Have any of you DIY COB Growers finished a crop under 1000W DE HPS? - POLL

Have any of you DIY COB Growers have actually finished a crop under 1000W DE HPS?

  • Yes

    Votes: 32 29.1%

  • No

    Votes: 78 70.9%
  • Total voters
    110
CobKits

CobKits

Well-Known Member
Enigma said:
but the lack of yield and lengthy flowering time disuades me.
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Neither of those have basis in reality. look at growmau5 example above.

do you realize that a 1000W gavita draws over 1100W at the wall and a comparable yield to growmau5's recent test would be well over 4 units? even his lower 1.42gpw yield on the preceding test would be ~3.5 units

both in the typical 9 weeks

neither of those include the savings in power from dealing with cooling 400 extra watts of heat in your space

Enigma said:
Hey, if CREE has a new product that finally matches HPS pound for pound (I'm not worried about g/W as I'm not worried about operational costs or lack of grow space) I will jump right on that fucking bandwagon.
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again to match it that was several years ago. you cant compare HPS to LED without g/W. to say an HPS yields "more pound for pound" when youre comparing it to an LED using a fraction of the energy just isnt realistic. anybody that tells you they can replace a 1000W hps with 300-400W of LED is full of shit
 
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CobKits

CobKits

Well-Known Member
Enigma said:
Until then, I have been thinking about supplementing a HPS with ultraviolet LED. I think that would be work the trichrome production in the last three weeks of flower or so.
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mercury vapor (t8/t5, agromax, reptisun, etc) all still better than LED. UV is where LED falls short (it can be done, uv leds are expensive and inefficient)
 
CobKits

CobKits

Well-Known Member
what size space? and what would be a fair comparison in your opinion?

same or better gpw? same or better g/sf?
 
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a mongo frog

a mongo frog

Well-Known Member
CobKits said:
what size space? and what would be a fair comparison in your opinion?

same or better gpw? same or better g/sf?
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Running DE 4x6 foot print, green power bulb. I don't know fair comparison or what that means. Everyone grows so different, via strains and veg times. I may run 750 watts of cob i have lying around, however I get nervous taking away a champion like the green power bulb. Plus id be unsure on how to space 3 250 watt 4 foot cob bars. Basically i never pay any attention to the gpw or any other measurement other then lbs.
 
Enigma

Enigma

Well-Known Member
CobKits said:
Neither of those have basis in reality. look at growmau5 example above.

do you realize that a 1000W gavita draws over 1100W at the wall and a comparable yield to growmau5's recent test would be well over 4 units? even his lower 1.42gpw yield on the preceding test would be ~3.5 units

both in the typical 9 weeks

neither of those include the savings in power from dealing with cooling 400 extra watts of heat in your space


again to match it that was several years ago. you cant compare HPS to LED without g/W. to say an HPS yields "more pound for pound" when youre comparing it to an LED using a fraction of the energy just isnt realistic. anybody that tells you they can replace a 1000W hps with 300-400W of LED is full of shit
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I don't use 1000w, 600w are my choice lamps as I don't have a warehouse. Still, nothing has shown me LED competes with HID.

All side-by-side experiments I've seen have kept me using HID.
 
Evil-Mobo

Evil-Mobo

Well-Known Member
I do not have a warehouse and 1K's everywhere. I have a couple 1K's here but they're just too much for the spaces I have. I am currently running the QB's vs AutoCob's, my 600W ballast blew on my right before this grow began. I am in the process of getting the ballast replaced under warranty. Once the new one is back in hand I will be testing the 600W Blue MH I love so dear against each type of LED. A lot of people bitch about no grows comparing lights but last year when I started my COB vs HPS grow running the 1K at my old grow the thread was a ghost town, no activity, so I took it down. It's a lot of work to do testing and stay on top of everything and post in a thread especially if more than one forum etc. I relate now to the guys on YT that say hit the like button at least while you're here lol..........
 
OLD MOTHER SATIVA

OLD MOTHER SATIVA

Well-Known Member
Evil-Mobo said:
I do not have a warehouse and 1K's everywhere. I have a couple 1K's here but they're just too much for the spaces I have. I am currently running the QB's vs AutoCob's, my 600W ballast blew on my right before this grow began. I am in the process of getting the ballast replaced under warranty. Once the new one is back in hand I will be testing the 600W Blue MH I love so dear against each type of LED. A lot of people bitch about no grows comparing lights but last year when I started my COB vs HPS grow running the 1K at my old grow the thread was a ghost town, no activity, so I took it down. It's a lot of work to do testing and stay on top of everything and post in a thread especially if more than one forum etc. I relate now to the guys on YT that say hit the like button at least while you're here lol..........
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well there were/are people interested..so how did it turn out?
 
frica

frica

Well-Known Member
Enigma said:
I don't use 1000w, 600w are my choice lamps as I don't have a warehouse. Still, nothing has shown me LED competes with HID.

All side-by-side experiments I've seen have kept me using HID.
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You're first saying LED is more efficient.

But then you say it can't compete.

So if you take a 600w modern led next to a 600w hps you think it can't outyield the hps despite being more efficient?

Something isn't right there
 
Enigma

Enigma

Well-Known Member
CobKits said:
even better. a 600 HID pulls about the same 700W at the wall as growmau5's rig. Do you get 1000-1200 g out of that setup?
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I've been reading through his posts, watched a few vids, saw his product and sales idea, yet I still am not convinced. IIRC, he stated he has invested over $2k into his LED's and if he truly is getting 1.4 g/W then LED's have come a long way in a decade but the startup cost is ridiculous.

The issue I have is, I've seen HID pull 0.6-1.6 g/W, soil to hydro respectively, excluding all CO2 enriched ops. The startup cost is far less, less work involved (and I've been itching to build an array since the days of knna), adjustable digital ballasts, MH and HPS for different stages of growth and it is simple.

I'll wait a little longer until the technology reaches the next stage and then I'll build that array I've always wanted.
 
CobKits

CobKits

Well-Known Member
its only getting better.

right now you can build a 600W array for under $500

gmau5 may have spent $2k on a rig a while back but his newer ones dont cost that... plus he goes out of his way to be extra fancy with the water-cut mounting plates and stuff. which is awesome but certainly not necessary
 
frica

frica

Well-Known Member
Yodaweed said:
Don't bother dude i'm done asking for sources they are just talking hypothetical with no evidence, 550w to replace a DE light...not going to happen. Honestly not worth the time they are just gonna come up with some more stuff they can't backup , more outrageous claims and hypothetical situations that never apply to the real world.

The only thing i care about is results, they post none.
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I think the 550w replacing 1000w is comparing it to a SE.

Otherwise it's a little dishonest because a 550w led to replace a 1000w DE would have to be around 3.2-3.4 umol/j efficient at least.

Which is possible if you're using the new Xp-g3 royal blues but the new quantum board is "only" going to be 2.8 umol/j
 
CobKits

CobKits

Well-Known Member
frica said:
Otherwise it's a little dishonest because a 550w led to replace a 1000w DE would have to be around 3.2-3.4 umol/j efficient at least.
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well remember that hps uses 1100+W and on a system efficiency is only pushing 1.7 umol/J gross with less than ideal coverage.

with a far better spectrum i think 550W at 2.8 umol/J might approach the results of 1100W 1.7 umol/J - spectrum could give a 10% or more edge to the QB fixture

a 600H instead of a 480H driver pushing it certainly would, but then we're talking 750W
 
frica

frica

Well-Known Member
CobKits said:
well remember that hps uses 1100+W and on a system efficiency is only pushing 1.7 umol/J gross with less than ideal coverage.

with a far better spectrum i think 550W at 2.8 umol/J might approach the results of 1100W 1.7 umol/J - spectrum could give a 10% or more edge to the QB fixture

a 600H instead of a 480H driver pushing it certainly would, but then we're talking 750W
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I prefer to keep it pure umol vs umol and not speculate about spectrums.

Rather keep expectations a little lower than too high.

550w equalling a 1000w de is speculation.

But 750w with 2.8 umol/j should certainly beat a 1000w de
 
Stephenj37826

Stephenj37826

Well-Known Member
frica said:
I think the 550w replacing 1000w is comparing it to a SE.

Otherwise it's a little dishonest because a 550w led to replace a 1000w DE would have to be around 3.2-3.4 umol/j efficient at least.

Which is possible if you're using the new Xp-g3 royal blues but the new quantum board is "only" going to be 2.8 umol/j
Click to expand...
frica said:
I prefer to keep it pure umol vs umol and not speculate about spectrums.

Rather keep expectations a little lower than too high.

550w equalling a 1000w de is speculation.

But 750w with 2.8 umol/j should certainly beat a 1000w de
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There is some speculation here. One thing to also be considered is everything isn't quite Umol/umol when we compare light sources. Light distribution is also a very big factor. If the plants are seeing an equal amount of light at the canopy i call it equal. Most DE hps fixtures that are designed for an overlapping light pattern are in the 1.7-1.8 umol/j range. The spread is very even in these situations. What isn't talked about so much is the same light level at the canopy is also in the center of the isles ( wasted). There are DE fixtures that put more light down to the canopy without as much loss into the isles. These fixtures "control" more of the light with a tighter reflector ( meaning a higher percentage of the light is reflected /corrected). Generally these fixtures are less efficient in total output but actually perform better because they deliver more light to where it counts (the plants). The 2.8 umol/j figure I started above is with optics that create a very nice even canopy coverage while keeping light spillage to a minimum. Without optics the elite will be close to 3.0 umol/j..... This isn't the most efficient way though. So yes I could just chase numbers with the elite and ignore a very important advantage led has over HPS or I could keep going with what I know will result in the end user having higher yields. (Optics)

The big DE HPS manufacturers have different model reflectors. Of course they state the highest umol/j achieved. Here is a good example/small read.

http://nanoluxtech.com/products/de-4x4-fixture/

Umol/j will suffer but overall yield will increase in the situation this was designed for.

Our new 550-Elite is designed for overlap in a linear fashion. It has about a 10' long light pattern that is 4.5' wide. Here is a prime example of its light distribution in action. We have a very even coverage across the canopy while keeping a very high percentage of light where it belongs. The HLG-550 Elite is the culmination of what we've been working on for some time now. Average canopy light levels exceed 900 ppfd here.
Yes we have built prototypes.....

DCA678648A0F467CA8E058EFC2059500~2.png
 
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