Any Organic Purists in Arizona?

I'm looking for anyone interested in learning and discussing real living organics. What I mean by that is actual building soils and not fox farm with blowjob betty recommened by joe dank at the dro store.

Any purists out there or are we still throwing down dirty shit bottles pulling the major weight bro lol???? hahah

We created this thread in the past https://www.rollitup.org/organics/636057-recycled-organic-living-soil-rols.html so something like this would be of great discussion locally.

I'm a on mission and there a many reasons but for now I will tell you that I have shelled out over 2k buying meds for my family from different sources all over the valley to compensate my personals. You all should rethink what you are doing to people's health for profit or your own health for that matter. 90% of was garbage and killed my lungs or hurt my head. WTF?

It was funny I was talking to an employee from a local nursery and he fed me the same line of brainwashed bullshit that organics cost too much to produce vs conventional methods lol. Even outsourcing your own natural amendments instead of growing or making your own compost for example is much cheaper than using chemical ferts and the long term damage the do.

Cannabis is a magnet for attraction of toxins sort of. Phytoremediation is the process. In a nutshell cannabis or hemp is used to clean up metals, pesticides, solvents, explosives, crude oil, polyaromatic hydrocarbons, and toxins leaching from landfills.

Think about that when you put that shit in your media. "just flush bro" lol!!!! haha

Source: http://www.hemp.net/news/9901/06/hemp_eats_chernobyl_waste.html


Quick in easy lesson on the topic on the observation nature. Sick crops = sick animals = sick humans and it goes down the line. It's not a difficult concept grasp.

Oh well, cancer and ill health is good business.

Living soil and thriving biomass.

Now you are talking my language.
I am so conservative that I do not use neem and had to be convinced to even try molasses in my water. My soil is still building. Not something you can do in one or two seasons. New location and only 2 seasons....Oh, I garden outside and in the dirt, not pots, no artifical light.
Compost and "biochar"...charcoal, some manures...but predominately, 99% composted plant matter. There are some eggs shells in there.

and a comment to add to sick plants...
sick/weak plants not only succumb to pests but actually attract pests.

Glad to see you back Treep!!! Ill be mixing my first batch up here soon. Hope you are well.

The power of NEEM. Neem soap is pure awesome. If you really want to feel clean wash up with neem, haha. Of course we use it in our soil and part of the IPM programs etc for our plant health but for human health is just such an interesting plant.

I ended up ordering some neem seedlings cause I figured they would be great for my bare grow area. Growing a variety of plants in your grow rooms will assist with keeping most of the unwanted creatures away. Medicinal plants and culinary plants also mask odors.

Neem is a blood purifier, detoxifier and promotes healthy skin and wound healing. It's a general health promoter and something to take a closer look at than just giving it to the plants.

We all should be feeding ourselves "almost" what we feed to our soil/plants etc. Aloe, coconut, neem, kelp, and the like. I've been using Aloe for stomach irritation and it's awesome.


Knock out unwanted soil pest with 5 gal bubbled solution:

1/2 cup neem
1/4 kelp meal

bubbled for 24 hours and drench see how they like that. That's a good recipe from the net I've been using for over a year after stopping BTI. Great for overall health like a once a month type thing. Be careful with young plants.

I'm more conservative than all that. I thought you were talking about growing "green manure" [alfalfa, buckwheat etc]...

I am a purist. Nothin on my meds but some dust. I garden outdoors.And neem wont stop the pests I get....grasshoppers

Even outsourcing your own natural amendments instead of growing or making your own compost for example is much cheaper than using chemical ferts and the long term damage the do.

Click to expand...

I pay about a 100 dollars for close to 4000 gallons of hydro feed once its diluted which will yield many many pounds.
How much cheaper is your organic formula? I run mostly perlite and 3.5 cubic foot bags are just under 7 dollars for me which yields about 26 gallons each so that's about 7- 5 gallon pots since 5 gallon pots are 3.5- 4 gallons
so about 1 dollar or less each for media in 5 gallon pots plus a little change for the nutes. Lets not forget I poor the bag in while you work hard mixing so we have some additional savings here as well. I am not bashing
organics but as far as costI completely disagree to it being cheaper in fact it is more expensive. I really don't need 5 gallon pots and of course can yield more in a smaller pot than any dirt grower.
The cost to run is so cheap I use the larger size. Again organics are great but cheaper they are not especially in the desert. Now with all this said I am not
foolish enough to source my nutes from some bs hydro store but instead
run commercial hydro fertilizers used in professional agriculture.

Azoned said:

I'm more conservative than all that. I thought you were talking about growing "green manure" [alfalfa, buckwheat etc]...

I am a purist. Nothin on my meds but some dust. I garden outdoors.And neem wont stop the pests I get....grasshoppers

Click to expand...

Yes am I like borage, comfrey, yarrow, and many other herbs. I have a background in herbal medicine and healing plants if you care to ever discuss. I'm currently growing barley, rye, red clover, vetch, and some other cover crops to prep my land for spring.

I also grow neem. What is you issue with neem and what do you know about it? Please enlighten me.

This "conservative" phase you throw out there mean nothing more than you being stuck in your ways without advancement and evolution. I consider myself just as conservative as the next so called purist.

Azoned care to show us some cool living soil pics on this thread? That would spark some attention to this thread.

thecoolman said:

I pay about a 100 dollars for close to 4000 gallons of hydro feed once its diluted which will yield many many pounds.
How much cheaper is your organic formula? I run mostly perlite 3.5 cubic foot bags are just under 7 dollars which yields about 26 gallons each so thats about 7- 5 gallon pots since 5 gallon pots are 3.5- 4 gallons
so about 1 dollar or less each for media in 5 gallon pots plus a little change for the nutes. Lets not forget I poor the bag in while you work hard mixing so we have some adituional savings here as well. I am not bashing
organics but as far as cost I am calling bullshit to it being cheaper. I really don't need 5 gallon pots
but the cost to run is so cheap I use the larger size. Again organics are great but cheaper they are not at least in the desert.

Click to expand...

Check this out man. I know your are diehard chemical grower that's and great for you.

1) I never throw away my media. Investment can be high depending on how much media your making and the quality of compost or if you get it free or not.
2) My media consist of natural amendments that YES there is work up front mixing and making soil as I do it from peat based brick. After you put it all together in its done.
3) Large containers with the proper HIGH quality organic amendments should ensure an proper CEC and then the microbes does all the work for you.
4) Using the same pot meaning treating like it a soil bed of sort cuts labor and again with a living soil the microbes acculate what the plant needs unlike chemical chelation.
5) Every cycle it keeps getting better just a like any biofarmers land. A little top dress here and there with some plants you can grow yourself and vermicompost which eat your scraps.

This is called sustainable bio farming and catching on very quickly. Europe is light years ahead of us but then again we aren't that old of a country, just a really greedy one.

Just about every grocery store now has natural and organic food offerings so it's not hype or fade. People are waking up and with the internet the truth is spreading.

My health and pocket book made me a believer in my approach to gardening and that's when I decieded to really dig deep into dirt and bust all the cannalore out there and I here. How can we call bud medical full of chems? I don't get it.

This method could become free if you're witty enough.

COMPOST IS CHEAP AND FREE MOST OF TIME
WORM CASTINGS ARE CHEAP AND FREE MOST OF TIME
WATER CAN BE RECUPERATED IF YOU HAVE A BRAIN AND USED TO IRRIGATE YOUR PLANTS OVER AND OVER WITH VERY LITTLE SUPPLEMENTAL
THERE IS NO DRAIN TO WASTE OR RUN OFF JUST A MEDIUM THAT KEPT EVENLY MOIST.

ITS COMMON SENSE OLD SCHOOL FUCKIN BACKYARD GARDENING BROUGHT INDOORS. NO BOTTLES REQUIRED. REMEMBER GRANDMA IN THE GARDEN WITH HER TOMATO PLANTS? WAS SHE HITTING THEM WITH HEAVY 16 LOL??? CANNABIS IS C3 PLANT LIKE 80% OF THE EDIBLE FOOD CROPS WE EAT SO THAT MEANS IT DOESN'T NEED SPECIAL TREATMENT AND CRAZY FERTS.

WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THAT? Enlighten me coolman.

headtreep said:

COMPOST IS CHEAP AND FREE MOST OF TIME
WORM CASTINGS ARE CHEAP AND FREE MOST OF TIME
WATER CAN BE RECUPERATED IF YOU HAVE A BRAIN AND USED TO IRRIGATE YOUR PLANTS OVER AND OVER WITH VERY LITTLE SUPPLEMENTAL
THERE IS NO DRAIN TO WASTE OR RUN OFF JUST A MEDIUM THAT KEPT EVENLY MOIST.

ITS COMMON SENSE OLD SCHOOL FUCKIN BACKYARD GARDENING BROUGHT INDOORS. NO BOTTLES REQUIRED. REMEMBER GRANDMA IN THE GARDEN WITH HER TOMATO PLANTS? WAS SHE HITTING THEM WITH HEAVY 16 LOL??? CANNABIS IS C3 PLANT LIKE 80% OF THE EDIBLE FOOD CROPS WE EAT SO THAT MEANS IT DOESN'T NEED SPECIAL TREATMENT AND CRAZY FERTS.

WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THAT? Enlighten me coolman.

Click to expand...

I grew up in the east with organic gardening and remember the days of
walking under the oak tree to the natural worm filled pile of jet black
compost. This is AZ and I run a 60 plant perpetual I believe that chemical
nutes are much cheaper for me and if i was using compost i would still need top soil
to mix it with... there isn't any here and if there was I would still prefer the low labor
set up I run. Now that's just me and again I am not bashing organics i have used them
but for me labor aside I find that with a larger set set up in the AZ desert organics are much more expensive
in both dollars and labor. Now you talk as if its all free please tell me what you would add
including supplements and the cost for 300 gallons of soil and remember this mix would need to be ready every month or so.
I am very aware that pot doesn't need special fertilizers
as I mentioned I use commercial hydroponics formulas-Jacks hydro, or plantex, and calcium nitrate preferred but verti grow, crop king etc it all works and is cheap and clean

P.S. There are no free worms around here and I dont want to raise them.
...................................................

headtreep said:

Yes am I like borage, comfrey, yarrow, and many other herbs. I have a background in herbal medicine and healing plants if you care to ever discuss. I'm currently growing barley, rye, red clover, vetch, and some other cover crops to prep my land for spring.

I also grow neem. What is you issue with neem and what do you know about it? Please enlighten me.

This "conservative" phase you throw out there mean nothing more than you being stuck in your ways without advancement and evolution. I consider myself just as conservative as the next so called purist.

Azoned care to show us some cool living soil pics on this thread? That would spark some attention to this thread.

Click to expand...

My issue with neem is the same as I have with ANY pesticide. Destroys the natural balance....Why would you create a "living soil" and then apply pesticide? And yes I will post some pics, when I start working up my soil for next season.

Coolman,
You throw away your "spent" soil"? Replenish it. Farmers don't scrape the soil from their corn field and truck in "new" every season, do they? that is what crop rotation is all about.

Azoned neem is not as cut and dry as you mentioned "pesticide". It doesn't destroy the natural balance. Where is your proof? I can produce a shit ton credible peer researched papers in a snap if you would like. Why don't you do some research? Do you really want to round and round on this? Haven't we discussed this before? This is how misinformation is spewed from lack of knowledge.

Motherfuckas eat the shit. What do you think now? haha

This is a good start right from the source and the real deal

[video=youtube;lTMRRQIxLuI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lTMRRQIxLuI[/video]



I have given up on western medicine now pretty much unless under emergency situations. Twice now I have been to the ER from pharmaceutical side effects and this is due to imo a weak diagnoses and lack of overall care. Eating well, educating, healing, and herbal medicines is where I have my focus at all times.

..PS

I am not saying anyone's technique is better. I hope we can have a exchange of ideas/info .
The parameters I works within are
3700ft alt..in a cold air drainage ..We had frost the other day....and into late March 40` day/night differences are common.
outdoors
soil type-a little red clay,lots of caliche and decomposing granite and shale.

...and very little $$$
It has taken me 2 seasons to get enough planting area softened to a 2ft depth. Had I the time...I would have grown alfalfa for a season, to loosen the soil, that was between the rock. My soil is still quite raw. Not bottom land, to say the least. I had a place that had red clay....that is some good stuff, once you get organic material in it.

thecoolman said:

I grew up in the east with organic gardening and remember the days of
walking under the oak tree to the natural worm filled pile of jet black
compost. This is AZ and I run a 60 plant perpetual I believe that chemical
nutes are much cheaper for me and if i was using compost i would still need top soil
to mix it with... there isn't any here and if there was I would still prefer the low labor
set up I run. Now that's just me and again I am not bashing organics i have used them
but for me labor aside I find that with a larger set set up in the AZ desert organics are much more expensive
in both dollars and labor. Now you talk as if its all free please tell me what you would add
including supplements and the cost for 300 gallons of soil and remember this mix would need to be ready every month or so.
I am very aware that pot doesn't need special fertilizers
as I mentioned I use commercial hydroponics formulas-Jacks hydro, or plantex, and calcium nitrate preferred but verti grow, crop king etc it all works and is cheap and clean

P.S. There are no free worms around here and I dont want to raise them.
...................................................

Click to expand...

Cool man there is a significant (somewhat) upfront cost if you want do this right. The soil you make is yours for LIFE? You feel me? Like a farmers plot. If I were to move I would take my all potting soil with undisturbed.

Interesting experiment if you really want to see how living soil works. Find a plant you can grow in an aquarium so you can see everything. You will notice all the different soil insects, fungi, worms, all types of life. If you disrupt that gentle environment it set it off balance hence the No Till method we use. Observation is key. Bio farming or natural organic growing take times at first but in the long haul it all pays off. The microbes do the work and they pull "nutes" from the atmosphere literally especially when growing companion plants in the same container. It works and it works well.

I never remove my potting mix from my pots. I cut and replant over and over, top dressing with other plants to "feed" and supplement with vermicompost. That's it and that's all. Dash of this and dash of that and I'm done. No water PH, No Res Clean, No buying all these chem ferts, and way less power consumption and machinery.

Why aren't you making your own chem salts to really save the $$ and the work is not much more?

Azoned said:

..PS

I am not saying anyone's technique is better. I hope we can have a exchange of ideas/info .
The parameters I works within are
3700ft alt..in a cold air drainage ..We had frost the other day....and into late March 40` day/night differences are common.
outdoors
soil type-a little red clay,lots of caliche and decomposing granite and shale.

...and very little $$$
It has taken me 2 seasons to get enough planting area softened to a 2ft depth. Had I the time...I would have grown alfalfa for a season, to loosen the soil, that was between the rock. My soil is still quite raw. Not bottom land, to say the least. I had a place that had red clay....that is some good stuff, once you get organic material in it.

Click to expand...

Have you tried to improve the aeration and drainage of your clay soils with organic amendments such as compost, peat and manure. Add a two inch layer of the organic amendment on the surface of the soil and till or spade in to a four to six inch depth. Basically like a tea. Compaction is a physical process that microbes will also do work on.

I love Living Soil Organics because once you understand you do less and less work and nature does it for you.

[video=youtube;ZT4aY1ABbqY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZT4aY1ABbqY[/video]

Hi Headtreep,
I understand. Let's just say I'm a knothead.
the only thing that gets sprayed on my plants is water. I will say that I am aware of the insects and their "foilar [sp?] feedings" [droppings] and bird droppings. The birds eat some of the bugs. ...

now..back to soil building
there are some earthworms here, but the beetle grubs do most of that work. I know...not the same. But we work with what we have. DO throw whole weeds, the roots too, into your compost heap. ALL roots have the magic myco stuff that you buy in jars. Run a "cold" compost...less than 140`F and they will not be killed. I say cold compost, because it will heat up and I have seen some catch fire.
alfalfa...this is great stuff. The roots go very deep and is loaded with N. The biggest problem I [and most outdoor growers] have is plants wanting to grow 20ft tall. So there is a trade off. Can't give it all the N they want.

...long time reader of OrganicGardener mag. I have sen some interesting styles...
French Intensive.
A 4ft deep trench backfilled with a layering of manure, straw and dirt.
I have a phone call.
be back later...I am enjoying this very much

Azoned said:

...long time reader of OrganicGardener mag. I have sen some interesting styles...
French Intensive.
A 4ft deep trench backfilled with a layering of manure, straw and dirt.
I have a phone call.
be back later...I am enjoying this very much

Click to expand...

Right on I need to get ready myself. Still in bed ugghh. Watched this video on utube, thought it might turn on the bulb for some people. I'm trying to basically become 100% sustainable so I see a homestead in my future.

[video=youtube;QfryVTZ5nRY]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QfryVTZ5nRY[/video]

We take these ideals and simply put them inside