Aero Cloning and roots

Anyone with experience......


Wanted to increase my success % and decrease my time with cloning
so I decided to go aero.

5 days now and have root nodes, so could I be looking at full roots
within another week or so for transplant?


Thanks for any answers..


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You should be fine to transplant within 7-10 days.

diggitydank420 said:

You should be fine to transplant within 7-10 days.

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My experience tells me that for hydro waiting for a real good root system is a good idea I don't know about transplanting to soil. Your clones will grow faster and be healthier. One more thing and i know this from experience. make sure you clean the WHOLE thing real good and rinse well or your next batch will not be so kind to you.

Good luck.

SParky

dawolf said:

5 days now and have root nodes, so could I be looking at full roots
within another week or so for transplant?

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Sounds good, 5 days is about avg for root nodes in an aerocloner that's working well.

If you're not using anything for pathogen control, you might add 50% grade H2O2 @ 1ml/L of the aerocloner res volume every 3-4 days. Will suppress any pathogen activity, might make it a bit more consistent and a day or so quicker, perhaps, as if 5 days isn't quick enough...

Probably ready sooner than you predict. When roots are about 5mm long, they can be planted in your medium of choice.

Thanks for the reply, Yea I added some peroxide and after I posted this a few hours later I checked on them and WOW they shot from nodes to like white tap roots! But now a day later the actual roots have kinda withered..still white but really weak looking and slowed growth but new nodes are showing. This isn't my first rodeo so to speak and I have been growing for awhile now but with soil. This aero cloner I made is fantastic though( close to real mist) with my micro sprayers.(i will try a pic later)
I also made a fogger that I have dripping off a line from the aero manifold
I made for the cloner. Since I have only worked with soil I really have never seen the root process so up and close like this atleast and so I am being very "motherly" I guess. I need pics I know I know but any help till then is greatly appreciated. Also, the clones haven't lost like any color, still very green and stalks are stiff. A little yellowing on the beggining of the leafs not the ends.

BTW, The mother for these clones is a 7-8' sage n sour and she is in perfect health with about a 3' wingspan planted in 10 gal. pot.

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Al B. Fuct said:

Sounds good, 5 days is about avg for root nodes in an aerocloner that's working well.

If you're not using anything for pathogen control, you might add 50% grade H2O2 @ 1ml/L of the aerocloner res volume every 3-4 days. Will suppress any pathogen activity, might make it a bit more consistent and a day or so quicker, perhaps, as if 5 days isn't quick enough...

Probably ready sooner than you predict. When roots are about 5mm long, they can be planted in your medium of choice.

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Checked roots just now and root growth has come to a stand still!
Roots took off like a rocket after posting the first post in this thread then started to shrink so to speak but are still white. Instead of thriving roots, looks like small/short strings of white snot dripping down. Sorry, don't know how else to explain it and since my grow experience has always been soil
I have never seen this. I dunno, has me really bummed. PH is a little high at 6.5 but they were shooting off at that earlier. Cleaned the cloner out very well down to the misters and the fogger. I guess we'll see in the morning but in the meantime I guess I will put the new cuttings I took after getting excited about the first rapid root growth after the nodes back into some thrivealive/water. Later and appreciate any help

small/short strings of white snot dripping down.

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That's pythium. You've underdosed your tank for the amount of pathogen load and all the H2O2 has been consumed. Dose the tank again now at 1ml/L. Correct the pH to 5.8.

Let me know how it looks in 48h.

Really? And from what I understand pythium is notorious with aero. Great. lol
I can't find my damn camera cuz I sure would like to show you a pic. One more thing...bottom of stems, near my cuts and where the roots are is a shade of maybe like brownish/yellow. Not prominent, but there. I'm just going to up the H2o2 like you said and forget about em till morning. I've got to get this down or go get some more RW cubes cuz I started my 12/12 with this 7' gorgeous babe and I need to get several clones up and running before she gets to far in cycle. Thanks for your help AL!!!

Al B. Fuct said:

That's pythium. You've underdosed your tank for the amount of pathogen load and all the H2O2 has been consumed. Dose the tank again now at 1ml/L. Correct the pH to 5.8.

Let me know how it looks in 48h.

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yep, pythium appears as a gelatinous mass of goo. It happens in all hydro systems. WHen you have a tank of yummy nutes around, you can hardly blame passing pathogens from stopping in for a feed and a place to hang out.

Happy to help, let me know how you go.

It's not really goo so to speak, the roots themselves are just runny looking
I know that does not tell you much maybe but there is no slime. I guess my sister took off to Florida and grabbed my camera or I would post a pic to help.
It went from nodes to BAM rootes and as fast as they went from nodes to roots they just came to a screaching hault and just lost all vigor shrank in size (width) and some have maybe grown a mm or so but nothing else since the above posts. It just sux not having any adv. hydro/aero experience.
I couldn't find my PH down so I used some lemon juice and then found the PH down and after a battle got the PH down to like 5.5 , I know you said 5.8 but for some reason I had a hard time buffering down. I'm thinking maybe I will just grab some Hydrozyme or something Monday and start over. I know the machine I built works fantastic. Time is a big problem for me these days this is why I have gone aero/hydro I know that may sound contrdicting but it's the shortened time that helps me with my situation not time it takes for care and maintenance. Anyway, what else can I grab if I was to start over? I have prolly access to 75-100 clones just from this one mother. She is whats left from my last harvest, and in fact she was reversed 2 weeks into flowering this past March when the original mother died. It was a slightly different phenotype from seed and I had given the 2 males I was going to use for breeding to a friend of mine to get some practise growing and sure enough he nute burnt this hell out of em. This plant though is one tough cookie, very pest and fungus resistant and when the camera gets back I will post a pic. The only reason I am flowering her is because I got a little over 1lb. from each of her sisters and this size and I am out of this smoke and craving some more so I just decided to bud her and clone another mother or two. Just a little bio while we wait.............................Again thanks for your help

Al B. Fuct said:

yep, pythium appears as a gelatinous mass of goo. It happens in all hydro systems. WHen you have a tank of yummy nutes around, you can hardly blame passing pathogens from stopping in for a feed and a place to hang out.

Happy to help, let me know how you go.

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OK, where to start? Don't use lemon juice; if you've used it before, it's part of the problem. 5.5 is too low and will cause nutrient lockout. Hygrozyme probably won't solve the problem. Keep treating with H2O2 every 3-4 days or more often if you see the return of the gelatinous goo.

Got it 5.7/5.8. I've got some B1, Superthrive, H202 3% and some root stimulator. That is what I am working with so if I need to grab something for the possible pythium let me know. This strain is really strong so I am hopeful
also, all are still very green and standing straight up but the bottom stalk is kinda yellowing (mustard) not slimy or anything kinda like a nute burn but there wasn't anything in there at the time. Today makes day 10. At day 5 was root nodes and day 6 nodes shoot to vibrant white small roots. Now, roots although small and withered looking are still white. Other small nodes appear on others but are stunted as well. I will have pics available sometime tomorow. Again, thanks for your help Al.

BTW, Since the H202 is adding extra oxygen and helping with pathogens, I don't need to worry about too much do I? It's only 3% but I'm sure about the measurements. 11ml/gal. for a medium dose. 5.5ml/gal. for maintenance

Al B. Fuct said:

OK, where to start? Don't use lemon juice; if you've used it before, it's part of the problem. 5.5 is too low and will cause nutrient lockout. Hygrozyme probably won't solve the problem. Keep treating with H2O2 every 3-4 days or more often if you see the return of the gelatinous goo.

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When I specify how to dose H2O2, I usually say '50% grade H2O2 @ 1ml/L'. 50% is 17 times stronger than 3%. Here's what I said on the last page:

If you're not using anything for pathogen control, you might add 50% grade H2O2 @ 1ml/L of the aerocloner res volume every 3-4 days. Will suppress any pathogen activity, might make it a bit more consistent and a day or so quicker, perhaps, as if 5 days isn't quick enough...

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I didn't know you were using 3%- and it makes a huge difference. 3% @ 1ml/L would do very little.... and that's your present problem.

If you must use 3%, you must use 17ml/L. This is impractical for moderate or large sized tanks. My 125L tanks would need 2125ml of 3% every 3-4 days.

Nip out to the hydro shop and get some 50%. If you can only get 35%, use it at 1.7ml/L. The rate of 3% you are applying won't do any good. That's why your tank went cloudy.

Yea, I know you said 50% but all I have is 3% and the store doesn't open back up till Monday but I don't remember saying th tank was cloudy and it isn't. I think you help so many people you have me mixed with someone else
but no, the PH is fine and at 5.8. I was thinking that if I had 35% H202 that a high does would be 1ml, so I am way off then. I need to check that then. I will add increments of 50ml unless I see water changes. I'm thinking that I never had problems with Rockwool and may just throw the clones out but they are still just like the day I cut them. Very green but below the neoprene
they are discolored but NO SLIME just really really shriveled root startings.
They also screached to a growth hault but yea no slime or goo. I was just saying they looked like snot cause they are still white but they just don't have any life in them. What would you suggest better than a higher strength H202 that I can get at the hydro store? Will it be ok to put new cuttings in this tank if the PH and the pathogen problem is o.k.? The E.C. reading for the tank is 1.29, I don't know if that tells you anything but I don't have any nutes in the tank only some Super thrive,PH down and the H202.

dawolf said:

Yea, I know you said 50% but all I have is 3% and the store doesn't open back up till Monday but I don't remember saying th tank was cloudy and it isn't. I think you help so many people you have me mixed with someone else

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awshit, you're right, I'm sorry about that. It does happen that I have too many tabs open and fuck it up from time to time. I'm also feelin' kinda ordinary today and probably should just go back to bed.

but no, the PH is fine and at 5.8. I was thinking that if I had 35% H202 that a high does would be 1ml, so I am way off then. I need to check that then. I will add increments of 50ml unless I see water changes.

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ah, ok. Yep, 35% is usually used at 1.7ml/L as the ordinary maintenance rate. However, plants will tolerate an awful lot more than that, particularly if there's a lot of pathogen material to be reacted with the H2O2.

I'm thinking that I never had problems with Rockwool and may just throw the clones out but they are still just like the day I cut them. Very green but below the neoprene
they are discolored but NO SLIME just really really shriveled root startings.
They also screached to a growth hault but yea no slime or goo. I was just saying they looked like snot cause they are still white but they just don't have any life in them.

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I've played with aerocloners but always went back to the cubes. Once you have got the feel of the weight of a properly watered cube down, it works every time.

Sorry for the cornfusion.

No biggie bro, I am grateful for the help so a little confucion is no big deal. I added a little to my last post and a few more questions if you wouldn't mind taking a peak. Man, I turned off the fogger and just have the misters running with of course an air stone. As far as the H202, will too much hurt? I don't see how it could really to an extent but I'm goingto the hydro store tomorrow and what would you suggest specifically for the pathogens and anything else. I've got 10 clones and despite the botom half the tops of all of them look great. Acouple of them I just re-cut and put a little Olivia's on them, just trying anything at this point. I understand it may take longer but it seems like no change at all has taken place.

I'm also going to take a few more cuttings tonight off the mother and this time instead of 6-9 inches I think maybe 1' or more. What is your opinion on this. The mother is about 7 months old, 7-8' and about 3' wide and so very bushy but tree bushy. It really is a great plant and her sisters which were the same pheno produced around 1' each dry. Some damn good smoke and I am craving it badly.lol Really I am. lol

Al B. Fuct said:

awshit, you're right, I'm sorry about that. It does happen that I have too many tabs open and fuck it up from time to time. I'm also feelin' kinda ordinary today and probably should just go back to bed.



ah, ok. Yep, 35% is usually used at 1.7ml/L as the ordinary maintenance rate. However, plants will tolerate an awful lot more than that, particularly if there's a lot of pathogen material to be reacted with the H2O2.



I've played with aerocloners but always went back to the cubes. Once you have got the feel of the weight of a properly watered cube down, it works every time.

Sorry for the cornfusion.

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As far as the H202, will too much hurt?

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I would imagine so but I have yet to determine where that point is. I've used 10ml/L in seriously infected systems and not done anything but good for plants.

I don't think I'd do 1' clones. Remember that the plants will usually triple in ht in wk 1-4 .

Yea, I found that you can overdose to the point where it can burn the epidermus of the root. But anyway, I just went ahead and flushed the whole tank/system with hot water and a high dose of the 3% H202, wiped it down and the Ph balanced the water to 5.8 and circulated the water. The bottom of the stems aren't gooy or slimey but looked bleached I guess. A light yellow(mustard) look. I went to my mother in which she is out in the woods and come to find out one half side of the plant has been flowering
and the other half not. I clipped a little bud off last night and quick dried and OMG memories. I went ahead and clipped off 3 nice size cuttings and put them in rockwool, so if the rockwool or aero cloner doesn't root by next weekend I may lose the strain or rejuvenate the mother after I harvest her. I will be going out of town for sometime therfore the rush in this recent cloning ordeal, this is why I went aero to begin with.

Al B. Fuct said:

I would imagine so but I have yet to determine where that point is. I've used 10ml/L in seriously infected systems and not done anything but good for plants.

I don't think I'd do 1' clones. Remember that the plants will usually triple in ht in wk 1-4 .

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After cleaning the whole system, tub and all and putting 3 new cuttings in
everything was going well from Sunday to today where the stems are a yellowish again now with little black spots all on the bottom of the stem underneath the neoprene so back to the for sure way with RW cubes. I know the aero cloner I made works and works well with the fogger I made with the nebulizer but the pathogens won the battle. Thanks for your help Al and I think you have great success with the cobes right? You have a thread with your technique?

dawolf said:

Yea, I found that you can overdose to the point where it can burn the epidermus of the root. But anyway, I just went ahead and flushed the whole tank/system with hot water and a high dose of the 3% H202, wiped it down and the Ph balanced the water to 5.8 and circulated the water. The bottom of the stems aren't gooy or slimey but looked bleached I guess. A light yellow(mustard) look. I went to my mother in which she is out in the woods and come to find out one half side of the plant has been flowering
and the other half not. I clipped a little bud off last night and quick dried and OMG memories. I went ahead and clipped off 3 nice size cuttings and put them in rockwool, so if the rockwool or aero cloner doesn't root by next weekend I may lose the strain or rejuvenate the mother after I harvest her. I will be going out of town for sometime therfore the rush in this recent cloning ordeal, this is why I went aero to begin with.

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yep, check here:

https://www.rollitup.org/hydroponics-aeroponics/15030-batch-clones-rockwool.html

I've altered that process since writing. I no longer use a weak nute soln for watering clones, seems that this slowed rooting somewhat. Just use tapwater adjusted to 5.8. Also, freshly cut clones should get about 6h darkness right after cutting to prevent wilt. After then, they can go on 18/6 or 24/0 lighting, your choice.