LED Without LEDs -My First T5 Grow

I think I got a little confused with V-HO so let me get the facts straight. No V-HO lamps or bulbs, correct? So, would all 48" bulbs be 54 watts, 24"/24 watts, etc.?

Prof, I was asking about the ballasts/heat because I could be talking about 800-1200 watts in a 5x5 cabinet. My room is 88* in the summer.

Nice price on the BADBOY. Good to see the kits, too!

Hasbroh said:

I think I got a little confused with V-HO so let me get the facts straight. No V-HO lamps or bulbs, correct? So, would all 48" bulbs be 54 watts, 24"/24 watts, etc.?

Prof, I was asking about the ballasts/heat because I could be talking about 800-1200 watts in a 5x5 cabinet. My room is 88* in the summer.

Nice price on the BADBOY. Good to see the kits, too!

Click to expand...

No v-ho... However these bulbs CAN be V-HO by putting them in a V-HO setup but they will shorten the lifespan by more than half.
My 8 lamp is in a 3x3x6 tent....no fans inside just an exaust fan with carbon filter...

pr0fesseur said:

I dont own LED so i can t tell you how much cheaper. what i can tell you is theres better penetration and more light output! at a fraction of the cost!

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rick: I have a 2 yo UFO 90. I think it only has 2 red and 2 blue spectrums; it's probably 90/10 R/B. I paid $370. Today, they sell the same light for $280, and oversell its' coverage potential. Current LED competitor offerings use 3 watt chip sets, provide 5-8 spectrums, and are way more expensive.

Foot print is an issue with LEDs. An 8 bulb T 5 provides a 2 x 4 foot print, getting that coverage with a LED of comparable spectrums to an 8 bulb T 5 with Pr0fs bulb recommendations would require 2 LEDs @~ $750 per (GSL.com- with Quantum option). Also consider when T 5 bulb lumens decline, replacing them is simple and fast. hth

new little test I through up... I had a mixture of aqurium bulbs, non of these are strict actinic bulbs, total of 6 bulbs put in a 8 bulb fixture, 1 is a regular bloom bulb the layout goes as such

life-glo (full spectrum bulb) - bloom 6500k - life-glo - life-glo - aquasun ( 3 peaks at 420/540/600 reddish in color) - empty - aquasun - empty

I placed 4 plants under this setup and 3 in between this fixture and my normal veg fixture. Will get a picture here shortly.
Goal is to see how the 3 between the two fixtures reacts, leaning turning of fan leaves etc... 4 under it are to see full fledge action with only those lights

Pics



Also noticed taking pics of this fixture that 1 of the ballasts doesnt seem to be happy, will have to replace this shortly... the 4 outside lights are on 1 ballast workhorse 7 that was replaced before, the middle 4 are on an old original ballast.

Very impressed and very interested! I was originaly going to buy 400 watt induction but I really cant fit that into my budget at the moment. I will soon be ordering the 8 bulb Quantum T5 BadBoy Fixture -4foot- along with what seems to be the most accurute bulb arrangement,

UVL Red sun 630nm;
UVL 454nm;
UVL Super Actinic @ 420nm;
ATI Pro Color 660nm;
KorallenZucht Fuji Purple 630 & 440nm

I'm excited to see what this setup can do for me. I plan on starting a thread/journal very soon. I allready have a small room built so things should move quickly.

Pr0fesseur, thanks for the tremendous amount information, and even more so to the way you lay it out.
+++ rep!

Precog420 said:

Very impressed and very interested! I was originaly going to buy 400 watt induction but I really cant fit that into my budget at the moment. I will soon be ordering the 8 bulb Quantum T5 BadBoy Fixture -4foot- along with what seems to be the most accurute bulb arrangement,

UVL Red sun 630nm;
UVL 454nm;
UVL Super Actinic @ 420nm;
ATI Pro Color 660nm;
KorallenZucht Fuji Purple 630 & 440nm

I'm excited to see what this setup can do for me. I plan on starting a thread/journal very soon. I allready have a small room built so things should move quickly.

Pr0fesseur, thanks for the tremendous amount information, and even more so to the way you lay it out.
+++ rep!

Click to expand...

I am Glad that i may have helped in any way. The ATI PROCOLOR are no longer being produced.... Unfortunately... SO i have replaced them with the UVL RED SUN. I am still trying to find a far red bulb but i dont think its extremely necessary... My last document about the "truth of Green light" has explained that far red does more cellular damage than blue actinic light... Also actinic light seems to enhance/increase resin production.
I hear induction lamps do very well and last a LONG time... I was considering them for a while before T5.. the ease of access to bulbs and equip was main concern for me...T5 wins
My bulb choice is in no way the "perfect" setup but if i had a 16 bulb i would add a few bulbs. Since this is not the case i dont have room to add "colors" the light would not balance properly..
PS don't put the red sun bulbs at the outside of the lamp..
I read somewhere out there that there are issues with these bulbs being on the outside of lamps...
Bottom line im getting LED light accuracy+T5 power+ BIG footprint+ evenly produced light=WIN

So far my setup seems to be Working well... Pioneering something has only theory/and here-say to go on...as long as my assumptions are based on good theory it works!

reverof said:

new little test I through up... I had a mixture of aqurium bulbs, non of these are strict actinic bulbs, total of 6 bulbs put in a 8 bulb fixture, 1 is a regular bloom bulb the layout goes as such

life-glo (full spectrum bulb) - bloom 6500k - life-glo - life-glo - aquasun ( 3 peaks at 420/540/600 reddish in color) - empty - aquasun - empty

I placed 4 plants under this setup and 3 in between this fixture and my normal veg fixture. Will get a picture here shortly.
Goal is to see how the 3 between the two fixtures reacts, leaning turning of fan leaves etc... 4 under it are to see full fledge action with only those lights

Pics
View attachment 1676359View attachment 1676358


Also noticed taking pics of this fixture that 1 of the ballasts doesnt seem to be happy, will have to replace this shortly... the 4 outside lights are on 1 ballast workhorse 7 that was replaced before, the middle 4 are on an old original ballast.

Click to expand...

Is it the UVL Aquasun?
AquaSun 10,000K T5
These bulbs are to be appealing to the eye hence to 500nm range. Rods are maximally sensitive to wavelengths near 500 nm, and play little, if any, role in color vision. In brighter light, such as daylight, vision is photopic: light is detected by cone cells which are responsible for color vision. Cones are sensitive to a range of wavelengths, but are most sensitive to wavelengths near 555 nm. I havent found anything on plants using this spike and wanted to avoid making them test subjects...there are so many 10000k bulbs out there with so many different color combinations i would need 30 or so bulbs i do plan on finding a "daylight" bulb to add to the mix on my next Veg...
I will watch closely as I'm sure others will do. +rep for helping the effort!

New Updates... Almost half way done! Lights just came on so updates it is! Flowers seem to be sprouting up EVERYWHERE on these plants all the way down to the main stem...I wont be pruning or preening i want the plants to go as far as possible on their own. the speckles of white stuff is DIatomaceous earth... keeps the bugs off.. i noticed some flies....so this will kepp them @ bay! and no chemicals or fowl odor..
I use a wetting agent and spray on .... wit till its done dripping and apply with a duster

Ballasts
http://cgi.ebay.com/TRIDONIC-PCA-2-x-54w-DIGITAL-DIMMABLE-BALLAST-DSI-ECO-/250847573742?pt=UK_BOI_Lights_Lighting_ET&hash=item3a67ae36ee#ht_544wt_1185

Lamp holders for those DIYers out there!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ARCADIA-ULTRASEAL-T5-WATERPROOF-LAMPHOLDERS-IP67-ABT5LL-/250842213171?pt=UK_Pet_Supplies_Fish&hash=item3a675c6b33#ht_500wt_1202

I had to do some moving around of my plants yesterday do to what was gonna be over crowding, I will state an auto easy ryder got placed under my actinic bulb around 5pm, within 18 hours that auto grew into the actinic bulb, lights were about 2 inches above her when she was moved to the location... that is a nice sight, could be coincidence, or it could be the mix of light and the much help of the actinic spectrum!

no such thing as coincidence! great post!

Hey there Prof,
A question about using DE. My experience with DE is limited to my using it in my swimming pool filter. I have noticed just how fine it is. While I cannot argue with the "inert" or maybe I should say innocuous nature of DE I wonder if due to the fact that is is so fine that it might have an adverse effect of the respiratory rate of your plants by basically clogging the stomata. Also, do you take any special care to avoid dusting on the actual flowers (and would taking that care be exceedingly tedious?), as I could also see the DE as having a diminishing effect on the overall turpenoid production of the plant? Just curious as to your opinions on those two issues.

How far are you keeping your lights from the tops???

Pakalolohui... if your asking that question to me, I attempt to keep the light atleast 1.5 inches from the tallest plant, which kinda sucks at the moment, because this one easy ryder is out pacing the entire crowd by about 3-4 inches, about 3 weeks old and pushing 11", 17" including the 1gal pot.

The question is open to all.

You don't see light burn as an issue at being this close to the tops???
What about frying the nugs and hairs being that close???

I do have a fan blowing pretty good on my tops, for fresh air circulation and cooling as well.

The warmest I may get is about 82 or 84 for the last hour or two in the evening before lights out, and this is seldom, it is usually no more than 80. Daytime temps are 73-77 typically.

Pakalolohui....
I do not flower with T5's at this time I just veg, but as far as vegging goes there are no ill effects from having a T5 light within an inch or two of a plant. Standard Bloom & Flower T5 bulbs only reach a temp of 125-140F with zero air movement. I h ave had plants literally grow into the bulb and about wrap leaves around the bulb and never even see a brown speck.

I've dropped my 2' T-5 a few times on a few plants and a leaf had grown to a bulb and I do and have had burn spots on my plants. It looks like a ring, burnt, on my leaves where the light dropped, kinda funny in a way.

I've tried to keep about 5" during veg. any closer and the nodes would of been staked on top of each other.
Now in bloom, the average height is 5", about 3" at the very tops and 7"-8" at the under sites.

I will try lowering a bit more but don't want to fry my buds.

SOCALRP said:

Hey there Prof,
A question about using DE. My experience with DE is limited to my using it in my swimming pool filter. I have noticed just how fine it is. While I cannot argue with the "inert" or maybe I should say innocuous nature of DE I wonder if due to the fact that is is so fine that it might have an adverse effect of the respiratory rate of your plants by basically clogging the stomata. Also, do you take any special care to avoid dusting on the actual flowers (and would taking that care be exceedingly tedious?), as I could also see the DE as having a diminishing effect on the overall turpenoid production of the plant? Just curious as to your opinions on those two issues.

Click to expand...

No worries its silica... not talc. the tiny "shards" of fossilized diatomes cant block stomata. viewed under a microscope its extremly "sharp" which in turn cuts the exoskeleton of the insect and it basically dehydrates to death.....
Im not worried if i get it on the plants as DE has been used for longer than you can imagine with no ill effects.. it wont "burn" and cant cause you harm in any way... matter of fact its "food grade"
im not coating the plants in a blanket but a small duster like device that is as fine as blush powder... the spots of it were my feeble attempt to hand apply...its easily blown off the leaves.. now a few days later no flies , no poison, no neem!"smelly shit" no sm90 either! BTW you can grow in DE as well as its organic and fill of crevices and makes great reusable growing medium.http://www.diatomitecanada.com/hydroponics-using-diatomite.htm

PakaloloHui said:

The question is open to all.

You don't see light burn as an issue at being this close to the tops???
What about frying the nugs and hairs being that close???

I do have a fan blowing pretty good on my tops, for fresh air circulation and cooling as well.

The warmest I may get is about 82 or 84 for the last hour or two in the evening before lights out, and this is seldom, it is usually no more than 80. Daytime temps are 73-77 typically.

Click to expand...

Low as possible actually right now one of my buds is 1" from my bulb and no issues...but usually as close as possible on that front...if i have to ill train the tallest buds down so i can get the light closer!

i am in the uk and out of work, i cant decide if i want a 400 hps lamp, or one of these ?

i can add more later.... can anyone please PLEASE advise a noob ?