Jesus Myth & Why It Endures

JCS57

JCS57

Well-Known Member
SamsonsRiddle said:
Can you be any more vague? And how could anyone not tell you are biblically illiterate if you think we get to interpret the bible?

If everyone got to interpret the bible their own way then it would be just people's opinions and their truth would die with them. There is absolute truth, whether you believe it or not, and it is revealed in the bible. But everything has to match together.

So if i say the sabbath is on sunday, and try to prove it by the word, i will be found out as teaching a lie. There is just too much evidence to prove that is on saturday, and that's not "just what i believe." It is easily verifiable by earnest study of what god's word say.

Just like most of the contradictions gnome's talking about; things are taken out of context and used in ways that just don't make sense. It's not my job to educate you on what the bible says or how to interpret it, but a little more study time may make you sound like you might know what you're talking about.
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See your first sentence is where you go completely off the rails. You're trying to hold me accountable for what other people think, believe, and claim. I'm only repeating their claims you're attempting to kill the messenger (me) with the assumption that somehow what they believe will then somehow be discredited. If you would have been following along you would have seen that I had previously stated that's the problem people saying it says what it doesn't say or reading it literally and believing that it is literally factual, and should be followed as such. You don't believe we should stone bratty kids to death do you?
Again try to follow along. There are other religious beliefs that hold that they have the one and only truth and what you believe is false their claim is mutually exclusive same as yours in other words you both can't be right but you both could be wrong. Secondly this holds true for Christianity, certain denominations or sects hold that they have the only truth and others do not and thus these false Christians are condemned to hell. This is not a point of contention do some research these people think Catholics aren't Christian nor do they believe in interpretation the Bible says what it says full stop.
As to your last paragraph I need to study more so I sound like I know what I'm talking about. Dude make you a deal, I'll study more just as soon as you learn reading comprehension. I haven't made any claims as to what the Bible says or what it doesn't say or what it means that isn't and hasn't been my argument even though you keep insinuating that it is.
 
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schnooby

schnooby

Well-Known Member
JCS57 said:
See your first sentence is where you go completely off the rails. You're trying to hold me accountable for what other people think, believe, and claim. I'm only repeating their claims you're attempting to kill the messenger (me) with the assumption that somehow what they believe will then somehow be discredited. If you would have been following along you would have seen that I had previously stated that's the problem people saying it says what it doesn't say or reading it literally and believing that it is literally factual, and should be followed as such. You don't believe we should stone bratty kids to death do you?
Again try to follow along. There are other religious beliefs that hold that they have the one and only truth and what you believe is false their claim is mutually exclusive same as yours in other words you both can't be right but you both could be wrong. Secondly this holds true for Christianity, certain denominations or sects hold that they have the only truth and others do not and thus these false Christians are condemned to hell. This is not a point of contention do some research these people think Catholics aren't Christian nor do they believe in interpretation the Bible says what it says full stop.
As to your last paragraph I need to study more so I sound like I know what I'm talking about. Dude make you a deal, I'll study more just as soon as you learn reading comprehension. I haven't made any claims as to what the Bible says or what it doesn't say or what it means that isn't and hasn't been my argument even though you keep insinuating that it is.
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youre doing the same thing youre accusing others of doing, namely trying to discredit something because of what other people believe or do.

"There are other religious beliefs that hold that they have the one and only truth and what you believe is false their claim is mutually exclusive same as yours in other words you both can't be right but you both could be wrong. Secondly this holds true for Christianity, certain denominations or sects hold that they have the only truth and others do not and thus these false Christians are condemned to hell"



 
SamsonsRiddle

SamsonsRiddle

Well-Known Member
JCS57 said:
See your first sentence is where you go completely off the rails. You're trying to hold me accountable for what other people think, believe, and claim. I'm only repeating their claims you're attempting to kill the messenger (me) with the assumption that somehow what they believe will then somehow be discredited. If you would have been following along you would have seen that I had previously stated that's the problem people saying it says what it doesn't say or reading it literally and believing that it is literally factual, and should be followed as such. You don't believe we should stone bratty kids to death do you?
Again try to follow along. There are other religious beliefs that hold that they have the one and only truth and what you believe is false their claim is mutually exclusive same as yours in other words you both can't be right but you both could be wrong. Secondly this holds true for Christianity, certain denominations or sects hold that they have the only truth and others do not and thus these false Christians are condemned to hell. This is not a point of contention do some research these people think Catholics aren't Christian nor do they believe in interpretation the Bible says what it says full stop.
As to your last paragraph I need to study more so I sound like I know what I'm talking about. Dude make you a deal, I'll study more just as soon as you learn reading comprehension. I haven't made any claims as to what the Bible says or what it doesn't say or what it means that isn't and hasn't been my argument even though you keep insinuating that it is.
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You must not have the whole book if you think we are supposed to stone kids. Remember when they got ready to stone the woman for committing adultery and jesus told them not to unless they were without sin? Then he told the lady to go and sin no more. The old testament was the discipline and the new testament explained forgiveness. So basically, if you take the WHOLE bible and stop taking parts out of context (as you did with the little stoned kids), then you won't sound like you don't have a clue what the word says. Like Jesus said, "Man shall not live by bread alone, but by EVERY word that proceeds from the mouth of god."

It should be taken literally, except in parts where it is using symbolism (such as in genesis when god creates light and darkness - using symbolism to describe righteousness and unrighteousness because he creates the sun and moon at a later verse). Here you go saying that's my belief again... However, a thorough examination of the scriptures shows that the things prophesied which came true always happened literally as they were said - not like some fairy tale with just words to allow your own imagination to take hold. The bible was to be taken literally as a whole book based on what Jesus said in the quote above, but denominations (catholics in particular) have chosen to pick and choose what they want to be true - without accepting what the bible says is true. This is another subject, but i'm sure you are going to say "Well who are you to say they are wrong?" The quote above, from Jesus, tells us how to do it and it's not based on what we believe but rather what the word says. Interpretation, once again, is done by the word and not the individual reading.

And as far as your last paragraph - then what is the stoning kids to death thing about? Sounds like you are insinuating a comprehension of the old testament above or equal to others, as well as saying it doesn't mean what it says (like you did before). I don't care about the messenger, all i care about is the truth being revealed to others who are actually open-minded enough to try to understand the bible without just going by what all these denominations (men) say.

"They come close to me with their words, but their hearts are far from me. They teach as doctrine the traditions of men."
 
GardenGnome83

GardenGnome83

Well-Known Member
SamsonsRiddle said:
You must not have the whole book if you think we are supposed to stone kids. Remember when they got ready to stone the woman for committing adultery and jesus told them not to unless they were without sin? Then he told the lady to go and sin no more. The old testament was the discipline and the new testament explained forgiveness. So basically, if you take the WHOLE bible and stop taking parts out of context (as you did with the little stoned kids), then you won't sound like you don't have a clue what the word says. Like Jesus said, "Man shall not live by bread alone, but by EVERY word that proceeds from the mouth of god."

It should be taken literally, except in parts where it is using symbolism (such as in genesis when god creates light and darkness - using symbolism to describe righteousness and unrighteousness because he creates the sun and moon at a later verse). Here you go saying that's my belief again... However, a thorough examination of the scriptures shows that the things prophesied which came true always happened literally as they were said - not like some fairy tale with just words to allow your own imagination to take hold. The bible was to be taken literally as a whole book based on what Jesus said in the quote above, but denominations (catholics in particular) have chosen to pick and choose what they want to be true - without accepting what the bible says is true. This is another subject, but i'm sure you are going to say "Well who are you to say they are wrong?" The quote above, from Jesus, tells us how to do it and it's not based on what we believe but rather what the word says. Interpretation, once again, is done by the word and not the individual reading.

And as far as your last paragraph - then what is the stoning kids to death thing about? Sounds like you are insinuating a comprehension of the old testament above or equal to others, as well as saying it doesn't mean what it says (like you did before). I don't care about the messenger, all i care about is the truth being revealed to others who are actually open-minded enough to try to understand the bible without just going by what all these denominations (men) say.

"They come close to me with their words, but their hearts are far from me. They teach as doctrine the traditions of men."
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If the book is the unerring word of God, why contradict itself? Gods law is unchangeable, but it changes?
Right there is a big red flag.
"Prophecy" being played out in the bible?
Lol, the authors had a guideline right in front of them, nothing divine there.
You've been duped.
 
schnooby

schnooby

Well-Known Member
GardenGnome83 said:
If the book is the unerring word of God, why contradict itself? Gods law is unchangeable, but it changes?
Right there is a big red flag.
"Prophecy" being played out in the bible?
Lol, the authors had a guideline right in front of them, nothing divine there.
You've been duped.
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please cite specific examples
 
GardenGnome83

GardenGnome83

Well-Known Member
schnooby said:
please cite specific examples
Click to expand...
infidels.org/library/modern/jim_meritt/bible-contradictions.html
www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/013/08/19/an-incredible-interactive-chart-of-biblical-contradictions
Here ya go. Take your time.
There is a site that can give you excuses for 143 of the contradictions out there too. I'm sure you would love it, as it ignores the fact that there IS a contradiction, while trying desperately to explain why it's there, and how it is good.
 
JCS57

JCS57

Well-Known Member
SamsonsRiddle said:
You must not have the whole book if you think we are supposed to stone kids. Remember when they got ready to stone the woman for committing adultery and jesus told them not to unless they were without sin? Then he told the lady to go and sin no more. The old testament was the discipline and the new testament explained forgiveness. So basically, if you take the WHOLE bible and stop taking parts out of context (as you did with the little stoned kids), then you won't sound like you don't have a clue what the word says. Like Jesus said, "Man shall not live by bread alone, but by EVERY word that proceeds from the mouth of god."

It should be taken literally, except in parts where it is using symbolism (such as in genesis when god creates light and darkness - using symbolism to describe righteousness and unrighteousness because he creates the sun and moon at a later verse). Here you go saying that's my belief again... However, a thorough examination of the scriptures shows that the things prophesied which came true always happened literally as they were said - not like some fairy tale with just words to allow your own imagination to take hold. The bible was to be taken literally as a whole book based on what Jesus said in the quote above, but denominations (catholics in particular) have chosen to pick and choose what they want to be true - without accepting what the bible says is true. This is another subject, but i'm sure you are going to say "Well who are you to say they are wrong?" The quote above, from Jesus, tells us how to do it and it's not based on what we believe but rather what the word says. Interpretation, once again, is done by the word and not the individual reading.

And as far as your last paragraph - then what is the stoning kids to death thing about? Sounds like you are insinuating a comprehension of the old testament above or equal to others, as well as saying it doesn't mean what it says (like you did before). I don't care about the messenger, all i care about is the truth being revealed to others who are actually open-minded enough to try to understand the bible without just going by what all these denominations (men) say.

"They come close to me with their words, but their hearts are far from me. They teach as doctrine the traditions of men."
Click to expand...
Alas this is useless and pointless. You keep singling out meaningless bullshit in order to ignore the context while bellowing everyone else is taking things out of context. Pot meet kettle.

All through the thread you have ignored all that I've said in order that you may defend against things I do not adhere. My point about stoning children was to show how foolish literal translation is an you once again jump on that as if it is the basis of what I'm saying. I'd call your responses nothing more than a straw man rebuttal but due to your lack of attention to detail it seems more of a learning disability.

You can proclaim all you want about what you believe concerning the Bible and how it should be read and understood but it still comes down to that is but your opinion which is one of many. The Bible doesn't have a instruction manual which says this is how you proceed.

Since it is plausible you are not illiterate or that you don't have a learning disability and that you really are just being obtuse because you don't want to really address what I'm talking about let me help you.

To show that my argument is false and without standing this is all you have to do.

1) demonstrate that every religion concerning deities are all in complete harmony with no conflicting tenets, beliefs, or dogma.

2) demonstrate that every Christian denomination or sects beliefs on how to read and understand the Bible and what constitutes a true Christian are all in complete harmony with no conflicting beliefs, tenets, or dogma.

I won't hold my breath for a reasoned response since you have yet to address this after I've repeated it how many times. You keep thinking you have but all you've done is invent talking points I'm not addressing.
 
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JCS57

JCS57

Well-Known Member
schnooby said:
youre doing the same thing youre accusing others of doing, namely trying to discredit something because of what other people believe or do.

"There are other religious beliefs that hold that they have the one and only truth and what you believe is false their claim is mutually exclusive same as yours in other words you both can't be right but you both could be wrong. Secondly this holds true for Christianity, certain denominations or sects hold that they have the only truth and others do not and thus these false Christians are condemned to hell"
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Another waving the hands and jumping up and down screaming don't look over there look over here. If you can't address the issue attempt to discredit the messenger. You like fallacies tell me which one that is. Nice try though but it doesn't discredit the point in any shape or fashion it just means you choose to ignor it to hammer on something else same as your buddy Samson.

Is your mind so closed that you cannot see this as a real issue do you truly believe that responses directed at me and not what I say magically make this go away? I thought you were all about open mindedness and self examination was all that just word salad to make yourself feel better about having closed yourself off to other possibilities?
 
JCS57

JCS57

Well-Known Member
GardenGnome83 said:
infidels.org/library/modern/jim_meritt/bible-contradictions.html
www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/013/08/19/an-incredible-interactive-chart-of-biblical-contradictions
Here ya go. Take your time.
There is a site that can give you excuses for 143 of the contradictions out there too. I'm sure you would love it, as it ignores the fact that there IS a contradiction, while trying desperately to explain why it's there, and how it is good.
Click to expand...

That doesn't work since all contradictions are simply misunderstanding or taken out of context.
 
JCS57

JCS57

Well-Known Member
JCS57 said:

1) demonstrate that every religion concerning deities are all in complete harmony with no conflicting tenets, beliefs, or dogma.

2) demonstrate that every Christian denomination or sects beliefs on how to read and understand the Bible and what constitutes a true Christian are all in complete harmony with no conflicting beliefs, tenets, or dogma.
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Add a third item to these other 2.

3) Why do beliefs/truths depend so much on who your parents are and where you were born and raised in other words geographical. How do the beliefs of one group substantiate or discredit the beliefs of others.
 
SamsonsRiddle

SamsonsRiddle

Well-Known Member
GardenGnome83 said:
infidels.org/library/modern/jim_meritt/bible-contradictions.html
www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/013/08/19/an-incredible-interactive-chart-of-biblical-contradictions
Here ya go. Take your time.
There is a site that can give you excuses for 143 of the contradictions out there too. I'm sure you would love it, as it ignores the fact that there IS a contradiction, while trying desperately to explain why it's there, and how it is good.
Click to expand...
lol, the first example on that patheos site it wrong.

According to the Book of Exodus, Mount Sinai (Hebrew: הר סיני, Har Sinai) is the mountain at which the Ten Commandments were given to Moses by God. In the Book of Deuteronomy, these events are described as having transpired at Mount Horeb. The name "Sinai" is only used in the Torah by the Jahwist and Priestly source, whereas Horeb is only used by the Elohist and Deuteronomist.[1] "Sinai" and "Horeb" are generally considered to refer to the same place, although there is a small body of opinion that the two names may refer to different locations.
 
SamsonsRiddle

SamsonsRiddle

Well-Known Member
JCS57 said:
Alas this is useless and pointless. You keep singling out meaningless bullshit in order to ignore the context while bellowing everyone else is taking things out of context. Pot meet kettle.

All through the thread you have ignored all that I've said in order that you may defend against things I do not adhere. My point about stoning children was to show how foolish literal translation is an you once again jump on that as if it is the basis of what I'm saying. I'd call your responses nothing more than a straw man rebuttal but due to your lack of attention to detail it seems more of a learning disability.

You can proclaim all you want about what you believe concerning the Bible and how it should be read and understood but it still comes down to that is but your opinion which is one of many. The Bible doesn't have a instruction manual which says this is how you proceed.

Since it is plausible you are not illiterate or that you don't have a learning disability and that you really are just being obtuse because you don't want to really address what I'm talking about let me help you.

To show that my argument is false and without standing this is all you have to do.

1) demonstrate that every religion concerning deities are all in complete harmony with no conflicting tenets, beliefs, or dogma.

2) demonstrate that every Christian denomination or sects beliefs on how to read and understand the Bible and what constitutes a true Christian are all in complete harmony with no conflicting beliefs, tenets, or dogma.

I won't hold my breath for a reasoned response since you have yet to address this after I've repeated it how many times. You keep thinking you have but all you've done is invent talking points I'm not addressing.
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i'm sorry, i thought you had an actual point to make.
 
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