storing the starches necessary for flower production. The larger the flower the more leaf area to store these sugars and starches is needed.
If the defoliators were correct you would see apples, oranges or any fruits on the outside of the leaf canopy and the leaves would be in the middle of the tree if this theory were true, but this is not the case as we all know well. The fruits size up because the light is captured by the leaves not how much shines on the fruits, in our case the ripening flower.
Some people will say they don't need the food storage from the leaf because they use the best and most expensive ferts available. You need to take a course in Botany and study plant growth. The fertilizers as introduced to the soil or water medias do not have the NPK available in a usable form until conversions of these chemicals occur in the photosynthetic process.
Pinching plants for branching or height control is not the same as defoliation of the most important food sources. Defoliation techniques are a slap in the face to good science. If you must try this misguided method at least leave a couple untouched so if the plants don't recover fast enough you will get some harvest.
Noob here. What about the timing and ripeness of the bud? Does this affect the quality if you let the buds grow longer?Well, I don't follow forum paradigms. I don't see any value in them and prefer to do botany as opposed to gimmicks and trends. For example, I don't flush, I keep leaves green and healthy until my first harvest cause deys what makes da bud, git it? I provide balanced NPK foods until the end even if it means a bump up in N in order to retain healthy leaves as long as possible. If The Herd Says means more to you, then you do what you have to do.
I assume you've harvested a plant before and can easily tell where the point is on the plant that the colas go from a stocky material to wispy buds. Cut out the bulked up colas to cure, and put the plant back under the lights to bulk up the lower buds with the same ole 12/12 drill. It aint rocket science.
Makes a big difference in overall yield.
UB
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Firstly, you have to define "ripen". I know what it means and harvest accordingly.
If the apple is ripe at the top of the tree and not at the bottom, where should you concentrate your attention?
ShinRaSensi420
Member
Lollipopping for me is removing the bottom 4 nodes during early veg so that when im 4 weeks in flowering its easy to get air circulation down underneath the canopy. I always keep all fan leaves but when you got a cramped closet its hard to reach underneath the canopy in the back to pick up dead leaves etc...thats why i lollipop, with proper lighting, like 1k, your side colas and penetration will dense those lower sites up.
SmoochieBoochies
Well-Known Member
Yes you can lollipop an auto. I do so up to 2 weeks into flowering and it really does boost yield/quality.
Nukebisket
Well-Known Member
nice........
420kushmanLover
Member
Lollipopping reminds me of SCRoG'ing with both using techniques to cut off bottom smaller buds.
Yes I am a Stranger, however, I have taken the last year or so and silently listened to you all. I have learned much from this site and respect all commentary (good and evil). I have needed both angles in order to attempt my first grow. The following is where I am at.
LightHouse 5x5x7
ProSource 2 180 watt saucers
Faford number 2 soil
Dyna-Gro nutes
Six 7 gallon containers
And six white widow bitches
I began from seed 06.01.12 and began 12/12 07.07.12 the girls have an average height 40 to 42 inches and finally stop growing. There are many flowers ie buds whatever and I have had to prune these girls on a regular basis. Today I lollipoped very significantly. I have unintentionally tried everything in my power to destroy this grow. These six bitches refuse to give up. Their response is screw you, it is our show not yours. So with out any experience what so ever my first grow will produce several colas per plant and I did not top. So I thank you all for giving me the proper and correct advice in this matter which I totally screwed up unintentionally. And like a blind pig stumbling across an acorn, it appears that I will have a decent yield. I said decent. I would send pictures, however, I do not have means to upload. Thank You All, I will keep you posted. Any responses would be considered an honor to recieve.
LightHouse 5x5x7
ProSource 2 180 watt saucers
Faford number 2 soil
Dyna-Gro nutes
Six 7 gallon containers
And six white widow bitches
I began from seed 06.01.12 and began 12/12 07.07.12 the girls have an average height 40 to 42 inches and finally stop growing. There are many flowers ie buds whatever and I have had to prune these girls on a regular basis. Today I lollipoped very significantly. I have unintentionally tried everything in my power to destroy this grow. These six bitches refuse to give up. Their response is screw you, it is our show not yours. So with out any experience what so ever my first grow will produce several colas per plant and I did not top. So I thank you all for giving me the proper and correct advice in this matter which I totally screwed up unintentionally. And like a blind pig stumbling across an acorn, it appears that I will have a decent yield. I said decent. I would send pictures, however, I do not have means to upload. Thank You All, I will keep you posted. Any responses would be considered an honor to recieve.
1blazeking
Member
I read the first few pages, and I gotta say, I respect UB for the buds he produces and the knowledge he has, but he's absolutely wrong about removing lower budsites being a bad thing for the plant and for yield. For someone who claims to have 50 years of gardening experience, I guess he just forgot to realize that, for example, tomato growers who want big tomatoes instead of little grape shits prune a lot of the budsites. It's documented, it works. Orchard growers know this and have for generations that pruning an apple tree will provide for larger apples and better yield. Pruning is an absolute must in orcharding. I realize if you have a few thousand watts going at the plant you are going to get big colas anyways. And here that guy is telling someone with a 150 watter that his plants suck. No kidding, he doesn't have 1000 watters.
Pruning also helps with air flow so diseases and rot are kept in check. There are many other reasons why to prune just google it or read a gardening book. Do folks that grow the huge pumpkins let the other pumpkin budsites produce other pumpkins? NO. They want all the plant energy going into that one pumpkin. Do you prune fan leaves? Absolutely No. But bottom budsites that get little light and will take nutrients that would otherwise go to buds that get the most light? Absolutely. I don't want popcorn bud, I want big buds. I also don't want the plant to spend plant energy on popcorn shits. It's been tried and it's true. Gardeners and orchardists prune because it works if you want to get big juicy produce instead of a bunch of small shit. Ya you could chop the top and leave the bottom for a while but that takes up time and space that could be used for another grow. You could add side lighting but it's not practical for most people.
Point is, like a few knowledgeable people have said, if you want some airy popcorn buds along with your harvest then don't prune the bottom budsites that are heavily shaded. You could also leave them if you want to reveg. If you want bigger dense colas without having to work with all those popcorn buds after harvest, then prune them.
Pruning also helps with air flow so diseases and rot are kept in check. There are many other reasons why to prune just google it or read a gardening book. Do folks that grow the huge pumpkins let the other pumpkin budsites produce other pumpkins? NO. They want all the plant energy going into that one pumpkin. Do you prune fan leaves? Absolutely No. But bottom budsites that get little light and will take nutrients that would otherwise go to buds that get the most light? Absolutely. I don't want popcorn bud, I want big buds. I also don't want the plant to spend plant energy on popcorn shits. It's been tried and it's true. Gardeners and orchardists prune because it works if you want to get big juicy produce instead of a bunch of small shit. Ya you could chop the top and leave the bottom for a while but that takes up time and space that could be used for another grow. You could add side lighting but it's not practical for most people.
Point is, like a few knowledgeable people have said, if you want some airy popcorn buds along with your harvest then don't prune the bottom budsites that are heavily shaded. You could also leave them if you want to reveg. If you want bigger dense colas without having to work with all those popcorn buds after harvest, then prune them.
Shivaskunk
Well-Known Member
Uncle Ben is the biggest prick this website has. He thinks his way is the only way and is down right miserable. I feel pity for him as im guessing few people on the net or'in real life'can stand him.
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Looks like a few are a little late to the party. This thread is dead, or should be.
OK, heard the anecdotal evidence, now where's the science? I provided it, which included a lecture on apical dominance and hormonal responses as well as cannabis life cycle development as well as an explanation of why a peach grower will drop 50% of the fruit. Peaches and cannabis, uh, apples and oranges. If you want big pumpkins or maters because you like fewer but bigger fruit, then drop some. When it comes to final weight, it comes out about the same. I'm a commercial wine grape grower and will drop juvenile clusters to balance out the crop in relation to the vigor and health of the vine. If the vine is weak for whatever reason, ALL clusters are dropped. This too I explained telling you it takes about 13 - 15 leaves to properly mature a cluster of grapes.
Don't try to confuse the issue by siting fruit production that receives specific gardening treatments with some noob paradigm.
Now....you and your nerdie MJ nerdie can get stupid, but I refuse. If it is a healthy green leaf (which means it is productive), it stays. You do what you want.
UB
Uncle Ben
Well-Known Member
Look you fuckin' idiot, why don't you just call me a "racist" and get it all off your chest? Speaking of guessing, you're probably one of those NW progressive pinheads that voted for Obama, that is if you're old enough to vote.
UB
Jimdamick
Well-Known Member
I thought you were a NW liberal, minus the shithead part
Katatawnic
Well-Known Member
UB, I get what 1blazeking is saying. He removes budsites, but not the fan leaves. I hope you don't need a photograph example to see what this means.
I do it too, but for personal reasons. I haven't seen scientific proof of "plant energy" or any of that, and I don't care whether I get more yield from pruning bottom budsites. I didn't get less yield when I did side-by-side clones from same mommy, with the only variable being pruned vs. unpruned.
My main reason is disability, severely limited mobility, including the use of my hands. I rarely have help in my nursery, so I have to make my gardening as physically manageable as possible. Trimming is extremely difficult and painful for me to do, so the less popcorn buds to trim the better.
I leave the fan leaves intact, removing only the stems growing from the same nodes as the fan leaves. Stem/shoot gone, leaf still there. I want all the photosynthesis I can get.
Of the 3-5 shoots I remove, I keep the most developed 2 for cloning. Of those two, the first to strongly root goes into my perpetually rotating cycle... a small scale SOG of 32-36 plants. This also frees my veg/clone area, as I don't need mothers; I keep one just in case I need it (I don't have seeds for her strain & can't afford to buy any for a while), and the rest of the space is roomy enough for all plants waiting to be put into the bloom area.
SOG enables me to take a large job (harvesting a bush for bours) and break it into small chores (harvesting one plant for half an hour every 2-3 days), which in turn enables more ability for me to walk and use my hands for other things even as simple as browsing web sites.
However, the fan leaves at the same sites as the pruned shoots remain, large and green and catching some rays along with the rest of the plant.
I do encourage others to keep as much as possible on their plants. If they ask me why I prune, I explain what I just did here, emphasizing that pruning works for me due to my limited abilities, but may not be what works best for them. For example, though I rarely top anymore, I do show others how to top (and my preference in topping is the same as yours) and explain what benefits they would obtain from topping and growing much fuller plants than I do.
My leaves stay green through to harvest, so pruning the corresponding shoots isn't killing them; doesn't appear to be weakening them at all. I have a few friends & relatives with whom I have shared my buds over the four years I have grown cannabis, and they all have noted improvement in quality, so pruning isn't hurting that, either. I consume a pretty decent amount daily (raw leaves & buds in my smoothies for great pain and inflammation relief, body lotion, vaping as needed for breakthrough pain), plus one friend for whom I provide is dying from cancer and requires about as much as I do... the only way I can produce enough reliably is to keep my work manageable, and that means SOG without having to deal with tiny buds. It is what works for me, and my plants do not suffer from it in the least.
Yet when someone I know asks me for growing tips, again, I suggest they grow fewer, larger plants than I do... unless they are physically limited like me and prefer smaller chores rather than large jobs.