DWC Air Pump Question

dbkick

Well-Known Member
Op some photos of your roots would help people help you too. you say a "browning" this could be a stain from nutrients.
These roots right here in this photo are stained(they were also h2o2'd on a regular basis) odd, the plants did fine, as a matter of fact conditions were so extreme (a lot of heat) that I'm surprised they made it let alone turned out like they did, I had one plant go over 12 zips.
 

Attachments

LT1RX7 Drifter

Active Member
Hmm. Ok so can the water be tool cold? I know 68 is the goal but what if it was lower?
uptake of nutrients can slow down to almost stopping, root system temps i thing are just as important as ambiant air temps and when the air temps drop so does the rate of growth.
 

LT1RX7 Drifter

Active Member
Are you just going to attack any member who advocates h2o2 or ever actually provide info that supports your abstract self-made theory?
#1 its not a self-made theory, they are facts it kills all micro life
#2 h202 has its place in a grow but not in the soil, at least in the fasion you all seem it sould be used, and i only attacked one member who has a huge history of telling almost every plant problem replies to with h202 man it fixes everything, what i was trying say is its going to do more long term harm then short term benefits
 

mufastaa

Active Member
ill put in my hat for h2o2, i think my plants like it alot and it keeps the res way cleaner. + its cheap and available (i use the 3%). and i think you are giving bad advice Drifter... i dont think anyone is putting it in their soil. these are dwc hydro systems.

And i also use a frozen water bottle every once in a while to bring temps down, i dont have a thermometer but they should be cool to the touch. I only use h2o2 when i think things are starting to brown, not as a preventative.
 

mike91sr

Well-Known Member
#1 its not a self-made theory, they are facts it kills all micro life
#2 h202 has its place in a grow but not in the soil, at least in the fasion you all seem it sould be used, and i only attacked one member who has a huge history of telling almost every plant problem replies to with h202 man it fixes everything, what i was trying say is its going to do more long term harm then short term benefits
1. It doesn't kill ALL micro life, but yes it does kill both good and bad bacteria. The point is to try to eliminate them entirely. Hence the term sterile. If sterile rez's didn't work then how would sooo many people have had such great success with it time and time again??
2. What does soil have anything to do with it? And how are we all saying it should be used which is incorrect? If youre going to attack a member for prescribing a solution you believe to be incorrect, why don't you also propose an alternative to the guy asking the question so he isn't lost. He clearly isn't an expert when it comes to this and if you know so much about bennies, why don't you tell him what you actually recommend instead of this:
  • [h=2]
    [/h]
    wow every post excepct 2 were even close to helping you with your problems, one add a frozen water bottle to stablize res temps, DO NOT USE HYDROGEN PEROXIDE, AND BIGV1976 QUITE TELLING PEOPLE TO USE THE SHIT, its for cleaning it remove skin from your jands what do you think it does toroot tissue, you clearly have no clue what your doing, every time someone has a problem you tell them to use it. Shut the fuck up with your dumb ass advice, ok no back to the OP's problem once you get temps in check bring you microculture up with some inoculants or worm/bat/shroom tea, keep ph @ or around 6.0 your problem will solve itself like nature intended.​


You're the reason people are so misinformed, this guy may now think h2o2 is horrible for any use. "Your problem will solve itself." Great advice...
And what are the long term harm h2o2 will cause? Because according to the universe and chemistry, h2o2 breaks down into h2o and O. So it raises the DO content after it breaks down the dead organic matter, leaving water as a byproduct. Is this the long term harm you're talking about? Too much oxygen and water in a hydroponic system...sounds like a rough one.
 

mdjenks

Well-Known Member
anyone mention using hygrozyme, its organic and is specifically for keeping your roots healthy and eating away the dead ones plus you can use it with H2o2
 

mike91sr

Well-Known Member
Depends. I personally use it as a preventative measure, though numerous people who recommend its use for cleaning and sterilization/treatment don't use it otherwise. Like I mentioned in my earlier post, I personally add a higher concentration when I change my rez, then add a small amount every couple days.
 

bigv1976

Well-Known Member
wow every post excepct 2 were even close to helping you with your problems, one add a frozen water bottle to stablize res temps, DO NOT USE HYDROGEN PEROXIDE, AND BIGV1976 QUITE TELLING PEOPLE TO USE THE SHIT, its for cleaning it remove skin from your jands what do you think it does toroot tissue, you clearly have no clue what your doing, every time someone has a problem you tell them to use it. Shut the fuck up with your dumb ass advice, ok no back to the OP's problem once you get temps in check bring you microculture up with some inoculants or worm/bat/shroom tea, keep ph @ or around 6.0 your problem will solve itself like nature intended.
First of all your approach to spreading your ignorance is far from effective. Second I may have reccomended peroxide twice in 2 years and 3rd I and hundreds of other growers use it quite successfully all the time. I have yet to see anyone reccomend cleaning with peroxide and it has never taken my skin off. You have insecurity issues obviously so please dont respond to me anymore pro ok?
 

bigv1976

Well-Known Member
#1 its not a self-made theory, they are facts it kills all micro life
#2 h202 has its place in a grow but not in the soil, at least in the fasion you all seem it sould be used, and i only attacked one member who has a huge history of telling almost every plant problem replies to with h202 man it fixes everything, what i was trying say is its going to do more long term harm then short term benefits
Hey smart guy who said anything about soil?
 

bigv1976

Well-Known Member
There is an aweful lot of info about h2o2 in this copy and post:

How do I identify and prevent Root Rot?
permalink
[HR][/HR]Introduction • Background • Id & Damage • Management Strategies • Emergency Treatment • Prevention • Environmental Control • Additives

Introduction
"Root rot" is a common waterborne disease that can seriously affect indoor and outdoor crops year round. "Pythium" is a generic term for several different root rot and stem rot fungus species (including Pythium, Verticillium, and Phytophthora, and Fusarium). Root rot is also known as "damping-off" in seeds, seedlings and clones.

Pythium can rapidly infect crops in vegetative and flowering stages. Damage includes strain infection, reduced yields, and crop failure. Pythium is particularly damaging in high-density dwc / hydroponic / aeroponic systems, as these recirculating systems provide ideal conditions for rapid growth and spread of pythium spores. One infected plant can quickly spread rot to all plants if the system has an interconected irrigation system.

This FAQ focuses on indoor prevention and treatment options.

Background
Pythium typically thrives in oxygen-poor (anaerobic), warm (75-85 F), and poorly circulated nutrient solutions. Heavy clay soils with poor drainage are high-risk soil planting sites.

Sources of infection:
# Unsterilized tools and equipment
# Unfiltered water
# Dead roots from previous crops
# Infected plant material (i.e. clones taken from infected moms)

Dissolved oxygen, temperature and pythium
The amount of dissolved oxygen (DO) in a nutrient solution depends on the water temperature. Cold water can 'hold' more dissolved oxygen. A fully aerated solution at 20C/68 F is 9 - 10ppm; at 30C/86F it's 7ppm.

Root oxygen requirement doubles for each 10C rise in root system temperature (max 30C/86F). The dilemma for the grower is that with a 10C rise in temperature, root system oxygen requirements will double, while the oxygen carrying capacity of the solution will drop by over 25%!

The nutrient DO is unable to supply the root's oxygen demands, leading to prolonged oxygen starvation. Oxygen starvation will result in slow growth, mineral deficiencies, root die-back and reduced yields. Oxygen starvation will stress the plant, leading to an eventual attack by opportunistic pathogens, such as ever-present pythium.

Identification, Symptoms and Damage:
Symptoms:
Initial:
# Yellowed, droopy and wilting leaves (possibly exhibiting mineral deficiencies). Leaf curl over - ram's horns' - roots are unable to uptake nutrients at that strength because they are infected.
# pH becomes more acidic (pH should rise slowly in a healthy system)
# 'Burnt' root tips (browning tips may also be a result of light exposure, or over fertilization)
# Reduced water consumption and rising nutrient strength
# Brown colored roots. (Note: GH "Micro" will stain roots brown as well; stain darkens @ ppm's. Healthy root should be white or slightly tan)

Advanced:
# Brown and slimy roots with a slight to strong rotting odor. Plant may appear healthy.
# Reddish and swollen root collar, becoming blackened over time. Eventually the plant will fall over as all connecting tissue will have been 'eaten away'.

Note: Root damage is permanent; new root hairs can form, but damaged roots will not regenerate. Lightly infected roots may turn white again if treated promptly.

Dead roots serve as energy sources for pythium; snip off dead roots and remove flating root piece by changing the tank frequently.

Physical test of advanced root rot:
"Brown tissue on the outer portion of the root easily pulls off, leaving a thin strand of hair-like vascular tissue exposed."

Management Strategies
Keeping the crop healthy, vigorous and stress-free is the best "cure" against pythium. Pythium is almost impossible to 100% eradicate from an infected system; this involves starting completely over (with new mothers, containers, equipment, etc). An infected crop can be nursed along, and subsequent crops can still yield, provided the grower takes care to minimize the growth and spread of pythium in the system.

Starting with a pythium-free system is the best strategy:

Startup with a new crop:
-disinfect the system. Manual scrubbing and bleach might be necessary.
-add tap water
-disinfect the water with strong h2o2. It takes 100ppm to kill pythium outright, however this can also kill small plants. Wait 24 hours for h2o2 to dissipate to a safe level - do not add tap water to system! Add only h2o2-treated water.
-add nutrients and beneficial enzymes. The aerobic-loving enzymes will colonize the sterilized medium and system, hopefully displacing any anaerobic bacteria.

Soil tips:
Improved soil is the first step to keeping root rot out of your garden. Adding amendments to improve drainage and aeration will decrease the chances of root rot. Use only sterilized soil/soilless mixes or heat-treated soil before use.
Removing the diseased plants and several inches of affected soil will slow or stop the spread of pythium. Avoid over watering, as saturated soil promotes anaerobic conditions. Remove and destroy roots and surrounding soil near infected plants. Use sterilized soil for transplants. Provide good drainage and avoid overcrowding plants.

Preventive gardening:
# Monitor plants and roots frequently. Inspect roots for browning. Stressed plants are attacked first, so it is important to inspect crop and remove unhealthy plants.
# Maximize aeration. Use venturis, powerheads, bubble walls/ air curtains, air stones, and daily h2o2 usage to increase dissolved oxygen. Allow nutrients to fall back into the reservoir to create 'waterfall aeration'.
# Use only healthy clones taken from healthy moms (pythium is systemic and diseased moms will pass on root rot!)
# Keep ph stable, between 5.5 and 6.0
# Keep air moving, circulate nutrients continuously
# Keep reservoir / root zone temps low: 62-65F.(Note: submerged pumps will increase water temperature)
# Maintain a clean system. Change tank weekly to reduce spore loads. Add only h2o2-sterilized water
# Use tank additives

Other tips:
# Isolate plants. Keep water culture plants isolated in their own containers if possible.
# "Run-to-waste" systems: nutrients are not re-circulated = reduced spore loads
# Use separate reservoirs/pumps to isolate systems.
# Sterilize equipment shared (ie. pH meters) between tanks
# Make sure cloning mediums (especially rockwool) do not remain saturated for too long. Drain fully after watering.

Special tips for bubblers:
(highgrade) "Have an empty, sterile bucket to place the bubbling bucket into when changing nutes. The extra bucket method allows me to run a gallon of water through the pot and flush the grorocs and root mass of any salt build up. Wash the bucket prior to refilling with solution."

(Baudelaire) "… maintain a humid air gap extending from the root crown down at least 4 inches. This provides the space for aerial roots to form, and keeps water away from the root collar, where root rot typically takes hold."

Emergency Treatment: top

1. Hydrogen Peroxide root dunk
-Remove each plant from system, snip off potions of the roots system badly diseased.
-Dip/swish each plant and container into a strong H2O2 solution, until diseased roots have been removed. Repeat as required. The H2O2 should burn off the pythium-infected outer root layers.

2. Sterilize equipment
All equipment should be disinfected (including hoses and pots, etc) with bleach solution or 10% h2o2 solution before plants are reintroduced into the system. Rinse well.

3. Add root rot medication.
Add anti-pythium additives, Vitamin B1, and fresh nutrients to a sterilized reservoir at a lower strength, at cooler temps. Reduce light levels. After a week or so, after new roots appear, add some root boost additives.

Environmental control: top

# Maximize reservoir circulation, aeration and cooling
# Reverse Osmosis (RO) to remove pathogens from source water
# UV sterilizers. UV kills pathogens as nutrients are passed through unit
# Ozone. Maintain a 300-400mV level
# Blow cool air through the root zone
# Minimize light leaks and cover reservoir (but don't seal) to limit algae growth. Algae will grow, reproduce and die, adding organic material for pythium to feed on. Algae and other slimes may coat the roots, stressing plants even further.

*Take care using UV and Ozone, as nutrients can precipitate out of solution. Iron is especially susceptible.

Chemical/Biological additives: top

Note: H2o2 may kill enzymes used in some biological additives. Additives should be considered preventive only; not all additives may be effective.

Beneficial bacteria colonize the root system, out-reproducing root disease organisms. Some additives may "feed" on decayed roots. Additives may be added during every tank change, except for H2o2 and Ridomil.
•H2O2 (See H2O2 FAQ) •Ridomil (1 app, systemic, toxic, 5 drops/gal).
•FloraShield (by GH) •Bio Bugs
Guardian angel (2.5-5 ml/gal) Bio Bran (rambridge.com, 11 enzymes)
Root Shield (americanagritech.com) Sm-90 (citrus extracts @ 2.5 ml/gal)
Hydro Shield (grotek.net) Pro-Silica (silicon, basic, up to 5 ml/gal)
Microkill (kills mold/fungus/mildew/algae) Pro-TeKt (silicon)
Canna-zyme (Canna, canna.com, 15 different enzymes) Power Active
ATAZYM (Atami) BN-ZYM (bio nova)
Zyme (Green Planet, 6-8ml/gal)
Others: Ascend/Fongarid/Consan 20)/Fosetyl-A1 (sold as Aliette)

For seeds, seedlings and clones:
# Use 1 drop bleach/gal when sprouting seeds using towel method
# No-damp (spray cloning domes at 5-10ml/L)
# Cloning gel/powder with a fungicide

Experimental
# UV Sterilizers. UV can kill waterborne organisms, with a slow exposure to UV light. Research suggests iron can precipitate out of solution. Pythium already attached to surfaces in the rootzone will not flow through the sterilizer and not be killed. Aquarium stores sell them.

# Continuous drip H2o2. According to Maximum Yield, 100ppm is required to kill pythium in solution. This level also adversely affects small plants. Of course, organics and beneficial bacteria in additives will also be destroyed.

H2o2 should be added to a seperate volume of water and allowed to sit for 20 minutes before adding to the reservoir. The majority of the O2 will be chemically released by the H2o2 by that point. (In high enough concentration, h2o2 will burn off the epeidermis of the roots, exposing it to attack by pathogens and damging fine root hairs).

# Slow sand filtration. According to interet literature, SSF can remove up to 99.7% of all bacteria. Aquarium stores sell sand filters.

# Dissolved Oxygen machines. Artifically injecting water with oxygen may inhibit or kill pytium and other anerobic organisms.
 

faller200

Well-Known Member
Yeah, thats what I was going to do, but then I read all kinds of stuff telling me to only use at least 15% food grade. But you have 3700 posts, so I'll take your advice.

You have to dilute the 15% and down to 3% with distilled water. I use just reg. 3% you can get anywhere. Works fine just don't get carried away. Imo 1 tablespoon per Gal. is on the high side. I use half that added every 3-4 days. Oh and by the way H2O2 is a BLEACH it will turn your roots white but not necessarily healthy. Just something to keep in mind.
 
I had gone through the post. The Air Pumps, as well as providing oxygen to the roots ans mixing nutrient solution, control pathogen growth in nutrient solutions. It may run for 24/7 , The hardest thing on any device is starting wears parts fast, mechanical wise 24 hour run is much easier on the place. Please produce some more attachment links for more detailed view.
 

elaxrawn

Member
The Oxygen Concentrators are very popular now a days. They are very comfortable and are recommended by most of the doctors. These Oxygen Concentrators are providing their use through out the day with having any time for sleeping mode, as they are having separate mode for this operation. These are very portable and are easy to carry anywhere along with us, The size also suits better for carrying. The FAA also approved these concentrators to carry in Air ways even. There are many models and of many types available now a days. These are also of affordable prices.
 

mufastaa

Active Member
someone has probably said this, but you should just make the root slime cure tea, it solves everything in yo res. and helps your roots out more than any other single product. +cheap.
 

Nizza

Well-Known Member
ive seen threads about this and the battle of h2o2 and i hear the best remedy is a compost tea. this will increase microbial levels and battle off the wierd brown roots. end of story. other things work, but this works too. i think its a fungal recipy u want to use
 
Top