First movers for Licensed Producers

So... The HC website now lists three producers. http://cannimed.ca/pages/about-cannimed-ltd http://www.mettrum.com/about/ http://peacenaturals.com/ ------ As I understand it, if you have an HC exemption then all you have to do is register with one of the producers and given them the original copy of your exemption, which means your stuck with whoever you choose unless you go back to the doc... Well...better choose wisely eh? So what is know about these three outfits? Where in Canada are they producing (shipping time/distance is big choice factor for me)? Does anybody know who the people are that are running these outfits? I'd like to know anything you know....

The pricing on two of these companies is in the FaQ. One is $6/g and one says $9-12/g and the other I couldn't find a price.

CanniMed Ltd seems to be the only one currently shipping. Have you called any of them to check for their courier/postal times and costs?

I'm not so much interested in the price. I'm more concerned with "who" they are, as in what kind of marijuana growing experience they have (Peace naturals has a PHD on the payroll and a "growing specialist" that lists only a couple years of experience with cannabis), where they're growing and that sort of thing. I think it's CanniMed that is that Saskatchewan farm which produced all the schwag a while back that was so bad that it led to the system we have now. I mean...just because these operators had the money and credentials to get a producer's license doesn't mean they can grow marijuana....

The other thing is... part of the reason that this new system has been put in play was because of the abuse in the old system...organized crime got involved... and they will certainly infiltrate this new system too, which is something I'd rather not support.

Gquebed said:

Peace naturals has a PHD on the payroll

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Only one?! Most pharma companies have MSc and PhD folks oozing from the cleanroom woodwork.

PN are by Staynor Ont. Head grower named Ken has been DG since 2001. Ive met him. Didnt like him. He is quite proud of the way he manipulated HC leading up to this process. They have a plant biologist on staff but he spent his career working genetically modifying grain. Now in 2 months hes an apparent weed expert. The portion of the grow I saw was hydro.
Yup they are pulling street prices of $2500 a lb with no middleman but of course that is if they can find enough rich sick people, who can find a doc to sign, to buy it. If I had just spent the last 12 years selling DG weed to compassion clubs I could of afforded a farm and gotten in on this scam too.

too bad LP types will be just like there counter parts south of the border
hypocrites ...plain and simple....
They were the first to organize down south,to start a lobby group AGAINST the legalization of pot,since it means that, if anyone can grow their own
they would no longer control the mmj markets.....so instead of being beside NORMAL in the states fighting for whats right,
they are fighting against it instead....HYPOCRITES.....

cannadan said:

too bad LP types will be just like there counter parts south of the border...
[snipped]

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What "counter parts"? There is nothing like the MMPR LP set up in the USA. There is no federal progamme that imposes all of these safety regulations and restricts production to LP facilities. The only thing close at the moment is Bedrocan in the Netherlands.

Magenta Thumb said:

What "counter parts"? There is nothing like the MMPR LP set up in the USA. There is no federal programme that imposes all of these safety regulations and restricts production to LP facilities. The only thing close at the moment is Bedrocan in the Netherlands.

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Maybe you missed the point......when money is involved there will be those exact" hypocrites" here as well....doing their very best to to sway the gov and law in their favor.....for their personal gain and not our health......don't kid yourself..

But (never start a sentence with but) that is where a free market will iron out those greedy apples who are just in it for the money. How will they compete with those that don't have stock holders to impress, that can grow as a farmer not for big pharma profits. They better have decades deep pockets. No advertising and the internet, also levels the playing field for smaller producers.

Your health will be our gain the way I see it.

Ask your LP how many sqft of growing space do they have? That will tell you plenty about what side of the fence they are on. 10,000 sqft or less is not big pharma in my opinion.

I doubt "Big Pharma" (meaning any colossal corporate entities) will get involved for a while yet... not until legislation is written to protect them. They have a big lobby on both sides of the border so that is just a question of time. And when they do come into the market it'll be like Chapters/Barnes Noble, Walmart all over again, in how they slaughtered independents everywhere they opened. Meanwhile... the first movers here will fight like dogs for market share and to hopefully survive. Can only hope that these brave ones won't have to compete against groups like the Hells Angels, who will surely get involved by proxy, as is their MO. And here is the irony... Harper brought this system in to cut organized crime out, but really his system is an invitation for them to get involved and become "legitimate" in this particular industry. And they don't even have to operate for profit, as it'll be a means to launder money. This is exactly how all the big breweries started. In fact, Sleemans, even advertises that part of it's heritage now... Seagrams, Molsons, Labatts...all of them. The better solution would've been to just legalize in a way that allows people to grow their own at home and just take the market away from them entirely...

I don't believe that a corporate takeover of marihuana is possible. Too many uses, too many varieties, Quantity hurts quality, no advertising, Barnes and Noble does not write the books they sell, and if they did the books would be bland. Medical Marihuana under the MMPR will be more like the wine industry in my opinion.

HA needs large profit margins, LP's will be cutting those to survive. Harper (I don't like him either), but he has only made it harder for HA to turn a profit from marihuana, and if you think those HA guys want to start working for a living LP's), your living in a bubble. You could say that about any business.

Growing in your home is not the way forward, growing properly out of your home is. I wish that patients could grow their own with out restriction too but that is not reality, many can do the MMPR but are scared, just like the MMAR was scary 10 years ago. Take the leap, check it out.

What leap? there's no leap of growing 10 large plants per year in a greenhouse that was already detached to taking a second mortgage out on your house if you have one just to continue with the same 10 plants. I've noticed you always talk as if patients who grow for themselves already have illicit profits to upstart with. Most people who grow in a non Top Shelf capacity are just living with what they have, yeah you can go up the "but think of better quality" ladder but the real medicine was in the man having a garden to evolve with.

This looks no different that big dairy, big poultry, big AG taking my right to sell food from my farm to people who "choose" it. Just try to get some raw goat's milk for you lactose intolerance and psoriasis and you will see another agrarian commerce system decimated by "$$$safety$$$". It's called due bloody diligence and it's been around since we got down from tree's, some people take their medicine further than a commodity and subscribe to spiritual beleif systems that are at odd's with ingesting commercial produce.

I had to pump the breaks on my own MMPR agenda's as I'm just a farmer with ducks and rabbits I can't sell as adrenaline free slaughtered meat because "$$$safety$$$" requires my livestock to be shell shocked onto a truck to a commercially sanctioned slaughter house only to come back as meat that went to hell and back after a pristine rearing. Yeah another genius idea killed by the lack of deep pocket's to turn my home into a facility that qualify's for 10k carcasses per day when I only need 120 per year! to support my rural needs.

I invented a food grade extraction of canabis = to bho using naturally sourced citrus terpene that is indistinguishable and absolutely safe to process indoors, my goal was to grow and convert as my business model. I have year's of micro scale growing to perfect that art, I have no profiteering goal's the start up money for you is my happy as larry money 10 years from now. My work is going to die with me because I did not live my life spot free to begin breaking laws. And this venture capitalism that's coming up for canada has no need to actually understand how many people DONT SMOKE or shouldn't be smoking as a means of medicine. The only bubble that existed to solve this was the current situation grey zone at least in BC. I just got my paper's that if Im caught with anything but "i'll never touch this RX' I'm giving up 20 years of my career, I've read allot of your post to see where your intentions lay as you stoke the pot either in self motivation or to build your business.

What say ye to my mixed message? It's lovely the "idea" my mother can have her mmj covered under insurance vs going broke buying it at a dispensary. But I watch people go broke for their health at whole food's everyday and this is no different. The sad part is they could have gone to the farmer's market and looked the grower in the eye and paid allot less, but places like whole foods made sure the city bylaws push that option to the fringe of city where only car's go. The chances of my dad going online for mmj are moot, he doesn't have a phone and only understand paper money he's a criminal now?

Kootenaygirl said:

I don't believe that a corporate takeover of marihuana is possible. Too many uses, too many varieties, Quantity hurts quality, no advertising, .

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It's inevitable.

Kootenaygirl said:

Medical Marihuana under the MMPR will be more like the wine industry in my opinion..

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I think that's more of a hope. The wine industry is dominated by huge corporations, but there has been niche markets created locally. But again, wine is no different than any other industry.

Kootenaygirl said:

HA needs large profit margins, LP's will be cutting those to survive. .

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Why? They make huge profit on all kinds of illicit activities. This would merely serve to launder money for those, at least until the industry evolves, as did the alcohol business.

Kootenaygirl said:

Growing in your home is not the way forward, growing properly out of your home is. .

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That's subjective. What is meant by "properly"? One thing I learned about growing is that everybody has their own way and have strong opinions about what is right/wrong. If "properly" means safely then you're right. However, I have some strong objections to the excuse that city officials and law enforcement have used to detract home growers. The fact is that none of the "chemical" or solutions that any of us growers use is more toxic or "dangerous" than any of the household cleaners that are under everybody's sink. The fire hazard angle is moot too. In any neighbourhood you'll find people in their garages or basements doing some incredibly stupid things with electricity, power tools, flammables/explosives, welders and so on for their various "hobbys" that are just as, or far more, hazardous. The fact is there is nothing about home growing that is more dangerous than any of the usual activities that go on in homes. What "hazard" boils down to is the intelligence level of the individual involved in the activity, not the activity itself. I'm really disappointed that nobody has argued that totally obvious point. At least I've never heard it.

Great post SaybianTv! First I thought your "mixed message" was well said. Working in the garden is very therapeutic, and we do under estimate it's value.
We had to stop buying a half cow every year for the same butchering reasons, too bad. The illegal goat milk market is healthy though, no pun intended.

Nobody is saying the MMPR will be easy, illicit profits to work with?, try 20 years running my own business, keeping my nose clean. Many average people like me, have purchased property years ago with the growing of marihuana in mind, with buildings or the room to build, away from neighbours, etc. etc. $50,000 more to be 100% legal is definitely not for everybody. I am only talking to those that already have a twenty light show($100,000 invested) and are facing these hard choices.

The MMPR is not as scary as it first looks and is also not for everybody. Have you avoided a criminal record? Have you run a small business? Do you have the zoning? If your answers are NO, then the MMPR is probably not for you.

Don't let the MMPR beat those of you that have earned resources that they could now be applied to continue doing what they love.

Is religion/spirituality the way forward if the conroy lawsuit comes up short? The tax free church of growing marihuana for the sick and dying? Hasn't anybody tried this before? Marihuana - Spirituallity - Laws

I find it criminal that HC is promoting "smoking", reducing edibles and I believe that will come back and bite them. I lump access regarding no phone, no computer, no credit with "smoking" because this will also bite HC, as this is a real access issue I hear about so rarely.

My goals are simple. Spread marihuana legally. I don't waste my time and energy worrying about anything I have no control over and do not break the law on purpose.

The way I see things is that we have few choices, go broke buying from MMPR, maybe go broke working the MMPR system, probably go broke breaking the law, or quit my life long love of marihuana.

Every grower I know, 18 of them, by the way all use their own medicine. I think 6 of 18 would be capable of making the change to the MMPR if they would take 3 weeks and read all the paperwork, building an application. None have even gotten past the read or the wasted anger. Well one has, #18, me. I am just a little frustrated that I can't even try to talk with them about it because of their anger at this change,they are still seeing red, and to me, you did not need a crystal ball to see this coming, this change was inevitable, get over it already and do your homework, nobody is going to hold your hand with this one, this is not the MMAR.

Gquebed thanks for the feedback. I agree with you. It will be a corporate takeover, like the wine industry. I want to be a local grower, specializing in the very best among the big boys and their swag as doobius1 would put it.

MMPR is the foundation for future legalization in my opinion it is the first step, once we get to rec use, who knows how long, the HA's marihuana profits will be completely eliminated. Last I heard HA is not in the brewing industry, they may own some bars, but no illicit alcohol profits. Moonshine died with end of prohibition.

Very subjective indeed, "growing properly". Well I was close to growing properly before the MMPR came out, but after reading it all, then writing our own SOP's, we had work to do. Generally speaking, I don't think the government should be able to tell you what you can or can't do in your own home that you own. With that said, do you live alone? Are you an annoyance to your neighbours? Are you a danger to your neighbours.

When you wave your arms in freedom are your hands in someone else's face? Apply this to all aspects of your grow, the MMPR does. You can't write laws that apply to intelligence levels, unfortunatley. If welding in your basement was a prevalent behaviour or the cleaners in your cupboard could hurt your neighbours, I'm sure we would have laws by now, come on?

Kootenaygirl said:

MMPR is the foundation for future legalization in my opinion it is the first step, once we get to rec use, who knows how long, the HA's marihuana profits will be completely eliminated. Last I heard HA is not in the brewing industry, they may own some bars, but no illicit alcohol profits. Moonshine died with end of prohibition.

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I think you're missing my point... HA doesn't need marijuana for profit. It would likely use this program, if at all, for money laundering = a legit business to pour crime dollars into and pour out legal dollars. The exchange rate is pretty high, but it would be better than paying people to fill video lottery machines. Anyway, I think what you might be missing here is that during prohibition, families like Seagram, Sleeman, Molsons and so on were Mafioso crime families or directly tied to them. When prohibition was lifted their enterprises became legitimate businesses over night. They had the brewing facilities and distribution networks already set up. But that didn't mean they gave up their other criminal enterprises. Proceeds from those other enterprises were poured into the booze business to clean them up, generally at a 4/5 to 1 ratio. Anyway, all I'm really trying to say here is that there is that danger here. I would like to avoid supporting anything that the criminal element might start up in the MMPR realm. I would also like to find good quality medicine, which is why I asked the original question of this thread, which is.... what is known about the 3 LP available to use now? I have to register soon and would like some more info than is offered on their sites. If nobody in our community knows anything then maybe it's best to avoid them entirely and keep growing my own.... after all, 4 plants scrogged twice a year would keep me stocked and I just can't imagine the police being bothered to charge somebody who has a documented medical history in this situation. And if they did, I highly doubt that court would convict. And if they did, the plant count would not warrant jail time, according to the mandatory minimums currently in place.................................. and that would be my advice to those who are truly growing for themselves - stay under 5 plants and the law will overlook...

Kootenaygirl said:

Growing in your home is not the way forward, growing properly out of your home is. I wish that patients could grow their own with out restriction too but that is not reality, many can do the MMPR but are scared, just like the MMAR was scary 10 years ago. Take the leap, check it out.

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I couldn't disagree with you more on this on Kgirl. It was the way forward...patients getting what they need and how much, no more dg's stealing from the sick and selling to the healthy, decriminalizing is the only answer to the black market. It's not that people don't want to take the leap, they just can't afford to.

The MMPR is the first step to a well regulated industry that will eventually supply the legal recreational market. Your right that decriminalizing is the only way to eliminating organized crime, the MMPR is the first step toward a regulated/taxed system like alcohol. This is how we get there.

Still don't think HA will favour this over any other money laundering system once we go recreational. Just another business. I think that HA sees the writing on the wall and won't want its illegal money in an industry with a magnifying glass every aspect of it. Safer with the teflon banks, lol.

I understand that some can in no way seriously look at the MMPR and 50K is a lot of money, I am trying to convince those that are too angry to think to start thinking, if you have 100K or more already spent on building, property, equipment, experience, don't let the hurdle of the MMPR dissuade you, let the 50K, the zoning, your criminal record, the fact you hate growing indoors, or because you think that big pharma's going to swallow you up, JUST READ THE PAPERWORK WITH AN OPEN MIND ONCE, THEN DECIDE. End the Hysteria.