Breeding an auto?

Sour Wreck

Well-Known Member
dc seed exchange sells ruderalis by casper seeds. i got some.

1st couple i germed did not make it, will throw more in soon.
 

xtsho

Well-Known Member
Yeah I think some Sensi Ruderalis is still floating around some banks.
I believe TSSC bank has them.
Do you mean these? I've already pollinated a female with a male to make more seeds. I try and do that with everything landrace so I have a stash of that strain. That's why I buy regulars. I had 100% germination rate with these seeds I got from Sensible Seeds. I'm not growing it to smoke but for some projects I'm working on.

 

Adam Tripper

Well-Known Member
Hey Bobqp, your experience in growing crosses of Autos x Photos and finding that 90% are autoflowering is interesting because it runs contrary to everything I read about the subject from seed companies about breeding autos -- they say none of the first generation auto x photo crosses will display the autoflowering trait.

I also made some auto x photo seeds. In every auto x photo strain I have made at least 90 percent are auto flowering, the other 10 or so percent are photos but they will flower weeks before normal photos start to flower. I'll give you an idea on breeding from what I've discovered throughout growing autos over the years: Auto x photo - 90 percent auto.
(Auto x photo) x photo - 100 percent photo. Hope that helps .just telling how my grows and breeding programs have turned out.
Seems my auto x photo plants so far have a 90 percent success of being autos. Higher rate then last time
I think the key to this discrepancy in results might be in your definition of "autoflowering", from the post below it seems you consider "autoflower" any strain that "will flower during the summer".

I breed autos x photos. I've been doing it for about 3 years now. First cross of a photo male and auto female will give you over 90 percent of plants that will flower during the summer . 10 percent will just keep on vegging until late summer. But if you cross those plants over each other then the next generation will not flower through summer.
Have you tried growing these first generation auto x photo crosses indoors to see if they truly autoflower, that is they flower on their own timer, regardless of whether it's summer or any other light availability consideration?

It seems to me that your 90% "autoflowering" are not really auto but "fast versions", that is photo-dependent plants that are a bit quicker than the photoperiod parent, as explained by in these images:

user34837_pic1355831_1417567095.jpg user34837_pic1355832_1417567095.jpg
 
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OldMedUser

Well-Known Member
Hey Bobqp, your experience in growing crosses of Autos x Photos and finding that 90% are autoflowering is interesting because it runs contrary to everything I read about the subject from seed companies about breeding autos -- they say none of the first generation auto x photo crosses will display the autoflowering trait.

I think the key to this discrepancy in results might be in your definition of "autoflowering", from the post below it seems you consider "autoflower" any strain that "will flower during the summer".

Have you tried growing these first generation auto x photo crosses indoors to see if they truly autoflower, that is they flower on their own timer, regardless of whether it's summer or any other light availability consideration?

It seems to me that your 90% "autoflowering" are not really auto but "fast versions", that is photo-dependent plants that are a bit quicker than the photoperiod parent, as explained by in these images:
Thanx for those articles! Got me some F1 crosses of one of my fave old photo crosses with an auto. (CaliMist x NL#5, both from Marc Emery's old seed bank c. 1999) X Purple Jem Auto which is (Mazar x LowRyder) from The Joint Doctor's High Bred Seeds c. 2010.

Those articles will answer a lot of questions I had about proceeding so as to produce a nice Auto version of my cross. Then to get the CBD in there too, stabilize the whole thing then feminize it! Should keep me busy 'til they shovel the dirt over my box. :D

:peace:
 

Adam Tripper

Well-Known Member
Thanx for those articles! Got me some F1 crosses of one of my fave old photo crosses with an auto. (CaliMist x NL#5, both from Marc Emery's old seed bank c. 1999) X Purple Jem Auto which is (Mazar x LowRyder) from The Joint Doctor's High Bred Seeds c. 2010.

Those articles will answer a lot of questions I had about proceeding so as to produce a nice Auto version of my cross. Then to get the CBD in there too, stabilize the whole thing then feminize it! Should keep me busy 'til they shovel the dirt over my box. :D

:peace:
Glad it was useful to you, my point was precisely to help people trying to come up with their own auto strains, because if you know what you are doing they can be just as potent as the photo counterpart. The key piece of information when creating an auto strain is that you need to inbreed to the F4 generation, at that point the recessive auto gene will be fixed to the point where 100% of the seedlings will autoflower.

You need to resist the temptation of getting there faster by selecting breeding parents from among the 25% F2 generation individuals that autoflower, because by doing that you'll skew the genes towards the original autoflower parent, and you don't want to do that because the autoflowering ancestor is of lower potency.

If you have the patience, you can "rinse and repeat", using your new resulting F4 auto strain to do it all over again by crossing it to the same photo, so by the time you get to the F4 generation again there is less left from the original auto strain other than the autoflowering gene.

Lab tests have confirmed that each time you cross auto x photo, the resulting F4 has a THC level of exactly halfway the two original parents, so in order to have the same THC level as the original photo parent, you need to reach the F4 four times (each time crossing the resulting F4 with the original photo parent again). In that regard, it's best to start with a female photo (it's easier to see beneficial traits like structure, yield, smell and potency in females than males) and the autoflower should be the pollen donor.
 
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macsnax

Well-Known Member
Glad it was useful to you, my point was precisely to help people trying to come up with their own auto strains, because if you know what you are doing they can be just as potent as the photo counterpart. The key piece of information when creating an auto strain is that you need to inbreed to the F4 generation, at that point the recessive auto gene will be fixed to the point where 100% of the seedlings will autoflower.

You need to resist the temptation of getting there faster by selecting breeding parents from among the 25% F2 generation individuals that autoflower, because by doing that you'll skew the genes towards the original autoflower parent, and you don't want to do that because the autoflowering ancestor is of lower potency.

If you have the patience, you can "rinse and repeat", using your new resulting F4 auto strain to do it all over again by crossing it to the same photo, so by the time you get to the F4 generation again there is less left from the original auto strain other than the autoflowering gene.

Lab tests have confirmed that each time you cross auto x photo, the resulting F4 has a THC level of exactly halfway the two original parents, so in order to have the same THC level as the original photo parent, you need to reach the F4 four times (each time crossing the resulting F4 with the original photo parent again). In that regard, it's best to start with a female photo (it's easier to see beneficial traits like structure, yield, smell and potency in females than males) and the autoflower should be the pollen donor.
Damn! If you know what you're talking about, and I'm not saying you don't. It's the interweb so.... anyway that's probably the most information I've ever came across on breeding autos. Pretty cool, and I'll definitely keep this in mind.
 
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