Barney's Farm - Tangerine Dream - Waterfarm!

Discussion in 'Grow Journals' started by Dayzt, Mar 19, 2011.

  1.  
    Dayzt

    Dayzt Well-Known Member

    Call me crazy, but if I manage to put together a way to put a music player on some sort on a timer, I'll purchase some of the mp3s at the below link and loop them to play for a few hours during lights on and a few hours before lights off.. =) I'll give them a special foliar spray when the lights come on as well - it would be a fun test!

    https://www.cdbaby.com/cd/endorfins

    Okie dokie...gonna get a few pics now and post'em up shortly - stay tuned! :leaf:
  2.  
    Dayzt

    Dayzt Well-Known Member

    Here's another picture update - so much growth in the past week, that it's nice to have picture updates every few days at this point!

    So I had a small 'weight' on the main stem yesterday and had her bent right over. I even pinched the stem a bit to get it to stay bent... but this is what I saw when I opened the tent at lights on this evening....

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    She pretty much just said 'screw you' and stood back up straight, regardless of the weight! Looks like she came back up even stronger though!

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    Here's a shot of the undergrowth - lots of branching starting to develop nicely...

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    So out come the anchor & ties - got her tied down a bit better this time - I don't want to stress her out too much though - the screen will keep her spread out nicely once it's tall enough to reach. Exposing the lower nodes will allow more light to get below there and encourage those new branches (potential tops) to catch up.

    [​IMG]

    Took readings:

    6.8 pH
    578 ppm

    I'll have to top up the rez in the next few days - some nice pH'd RO water to bring the pH down a little will make her happier I'm sure... I don't want to increase the ppm's quite yet - most likely not until the next rez change - I think her tummy is full enough right now after going from ~300 ppm to ~570 ppm last rez change..lol. Still looking green everywhere though - I inspect it pretty close each day now so I can stay on-top of it in case I overdo things.

    Thanks for watching!

    :leaf:
  3.  
    dishinit

    dishinit Active Member

    I follow TDooda's Water Farm/Scrog guide, based in ScottyBall's Water Farm techniques. I run my PH at about 5.8 and let it climb some, then re-balance res. and repeat. I use the 5.8 PH baseline to regulate my nutes. If PH climbs substantially, I add back nutes in 50 ppm to no more than 100 ppm increments over current ppm readings. It usually takes me a couple of adjustments to dial in a fresh res. Once dialed in my PH stays relatively stable with slight drifts up over time, or until I change out the res again.
    I realize PH is not a major concern until your plants roots hit the res. yet a 6.8 PH in Hydro seems high to me. Looking at the nutrient uptake charts for soiless/Hydo applications you are on the money for some, but edgy for others, like boron, zinc, copper & manganese. Do you intend to let your PH drift down enough to allow uptake of these nutrients? Or am I missing something here.
    By the way your plant looks very good.
    One more question......Is that a Ballast on your tent floor? If so, get it out of there......
    Water and electricity can mess up your day.........and at some point, you will spill some water, guaranteed.
  4.  
    Dayzt

    Dayzt Well-Known Member

    Yeah, I know the pH is a bit high - I didn't want to pH adjust the nutrient solution in my rez though - heard that's a 'no-no'. Instead, i'll be adding some pH'd RO water to top off the rez in the next few days - that will bring down the overall pH a bit as well as the ppms which are already a tad higher than they probably should be at this point. I haven't noticed any deficiencies yet - happy looking plant so far! I hear ya though man - I have to admit though, it's nice to see the plant react this nicely considering the higher pH... maybe this strain is just a bit more tolerable to that. Regardless, it's good to know that it still doesn't mind the higher pH - shows that it has a larger 'range' of pH that it will eat. Overall, I want to try and keep the pH within 5.5 - 6.5 though, so I will indeed be addressing that.

    Oh, and there's quite a lot of roots in the rez right now - I checked it again this evening, and there's the expected long tap-root down the middle along with some thinner roots and root tributaries... then there's a number of new roots coming through the extra holes I drilled in the bucket - good sign that it's spreading out nicely in the hydroton.

    Thanks dishinit - I really appreciate the feedback!

    Cheers!
  5.  
    dishinit

    dishinit Active Member

    OK, once again, I know nothing.......I read this........" I didn't want to pH adjust the nutrient solution in my rez though - heard that's a 'no-no'".................... And I wanna know...................
    Where did you hear/read this?
    I may be committing a cardinal or bluebird sin here, but this is what I do.
    FYI: 1st of all, I have found that for some ungodly reason, when I take PH samples from my site level/drain tube, even if I fill a cup, drain it, fill it again, then pour half off (it's my ritual) and take a PH reading from that sample, it is invariably a 10th of a point or more higher than if measured at the res itself. Weird.......
    I can go back and forth from the sample to the res and repeat my findings. I do check calibration of my PH meter on a weekly basis. It's pretty much rock solid.
    But back to my process....
    So, I have an extra bucket to sit my top bucket/plant into when I clean & change out the bottom res. My plant stays in my tent under the light while I go about my business (this only works for awhile, then becomes unwieldy, especially when under Scrog)
    I prefer to mix & balance in my res as I know I have it dialed in as one unit, not two or three (gal) units. (I run DYI Water Farms, 5 gal buckets, constructed with GH WF Plumbing kits & 10" Net Pot Caps) I have never been able to drain the last 1/4 to 1/2" out of the bottom bucket via the drain tube, and I always find some hydroton sediment when I dump a bucket (water my outside garden)
    Best case nute prep for me, is to mix & balance the night prior, in spare bucket, & re-balance PH (if needed) the day of change.
    I do not always pull off the "best case" change outs.....and when you are making PH changes and Nute changes at the same time, it's a whole lot easier to do it in one container, not in an add back process.
    Once your plant is in the screen (if you intend to scrog), you can forget about the bucket swap.........everything is add back until you change the res out. The good side of this, is by that time, you have dialed your nutes in, and do not experience large PH swings, unless your into self-destruct.
    Don't laugh, known to happen..............frequently.
    So after all this rigmarole that I put myself through....................Your saying I might be doing the wrong thing?
    Geesus..........................
    It's a wonder my plants survive............................
  6.  
    dishinit

    dishinit Active Member

    Forgive me for my long winded blather. Once your roots hit the res, now is the time you will see some incredible growth. The plant will seemingly double in size over a very short period. I am amazed at the quality of roots produced via Water Farm. Thick & hefty accompanied by thinner, hair like strands. Much more robust looking than I am getting in my Hempy grows, or for that matter previous Hydro grows. I also dropped an air stone in my res just to keep things sweet down there. I am pretty sure that this extends my res change out times as my TD is now gulping close to a gallon a day. If I follow TDooda's guide to the letter, I would be changing out the Res every 3rd day, this way I can go a week and not worry about root rot.
  7.  
    Dayzt

    Dayzt Well-Known Member

    I don't recall exactly where I read about it not being a good idea to pH adjust nuted water, but I think it may have been in Scotty's journal... but the reason this is a bigger issue in my case is due to the pH buffers in the flora nova - they are already trying to balance the pH, so when you add pH down or up straight into a nuted rez, the pH liquid and the buffers in the nutes 'fight against each other' in a sense. But as you'd said, once the ppms are higher, the extra pH buffers in the nutrient are enough to keep the pH stable...

    Gonna try and get some pics of the roots in my rez soon - I just need someone to help me hold the bucket up while I take the picture. =)
    mully1982 likes this.
  8.  
    dishinit

    dishinit Active Member

    You are probably right. There is more than one priceless tid-bit, hidden in Scottyball's journal that has proven invaluable to me.
    I read it once, skimmed it at least once more, and usually find some gem tucked away when trying to find something that caught my attention earlier.
    I use SuperNatural Nutrients and PH my filtered Tap water before adding nutes. The Nute's buffers hold the PH steady as I add PPM to reach my target point which currently is around 800 to 900 ppm. above my Tap ppm and you don't want to know what that is.
    I'm pretty much happy with my regimen and have had moderate to good success with this in both Hydro & Hempy.
    However, I am impressed with those of you who are using Flora Nova Products and look forward to following your grow as an educational experience.
  9.  
    ottermunky

    ottermunky Active Member

    yeah, when the plant is young I only use ph down if there is no alternative- it balances out nicely after a while though with the nutes. I use flora nova and they are very good at balancing the ph, I had some terra vega nutes for my first couple of soil grows and they were terrible, really not nice- no matter what you did they burnt the plants, would never ever use them again, having no experience with other nutes I can't say what is best, although I hear Barneys Farm nutes are really good.
    Dayzt likes this.
  10.  
    weedsLV

    weedsLV Active Member

    Hey just chimin In for the first time things r lookin nice. Not to b rude but playing your plants music isn't gonna do anything they don't have ears. Lol now if u sit in the room and sing to them the music comin out your mp3 player that will definitely help. The music/ singing to your plants myth is true due to the fact your breathing out co2 while singing but an mp3 player won't do anything alone. Haha your plants need u to cerenade em with beautiful music out if your mouth. Besides that my friend just finished and cured his bf tangerine dream the bud is amazing but beware it does have a massive stretch and it becomes a lanky mofucka try and keep it short and bushy a possible. Good luck n good growing.
    Dayzt likes this.
  11.  
    realnyjuggalo23

    realnyjuggalo23 Active Member

    Dayzt.......i must ask y have u not covered hydroton or at least the drip ring????have u encountered n e burns from the water getting on the leaves????jw
  12.  
    Dayzt

    Dayzt Well-Known Member

    I had it covered for the first while, but I took it off after the last rez change out to take some nicer pictures and haven't put it back yet... I don't know, some people think using foil to cover it is a bad idea due it reflecting light back up at the leaf bottoms, but we'll see. I haven't noticed that 'splashing water' has done any harm to the plant, but my drip-ring is touching the hydroton all the way around, so it really doesn't splash too much anyway...
  13.  
    realnyjuggalo23

    realnyjuggalo23 Active Member

    i had alot of issues with burn till i covered with foil...it didnt hurt n e thing infact it stoped the burn...i know the lower leaves wont do much, if i remember correctly ur goin to scrog n e how.....i guess i am just a info sponge...lol...also i didnt fill to the ring so the makes a big difference i bet......ah i saw and got nervious thats all......looks awsome...sub'ed
    Dayzt likes this.
  14.  
    Dayzt

    Dayzt Well-Known Member

    Hey weeds...thanks for your advice - regarding the plant not having 'ears'..lol... well, your right it doesn't actually 'hear' the music - it reacts to the 'resonance' created by different tones of sound. Different pitches of sound created by different music or different birds, has been proven to positively or negatively effect plant growth, both quality-wise and growth-speed-wise. A key thing to note here though is the vibrations (or resonance) the plant is experiencing causes it's stomata to open when it normally may not open for as long or at the particular time the sound occurs...and giving the plant a foliar feeding during those specific times can be beneficial - some will swear to you it's a 'night and day' difference...I'd like to test the whole thing out for myself. And hey, what could it hurt? If we're not always trying new things to try and improve our grow methods, then how will be ever gets better and learn more? :leaf:

    You're absolutely right about the CO2 though - your breath makes a big difference, and consequently, the more time you spend with your plants, the more CO2 they'll receive, especially in an indoor 'closed' environment like the tent I'm using. For every grower, it's finding that 'sweet spot' and technique(s) that work for you - every grow is different, but finding those key elements that work for you every time is what make it so challenging and fun!
    realnyjuggalo23 likes this.
  15.  
    Dayzt

    Dayzt Well-Known Member

    Hey otter - yeah, this is the first time I've tried the Flora-Nova - how could anyone resist after seeing Scottyballs' results? I user AN Iguana juice before this with decent results, but having nothing to compare it to, I've been trying to branch-out and try more things so I can find what works best for me. I didn't know BF had thier own nutes...?

    Thanks mully! Welcome aboard - glad you're watching! Lots of picture updates to come as this grow progresses - being my first time trying hydro, I'm keeping close tabs on it as I hope to completely switch from soil to hydro and save some extra work and time...soil is great but it's such a PITA..lol.
  16.  
    Dayzt

    Dayzt Well-Known Member

    Yeah - I know i'm 'breaking some of the rules' by keeping the cover off, but I wanted to see for myself how things develop - both ways, with and without the foil. So far not a big deal but I still have the foil cover ready to put back on if necessary. I've noticed a few tiny water-issue without the cover - 1 or 2 leaves are getting some white salt-film on them from evaporated nute-water...I just gently wiped it off and it seems fine... the plant is really taking off now so those first few leaves are soon going to be irrellevant anywayz... And yes, keeping the drop-ring close to the hydroton causes the water to flow nicer through the holes into the medium - not much splashing, a bit of small 'spurting' now and then but not enough to burn the plant as far as I've seen.
  17.  
    Dayzt

    Dayzt Well-Known Member

    A small shout-out to everyone who'd tuned in here...

    Has anyone done any LST with their waterfarm? Even though I will be using a screen when the plant is big enough, I've started to tie down the plant in order to encourage the lower growth to catch up - is this necessary considering I'll be weaving it once I have the screen in place? I don't care how long it stays in veg - I'll have a massive screen if I try to cover the whole 4x4 tent, but I don't want to overdo it and run into space issues vertically. So far I've had to tie her down twice, starting the typical LST circling of the pot to allow the lower nodes to grow up and join the main top...so far so good, but the big fan leaves are getting in the way a bit and tend to touch the hydroton and get wet.

    Thoughts...? I'll throw some pics up later this evening or tomorrow night...
  18.  
    Dayzt

    Dayzt Well-Known Member

    Sorry I missed this question... no, that's not a 'ballast' in the tent - I've never put my ballast inside my tent, both due to electricity/moisture dangers (as you mentioned) as well as the large amount of heat it gives off - especially these old ballasts the CMH lights use. What you see there is the cardboard piece I was using the prop up my floro lights earlier on - I still need to clean some things up in there..lol
  19.  
    dishinit

    dishinit Active Member


    Speaking after the fact........I have not done LST on my TD, but did U B Top, pinch & super crop her before she hit the screen. I can see now that I am in week 1 of flower, that some early LST would have aided in training for the screen (longer horizontal pre-trained runs of main colas up against the screen)
    I have a single plant, similar to you, and thought it to be more Indica dominant at 1st, as I had fatter leaf shape similar (if not more so) to yours, however, as it grew, the leaf shape changed, to that more representative of Sativa.
    So far the stretch has been kind to me.....I flipped at about 40 to 50% full on originally a 3-1/2' X 2-1/2' free standing screen, but quickly saw I would outgrow this. Then I changed up and put her under what is now a 4 X 4 screen after reading all the complaint's about the stretch during flower.
    I actually expect to fill (or come very close to filling) my larger screen at the end of the stretch, that I anticipate to finish at week 3, or so.
    So be prepared.............
    And I am glad to hear I was incorrect about what I thought to be a ballast in your Tent. Good show.
    Look forward to more Pics.......
  20.  
    Dayzt

    Dayzt Well-Known Member

    Okie, here's the pic update! Sorry it's a bit later in the evening than I expected - I've been kinda sick today so I haven't been too mobile until now.

    These first few pics are what I saw when I first opened the tent... still lookin nice a green!

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    I thought about it for a good few minutes and then decided I needed to trim this fan leaf - it was blocking a lot of tops trying to come up, and with the growth over just the past 2 days, this girl is ready to get tied down AGAIN! I know with most LST work, the lower leaves get in the way and normally get trimmed - in this case it was one that was sticking up and covering lower potential tops when the main top recovers...so it had to go.

    [​IMG]

    The below pics were taken after I did the 3rd tie-down - lookin sexy! It's looking like I'll be able to hold off on setting up my screen for about another week or so yet at this rate - she doesn't seem to mind the tieing so far - still nice a green all around!

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    Here's a pic from outside the tent looking in... I'm really impressed with the waterfarm so far - the plant is really looking healthy and is easy to train.

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    I re-calibrated my meters this evening and found that the pH meter was out (high) by .10 and the ppm meter was out (high) by ~100. I did another test afterwards:

    6.7 pH
    574 ppm


    I know, I know, the pH is still a bit high... I'll lower tomorrow I think, by increasing my ppm's - I think she's ready for a bit more, so I'll bump it up to ~700-750 and see where my pH is at after that. :leaf:

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